Roz Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Let's talk tithe and offerings. I was one of the chumps who really did pay tithe and offerings regularly, something equivalent to a brand new car payment every month. For 2 and a half decades. Thinking about it now and the things I could've used that money on (buying property sooner, paying off student loans faster, taking a nice vacation, just plain saving/investing...) makes me sick. The old folks who are only a few years away from retirement do pay out close to 600 monthly. And they're worried about their golden years. Fuck... I would most likely support them (hey, they are family, for better or worse) but if they pay tithe from the money I give them... egh... People say that leasing a car is one of the worst financial things to do, but at least you get transportation out of it. How about taking a bunch of student loans? At least you get education out of the deal. What's the fucking upside to tithe? I paid into the system for decades and all that's left are 'treasures in heaven'... which is really to support several different pastors buy new cars, send their kids to private adventist schools, and oh yes lying to my face. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Jeff Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 I always heard that god would not bless you if you didn't tithe, but if you did so, the windows of heaven would open up and the blessings would pour down...what a stinking load of bullshit I know that is now! I was often barely able to scrape by back in my Christian days, and didn't have the money to tithe, so I rarely did. But I did regularly give of what little money I had hoping it would benefit someone worse off than me. How I wish I had even that back! And... I also sent money I didn't really have to spare to the 700 Club and at least a few times to TBN... *gags at the thought now* At least i was never gullible enough to fall for people like Robert Tilton (of Farting Preacher fame). He's made a fortune off of bilking gullible believers into sending him a $1000 vow of money, promising the blessings of god in return. I think assholes like him richly deserve the hilarious farting videos made from their broadcasts. They should be punished a hell of a lot more! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonymousCoward Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 I still tithe - only not to the church, but to secular charities. In a world that has given me so much (if you're middle class in a western nation, chances are you are the 1% or close to it) I feel the need to give back. The problem with giving to the church is that it's so self-serving. The majority of the money given to the church is there for the benefit only of those who attend or work at the church. Now, I feel there are a world of possibilities for positive change I can make in this world by giving money to improve the world. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 On the "windows of heaven" thing: I had one of those 'reasonable' apologetics done up in my mind for that one: "Clearly it can't mean money. It must mean something metaphorical ..." And nobody found that less convincing than fellow Christians did. But we'd been faithful. We'd gotten out of a very bad situation, and I found myself without a business for the second time in my life with a wife and a daughter. I felt responsible, found the standard apologetic wanting, and knew deep down what was up. I honestly felt embarrassed for believing something that clearly wasn't accurate. I could see that there was no statistical difference between Christians and nonchristians in the same income demographic. It's obvious to me the testimonies were always of a one-off event, not of actually improving someone's lot in life. To make it all make sense to.myself, I claimed I must be being tested, to see if I could or would endure. Only, as a husband, I would never do that, and the common belief is God is the husband of the church. And it would be abusive if I pulled a stunt like that as a father. Same thing. This only leads, via deductive thought, to one thing: the god with those exclusive properties, simply can't exist. Hence, I tried to modify the properties to keep in line with reality, but still maintain the Christian framework. There is nothing like being a loving, dutiful father and husband, trying to do the honorable thing, and ending up thereby disproving the Christian God's existence. I didn't know it then, can only see it now looking back. The irony is, millions of Christian women are taught what a better lover Jesus is, than that less spiritual man at home who can't do anything right. I don't know how the story ends for such women. But it can't be good. And fathers? Always to blame, and Father's Day the worst day at church. No, the promises on tithing ultimately helped open my eyes. I couldn't see it then, but I see it now with crystal clarity, and no blame, no shame. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 I buy a lot of equipment for myself every year. It is related to my business, and I make money off of it, but I still have felt very "guilty" when I buy them, because they really are just expensive toys for me. For instance, I have 6 guitars, all for different kinds of music I may be required to write (jazz, rock, metal, etc). I could very easily choose one guitar that could get acceptable results, but I always want "authenticity" in my work so I spend money every year collecting stuff. I stopped feeling bad last year after reading a similar tithe thread. I stepped back and did the math to figure how much I would be tithing if I still went to church. The money I spend on myself is nowhere near the amount of money I would be tithing to a church, on the order of $1,200/year more for the tithes! I can't believe how much money I would be giving away at 10% to the church, and I am a poor person who struggles to stay in the very bottom of the "middle class". I am disgusted to think how much money the Romney's and Bush's give away to these places at 10%… Perhaps if they didn't tithe they wouldn't be so upset about their tax bill... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mymistake Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 I tithed from the beginning. I gave 10% of my income even when I was on minimum wage. When I moved out on my own there came a time when I could not afford to keep my car repaired so I switched to a bicycle. I would ride my bicycle to church and kept tithing anyway. Then one night my bike got a flat on the way home from church. I had to walk for hours in the dark. And that still didn't change my thinking. My fundie relatives chipped in and got my car fixed. It was a faith building experience for me. Gawd moves in mysterious ways! I finally stopped tithing a couple of years ago. The change was instant. My family went from struggling to being debt free. I paid off all my credit cards like it was nothing because I stopped giving that money to the con artist at my church. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milesaway Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 I never got to the point where I was tithing, but that was something I worried about as I was getting ready to join that stupid church. I remember seeing people forking over their money and whipping out their checkbooks like crazy. A lot of these people were upper middle class, some were upper class, but seeing the ones who were working class pony up the cash that they probably couldn't afford to are the ones that stuck with me. If it weren't for that damn church hoovering their time and money, who knows how much better off they'd be. And the pastor had the nerve to whine for even more money on top of all that. Lame! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfuddled Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 I want my $$ back too, but unfortunately we're STILL tithing since my husband is still a believer. Talk about FRUSTRATING! I told him that it's his decision, but now I feel like I need to allot a chunk of money every month to go to a charity of MY choice, since that's essentially what he's doing. And don't get me started on the ridiculousness of the church taking advantage of the older generation. My 93 year old grandma is a devoted attendee, who lives on less than $1000 a month from SSI and savings. When my dad took over her finances to help her out, he found that she was giving over half of her monthly income to the church. She'd forget if she had tithed, so would tithe multiple times a month, as well as the "special" causes that seem to be there every week. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Jeff Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 I want my $$ back too, but unfortunately we're STILL tithing since my husband is still a believer. Talk about FRUSTRATING! I told him that it's his decision, but now I feel like I need to allot a chunk of money every month to go to a charity of MY choice, since that's essentially what he's doing. And don't get me started on the ridiculousness of the church taking advantage of the older generation. My 93 year old grandma is a devoted attendee, who lives on less than $1000 a month from SSI and savings. When my dad took over her finances to help her out, he found that she was giving over half of her monthly income to the church. She'd forget if she had tithed, so would tithe multiple times a month, as well as the "special" causes that seem to be there every week. My grandmother was extremely religious all of her adult life, as far as I know. She lived to be 87, and though I don't know for sure, she likely was a good Christian and tithed. My grandparents were not poor, but they didn't have a lot of money either. Whatever money they tithed could have gone to much better use! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
centauri Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 It's one of the most vile scams run by Christianity. It essentially says: "Give money unto God but send it to My address". 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Jeff Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 It's one of the most vile scams run by Christianity. It essentially says: "Give money unto God but send it to My address". Yes! God needs your money, but send it to me! Doesn't god own the cattle on a thousand hills, or something like that? Doesn't everything in the universe belong to him? Why would god need MY money? Or is it really god's and just on loan to me? I can't believe I ever fell for this shit. And, as I mentioned in an earlier reply, I can't believe people actually fall for Robert Tilton's scams. He is such an obvious fake and such a bad actor, yet he still manages to rake in millions from extremely gullible and desperate believers...it would be funny if it wasn't so sad... kind of like how I feel about the gullible believers who sold their houses and all of their material possessions a few years ago because of the sure and certain return of Jesus. And, of course, when he predictably failed to show up on schedule because he's just a myth, those people were left with little or nothing and were also left looking very foolish... it would be funny if it wasn't so tragic... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roz Posted September 3, 2014 Author Share Posted September 3, 2014 I want my $$ back too, but unfortunately we're STILL tithing since my husband is still a believer. Talk about FRUSTRATING! I told him that it's his decision, but now I feel like I need to allot a chunk of money every month to go to a charity of MY choice, since that's essentially what he's doing. And don't get me started on the ridiculousness of the church taking advantage of the older generation. My 93 year old grandma is a devoted attendee, who lives on less than $1000 a month from SSI and savings. When my dad took over her finances to help her out, he found that she was giving over half of her monthly income to the church. She'd forget if she had tithed, so would tithe multiple times a month, as well as the "special" causes that seem to be there every week. B... my heart really goes out to your family... My rage goes to that fucking church... she attends it, they KNOW she's over 90, and they SEE the amount of money she gives them... I remember the story of jesus and his disciples watching synagogue goers drop their cash, and in walks this old lady dropping her last 2 coins in the collection. What does he, the 'king of kings' and 'creator and owner of all things' do? Praises her as she plunks down her last income to him (hey, tithe is his remember?). Fuck him... fuck christianity... 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
centauri Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 It's one of the most vile scams run by Christianity. It essentially says: "Give money unto God but send it to My address". Yes! God needs your money, but send it to me! Doesn't god own the cattle on a thousand hills, or something like that? Doesn't everything in the universe belong to him? Why would god need MY money? Or is it really god's and just on loan to me? I can't believe I ever fell for this shit. And, as I mentioned in an earlier reply, I can't believe people actually fall for Robert Tilton's scams. He is such an obvious fake and such a bad actor, yet he still manages to rake in millions from extremely gullible and desperate believers...it would be funny if it wasn't so sad... kind of like how I feel about the gullible believers who sold their houses and all of their material possessions a few years ago because of the sure and certain return of Jesus. And, of course, when he predictably failed to show up on schedule because he's just a myth, those people were left with little or nothing and were also left looking very foolish... it would be funny if it wasn't so tragic... Sadly, the elderly are prime targets for these crooks. These preacher con men pick their pockets and still receive their blubbering thanks. What a great racket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milesaway Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 I want my $$ back too, but unfortunately we're STILL tithing since my husband is still a believer. Talk about FRUSTRATING! I told him that it's his decision, but now I feel like I need to allot a chunk of money every month to go to a charity of MY choice, since that's essentially what he's doing. And don't get me started on the ridiculousness of the church taking advantage of the older generation. My 93 year old grandma is a devoted attendee, who lives on less than $1000 a month from SSI and savings. When my dad took over her finances to help her out, he found that she was giving over half of her monthly income to the church. She'd forget if she had tithed, so would tithe multiple times a month, as well as the "special" causes that seem to be there every week. Aw, hell no! That's another thing that didn't sit right with me about church. I'd see these senior citizens putting money in the collection plates all the time, and I figured they were all wealthy at the time. Now I realize they were probably on fixed incomes like your grandma. My thoughts go out to you, and it breaks my heart to know that stupid church is fleecing your grandma the way they are. It pisses me off that this kind of thing is so commonplace too. If she's a regular at the services, and if they know her as well as I suspect they do, they should know damn well that she's on a fixed income and can't really afford to pony up the cash every time they whimper and whine about their "special causes". Instead of doing the right thing and giving those multiple tithes back to her to save for next time, they're happily taking advantage of her forgetfulness. And for what, their greed. Those sorry assholes! Can your dad take power of attorney for her? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
★ Citsonga ★ Posted September 7, 2014 Share Posted September 7, 2014 I tithed for years, giving 10% or more of my GROSS income (I felt that it was cheating God to only tithe off of net income as some do). I also sometimes gave additional money, and I also spent a lot of money on Christian music and books. I would LOVE to have that money back now that I know that it's a scam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
passerina Posted September 8, 2014 Share Posted September 8, 2014 I'm glad the scam has ended for DH and I. We always paid 20 percent since we were ultra faithful. It was on net income not gross, so I guess it could be worse? We were planning to tithe on our retirement income to make up for it. Lol doesn't seem quite appropriate here. I'm just going to think of the big 20% income bump we've given ourselves this year and not calculate how much we lost over the years... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RipVanWinkle Posted September 8, 2014 Share Posted September 8, 2014 I agree that money spent for tithing could have been much better spent for other things. But can we say that we xtians got nothing out of Xtianity? Some of us certainly can say just that. But for me, at least, I think I got something from it. When I was in junior high school I would browse through the NT on slow days, I would skip over those things that seemed too hard and focus on things I could easily understand. Some of Jesus' sayings made good sense to me. "Forgive, so that you may be forgiven," "Judge not that ye be not judged." "Love thy enemy."." Love thy neighbor as you love yourself." Also some of the parables got my attention. For example, "the prodigal son". The adulteress who was saved from stoning. "Where are thy accusers?" "They have all gone." "Nor do I accuse you. Go and sin no more." And many others. I don't suggest that as a thinking adult problems can't be spotted in many if not all lf these sayings and parables. But they are beautiful sentiments and attitudes that cane be read in each of the above, Every one of them, even "love thy enemies" which can't be followed literally, but it makes one think of the soldiers and the families of our enemies who have no choice but to do what they have to do as citizens of their country. That idea was never expressed in the OT There is at least a pearl of wisdom in each of these sayings. And they made a deep impression on me as a young man. bill Of course these same jewels of wisdom were available in the literature of other religions, but I didn't know that at the time. Also, later I discovered many inconsistencies in the bible and in the dogma itself as I grew and learned. So I finally rejected Xtianituy, But one of the things that took me so long were the pearls in the sayings and proverbs of Jesus. bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluechipx Posted September 16, 2014 Share Posted September 16, 2014 Check out my tithing chart. I am a member of Landover Baptist and I posted this awhile back. If you are not familiar with Landover, I'll say that the title is somewhat misleading to say the least. Do a google search on "Landover Baptist 60 second sermons" and it should be obvious! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SquareOne Posted September 16, 2014 Share Posted September 16, 2014 I'd like to give a kick into the crotch to the next pastor that asks for money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moanareina Posted September 16, 2014 Share Posted September 16, 2014 I did tithe and when I could not afford it I felt bad for it and intended to do so later when my next salary would come in...I got money twice from the church when I was in trouble. While I think ten percent of your salary is way too much I must say, if you go to one of those social clubs called church it is justified to pay something. While now I think this tithing and especially the teaching about it is insanity...like those who give will receive...what? You give because of the promise that you ll receive? That is no giving at all...not if you do so to the church and especially not if you give to someone in need. Now what I regret more than the money I gave the church is the time I gave them...without any reward. All those hours I worked for them, produced flyers and other graphic design products...all those hours I spent cleaning after services...all those hours I projected the song texts on the screen and got no appreciation for it, only people who told me what was wrong and where to do it better etc. And for sure no payment. That is wasted time for me. Time I could have found a hobby...also all those hours I spend in counseling with a totally unqualified person who had never even taken one lesson of counseling, only a short introduction by the pastor's wive. Turned out she was overwhelmed with me but did not find the courage to send me to a psychologist... Also I regret my last project I accepted where the guy who gave it to me promised to pay me. I already was in my questioning phase and after having already done a great amount of work I decided to give the project back. The guy told me I could tell him how much work I had done and they would pay that work to me...of course the payment never arrived... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rachel15 Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I did tithe too, and it was out of benefit payments for a health condition. I was crazily indoctrinated - and even had received budgeting advice from my group leader who had several holidays a year and a local debt advisor who both knew full well that I had just enough to live on and was meant to be using that money to help my recovery. Finally what really got to me was the fact that my tithe was contributing to a salary for my pastor (which the church didn't disclose) which enabled him to enjoy skiing holidays abroad on top of his regular family holiday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
directionless Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I am angry at myself for giving too much money to my church. I had the delusional idea that I should give away all my money and join a monastery. I gave away most of my savings. I don't make as much money as I used to make, so it is hard to rebuild my savings. What really makes me angry is my priest's behavior. He almost certainly knew that I was having psychosis, because I told him about several "visions" that I didn't understand. He was probably an atheist, so I'm sure he knew my "visions" were mental illness. Yet he came to "visit" me several times to "borrow" money (never to be repaid, but of course Jesus said we should not ask to be repaid). I know it is my own fault for being stupid, but I am angry that the priest would have so little respect for me as a human that he would rip me off like that. It's not as bad as taking money from elderly, but I was not in a rational state of mind. Maybe from his perspective he did not intend to rip me off. Looking at the positive side, that priest discouraged me when I wanted to visit a monastery, and he generally discouraged me from fasting or praying too much. So he may have prevented me from going further into religious extremism. I thank him for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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