Super Moderator TheRedneckProfessor Posted August 17, 2014 Super Moderator Share Posted August 17, 2014 14 Behold, the heaven and the heaven of heavens is the Lord's thy God, the earth also, with all that therein is. 15 Only the Lord had a delight in thy fathers to love them, and he chose their seed after them, even you above all people, as it is this day. 16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked. 17 For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward. Deuteronomy chapter 10 ... So, god, who is not a respecter of persons, by his own admission delighted in the fathers of the Hebrews, chose their seed, and placed them above all people? Does this really sound like an omniscient being? To make a claim--"I have chosen this one people above all"-- and immediately contradict the very claim just made--"I am not a respecter of persons."? Does this really sound like the actions of an omnipotent god? To set one people above all others as an example, rather than being the example himself? Does this really sound like a god who is all-loving? To exalt his "chosen" ones over all of the others? ... Or does this sound like the myths of a particular people about their particular god trying to justify their particular existence and their particular politics and their particular wars? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RipVanWinkle Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 You don't suppose the guy that wrote that was a Hebrew, do you? bill 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moanareina Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 I never understood the concept of choosing one people and call it his own while all the other folks where left to themselves and for destruction by his favorites... And it was another of those concepts of making us feel bad in Church. Like: You know that Jesus came for the Jews. The Jews are his favored people. You need to be thankful for the Jews and have a positive attitude towards them. It is all about the Jews and was never about the heathens...ah, OK. So he does not really love me for who I am but only because I have chosen to believe in him despite the fact that he actually did not even come on this planet for my sake. And I would always be secondary anyways...not really his main focus because I have been born in the wrong place by the wrong people...and the only reason I would be his own was, because his own people did not want to be his own...well... Crazy shit this is...everything. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roz Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 The concept of choosing one people to call yeshitwa's own? It's a very useful tool in creating an 'us vs them' mentality on one's followers. I never understood why yaweh had called one special people in the first place until I saw it from a non-believer's perspective. The hebrew leaders wrote 'thus says our lord, we're the chosen ones!' to band the population together. Here's PZ Myers explaining it better than I can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdelsolray Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 I never understood the concept of choosing one people and call it his own while all the other folks where left to themselves and for destruction by his favorites... … It's easy to understand. The "chosen" ones created the imaginary god to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moanareina Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 I never understood the concept of choosing one people and call it his own while all the other folks where left to themselves and for destruction by his favorites... … It's easy to understand. The "chosen" ones created the imaginary god to begin with. Yes, I was speaking of being in the club still...Now I can see that of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdelsolray Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 I never understood the concept of choosing one people and call it his own while all the other folks where left to themselves and for destruction by his favorites... … It's easy to understand. The "chosen" ones created the imaginary god to begin with. Yes, I was speaking of being in the club still...Now I can see that of course. Cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 14 Behold, the heaven and the heaven of heavens is the Lord's thy God, the earth also, with all that therein is. 15 Only the Lord had a delight in thy fathers to love them, and he chose their seed after them, even you above all people, as it is this day. 16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked. 17 For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward. Deuteronomy chapter 10 ... So, god, who is not a respecter of persons, by his own admission delighted in the fathers of the Hebrews, chose their seed, and placed them above all people? Does this really sound like an omniscient being? To make a claim--"I have chosen this one people above all"-- and immediately contradict the very claim just made--"I am not a respecter of persons."? Does this really sound like the actions of an omnipotent god? To set one people above all others as an example, rather than being the example himself? Does this really sound like a god who is all-loving? To exalt his "chosen" ones over all of the others? ... Or does this sound like the myths of a particular people about their particular god trying to justify their particular existence and their particular politics and their particular wars? Instead of dropping gold tablets fro the sky or being visible to people on earth every day, God chose to work through history to reveal himself and to present his message. This required people. To best accomplish this goal he decided to work with a specific group. He could have chosen the Chinese or a tribe in Africa or a tribe in the Americas. He chose the Jews. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Instead of dropping gold tablets fro the sky or being visible to people on earth every day, God chose to work through history to reveal himself and to present his message. This required people. To best accomplish this goal he decided to work with a specific group. He could have chosen the Chinese or a tribe in Africa or a tribe in the Americas. He chose the Jews. It's a convoluted story that makes excuses for the fact that there is zero evidence for God. Considering your religion makes all kinds of extraordinary claims about fantastic things the burden is on your religion to provide convincing evidence. The Chinese, Africans and Native American all had tribal gods that make as much sense as Jewish mythology. Quit wasting your time. We are not interested in what you are selling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Moderator TheRedneckProfessor Posted August 18, 2014 Author Super Moderator Share Posted August 18, 2014 14 Behold, the heaven and the heaven of heavens is the Lord's thy God, the earth also, with all that therein is. 15 Only the Lord had a delight in thy fathers to love them, and he chose their seed after them, even you above all people, as it is this day. 16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked. 17 For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward. Deuteronomy chapter 10 ... So, god, who is not a respecter of persons, by his own admission delighted in the fathers of the Hebrews, chose their seed, and placed them above all people? Does this really sound like an omniscient being? To make a claim--"I have chosen this one people above all"-- and immediately contradict the very claim just made--"I am not a respecter of persons."? Does this really sound like the actions of an omnipotent god? To set one people above all others as an example, rather than being the example himself? Does this really sound like a god who is all-loving? To exalt his "chosen" ones over all of the others? ... Or does this sound like the myths of a particular people about their particular god trying to justify their particular existence and their particular politics and their particular wars? Instead of dropping gold tablets fro the sky or being visible to people on earth every day, God chose to work through history to reveal himself and to present his message. This required people. To best accomplish this goal he decided to work with a specific group. He could have chosen the Chinese or a tribe in Africa or a tribe in the Americas. He chose the Jews. Instead of using brute force alone to accomplish their goals, the Jews invented a god and claimed their political/social/economic desires were the will of this god. They could have used Ba'al or Molech. They chose yahweh. Does this make more sense? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest end3 Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 14 Behold, the heaven and the heaven of heavens is the Lord's thy God, the earth also, with all that therein is. 15 Only the Lord had a delight in thy fathers to love them, and he chose their seed after them, even you above all people, as it is this day. 16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked. 17 For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward. Deuteronomy chapter 10 ... So, god, who is not a respecter of persons, by his own admission delighted in the fathers of the Hebrews, chose their seed, and placed them above all people? Does this really sound like an omniscient being? To make a claim--"I have chosen this one people above all"-- and immediately contradict the very claim just made--"I am not a respecter of persons."? Does this really sound like the actions of an omnipotent god? To set one people above all others as an example, rather than being the example himself? Does this really sound like a god who is all-loving? To exalt his "chosen" ones over all of the others? ... Or does this sound like the myths of a particular people about their particular god trying to justify their particular existence and their particular politics and their particular wars? Instead of dropping gold tablets fro the sky or being visible to people on earth every day, God chose to work through history to reveal himself and to present his message. This required people. To best accomplish this goal he decided to work with a specific group. He could have chosen the Chinese or a tribe in Africa or a tribe in the Americas. He chose the Jews. Instead of using brute force alone to accomplish their goals, the Jews invented a god and claimed their political/social/economic desires were the will of this god. They could have used Ba'al or Molech. They chose yahweh. Does this make more sense? Prove it non-believer! Prove they invented God!! You have nothing you liar. Sincerely, Roz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 14 Behold, the heaven and the heaven of heavens is the Lord's thy God, the earth also, with all that therein is. 15 Only the Lord had a delight in thy fathers to love them, and he chose their seed after them, even you above all people, as it is this day. 16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked. 17 For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward. Deuteronomy chapter 10 ... So, god, who is not a respecter of persons, by his own admission delighted in the fathers of the Hebrews, chose their seed, and placed them above all people? Does this really sound like an omniscient being? To make a claim--"I have chosen this one people above all"-- and immediately contradict the very claim just made--"I am not a respecter of persons."? Does this really sound like the actions of an omnipotent god? To set one people above all others as an example, rather than being the example himself? Does this really sound like a god who is all-loving? To exalt his "chosen" ones over all of the others? ... Or does this sound like the myths of a particular people about their particular god trying to justify their particular existence and their particular politics and their particular wars? Instead of dropping gold tablets fro the sky or being visible to people on earth every day, God chose to work through history to reveal himself and to present his message. This required people. To best accomplish this goal he decided to work with a specific group. He could have chosen the Chinese or a tribe in Africa or a tribe in the Americas. He chose the Jews. Instead of using brute force alone to accomplish their goals, the Jews invented a god and claimed their political/social/economic desires were the will of this god. They could have used Ba'al or Molech. They chose yahweh. Does this make more sense? Not to me. I'm going with the Biblical narrative. I'm drawn to the story of God using people through history to reveal his himself and his message. Of all the religions I have read about, this is the story that makes the most sense. You believe the Jews invented a god. There's a saying Baptists often tell each when they cannot agree on a particular issue. "Well friend, I guess we will have to agree to disagree." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdelsolray Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 14 Behold, the heaven and the heaven of heavens is the Lord's thy God, the earth also, with all that therein is. 15 Only the Lord had a delight in thy fathers to love them, and he chose their seed after them, even you above all people, as it is this day. 16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked. 17 For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward. Deuteronomy chapter 10 ... So, god, who is not a respecter of persons, by his own admission delighted in the fathers of the Hebrews, chose their seed, and placed them above all people? Does this really sound like an omniscient being? To make a claim--"I have chosen this one people above all"-- and immediately contradict the very claim just made--"I am not a respecter of persons."? Does this really sound like the actions of an omnipotent god? To set one people above all others as an example, rather than being the example himself? Does this really sound like a god who is all-loving? To exalt his "chosen" ones over all of the others? ... Or does this sound like the myths of a particular people about their particular god trying to justify their particular existence and their particular politics and their particular wars? Instead of dropping gold tablets fro the sky or being visible to people on earth every day, God chose to work through history to reveal himself and to present his message. This required people. To best accomplish this goal he decided to work with a specific group. He could have chosen the Chinese or a tribe in Africa or a tribe in the Americas. He chose the Jews. Just not in any way you can demonstrate, Mr. "I Have an Apologetic for Everything, I Just FInd Them From My Theist Whore Masters On The Internet, But Only Those That Agree With Me". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roz Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Oh look it's Ray Comfort and Kirk again. Oh yeshitwa, please send us better christians than these two. And End Comfort, I hope you'll learn something from this. The person with the claim has the burden of proof. You still haven't proven 1 ounce of your yeshitwa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Not to me. I'm going with the Biblical narrative. I'm drawn to the story of God using people through history to reveal his himself and his message. Of all the religions I have read about, this is the story that makes the most sense. You believe the Jews invented a god. There's a saying Baptists often tell each when they cannot agree on a particular issue. "Well friend, I guess we will have to agree to disagree." You are acting irrational. And you are not agreeing to disagree. You are preaching when you know we are not interested. Keep your religion to yourself or else talk to people who want to hear about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdelsolray Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Not to me. I'm going with the Biblical narrative. I'm drawn to the story of God using people through history to reveal his himself and his message. Of all the religions I have read about, this is the story that makes the most sense. You believe the Jews invented a god. There's a saying Baptists often tell each when they cannot agree on a particular issue. "Well friend, I guess we will have to agree to disagree." You are acting irrational. And you are not agreeing to disagree. You are preaching when you know we are not interested. Keep your religion to yourself or else talk to people who want to hear about it. He abandoned rational thinking long, long ago. It is likely the specific neurons in his frontal cerebral cortex, which would have been used for rational thinking, have atrophied, lost synapse connections and/or simply died. Instead, he's using the limbic part of his brain, practicing hubris, self-importance and holier-than-thou-ness. If he does really, really well, his imaginary sky fairy will give him a gold star. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moanareina Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 14 Behold, the heaven and the heaven of heavens is the Lord's thy God, the earth also, with all that therein is. 15 Only the Lord had a delight in thy fathers to love them, and he chose their seed after them, even you above all people, as it is this day. 16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked. 17 For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward. Deuteronomy chapter 10 ... So, god, who is not a respecter of persons, by his own admission delighted in the fathers of the Hebrews, chose their seed, and placed them above all people? Does this really sound like an omniscient being? To make a claim--"I have chosen this one people above all"-- and immediately contradict the very claim just made--"I am not a respecter of persons."? Does this really sound like the actions of an omnipotent god? To set one people above all others as an example, rather than being the example himself? Does this really sound like a god who is all-loving? To exalt his "chosen" ones over all of the others? ... Or does this sound like the myths of a particular people about their particular god trying to justify their particular existence and their particular politics and their particular wars? Instead of dropping gold tablets fro the sky or being visible to people on earth every day, God chose to work through history to reveal himself and to present his message. This required people. To best accomplish this goal he decided to work with a specific group. He could have chosen the Chinese or a tribe in Africa or a tribe in the Americas. He chose the Jews. Oh really? Why not choosing more then one group? Like one on this side of the globe and one of the other...and maybe one on the north pole too...and then in the end they would meet because they would all find out about each other and see how God was the God of many and the lover of all instead of singling one folk out and make them exempt? Or why not just picking the ones who where honestly looking for that God, who served him and believed in him like one here and one there...no force, no crazy demonstrations of his might, no killing of other folks through his folk but genuine love and compassion...would have worked too I guess. Why making it all bloody and brutal and why elevating a people above all the others? Why would that be the best way to choose to accomplish his goals? What does this say about that God you so firmly believe in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roz Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 Yaweh, the respecter of persons: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironhorse Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 14 Behold, the heaven and the heaven of heavens is the Lord's thy God, the earth also, with all that therein is. 15 Only the Lord had a delight in thy fathers to love them, and he chose their seed after them, even you above all people, as it is this day. 16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked. 17 For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward. Deuteronomy chapter 10 ... So, god, who is not a respecter of persons, by his own admission delighted in the fathers of the Hebrews, chose their seed, and placed them above all people? Does this really sound like an omniscient being? To make a claim--"I have chosen this one people above all"-- and immediately contradict the very claim just made--"I am not a respecter of persons."? Does this really sound like the actions of an omnipotent god? To set one people above all others as an example, rather than being the example himself? Does this really sound like a god who is all-loving? To exalt his "chosen" ones over all of the others? ... Or does this sound like the myths of a particular people about their particular god trying to justify their particular existence and their particular politics and their particular wars? Instead of dropping gold tablets fro the sky or being visible to people on earth every day, God chose to work through history to reveal himself and to present his message. This required people. To best accomplish this goal he decided to work with a specific group. He could have chosen the Chinese or a tribe in Africa or a tribe in the Americas. He chose the Jews. Oh really? Why not choosing more then one group? Like one on this side of the globe and one of the other...and maybe one on the north pole too...and then in the end they would meet because they would all find out about each other and see how God was the God of many and the lover of all instead of singling one folk out and make them exempt? Or why not just picking the ones who where honestly looking for that God, who served him and believed in him like one here and one there...no force, no crazy demonstrations of his might, no killing of other folks through his folk but genuine love and compassion...would have worked too I guess. Why making it all bloody and brutal and why elevating a people above all the others? Why would that be the best way to choose to accomplish his goals? What does this say about that God you so firmly believe in? As you read my reply, please remember I really do believe in God. I accept the way God chose to interact in this world because he is God. My understanding of God is limited to what he has revealed in scripture. God the supreme being in the universe. His mind and intellect are beyond infinity compared to my mind and intellect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdelsolray Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 … I accept the way God chose to interact in this world because he is God. … Yeah, let's add a little circular reasoning into my skit. Spice is the variety of life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
♦ ficino ♦ Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 As you read my reply, please remember I really do believe in God. I accept the way God chose to interact in this world because he is God. My understanding of God is limited to what he has revealed in scripture. God the supreme being in the universe. His mind and intellect are beyond infinity compared to my mind and intellect. Thanks for another little piece of your autobiography, Ironhorse. It's exciting for us all to follow along as you talk about your beliefs, what you accept, and what you don't understand. I'm still waiting for a reason why I should go back to believing this stuff. As far as I know, it's a Big Lie with some good things mixed in. I should be convinced because.... ? 'cuz I'll go to Hell if I don't? Cuz being a Christian rocks? Hit me with your best shot. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 As you read my reply, please remember I really do believe in God. I accept the way God chose to interact in this world because he is God. My understanding of God is limited to what he has revealed in scripture. God the supreme being in the universe. His mind and intellect are beyond infinity compared to my mind and intellect. See? You are not agreeing to disagree. You keep pushing your religion even though it is just mental masturbation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdelsolray Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 As you read my reply, please remember I really do believe in God. I accept the way God chose to interact in this world because he is God. My understanding of God is limited to what he has revealed in scripture. God the supreme being in the universe. His mind and intellect are beyond infinity compared to my mind and intellect. See? You are not agreeing to disagree. You keep pushing your religion even though it is just mental masturbation. Well, Tin Pony's stated reason for being on this forum is (in his own words): "I'm here to try to present the Christian message and faith." We should not be surprised by his incessant promotion of his religion. Of course, he tries and fails. But that's a topic for another thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pratt Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 ironhorse claimed to have investigated and examined some/many/majority/all religions and he believed the christianity and biblical scripture to be true,,, who are you in exC to disagree,,,, have you folks done the same and diligent research as ironhorse claimed even how ridiculous he sounded? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moanareina Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 14 Behold, the heaven and the heaven of heavens is the Lord's thy God, the earth also, with all that therein is. 15 Only the Lord had a delight in thy fathers to love them, and he chose their seed after them, even you above all people, as it is this day. 16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked. 17 For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward. Deuteronomy chapter 10 ... So, god, who is not a respecter of persons, by his own admission delighted in the fathers of the Hebrews, chose their seed, and placed them above all people? Does this really sound like an omniscient being? To make a claim--"I have chosen this one people above all"-- and immediately contradict the very claim just made--"I am not a respecter of persons."? Does this really sound like the actions of an omnipotent god? To set one people above all others as an example, rather than being the example himself? Does this really sound like a god who is all-loving? To exalt his "chosen" ones over all of the others? ... Or does this sound like the myths of a particular people about their particular god trying to justify their particular existence and their particular politics and their particular wars? Instead of dropping gold tablets fro the sky or being visible to people on earth every day, God chose to work through history to reveal himself and to present his message. This required people. To best accomplish this goal he decided to work with a specific group. He could have chosen the Chinese or a tribe in Africa or a tribe in the Americas. He chose the Jews. Oh really? Why not choosing more then one group? Like one on this side of the globe and one of the other...and maybe one on the north pole too...and then in the end they would meet because they would all find out about each other and see how God was the God of many and the lover of all instead of singling one folk out and make them exempt? Or why not just picking the ones who where honestly looking for that God, who served him and believed in him like one here and one there...no force, no crazy demonstrations of his might, no killing of other folks through his folk but genuine love and compassion...would have worked too I guess. Why making it all bloody and brutal and why elevating a people above all the others? Why would that be the best way to choose to accomplish his goals? What does this say about that God you so firmly believe in? As you read my reply, please remember I really do believe in God. I accept the way God chose to interact in this world because he is God. My understanding of God is limited to what he has revealed in scripture. God the supreme being in the universe. His mind and intellect are beyond infinity compared to my mind and intellect. I know what you believe...and that is why you are screwed up. I say so because I have believed pretty much as you do and I was screwed up too. And pretty much everyone I know who believes that way is screwed up in one way or the other. Maybe you need to stop choosing to be stupid and start using the brain you got because if there is a God he obviously wants you to use it...or why would he give you one in the first place? If he was so much more intelligent and his ways are so much beyond your ability to think, you ll never outdo him anyways. But to use that as an excuse to say: His mind and intellect are beyond infinity compared to my mind and intellect and therefore I just trust him and his ways is the same as choosing to be stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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