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Goodbye Jesus

Discovering My Spirituality - Would Like Your Input!


Learner

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Hello, all!  I am new to this forum.  I only deconverted this past year after doing in-depth study of "the other side" issues (historical-biblical criticism, science and evolution, comparative religions, etc).  I am very interested and excited to share some thoughts I've had on spirituality since my deconversion to get any input or direction from others.  I want to share my very-early personal thoughts/formulations on spirituality with all of you: please share anything helpful from your experience that you think would be valuable in my journey, and please let me know a "spiritual" direction I could pursue based on what my thoughts and beliefs are sounding like to you.  (Like "Hey, what you're describing sounds a lot like ____...you should check out ___ for more information.")
 

I have always been a spiritual person...as a Christian, I always felt the need to pray to God and share each day with Him, felt like my soul yearned for something higher than and outside of myself, etc.  Before I became a non-believer, I thought atheists were all anti-spiritual and out to disprove anything spiritual.  But, now after more reading and study and encounters with other non-believers, I see this isn't the case at all.  Since deconverting, I've felt these unmet spiritual needs and still feel spiritual, but don't know what to turn to although I have some early reflections and thoughts.  "Atheist," as I use it, simply means I don't have a belief in a theistic god or any organized religions...I don't believe in anything that can't be proven by evidence.  But that is entirely different thing than sensing an awe of the universe and being wrapped up with joy and intrigue at the thought and contemplation of it all.  (I'm still not sure I fully understand how I can long-for/feel the spiritual, but only believe what's proved by evidence...I mean, I see no evidence that there is a spiritual realm out there.  I know what I feel, and I don't think I'm feeling anything irrational.  I just haven't thought this all through very much yet.  Maybe I'm just wrangling with terminology of what "spiritual" means.)

So my beliefs right now involve, first, that I feel spiritual and still feel as if I have a soul that yearns for something greater than myself, awes over contemplating the cosmos and the wonder and interrelatedness of it all, at its size and age and beauty, etc.  I don't think I'd say I'm a mystic, but I'd be open to mystic experiences.  I feel like there's something I should thank for life and experiences and all.  Second, I believe everything is one.  Just as all of life is from common origins, we are all part of the cosmos, we are all star-stuff.  Third, I wouldn't say I believe reincarnation in the sense that I'll die and have another conscious existence...but I believe the universe shows a sort of reincarnation in the sense that we are star-stuff, which is the result of previous stars that existed and went supernova.  When an animal eats a plant, the animal benefits eating the plant...but one day the animal will die and thus provide nutrition for soil and a growing plant.  I see everything as being interconnected in this way.  Fourth, I find the typical arguments for a God lacking in the sense that it's illogical to say that intelligence requires an intelligent designer, because what intelligence then designed the intelligent designer?  So maybe nature is all there is...nature is what brought us into existence.

I'm not a philosopher, and these are still very new thoughts I'm formulating in my mind and struggling to adequately describe to you all.  I can't even begin to describe how incredible of a feeling it is to allow myself to pursue what I believe deep inside is the truth, rather than forcing religious dogma into my head and forcing myself to try to believe it as if it's reality (that never worked).  (I think many Christians, speaking as a former Christian, have a hard time truly believing what they believe is reality because they know deep down it's not true...and that's why it's so hard to really believe.)  I must say, it's such a completely new experience and journey into spirituality without expecting some divinely-authoritative exclusivist religion.  Any direction you could point me in or any input you could provide based on what I described above would be very welcome and helpful!  Thank you!

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Welcome, Learner!  I'm glad that you're enjoying your newly found naturalistic sense of awe.  Even those of us who know longer consider ourselves spiritual can enjoy the awe and wonder of the universe and the connections we have with what fills and surrounds our bodies and our consciousness.  I hope to eventually make the time and space to meditate and experience a deeper connection with the cosmos.

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I know what you are saying… I have some of the same feelings and is why I am sort of a non-religious neo-pagan (yet in some ways also an atheist). Nature fills me with a deep and profound awe.. all of it, and if anything is spiritual - it's that feeling.

 

Welcome to Ex-C!  

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Thank you for your post, Learner.  There are quite a few of us spiritual, but not religious people here. Its nice that you are open to experiences. I think everyone's journey is very individual. I am Buddhist.

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Learner, spirituality is certainly not limited to any particular outlook.

 

Neither can it be pigeon-holed as to what it should be.

 

It is your relationship with reality.  How you relate and negotiate that reality is up to you.

 

I believe the main point is balance.  In particular, be confident in following your own conscience, but cautious not to over-reach yourself (particularly if you decide to pursue altered states of consciousness type approaches).

 

Beyond that, it's your journey - enjoy the ride.

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Agreed with other posters here.

I think if you figure out what it is you need out of spirituality you can more easily find what you're looking for. There is a "belief gene" hypothesis afoot, and I think it's too soon to tell, but there are people who feel they get something out of ritual, belief in deities or external powers, and so forth. Again, pretty complicated to find out, but you shouldn't short change yourself in pursuing what it is you need. Perhaps, find out what it is you need or want.

What did you like about spiritual experiences before? What did you dislike? What did you find instructive? Destructive? That sort of thing. I know belief in deities works differently, but you said "spiritual" which can encompass any number of things. I would personally caution against any system that requires belief, just in case you end up finding it unbelievable.

I met a woman at an atheist meetup recently, who described for us what it's like, as much as she could, for some feminist pagan friends of hers. Theirs is a world where their goddesses don't have the problem of evil, because they don't have the ttrifold paradoxes, omnipotence, omniscience, and omnipresence. Also, their goddesses just are, and do not require belief. They are apparently so uninjured by lack of belief that the woman in our atheist group could go to their ritual activities and participate in some form, and they didn't perceive their goddesses as being offended. In fact, some of the crowd even acknowledged that dopamine and oxytosin were likely the causes of the good feeling they got. So, it's clear, you can participate in at least some systems without the dogmatic reliance on belief and adherence.

Then again, I also find that working on a community project with people can stimulate the same effects. I don't know anything about mysticism really, and have had few of what people call spiritual experiences, especially outside of the sphere of a group with preconceived ideas.  But there's a lot of smart people who do. Although I am personally an atheist, I kind of resent other fellow atheists acting like theists or spiritual types are les intelligent than we are.

Ultimately, I hope you find what you're looking for, and more than that, you enjoy the journey.

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I have always been a spiritual person...as a Christian, I always felt the need to pray to God and share each day with Him, felt like my soul yearned for something higher than and outside of myself, etc.  Before I became a non-believer, I thought atheists were all anti-spiritual and out to disprove anything spiritual.  But, now after more reading and study and encounters with other non-believers, I see this isn't the case at all.  Since deconverting, I've felt these unmet spiritual needs and still feel spiritual, but don't know what to turn to although I have some early reflections and thoughts.

You might want to check out the Sam Harris book "Waking Up: Spirituality without Religion"

 

 

"Atheist," as I use it, simply means I don't have a belief in a theistic god or any organized religions...I don't believe in anything that can't be proven by evidence.  But that is entirely different thing than sensing an awe of the universe and being wrapped up with joy and intrigue at the thought and contemplation of it all.

What you are describing (awe at the universe) is natural pantheism. You'll find it on Wikipedia.

 

 

Maybe I'm just wrangling with terminology of what "spiritual" means.)

Yes, I went through the same thing. Sometimes the terminology is a problem. Trust your feelings, only you know what you need.

 

So my beliefs right now involve, first, that I feel spiritual and still feel as if I have a soul that yearns for something greater than myself, awes over contemplating the cosmos and the wonder and interrelatedness of it all, at its size and age and beauty, etc.  I don't think I'd say I'm a mystic, but I'd be open to mystic experiences.

Hi, I'm a mystic. If you want a mystic experience you could try meditation (but there are no guarantees). I find meditation very helpful in general. Being a panentheist, I often get a feeling of connection to the universe through meditation.

 

Feel free to tell us more, you have an interesting perspective. Let us know how we can help.

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