35 replies to this topic

[ConureDelSol]

The closest one is 40 minutes away   I have decided no more AWANAS effective immediately. The local ministry I'm still on the fence about.

 

Last night I tried to talk to her about it a little bit. I said "Some people don't believe god is real." She said "But he is! Isn't he?" (yikes) I said "Well baby, no one really knows.." and she interrupted me with "I think he is real."

 

She seemed so content with that I just didn't say anything else.

 

Have you ever checked out MeetUp.com?  You may be able to find groups of people who meet together based on a common interest.  Or maybe you can just find playdates or some sort of book club.

 

And pray to FSM you can move somewhere closer to a good freethinker community soon. 

[CDFree]

I have no intention of taking her out of girl scouts She loves it. I was just disappointed to see that it wasn't the escape from religion I was hoping for.

Sorry, thought I was replying to the OP, but I didn't think there was that much religion in GS?

[CDFree]

Duh, I can be thick sometimes, you are the OP. I've reread your post, I misread it first time, I didn't think she was actually in the GS, just that you were thinking about it.

[ConureDelSol]

Oh and EventBrite.com sometimes shows free events you can get tickets to.

[Sheerbliss]

In a few years, you can get her The Book of Totally Irresponsible Science.

 

[Fuego]

You can ask her legitimately why she thinks god is real. And you could explain why you used to believe that also, but now you don't. Asking questions is a good way to plant ideas. We don't have to be dogmatic like the believers. Also, getting god to actually answer questions or heal people is a big test she could try, since the bible stories are full of these exciting tales that never quite seem to happen in reality. Or ask why god was so mean to people, including children. Stuff like that.

[msipsy218]

 

Are there any programs at the local library? 

 

 Not for another few years, except in the summer. Which will be helpful for avoiding VBS. We are already very active with the library but they skip ages 5-11 unless you're home-schooled :/

[msipsy218]

 

Have you ever checked out MeetUp.com?  You may be able to find groups of people who meet together based on a common interest.  Or maybe you can just find playdates or some sort of book club.

 

And pray to FSM you can move somewhere closer to a good freethinker community soon. 

 

 

I haven't tried that site but I will, thanks It's really looking more and more like Savannah is going to happen, maybe it will be a better area as far as religion is concerned.

 

 

 

Sorry, thought I was replying to the OP, but I didn't think there was that much religion in GS?

 

 

I don't think there is in most places. I remember as a xtian hearing how "evil" GS were because they give money to planned parenthood or something, but in the bible belt, I guess we do things differently lol. The pledge is "On my honor I will try to serve god and my country" or something like that and they have a "My Faith" badge that requires them to sit through a 4 hour sermon and bible craft. She won't be doing that, of course.

 

 

You can ask her legitimately why she thinks god is real. And you could explain why you used to believe that also, but now you don't. Asking questions is a good way to plant ideas. We don't have to be dogmatic like the believers. Also, getting god to actually answer questions or heal people is a big test she could try, since the bible stories are full of these exciting tales that never quite seem to happen in reality. Or ask why god was so mean to people, including children. Stuff like that.

 

I love it when people suggest such simple things that U never would have thought of otherwise. "Why do you think god is real?" That is perfect. lol

[TwistedHiss]

I think, even though she seemed content, a good honest discussion would be warranted between you and your daughter. Nothing brutal, but it's okay to let her know your thoughts about something and why you feel the way you feel about it and encourage critical thinking on her part.

 

I think you'd be showing your daughter respect by having an up-front talk about it. It would give her some food for thought. Even though she's young I think it would still be valuable if approached on a level she can understand for her age.

 

 

[Akheia]

In your neck of the woods I'd be worried about religious indoctrination too. I was in the Campfire Girls out in California and don't remember us ever doing anything religious. I was in it for like 3 years. We went camping and learned to cook and studied local history and stuff. Maybe CFG would be better that GS? They sell Almond Roca, which might not be Samoas and Thin Mints, but it's damn good anyway.

 

I love the idea of asking her why she believes and sharing that you used to think so too. Also the library; it's a shame your area doesn't have a more active library scene. In my town they always seem to have something going on for everybody. I reckon it's very contingent on one's local area funding. Well, could get 'em hooked on reading, I guess. When I was a kid, my mom was VERY broke and the highlight of my week was our Saturday trip to the library. I was like a fat kid in a candy shop. When it gets warmer at least there'll be park excursions... does your area do any family days? Mine opens all its museums and stuff up to everyone for free one day a month. You'll figure something out I'm so relieved you're taking that religious shit out of your kids' lives. Probably better to handle the recreation stuff yourself anyway.

 

Man, what a damn scam churches are.

[falemon]

I wouldn't worry about it too much. Judging by your picture I think you're a pretty cool person, so just be a cool and loving mum, encouraging her to read books

 

Indoctrination is a lot more difficult with a person who is skilled in fact finding and analytical thinking. If it helps, use the vocabulary of God subtly so that it dissipates into background noise and she no longer needs to think in those terms.

 

For example, you can ask her where the stars in the sky comes from. If she can relate that to God then good, because she will soon see how redundant God is when she learns about science. If she relates God to helping others, teach her to help others with actions as a human being. Show her that in her resides love and the inner God. Enrich her with your subtle wisdom.

 

And if you know what she thinks God does then it is easier to help her think rationally and also for you to know if there is any need for damage control. There is a certain skill in the process too where the goal is not to tell them what to think but to give them the opportunity to explore their own thoughts about their true thoughts. It's almost like you are playing the role of psychotherapist.

 

 

 

If you're a reader, I would recommend arming yourself with Collins Need to Know NLP

[PeopleArePeople]

I have been lurking around the past few months, but I finally decided to join so that I could respond I am in a very similar situation as you. My husband and I have both deconverted this past year, and our children are 7 and 5. We did things differently though, and wanted to share our experience. We were heavily involved in our church, so we couldn't just slowly drift away. It was sudden. A couple of months before we left, we changed some things in our home. We stopped praying before meals, reading the Bible before bed, Bible memorization, and catechising them. We couldn't share why with them at the time, but they didn't really notice. Anytime they would remind us, we would do it, but it wasn't often. When we finally were able to extricate ourselves from our church, we explained everything with them. We told them that we didn't believe anymore, and we were no longer going to influence them. They are free to believe whatever they want to, and ask us questions. It went surprisingly well. My oldest was very sad about not seeing her friends anymore, but other than that, they have not asked to go back. I think it is a good idea to remove your daughter from AWANA's. She will only associate church with having fun. I think that's why my kids haven't asked to go back. They remember the two long sermons they had to listen to every Sunday.

 

I agree with the other posters about trying to substitute something fun. We have tried to do something special with them on Sundays since we stopped going. I like your craft idea. A trip to the library together, maybe play a game, cook her favorite meal, or watch a movie together are some other cheap ideas.

 

I would also recommend finding some science books to look at together. We have been talking about science with our kids, and they are enjoying it. My oldest a few days ago proclaimed that she had come up with an excellent question. If God didn't make us, then how did we get here? That is when my husband sat down with her with Richard Dawkins The Magic of Reality, and read the chapter explaining evolution. Her attention span wasn't quite able to finish the chapter, but she knows now that there is a scientific explanation of how we came to be.

 

I wish you well in this journey. It has been difficult for us. We have lost all of our friends, and that includes our children's friends too. I was hoping that some people wouldn't abandon us, but I am not holding out too much hope anymore. Just yesterday, I had to be honest with my daughter, and tell her that no one wants to be around us right now. (She had mentioned contacting an old friend.) I encouraged her to start making new friends, since she is involved in a couple of extracurricular activities. We homeschool too, so this makes it even more difficult. I did find a couple of secular family groups on meetup.com so hopefully we will make some new friends soon. I wish it didn't have to be this way, but I know we have made the right decision to leave Christianity.

[Akheia]

Welcome, PeopleArePeople! And thanks for posting that. I've been meaning to read that Dawkins book myself; I'm glad to hear that it helped your daughter.

[owen652]

AWANA, lol, I did that when I was a kid. I was so excited at first cos I was told it was gonna be just like scouts.. Boy, was I wrong. I kept thinking, when are we going to do knots, or camping skills, or anything remotely outdoorsy..we never left the fucking church hall! Indoctrination school.

[msipsy218]

 

I love the idea of asking her why she believes and sharing that you used to think so too. Also the library; it's a shame your area doesn't have a more active library scene. In my town they always seem to have something going on for everybody. I reckon it's very contingent on one's local area funding. Well, could get 'em hooked on reading, I guess. When I was a kid, my mom was VERY broke and the highlight of my week was our Saturday trip to the library. I was like a fat kid in a candy shop. When it gets warmer at least there'll be park excursions... does your area do any family days? Mine opens all its museums and stuff up to everyone for free one day a month.

 

The local libraries are terribly under-funded. The one 2 towns over just had to close, actually I take my 3 year old to the pre-k group once a week and usually just pick up some books for my 6 year old then because she is at school, but we could just as easily take her separately as a fun little outing.

 

The local children's museum and art museum both have free days once a month that we try to take advantage of. The art museum bores her to death but she loves the children's museum

 

 

I wouldn't worry about it too much. Judging by your picture I think you're a pretty cool person, so just be a cool and loving mum, encouraging her to read books

 

 

If you're a reader, I would recommend arming yourself with Collins Need to Know NLP

 

Does my picture say so much about me?

Just ordered a copy, thanks!

 

 

I have been lurking around the past few months, but I finally decided to join so that I could respond

 

 

 

Nice to meet you! Sounds like we have pretty similar circumstances. We actually home-schooled last year too but we decided to put her into public school for completely non-religious reasons, but my point is I can kind of relate to that too.

[Medjool]

There's a wonderful book called Raising Freethinkers, a practical guide for parenting beyond belief - a worthy $12 investment.

It is chock full of fun activities for children (ie, make a world history timeline with ribbon, using a different color for when humans are on the earth - that part ends up being insanely short - really gets the point across and inspires humility and awe for the world).

It also has loads of online resources and more. I read about camp quest in there (http://www.campquest.org/) - it's a camp for freethinking children! They do all the regular summercamp fun things, and also expose the kids to critical thinking, philosophy, mythology. "The centerpiece of the camp's approach is encouragement of critical thinking and an introduction to logical fallacies. One tradition along these lines involves making the claim that two invisible unicorns inhabit Camp Quest. Campers are told that these beings cannot be seen, heard, touched, smelled, tasted, and that they cannot do harm, do not eat, and leave no mark. An ancient book handed down for untold generations offers proof that the unicorns exist, though no one is allowed to see this book. Any camper who can prove that the unicorns do not exist will win a godless one-hundred dollar bill (issued before 1957, the year the U.S. Congress mandated that "In God We Trust" be printed on American currency.) Since first offering this challenge in August 1996, the prize remains unclaimed."

Finally, I just want to encourage and reassure you. Raising children free of religion is so much fun and a rich experience full of true, unmanufactured awe. I have 3 young children who have been to church only a handful of times, and they think of it as one more place to be forced to sit still and be told what to do. They get enough of that at school, so they are not interested in church! Even my middle daughter, who is the one I most think could fall for god and who loved the crafts in Sunday school, really hated having to go to another "school". My oldest - when he was 9, we were listening to a Christian radio station in the car one day (another good opportunity for sharing what you think or sharing critical thinking), and after the radio announcer made some far-fetched reference to Jesus and our behavior, my son said, "that makes no sense, Mom" - I just laughed, love that boy!