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ThereAndBackAgain last won the day on May 7

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About ThereAndBackAgain

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  • Gender
  • Location
    West Virginia
  • Interests
    Life, the Universe and Everything
  • More About Me
    From childhood Catholic to lukewarm conservative Christian. But now the spell is broken. I've come to realize I was probably always an atheist by nature.

Previous Fields

  • Still have any Gods? If so, who or what?

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  1. Out of the Frying Pan...

    Religion as we know it may be on the decline, but that doesn't mean people are becoming more rational. We have a long way to go... "... evidence suggests that the religious mind persists even when we lose faith in traditional religious beliefs and institutions." "The less religious people are, the more likely they are to endorse empirically unsupported ideas about U.F.O.s, intelligent aliens monitoring the lives of humans and related conspiracies about a government cover-up of these phenomena."
  2. Things Fundies Say On Facebook

    This was in my Facebook feed just now. I wanted to say "maybe you should thank the guys working in the heat and humidity on a Sunday afternoon!". But it was a friend of a friend, so I bit my tongue.
  3. Wow, this guy needs to deconvert so badly...
  4. Is there a Science for dummies book?

    I'd recommend 'A Short History of Nearly Everything' by Bill Bryson. He's not a scientist but he's a terrific writer. 100606629&ref=pd_sl_qnx3um4ta_e&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIkafV_9Sa1QIVTZF-Ch3RogLLEAAYASAAEgIcpPD_BwE
  5. Hesitant to plant seeds of doubt in wife in case I'm wrong...

    Hi Insightful, your residual fear of hell is not crazy. I mean, it's unfounded, but it is understandable too. We are not always rational creatures by any means. We can fear things and at the same time know that the fear is unjustified. Getting theism out of your mind can be a long process and traces of it tend to hold on stubbornly. My wife is not averse to questioning some things. She has listened to some Bart Ehrman lectures with me and is inclined to learn more. But I don't think she could give up on god belief completely. I'm fine with there being no god or afterlife, but I don't know that she could go there. I would rather she be a happy believer than an unhappy atheist or agnostic. So even though I don't hide my own unbelief, I hesitate to sow those seeds of doubt...
  6. How Islam Infects

    Hmmm, that's fishy. I'm afraid they'll nab her again when the hullabaloo dies down. I hope I'm wrong.
  7. Hi AlienGoddess and welcome to our community! You bring a valuable perspective as an ex-Muslim as well as an ex-Christian! It saddens me to see Islam in countries like Malaysia and Indonesia becoming ever more conservative and backward. Until relatively recently, Muslim countries from Egypt to Pakistan to Indonesia were relatively secular in some ways: many women went without any form of hijab whatever, it seems. Now this is no longer tolerated. Evidently much of the backtracking is a result of Saudi-funded madrassas and mosques that have succeeded in exporting Wahhabism and displacing more tolerant versions of Islam.
  8. I would just like to say how much I appreciate the civilized level of debate and discussion that (usually) is on display in this community. The posts above are good examples. Contrast this with how social media (and Twitter above all) usually operate: point-scoring is the order of the day, gaining 'likes' becomes the main goal, and any attempt at nuance or subtlety is lost. Venom is spewed all over the place. How nice it is to see people here use complete paragraphs to express themselves! I appreciate you all.
  9. Atheism on YouTube

    I really like Dave Rubin. It's not an atheist channel per-se, but he is an atheist and the topic often comes up. But he has excellent long-form interviews. He's had Sam Harris, Peter Boghossian, Michael Shermer as his guests.
  10. Stranger, if you would, please read the following excerpt from the Westminster Confession of Faith (1642, per Wikipedia) and indicate to what extent it matches your beliefs: "By the decree of God, for the manifestation of his glory, some men and angels are predestinated unto everlasting life, and others foreordained to everlasting death. As God hath appointed the elect unto glory, so hath He, by the eternal and most free purpose of His will, foreordained all the means thereunto. Wherefore, they who are elected . . . are effectually called unto faith in Christ by His Spirit working in due season, are justified, adopted, sanctified, and kept by His power. through faith, unto salvation. Neither are any other redeemed by Christ, effectually called, justified, adopted, sanctified, and saved, but the elect only. The rest of mankind God was pleased, according to the unsearchable counsel of His own will, whereby He extendeth or withholdeth mercy, as He pleaseth, for the glory of His Sovereign power over His creatures, to pass by; and to ordain them to dishonour and wrath for their sin, to the praise of His glorious justice." Thanks, TABA
  11. I'm probably stepping into a minefield here, but what the hell... First of all, both Citsonga and Geezer are two of my favorite ex-Christians. I always like to read your latest posts. Both of you have helped me on my own deconversion journey. You both have done a great deal to help and encourage new deconverts, and you both are eloquent critics of Christianity and theism in general. You are both good men whom I consider brothers in a sense. So I hate to see this acrimony develop and I hope it will not be lasting. Clearly Citsonga has insight and perspective that most of us can never equal. I can't imagine how I would handle parenting a child in this situation except to hope that love would come first, second and always. It's good that Citsonga's kids have a dad whose mind is not fogged by Christianity or any other god belief. But I don't think Geezer is any kind of bigot. Maybe a wee bit cantankerous at times, but then look at his avatar, haha. I do think that Geezer, like me and many others, is utterly baffled by the concept of gender fluidity and the whole transgender issue. It isn't helped by the antics of some on the left of the social justice movement. It is bewildering when, after years of understanding there to be two genders, we are now told that this view is hateful and bigoted (I'm not talking about Citsonga here, but other extreme views I hear). It is maddening when California bans official travel to North Carolina because of the NC bathroom law but conducts business as usual with Muslim countries where gays and atheists live in fear of their lives. And the actual bathroom laws are equally perplexing and seem designed to rally the right. So much damn virtue signaling on both sides! Not much interest in finding common ground. So I hope I haven't done anything to make things worse here or to antagonize two guys that I like a lot. I wish we could all sit down over a few drinks and learn more about each other and each other's families - and celebrate our escape from religious indoctrination....
  12. Why deconversion is hard on a lot of folks

    Margee, you have been such a great source of encouragement and support to all of us who came to this community. It breaks my heart to hear about the anguish you have gone through. I hope it gets better. Great big hug from south of the border...
  13. No doubt older people are prone to categorize and dismiss the youth. Likewise the young are prone to dismiss the lessons learned by their elders. Ageism works both ways. Increased exposure to higher education does not necessarily mean better educated. There does seem to be increased exposure to fields (broadly categorized as social studies) that tend to narrow rather than broaden the mind and leave students in debt without equipping them for well-paid jobs. Emphasis is placed on diversity in everything but opinion, so that college campuses Have become bastions of left-wing orthodoxy. Far from totally missing it, I specifically mentioned Millennials being less religious. You totally missed that. How did you determine that I espouse 'Free Market Fundamentalism'?
  14. As one who expressed fury at having his generation described so broadly, it seems like you are slandering previous generations rather dramatically.
  15. Why deconversion is hard on a lot of folks

    Interesting analogy. But why is this limited to 'we in the West'? Are other cultures less prone to this?