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Kemetic Deities


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#1 lunaticheathen

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 01:00 AM

So, there's at least one person interested in discussing Kemetic (Egyptian) deities besides me. I always can! So, that's what this thread is for. I'm not setting myself up as an authority - if anything, this could help me learn new things myself, and encourage me to research more.

There are a lot of misconceptions about these gods, and Kemetic religion as well, that I hope to clarify. But know that if I don't know the answer, I will say so. Then I will go look for the answer.

I might include UPG (unverified personal gnosis) about some deities. I will say so when I do. My knowledge and practice is a mix of academic and UPG. The academic is to try and get into the mindset of an ancient Kemetic, so I may connect with Netjer and experience Them directly, gaining UPG.

Out of habit, I will be using Kemetic names for the deities. The popularly known names, the ones most of you know, are Greek. I don't do this to be snotty or look smart, this really is habit. I will try my best to post the Greek name first, for clarification. If I forget, wepwawet.org will lead you to the Greek name of whoever I talk about.

Also, since I forget not everyone knows the terminology, here: http://www.kemet.org/terms_list.html The terms are useful, because the concepts I will speak of often don't directly translate into modern English words. This will help you understand me when I forget to "translate."

Now, who are y'all interested in? Posted Image

Edit: herpderp grammar.

Edited by lunaticheathen, 23 June 2012 - 01:02 AM.

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#2 TrueFreedom

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 01:10 AM

Feed me! I want it all! We've all heard of Ra, Isis, Set. I want their real stories and all of the lesser-known. Sources are much appreciated. Thanks!

Edited by TrueFreedom, 23 June 2012 - 01:15 AM.

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#3 lunaticheathen

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 01:19 AM

Well, I'll have to find a good one. I'll look in my books and other sources about the Contendings of Heru (Horus) and Set and write up a good essay. I'm tired right now, but it's a good story that involves many many Names, and has some good violence and trickery. Even has an episode of Hethert (Hathor) getting nekkid.

Also, in temple wall texts, there are a lot of references to penises. A lot. And beer.

This is going to be a fun thread. xD
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#4 mcdaddy

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 05:46 AM

Weren't Egyptians the first known culture to practice circumcision? How did that cum about.
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#5 lunaticheathen

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 06:11 AM

Weren't Egyptians the first known culture to practice circumcision? How did that cum about.


They have the oldest documentation of the practice, but it's unknown as to where it originated. Other African tribes did/do it too, but in adolescence, as a rite of passage. Not to babies.
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#6 Deva

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 06:26 AM

I am interested in this religion and I have a few questions. If any of them come off as disrespectful, its purely out of ignorance.

How is the modern Kemetic religion related to the old Egyptian religion? Is there a continuity like we have in other religions - a lineage or an "apostolic succession" type of setup?

Is there an astrological system in the Kemetic religion? I have a card I bought in a New Age bookstore of Bastet - that this God corresponded to my birthdate and some info about Bastet. Of course I thought that was cool since I like cats.

How does the Kemetic religion view the afterlife? Is there reincarnation or heaven or some other realm?

Thanks for starting this thread.

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#7 JadedAtheist

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 06:32 AM

My questions are (if they're welcomed, I am genuinely interested in knowing a bit more about Kemetic Orthodoxy as I haven't really heard much about it):

Is Kemetic Orthodoxy an attempt to recreate the ancient Egyptian religion, or something else entirely?
Does Kemetic Orthodoxy acknowledge gods outside of its own tradition (i.e. Zeus, Thor, Hades et cetera)? Or, does it hold the view that these are merely other names for the same gods that they worship (i.e. Zeus is Egyptian deity X)?
Does one have a personal relationship with their god/s?
Do one worship more than one god, and if so is there one that you have a closer "connection" to?
Are there rituals that need to be performed, or if not needed that can be performed to show reverence, devotion et cetera?
Is prayer merely for communicating one's thoughts and feelings, or can intercession take place?
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#8 lunaticheathen

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 11:44 AM

Good questions. Posted Image

Deva, modern Kemetic practice, as a whole, isn't monolithic. There are many groups that call themselves Kemetic, but most do not claim and unbroken lineage. Kemetic Orthodox kind of does, in that it's taught that Tamara Siuda does indeed carry the Kingly Ka (earthly embodiment of Heru). On lists of Nisuts made by the House of Netjer, Hekatawy I is at the end of them. But this is in Kemetic Orthodoxy, and while we refer to her in royal terms, she does have a day job, and usually asks that people call her Tamara if we're not in ritual. Then there are other Kemetic groups, and independent Kemetics. Being in Kemetic Orthodoxy, I know most about it - and I will say that no one in our faith I've spoken with belittles or derides other Kemetic groups or people, or thinks them "heretics" for not acknowledging Hekatawy I (AUS) as Nisut. Functionally, she's our teacher, and if someone else wants to worship Netjer and not be taught by Hemet (AUS), that's fine. As she as said, at least they're worshiping Netjer! That's rare as it is.

However, at the same time, it is acknowledged that Kemetic Orthodoxy religion is not, and can not be, exactly as it was in the ancient past. Even if we knew every little thing there is to know about how the ancients practiced and believed, we're modern people, we don't live in a Kemet where the Nisut has temporal/political power. But much of it is for the better, since all who practice are literate, and access to our Nisut is vastly easier than it was in ancient times. This also covers part of JA's questions, I think.

I'm kind of behind on Kemetic astrology, but the ancient Kemetics did study the stars. But, I do know that every "Egyptian zodiac" system with cards and do-dads I've encountered have absolutely no basis in ancient practices. As far as I know, the most consuming astronomical feature was Sopdet (Sirius) and its movements. The rising of Sopdet determined the calendar, and it still determines the Kemetic ritual calender. But there is little sign that there was a personal birth zodiac, as such. Relics one would find that have "Egyptian zodiacs" on them for decoration are from the Roman period, so that would obviously be influenced by them.

The afterlife is written about exhaustively on the walls of tombs in ancient Egypt. All Kemetics that I know of absolutely believe in an afterlife, usually taken place in a realm called the Duat. It's very much like life on earth, just without sickness and pain. But people do the things there that they enjoy on earth, and there is beer. Reincarnation isn't taught by Kemetic Orthodoxy, as there really isn't a concept of it from ancient Kemet. The dead are akhu, and are poetically described as being stars in the heavens. I have had conversations about reincarnation with Kemetic people, but it's generally accepted that one's ka lives on earth once. As for the ba, that could be reincarnated, but it's not something that is a central teaching, or even really normally considered.

Generally, the scenario of the Weighing of the Heart is accepted - but this is a holistic assessment, not a situation where a list of rules is adhered to, or where the deciding factor is believing that Wesir (or any other Name) loves you and is God. The scales are an apt symbol for this, because it's not any one thing, it's the general state of your being that is tested. And I believe Netjer is loving and understanding. And, while there are some ancient texts about "hells", generally, the worst punishment is being devoured by Ammit and not existing at all anymore.

JA, I was taught by teaching priests in Kemetic Orthodoxy that, while we try our best to continue the worship of Netjer as it was, it's impossible to recreate it exactly. We're just in vastly different times and situations. As such, most within the faith prefer to call it a revivalist faith, rather than reconstructionist. It's more of the spirit of devotion we hope to recreate - though many of us would love to, we're not building temples and employing a huge schedule of rotating priests. We can't celebrate the Beautiful Reunion with parades and giving a statue a boat ride down the Nile. But we do have a Nisut (and even her function has necessarily changed, as I stated), we keep to ancient standards of purity in ritual, and we read hymns and liturgy translated from ancient Egyptian sources.

Kemetic Orthodoxy acknowledges that other deities may exist for others, and even our own devotees (one can have another faith and still be Kemetic Orthodox, even Hemet (AUS) is also a Mambo) but it's not a practice to equate Kemetic Names with the gods of other cultures. When we worship Wesir, it's just Wesir (unless it's a syncretization with Sokar or Ptah, but that's a whole different discussion); we don't bring up Hades or another "underworld god" from another culture. Our practices are firmly fixed within Kemetic culture and framework. It's not Orthodoxy to mix and match, as is the tendency for eclectic Wiccans to do. Not that it's wrong, we just don't do it, and it wouldn't be called Kemetic Orthodoxy.

Yes, we have a personal relationship with Netjer, the One and Many. It's a religion of monolatry, which sees one Divine power expressing Itself in many distinct Names. It's brain-bendy, but They are both separate beings and One essence and being.

Most practitioners do worship more than one Name. As for being close to one or another, that's highly individual. Many undergo the Rite of Parent Divination, where it's determined who the parent/s of your ka is/are, as well as any beloved gods. That subject could be a whole post in itself, but experience has taught me that generally (not always) when this is done, one is generally closest to their parent deity (or deities, max of two parents). Yet, one can not feel a close connection to any deity from one's RPD and feel close to, and worship another Name entirely, and still be Kemetic Orthodox. Not a shemsu, but that's only because that entails both accepting the results of the RPD and taking a vow to serve those divined Names above others - not exclusively, but first. I am a shemset, divined daughter of Hethert, beloved of Bast-Mut and Set. I felt a deep connection with Hethert even before my RPD, so it's natural for me to hold to primary worship to Her. As for beloveds, at this point, I feel closest with Set. That may change. And Wesir has come up for devotion for me, and He's not in my divination line up. Shrines can become crowded places, and I know others that have their shrines way more crowded than me!

We have one main devotional ritual, and that is senut. It's simple, but has a definite rote formula (which is in keeping with ancient thought and practice, repeating the exact same actions and words in ritual compounds their power). Ideally, it is a daily ritual, but in practice, it's generally weekly. The more one does it, the more one reaps the benefit of its heka (power/magic). It does show devotion to Netjer, but it's really for our benefit, not Theirs. They, ultimately, don't need us - but They love us, and, in my experience, appreciate senut time and offerings.

Prayer is anything that's needed, though when it comes to "intercession", that's more of the realm of heka (magic) than prayer. Prayer is also not limited to senut or any other ritual. Prayer can be a conversation, can happen while doing everyday tasks, can be giving thanks, can be "crying on His/Her shoulder", or lots of other things, just as offerings need not be physical things - actions, especially in service of others, are wonderful offerings. Kemetic Orthodoxy doesn't really tell someone how to pray, what to offer, or what can/can't be said or done. As long as it doesn't hurt anyone, i.e., in keeping with Ma'at, it's acceptable. Any contact or communication with Netjer is seen as good. One can ask for intercession, but we also have heka, which is far more hands-on.

I hope this helps. If anything needs clarification, tell me. Posted Image

Edited by lunaticheathen, 23 June 2012 - 11:57 AM.

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#9 VacuumFlux

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 12:18 PM

Yes, we have a personal relationship with Netjer, the One and Many. It's a religion of monolatry, which sees one Divine power expressing Itself in many distinct Names. It's brain-bendy, but They are both separate beings and One essence and being.


I've got a metaphysics question that I'm not sure exactly how to ask. Is the One the ultimate reality (or source of reality, I guess)? Is it personal, or are only the Names personal? Is Ma'at one of the Many or something more fundamental than that? Is material reality part of the One or separate?

I read stuff a long time ago (maybe at a museum or in an educational book) that said there was a fight between chaos and order (where order = Ma'at, I think) and that there's still an ongoing struggle between the two; I remember getting the impression that it was like "in the beginning, there was chaos..." and that Ma'at is in a constant struggle to keep chaos at bay. Is that at all accurate?
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#10 TrueFreedom

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 12:30 PM

This is very interesting. How did you come to believe and practice Kemetic religion, LC?

Edited by TrueFreedom, 23 June 2012 - 12:30 PM.

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#11 lunaticheathen

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 12:39 PM

VF, The One isn't the ultimate reality - it's the sum of all Divine. It can be personal, but in my experience, the Names are far more personal. I believe that's why the Names exist, to get closer to human level. The akhu (ancestors) are actually closer to, and have been at, our level, but Akhu veneration deserves its own post entirely.

Ma'at is a huge subject. It is a goddess, a Name, but it is also a concept and a force. It can be closest equated to the Tao, as a force, yet doesn't equal it. Ma'at is very fundamental, as even the Names (maybe even the One) must follow Ma'at. That is one theological question that I liked the answer to, that even the Gods are accountable on some level.

There is a flux and struggle between ma'at and isfet. Both of these terms are difficult to translate into simple dictionary definitions, but for all intents, ma'at is "truth, order, and existence" and isfet is "evil and uncreation." Isfet is an action that unmakes the world. Not to be confused with "chaos", i.e., disruption of calm - Set is a "chaos god", but even He works within ma'at, and fights isfet when He defeats Apep nightly, who actually seeks to do isfet and unmake the world. When we speak of Kemetic chaos, it's more accurate to talk about uncreation, rather than "things are just CRAZY!"

TF, I was always drawn to Kemetic beliefs and gods, since I got my library card at age 5. I discovered the House of Netjer (Kemetic Orthodoxy) through a Google search on Ma'at. She was the first Name I honored, even outside of KO, but was intrigued at the concept of ma'at as well, which led to more academic research. It took a few years to actually commit to KO though, because of a general wariness of organized religion (though I have always been spiritual, and practice some form of devotion on my own). It took a striking vision/experience of Hethert to convince me to join the beginner's class, which carries no obligation to join afterwards - but I did join. And I'm so glad I did.
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#12 Deva

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 01:31 PM

Thanks for answering my questions, LH! Posted Image

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#13 lunaticheathen

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 03:11 PM

Thanks for answering my questions, LH! Posted Image


My pleasure!

Also, about my idea of posting about the Contendings, I think that will have to wait. And probably be several posts. That was me being ambitious and grandiose in my research/writing goals again. I'm looking to move across the whole country, and I just can't see myself devoting myself to such a huge story right now. And I want to get it right. BUT IT WILL HAPPEN, if only because I want to do the research and teach myself stuff.

Do keep the questions coming though, I rather like this format. And it's something I can do during breaks in planning and packing. :)
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#14 TrueFreedom

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 03:18 PM

LH, Are you up for describing your vision of Hethert?
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#15 TrueFreedom

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 03:21 PM

I had a dream in college that really cemented my Christian faith. I had been having nightmares, so I asked a couple of close friends to pray over me. That night I had a dream of being sucked into the sky and into outer space where I felt a peaceful presence cradling me. I wasn't afraid. My nightmares stopped. Praying before bed always seemed to prevent nightmares when I was growing up as well.
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#16 lunaticheathen

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 03:43 PM

I had a dream in college that really cemented my Christian faith. I had been having nightmares, so I asked a couple of close friends to pray over me. That night I had a dream of being sucked into the sky and into outer space where I felt a peaceful presence cradling me. I wasn't afraid. My nightmares stopped. Praying before bed always seemed to prevent nightmares when I was growing up as well.


Heh, funnily enough, that reminded me of Nut. Such a great goddess (not saying it was Her, just that the dream doesn't sound very Christian to my mind)

As for my vision of Hethert, it happened while I was awake. I had just participated in a St John's Eve Vodou ritual, and was definitely in an altered state of mind at the time. I was laying on the banks of the bayou, after crawling out of the water, and saw Her as a great shining cow, with the solar double-plumed headdress, emerging from the reeds on the bank. I was very very confused at the time, and remember thinking "woah, wrong pantheon!" It was like She heard me, and She laughed (don't ask me how a cow laughs, but that's what it was). She then splashed off into the bayou and vanished. And I felt an incredible lightness fill me. After that, I was full of giggles and hugs for strangers the rest of the night.

A few days later, when I was seriously asking myself about joining KO, I constructed a very basic altar for Netjer, sat in front of it, lit a candle and some incense, and prayed, basically, "is anyone there? I'd like to get to know Netjer, please." Hethert showed up again, in a very clear impression of Her, unmistakably, with a red dress, the sound of bells and laughter, and a mental/spiritual pouncing hug. And the word, screamed in my head "FINALLY!"

I knew before my RPD that Hethert was my Mother. It was nice to have outside confirmation, though. And my experiences with Her haven't stopped, but those were the most striking, because I wasn't looking for Her, specifically.

Edit: Here's a depiction that most closely matches what I saw on the bayou.
Posted Image

Edited by lunaticheathen, 23 June 2012 - 03:47 PM.

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#17 TrueFreedom

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 04:01 PM

Sounds exciting! Did Hethert look like depictions that you had seen in the past?
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#18 lunaticheathen

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 04:11 PM

Sounds exciting! Did Hethert look like depictions that you had seen in the past?


Yes? Kind of - but I honestly didn't research Her exclusively much in the past. It was all relatively new to me. And, definitely, I didn't see hardly any depictions of Her in cow form. I knew She had cow horns, but the ancient depictions of Her as a Celestial Cow was unfamiliar to me before my vision.

My impressions of Her generally fit with ancient depictions, but can differ. Usually when She's trying to make a point - like morphing into a lady with dreds and golden lion-eyes when I asked Her if how separate She was from Sekhmet - also, grinning with lots of teeth, and big canines. That's not "traditional", but made the point that in a moment, She can be Sekhmet.

Do I sound crazy yet? xD
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#19 Babylonian Dream

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 04:22 PM

I had similar visions in dreams in the past regarding the Babylonian goddess Ishtar. She told me to fight and I will prevail, and my struggles (getting onto my feet and all that) will pay off. They certainly have. I also would pray to not have nightmares, and went from having nightmares everynight to every once in a great while. Part of me still wants to be a polytheist, but part of me still feels I'm being dishonest with myself, that maybe it's not real.

Ishtar, interestingly enough, appeared to me in the dream wearing a hat I never saw before until I began researching Mesopotamian polytheism. It was very similar to what you'd see in ancient iconography. Also, I've had lions sightings in dreams where they'd help me overcome obstacles, symbolizing life's obstacles (or was so the meaning I gave it). Ishtar is the only babylonian deity associated with lions, the rest are usually demons. The same curiously holds true with owls. But she's not a demon, just a really powerful goddess.

There are alot of similarities to Hethert/Sekhmet and Ishtar. Is a star also a part of Hethert's iconography? The 8-pointed star is the star of Ishtar.
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#20 lunaticheathen

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  • Interests:Religions, drumming, dancing, reading, honoring my spiritual Mother.
  • Still have any Gods? If so, who or what? :Netjer and the Loa

Posted 23 June 2012 - 04:31 PM

I had similar visions in dreams in the past regarding the Babylonian goddess Ishtar. She told me to fight and I will prevail, and my struggles (getting onto my feet and all that) will pay off. They certainly have. I also would pray to not have nightmares, and went from having nightmares everynight to every once in a great while. Part of me still wants to be a polytheist, but part of me still feels I'm being dishonest with myself, that maybe it's not real.

Ishtar, interestingly enough, appeared to me in the dream wearing a hat I never saw before until I began researching Mesopotamian polytheism. It was very similar to what you'd see in ancient iconography. Also, I've had lions sightings in dreams where they'd help me overcome obstacles, symbolizing life's obstacles (or was so the meaning I gave it). Ishtar is the only babylonian deity associated with lions, the rest are usually demons. The same curiously holds true with owls. But she's not a demon, just a really powerful goddess.

There are alot of similarities to Hethert/Sekhmet and Ishtar. Is a star also a part of Hethert's iconography? The 8-pointed star is the star of Ishtar.


Very cool dreams, BD. :)

Hethert has no specific star in Her iconography, as far as I know. She is primarily, from pre-dynastic times, a sky goddess. Mostly the day sky, especially since Her name literally means "House of Heru." Which is, obviously, the sky. Her form that is my Mother is Hethert-Sekhmet, and, being an "Eye of Ra", is rather more solar.

She does have an interesting syncretization, however, of Hethert-Nut, and is depicted as a sky-cow covered in stars. This is the form we celebrate around winter solstice, the Establishment of the Celestial Cow, or affectionately known in KO as "Moomas."
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