Jump to content
Goodbye Jesus

I Don't Fit In... Anywhere.


Aiyana

Recommended Posts

  • Super Moderator

I am a blue-collar, intellectual, football loving, unathletic, Walmart and Hobby Lobby shopping, Trader Joe's shopping, pro-life, pretty-darn-close-to-atheist, crunchy, Coke drinking, fantasy genre loving, sci-fi hating, neo-Luddite, facebook addict, anxiety having, wannabe badass, road trip loving, freeway avoider, homeschooler, mother of a public high schooler, nature loving, SUV driving, rap and hip-hop loving, white suburban female.

 

Great, I finally meet the girl of my dreams when I'm already taken.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

LOL... it's a pretty complicated formula... but apparently it was my husband's dream girl formula too :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, except for the atheist part... I was still a Christian when we started dating!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's been ten months since I deconverted, six or seven since I came out publicly. I have been realizing lately that although I don't miss much about Christianity, I do miss having somewhere to fit in. Now, I fit in nowhere.

 

Nowhere religiously. I can't go to a liberal Christian church, because I don't feel liberal politically.

I can understand this.

 

I don't fit with atheists, because I don't consider myself a "hard" atheist.

Atheism isn't a church, it's just not believing any god-hypothesis presented to you thus far. 

 

I don't feel like I fit in here at ex-C, because I have a pro-life stance and really like football.

What does pro-life have anything to do with being ex-c?  I know non christians who are pro-life simply because they believe this life is the only life anyone's got.  I can understand their viewpoint just fine.  I'm of the opinion that it's best left to the individual parents.  And lots of ex-cs like football and futbol.

 

I don't fit in with football fans, because none of them seem to be interested in intellectual pursuits. I don't fit with intellectuals, because, again, I'm conservative politically.

??? Sorry I don't understand.  Lots of futbol/football fans are intellectuals, and lots of intellectuals are conservatives.

 

But I don't fit in with political conservatives, either, because I have too much interest in the "crunchy" lifestyle. And I don't fit in with crunchy people because I still drink Coke and think kids sometimes just need a good spanking on their butts.

mmm butt spanking...

 

I am a blue-collar, intellectual, football loving, unathletic, Walmart and Hobby Lobby shopping, Trader Joe's shopping, pro-life, pretty-darn-close-to-atheist, crunchy, Coke drinking, fantasy genre loving, sci-fi hating, neo-Luddite, facebook addict, anxiety having, wannabe badass, road trip loving, freeway avoider, homeschooler, mother of a public high schooler, nature loving, SUV driving, rap and hip-hop loving, white suburban female.

 

Where the fuck do I fit???

Welcome to Ex-C, pull up a chair, have a beer, and there's a hockey game on! 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

LOL fweethawt... yes, I am one of those people who insists that sci-fi and fantasy are two different genres. My husband hates that I say that! I love fantasy, but sci-fi, not so much. Bring on the gnomes and talking animals, but no robots or space travel! 

 

I have the same gripe. Why are they in the same section? It's like petrol and diesel. They're both fuel but it's crucial you don't mix them up. I hate it when I'm in the middle of a sci fi book and then animals and gnomes start talking. 

 

Haha... that's funny. P.S. I used to live in South Africa.

 

 

Awesome place this country if you ignore the politics. But hey, that's probably true for any country in the world.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

 

LOL fweethawt... yes, I am one of those people who insists that sci-fi and fantasy are two different genres. My husband hates that I say that! I love fantasy, but sci-fi, not so much. Bring on the gnomes and talking animals, but no robots or space travel! 

 

I have the same gripe. Why are they in the same section? It's like petrol and diesel. They're both fuel but it's crucial you don't mix them up. I hate it when I'm in the middle of a sci fi book and then animals and gnomes start talking. 

 

Haha... that's funny. P.S. I used to live in South Africa.

 

 

Awesome place this country if you ignore the politics. But hey, that's probably true for any country in the world.

 

I'd love to go back and visit someday... my dad's whole side of the family is still there.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

LOL fweethawt... yes, I am one of those people who insists that sci-fi and fantasy are two different genres. My husband hates that I say that! I love fantasy, but sci-fi, not so much. Bring on the gnomes and talking animals, but no robots or space travel! 

 

I'd argue that Science Fiction and Fantasy are the same genre, just told from different perspectives. I view Sci-Fi as being the masculine version of fantasy and fantasy as being the feminine version of science fiction. One of the definitions of science is: "a systematically organized body of knowledge on a particular subject." I shorten that to "a body of knowledge". That's all science really is and that broad term can apply to any number of things, really.

 

The great debate between sci-fi and fantasy will always be that sci-fi insists on having a touch of reality to it, while fantasy doesn't care about reality in the slightest. The two genres are really the same thing, imo. Sci-fi just legitimizes itself by being set in the future or an alternate reality where society is advanced and progress is a shiny new something-or-the-other. The heroes save the day (or not) and the world might end (or not) but no one cares because humanity has technology and that's enough to keep living for, I guess. Fantasy doesn't play by those rules, preferring that things be alive (no robots, no human-created creatures most of the time). Fantasy is about feeling, relationship, morals, mythology and those are things that science fiction is awkward about in most cases, imho.

 

If you want to follow this to its logical conclusion (fwiw, jmvho), science fiction is mostly godless (atheist, agnostic) or presents man and his technology as god (humanistic or mechanistic), whereas fantasy tends to be more spiritual, open to the idea of there being something eternal (outside of time) and forces beyond our control (nature, magic). Fantasy actually mirrors reality as it was for thousands of years. Science fiction is merely a rogue form of fantasy for modern times, espousing the mythology of our time (man as master, progress is good, necessary evil for the greater good, logic rules supreme, many others).

 

In modern literature, you will often find that science fiction is pretty rigid. Sci-fi almost always means dystopian, war epics, space operas, technological empires, robots, etc. It's been awhile since anyone has written anything that doesn't fit into one or more of those molds. In fact, there is a bit of a crisis in the SF writer's world in regards to this. Apparently, science fiction no longer inspires young people as it once did. Not that surprising, imho. It's all about technology worship or depressing bits where humanity succumbs to machine rule or is at war over X. Gone are the days of imaginative political symbolism or complex utopic dreamscapes. As a whole, I find science fiction to be interesting. It's something that I enjoy reading from time to time and I write a lot of it for fun, but I find myself lacking inspiration these days.

 

Fantasy has more latitude, but a lot of younger people don't read it these days. The classics like LOTR and Narnia and a few big series like Wheel of Time and that's about it. The feminine voice of mythology and the creative complexities that go along with imagining whole worlds from scratch is a dying art. A lot of this has to do with writer's writing for the market (what sells) vs. writing for readers or personal fulfillment (which may or may not sell). Twilight and Hunger Games knock-offs sell well, so the Fantasy genre has become geared towards those sorts of things nowadays. Nothing wrong with either (although Hunger Games is more a dystopic sci-fi with political overtones than fantasy, imho).

 

It's just that it has been nearly a decade since Harry Potter wrapped up. (7 years, to be exact.) There hasn't been anything really exciting in the genre since then and HP was just a modern rehash of the older series from the 30s-50s and the wizards tales of old. Not really groundbreaking and in all honestly, severely lacking in depth beyond what the fandom reads into it. Which is pretty fucking sad considering that Disney was still making films based on Narnia during the early 00s and LOTR and The Hobbit are still pop culture forces in modern times. HP will likely become a dusty relic within the next 20-30 years and it is highly unlikely that future generations will be enamored with HP & Co like my generation was.

 

Anyway, this is a tangent from me. I'm currently brainstorming for a science fiction (perhaps fantasy, who knows?) novel that I am going write a rough draft of next month. So all of this weights heavy on my mind currently. I'd like write something that inspires the kids of today, but what is that exactly? More technology doesn't seem to be the answer and I don't want to write yet another "end of the world, brave souls overcome obstacles to restore society blah blah" story. What else is there? Maybe the world should be overrun by magic, lol. tongue.png

 

------

 

As for being different and not fitting in, I wouldn't place too much emphasis on that around here. We're all individuals and we mostly come from different places, and different variants of Christianity. In my case, I was a Messianic Jew. If you are interested, click the "Former Faith" link in my signature. Since my background differs from many here on ex-c, I don't often find common ground in theological or biblical discussions here. That's ok. There are plenty of other discussions to have, I think.

 

Also, I wouldn't get discouraged because people disagree with you on such a hot button issue as abortion (you mentioned this in a previous post, I didn't quote it). Whatever works for you, should be good enough for you and yours. That's what I think anyway. Some people get caught up on issues like abortion, thinking that if they just say the "one right thing", everyone will come to their senses and things will be a-ok. Online discussions rarely work that way and it is best not to invest too much of yourself in such things. Especially when you are deconverting. Part of the process is examining your path, your old thoughtspace and testing new ideas to see what works and what doesn't. Some things (like a pro-life stance or other personal or political views) may not change when you give up belief in Christ and all that goes along with it. Then again, some of those sorts of things might change along the way. You won't know until you engage in discussions, read, research, and write and/or talk it out. cool.png

 

~seven77

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sci-fi and fantasy are definitely two different genres!

 

Sometimes it's not always obvious which is which though...

 

After all, I would say that Star Wars is fantasy, not sci-fi.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I never really understood why they call it science fiction. I could never really see the science in it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well I'm glad you have checked out Druidry and other things. I'm an atheist but can't be said to be a "hard" atheist. I don't do any supernatural, but understand the most do. I even like the idea of certain supernatural things, like a goddess for instance, but I don't believe there is one.

Also, atheists, and pagans, are not all liberals. Many are nonstatist types. I have a lot of the nonstatist freethinking tendencies myself though am no longer a registered libertarian. I've learned over the years there's a surprising number of pro-life women who aren't Christians. I know we have heard the narrative that all pro-lifers are males controlling women, and so finding this out about women feeling that way, was new to me.

I think if yu find out your pagan, or atheist even, you'll find there are a lot more types of thought, and a lot more room for thought differences. There is no orthodoxy demanding you conform. Even in the atheist community, you have people who could be said to be conservative, folks who support the rights of us dads, and on the opposite extreme you have folks like those involved in the now-infamous "elevatorgate" with Rebecca Watson, organizing what dress can be worn by women at atheist conferences, dictating activities and so forth, something similar to a left version of a Jesus camp.

There's some of us, myself included, who vote to support legalization of marijuana, and others who oppose it. Even among the pagans there's a whole host of variety.

I personally find it helpful to steer clear of some of the more dogmatic types. But, I personally celebrate humanity and individual human autonomy, and that just doesn't square very well with anybody's dogma.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks again to everyone who has responded. I think I am a victim to my own prejudices, formed in the bubble I lived in for twelve years as a Christian.

 

seven77, I like your definition of the differences between sci-fi and fantasy, and I totally agree with them. I think it speaks a lot to my personality why I like one and not the other. I think it very much ties in to the reasons I was drawn to religion in my younger days, also. I could sit and self-analyze it all for a long time, but I have to feed these darn kids dinner. ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sorry you feel that way.  Just to let you know most atheists are soft atheists.  But there really isn't any thing to fit into with atheists.  We are just a group of people that lack one thing.  It makes us a very diverse group.

 

Sounds like you belong here just fine.  I'm pro abortion rights but I don't hold your views against you.  Maybe the feeling will improve with time.

 

As an atheist I don't feel I lack anything. I actually gained something by not having religion. I gained freedom and truth.

 

I belong any place other humans are just like the rest of you :)

 

I fit in with me and that is enough for me. It should be enough for others as well that I know what and who I am. Accept me as that or move on.

 

I bet you fit in great, don't sell yourself short and do it on your own terms. You only get this life.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I never really understood why they call it science fiction. I could never really see the science in it.

 

it is science fiction when it has a basis in our modern science even if it is far out there.

 

It is space fantasy or space opera when there is no explanation or even an attempt to explain things that seeminly are science but there is no knowledge of for the reader/viewer.

 

 

example (and don't shoot me over it since this is widely debated)

 

Star Wars = Space operatic because they make zero attempt to really explain things like propulsion or weapons or hyperspace travel. it just works and they understand it.

 

Star Trek = Science Fiction because they talk about and relate the things of the future to things in science in the past (our present and before) even if it is just theory they base it on things we know now.

 

This is just how I see it but I have heard professors argue it this way as well in classes about writing and creative fiction works.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm with the majority here RE: the Sscience fiction / fantasy argument. I found seven77's post particularly enlightening on the topic.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's been ten months since I deconverted, six or seven since I came out publicly. I have been realizing lately that although I don't miss much about Christianity, I do miss having somewhere to fit in. Now, I fit in nowhere.

 

Nowhere religiously. I can't go to a liberal Christian church, because I don't feel liberal politically. I don't fit with atheists, because I don't consider myself a "hard" atheist. I don't feel like I fit in here at ex-C, because I have a pro-life stance and really like football. I don't fit in with football fans, because none of them seem to be interested in intellectual pursuits. I don't fit with intellectuals, because, again, I'm conservative politically. But I don't fit in with political conservatives, either, because I have too much interest in the "crunchy" lifestyle. And I don't fit in with crunchy people because I still drink Coke and think kids sometimes just need a good spanking on their butts.

 

I am a blue-collar, intellectual, football loving, unathletic, Walmart and Hobby Lobby shopping, Trader Joe's shopping, pro-life, pretty-darn-close-to-atheist, crunchy, Coke drinking, fantasy genre loving, sci-fi hating, neo-Luddite, facebook addict, anxiety having, wannabe badass, road trip loving, freeway avoider, homeschooler, mother of a public high schooler, nature loving, SUV driving, rap and hip-hop loving, white suburban female.

 

Where the fuck do I fit???

I was born and raised in LA and even though I have lived in lots of other places, the thing I love about that city is that it's an entire city filled with a bunch of people who don't really fit anywhere else. Where else do you have the extremely rich, the dirt poor, every color and ethnic group under the sun, rap stars to movie stars to country stars to porn stars, to liberals to conservatives, to gang members to drug dealers to business titans to surfers to neo-nazi's to gays, straights and transgendered all crammed into one big city? That would be LA. And I guess that describes me also, I have a very broad mix of tastes/interests/preferences that sometimes seem in conflict with each other to the casual observer (they are not), and I really don't fit in any pre-defined box of stereotypes or labels that we humans seem to want to put everyone into.

 

Let me ask you this - what exactly does it mean to "fit in"? Even more important, why would anyone aspire to "fit in"? While it's true that people need to get along to form friendships, relationships, obtain employment, get along with neighbors, etc., where's the rule book that says we're all supposed to be clones of each other? To be honest, I like that I have a diverse mix of views, preferences and likes/dislikes that don't conform to a particular lifestyle, political ideology or psychological profile. It makes for interesting discussion/debate because I am very confident in who I am and I don't compromise. I couldn't have it any other way, or I would be too bored smile.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

When I first left Christianity, I had this feeling like I couldn't fit in anywhere because no one else had the right combination of interests/personality and no one else could possibly understand me. It turned out that people weren't as judgmental as me as I was of them.

 

Over time, I've become much more ok with accepting that friendship happens on different levels. When I met one of my friends, many years ago, I immediately assumed that she wasn't worth getting to know because we clearly had little in common. One major thing is that she watches a lot of TV and I don't watch any, and she likes to talk about TV shows to other people who watch the same ones. So I wrongly assumed that's all she had to talk about. It was really easy to pigeonhole her. I still don't watch TV and she still doesn't run or bike or ski with me. We found other reasons to connect - liking some of the same books, trying new beers, and ultimately just being open to being friends.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't have much of an answer except I feel the same. I'm pursuing new-ish non-C interests and hoping I eventually fit into a new community somewhere.

 

xox

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think one of the problems in Christinsanity is that everyone is supposed to automagically love one another because we all love the Lord.

Stop and think about it: We're not loving one another in that environment, we're loving one another's love for the Lord, so the individuals become a moot point.

I knew a woman who went to Christian singles events, and her big, justifiable (in my opinion), complaint was, everyone just talks about Church and the Lord and the Spirit. You never get to know the person. And she was, and is, very evangelical. But. She's right. Not just singles: Men's groups where you're to conform and be one of a few tropes: cannon fodder for Jebus, the disposable male blamed for everything. Women's groups, well I wasn't there, but have heard similar if polar opposite complaints.

So, did we really fit in as Christians?

Even if you weren't a doubter, often on the wrong side of dogma, often raising the 'concerns' of other people, even if instead you were center stage and really fit in: Did you really? Or was that the response of people who believed everything that you did, and it was all around belief?

I don't know: I'm not a very dogma-friendly individual, a bit of a renegade, a rogue perhaps. Not because I set out to be this way, but it just happens. And I think part of breaking the bubble is realizing what we had by the 'fitting in.'

That isn't to say there weren't Christians who were sincere and friends. There were, at least in my case. People who I would still respect if we were around one another, even though they'd not agree with my conclusions RE: belief. But truth be told, I saw them struggle too. Struggle with fitting in, gaining acceptance from the cookie cutter crowd.

Now that we're unplugged from the matrix, we can just acknowledge that this is what we are. We have no pretense to uphold anymore.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Losing community is one of the biggest downsides to leaving Christianity. I think we have all experienced what you're feeling. 

 

One of the most mature things you can do is to recognize that you have to evaluate human beings one at a time. There are some amazingly great Atheists and there are some who are complete assholes. You find this dynamic in any group of people.

 

I have several Christian friends who respect the fact that I cannot accept Christianity. I have also made some really close friends on this site. We communicate via email, social media, Skype, and stuff like that. This has helped me tremendously in the past few years. (If there's someone here that you want to meet one on one, click on their avatar then click on the "Send me a message" link.)

 

This community here is fantastic and I think you'll get a lot of help and friendship here. It's the IRL stuff that is a bit harder. You could always go to MeetUp.com and find groups that have similar interests. There are also atheist/agnostic groups in lots of communities.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Guidelines.