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Goodbye Jesus

A Scary Thought(Apparent Fact) That Most Christians Seem To Say


VahnBlue

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i decided to post about this, simply because it was/is something that I heard and continue to hear. Most recently from a close Christian friend of mine, who was the first person, that I came out as an Atheist to. He said, "well if there is no God, then what is the point of anything? What is the point of even living?"

 

 

What...the fuck?....

 

It was then that, right after when he had asked me, that there was no point of bothering to continue on with ORIGINAL topic -- which was him asking me to help him understand where I was coming from. I did not think it was even possible at that point(I wasn't close to as knowledgable as I am now and him being very deep inside this, this cult) but if someone is that content inside, why even bother breaking their foundation a part? It also brought me to a closely related point: if religion is the only thing keeping a certain person(many, but not all) within our society's moral standpoint, in to a sense of extreme, radical, depression, and the possibility of unleashing a sense of sociopathy, capable of murder and all that, out in reality where there, technically, is no after-death punishment; then there comes a point where you just have to let someone live in their delusion of religion, because you never know that you might be breaking the chains of an inner, destructive, beast, who could be either a friend or a loved one.

 

All this is spoken in a general sense, of course. Nobody or group in particular, except for maybe people that you knew or saw; that had barely any sense of empathy, on a path of destruction and terror before religion came into their life and all that went away, or someone who shows extreme signs of being a danger to society, if they were not kept chained to religion. Stripping that away from them and it's possible that they might revert back, or in one's case who was already born and grew up in it, START down the path once broken free.

 

Idk just a thought. It's particularly a reason of mine as to why I, personally, don't even try to give people reasons to think critically of religion, even when some try to see everything from that perspective. I don't have the heart to even give them push into breaking their foundation, let alone taking a possible risk that a person can go in to multiple paths of either going into super depression, a damn near vegetable/catatonic state, suicide, or a vicious beast, once freed. I couldn't have that on my conscious and would feel terrible.

 

What are y'all thoughts on this?

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I think that anyone that has the potential to act as you have described, is going to act that way regardless. What we do know is that there are plenty people who "found God" after being locked up.

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i decided to post about this, simply because it was/is something that I heard and continue to hear. Most recently from a close Christian friend of mine, who was the first person, that I came out as an Atheist to. He said, "well if there is no God, then what is the point of anything? What is the point of even living?"

 

 

 

What reason for living does God provide? What 'point' does God provide? If your reason for life is to obsess over silent invisible supernatural beings who probably dont really exist...then I suppose atheism might let you down... :-)

 

The point of living as an atheist might be to enjoy reality just as it comes.

The point of living as an atheist might be freedom from guilt, fear, shame, thought crime....

 

Try replacing God with "Mental Illness" ...."If there is no mental illness, what is the point of anything...." Hmmm. haha.

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Religion does more harm than good. I'd say play the odds.

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i decided to post about this, simply because it was/is something that I heard and continue to hear. Most recently from a close Christian friend of mine, who was the first person, that I came out as an Atheist to. He said, "well if there is no God, then what is the point of anything? What is the point of even living?"

 

 

What reason for living does God provide? What 'point' does God provide? If your reason for life is to obsess over silent invisible supernatural beings who probably dont really exist...then I suppose atheism might let you down... :-)

 

The point of living as an atheist might be to enjoy reality just as it comes.

The point of living as an atheist might be freedom from guilt, fear, shame, thought crime....

 

Try replacing God with "Mental Illness" ...."If there is no mental illness, what is the point of anything...." Hmmm. haha.

lol but then you have Christians, like me friend, who say they don't feel any of that, that you've described. Then what? I personally didn't have an answer for it.
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I agree with Bedouin. People with psychological or personality disorders are going to behave in the way their brain is set whether religion is present or not. My parents are christians and they both have narcissistic personality problem and were abusive... I think the chances of freeing a good and sensible person from their religious prison are better for impacting the world positively. 

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I think it is impossible for us to know what effects enlightening a Xtian will have on him/her in advance, if indeed we have the ability to do that. The only way  Xtians  will deconvert is if they allow themselves to let the truth inside. Once they open their minds I believe they have made an irreversible step. They will continue to search to one degree or another for the answer. We can help them with that , but not until they have broken down the dam that has imprisoned their minds. Whether they deconvert will depend upon how well they do their search for the  truth.

 

We must look at the big picture. On the whole will is it be better to assist Xtians who are at long last willing to search for the truth or to leave them in ignorance for fear that they will not be able to handle it? My belief is that the vast majority of Xtians who have doubts, but are willing to search for the truth about their faith will be better off by far when they discover the truth. Those few who are damaged psychologically by discovery of harsh reality..would be better dealt with by secular counselling than by continuing to look to the church which will feed them the same old bullshit. So I say help those Xtians who have doubts, despite the minimal risks.  bill/Rip

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All this is spoken in a general sense, of course. Nobody or group in particular, except for maybe people that you knew or saw; that had barely any sense of empathy, on a path of destruction and terror before religion came into their life and all that went away, or someone who shows extreme signs of being a danger to society, if they were not kept chained to religion. Stripping that away from them and it's possible that they might revert back, or in one's case who was already born and grew up in it, START down the path once broken free.

 

iraq-bush.jpg

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All this is spoken in a general sense, of course. Nobody or group in particular, except for maybe people that you knew or saw; that had barely any sense of empathy, on a path of destruction and terror before religion came into their life and all that went away, or someone who shows extreme signs of being a danger to society, if they were not kept chained to religion. Stripping that away from them and it's possible that they might revert back, or in one's case who was already born and grew up in it, START down the path once broken free.

iraq-bush.jpg

lol true
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I'll be honest with you all. As I journey through my own deconversion I have found myself asking the same question in the OP's first post.

 

"If God doesn't exist, if all of this is a lie, then what's the point? Why go on living?"

 

Granted its not a nice thought, but it comes none the less. I think for me at least Christianity became a large part of who I was. I've struggled for acceptance much of my life, gone through difficult times and found loving myself for who I am a challenge. God and Christianity gave answers to all that - I was set apart because I was God's child, I found belonging within the Church, everything that happened to me happened for a reason and I was special because God loved me.

 

Now that all of that crumbles away I find myself empty and lost. I am no longer special, what worth I believed I had was in a being that didn't exist. Things just happen, there is no rhyme or reason for them. There is no great plan to be a part of, no special mission and its loss is keenly felt.

 

Of course there is a part of me that knows this will pass in time, that it is simply the grief of losing what was once so important to me. But for now it is very real and painful.

 

I'd like to make clear that I in no way wish to go on a crazed murder spree, nor do I feel my morality has suffered. These are very inward focusing thoughts and perhaps those of you thay can't understand my current frame of mind can be reassured by that.

 

Hopefully you don't all think I'm a crazy person now.

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I'll be honest with you all. As I journey through my own deconversion I have found myself asking the same question in the OP's first post.

 

"If God doesn't exist, if all of this is a lie, then what's the point? Why go on living?"

 

Granted its not a nice thought, but it comes none the less. I think for me at least Christianity became a large part of who I was. I've struggled for acceptance much of my life, gone through difficult times and found loving myself for who I am a challenge. God and Christianity gave answers to all that - I was set apart because I was God's child, I found belonging within the Church, everything that happened to me happened for a reason and I was special because God loved me.

 

Now that all of that crumbles away I find myself empty and lost. I am no longer special, what worth I believed I had was in a being that didn't exist. Things just happen, there is no rhyme or reason for them. There is no great plan to be a part of, no special mission and its loss is keenly felt.

 

Of course there is a part of me that knows this will pass in time, that it is simply the grief of losing what was once so important to me. But for now it is very real and painful.

 

I'd like to make clear that I in no way wish to go on a crazed murder spree, nor do I feel my morality has suffered. These are very inward focusing thoughts and perhaps those of you thay can't understand my current frame of mind can be reassured by that.

 

Hopefully you don't all think I'm a crazy person now.

 

the problem I see here is that you thought you were special to begin with. All that does is put a ton of pressure on you to perform up to some level that isn't even real in the first place.

 

it is not that you are ordinary but we all sort of are. When all is said and done for most of us we are average.

 

I find that a lot of christians feel special or think they are special and better than others. Why?

 

The majority of people on the earth believe in some god or another and feel special but it is the atheist and those that refuse to buy into religion that are the minority or the special ones. It is easy to follow the mass. Instead you are OUT. you broke out and stopped doing that and became special :)

 

You are on the right track.

 

People talk about going on a "spree" cause they lost god or that someone might do that but I have never met anyone that because they stopped believing in god wanted to go out and have a crime spree... why would anyone think that is the normal reaction? I have never believed and never felt like I was morally deficient. Of course I deal with ethics far more than morals because morals start forcing you eventually to have a belief system and I prefer to have an idea system. it is just easy to change ideas and far less painful.

 

You are not crazy just coming out of something difficult and your mind just needs some time to adjust.

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i decided to post about this, simply because it was/is something that I heard and continue to hear. Most recently from a close Christian friend of mine, who was the first person, that I came out as an Atheist to. He said, "well if there is no God, then what is the point of anything? What is the point of even living?"

 

If someone would ask me that, I think I'd probably respond with something like, "What? Are you suggesting that I commit suicide? Shame on you!"

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gwM5e6i.jpg

 

Religion teaches followers to not think, and emphasizes belief. It holds out a carrot of bliss for the future and the approval of a father figure in the meantime, and sometimes contrasts that with punishment for the future and meaninglessness for now. Meaning is something we always assign, so life can mean whatever we like it to, and we can choose to pursue nearly any direction we like. But people often like to be sold an answer that seems authoritative even when it is bogus. Sales techniques by Zig Ziglar were often pushed in the first church I attended.

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i decided to post about this, simply because it was/is something that I heard and continue to hear. Most recently from a close Christian friend of mine, who was the first person, that I came out as an Atheist to. He said, "well if there is no God, then what is the point of anything? What is the point of even living?"

If someone would ask me that, I think I'd probably respond with something like, "What? Are you suggesting that I commit suicide? Shame on you!"

lol that's funny. I never thought about it in that way.
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i decided to post about this, simply because it was/is something that I heard and continue to hear. Most recently from a close Christian friend of mine, who was the first person, that I came out as an Atheist to. He said, "well if there is no God, then what is the point of anything? What is the point of even living?"

 

If someone would ask me that, I think I'd probably respond with something like, "What? Are you suggesting that I commit suicide? Shame on you!"

 

I have been asked this question on a number of occasions, both by family members and friends. I always find it somewhat puzzling. After all, it is nothing more than an appeal to wishful thinking. It may be the case that life has no point or purpose without God. That does not entail that God exists. It just entails that life sucks.

 

My default answer to this question is to say that of course my life has meaning. If nothing else, it means a great deal to me. It's also fairly important to those who love me. That's enough for me.

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I'll be honest with you all. As I journey through my own deconversion I have found myself asking the same question in the OP's first post.

 

"If God doesn't exist, if all of this is a lie, then what's the point? Why go on living?"

 

Granted its not a nice thought, but it comes none the less. I think for me at least Christianity became a large part of who I was. I've struggled for acceptance much of my life, gone through difficult times and found loving myself for who I am a challenge. God and Christianity gave answers to all that - I was set apart because I was God's child, I found belonging within the Church, everything that happened to me happened for a reason and I was special because God loved me.

 

Now that all of that crumbles away I find myself empty and lost. I am no longer special, what worth I believed I had was in a being that didn't exist. Things just happen, there is no rhyme or reason for them. There is no great plan to be a part of, no special mission and its loss is keenly felt.

 

Of course there is a part of me that knows this will pass in time, that it is simply the grief of losing what was once so important to me. But for now it is very real and painful.

 

I'd like to make clear that I in no way wish to go on a crazed murder spree, nor do I feel my morality has suffered. These are very inward focusing thoughts and perhaps those of you thay can't understand my current frame of mind can be reassured by that.

 

Hopefully you don't all think I'm a crazy person now.

This was my main problem with deconverting as well. I don't think I've ever "solved" it. I just live with two possibilities: either there really is nothing deeper to life than survival and reproduction or there is some sort of cosmic morality after all and Christianity along with many other religions is just a mistaken manifestation of some deeper sense of meaning. Critics could say the latter is just wishful thinking, and I cannot really deny that. But I can just as well state that the former is arrogant to assume as true, as you simply cannot know, and the sense of 'something' can be found in people all around the world.

So essentially what I am saying is the good ol' "In your heart of hearts you know there is god".

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I do find it appalling on a deep emotional level that this life is all there is.

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I think deconverting is like quitting caffeine.  Sorry this is long, but bear with me...

 

When you are addicted to caffeine...

 

...the idea of quitting scares you.  You love the hit you get every time you drink it, and how it calms the cravings or withdrawal symptoms you feel when you wake up each day.

 

... If you don't wean yourself off it and you quit cold turkey, you typically get unpleasant withdrawal symptoms 24/7.

 

... This messes with your mind so that you think life without caffeine sucks and you were better off when you were drinking it.  

 

... To stay caffeine free you have to be strong and remind yourself of the truth, that the only reason you felt better on caffeine was that you were avoiding withdrawal by drinking it every day, and that soon your body will get used to not having it and you will feel ok again.

 

When you are a xian...

 

...you feel good because you believe you are special, your life has meaning, and when you die there will be justice and love and clouds and reunion with dead loved ones and it is all so wonderful.  

 

...Then you find yourself in the position of not believing in god.  You may get unpleasant withdrawal symptoms such as facing the reality that you are special in a new, unfamiliar way that you have yet to get your head around, there doesn't seem to be any meaning to your life, there is no justice, bad things happen to good people without consequences, when you're dead you're dead, and you will never see dead loved ones again.  

 

... Understandably, this messes with your mind so that you think life without belief in god sucks and you were better off when you believed.  

 

...To have peace of mind you have to be strong and remind yourself of the truth, that the only reason you felt better as a xian was that you were avoiding these realities by reinforcing your belief every day, and that soon your mind will get used to not having it, you will learn new, better ways of looking at life, and you will feel even better than you did as a xian.

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I'll be honest with you all. As I journey through my own deconversion I have found myself asking the same question in the OP's first post.

 

"If God doesn't exist, if all of this is a lie, then what's the point? Why go on living?"

 

Granted its not a nice thought, but it comes none the less. I think for me at least Christianity became a large part of who I was. I've struggled for acceptance much of my life, gone through difficult times and found loving myself for who I am a challenge. God and Christianity gave answers to all that - I was set apart because I was God's child, I found belonging within the Church, everything that happened to me happened for a reason and I was special because God loved me.

 

Now that all of that crumbles away I find myself empty and lost. I am no longer special, what worth I believed I had was in a being that didn't exist. Things just happen, there is no rhyme or reason for them. There is no great plan to be a part of, no special mission and its loss is keenly felt.

 

Of course there is a part of me that knows this will pass in time, that it is simply the grief of losing what was once so important to me. But for now it is very real and painful.

 

I'd like to make clear that I in no way wish to go on a crazed murder spree, nor do I feel my morality has suffered. These are very inward focusing thoughts and perhaps those of you thay can't understand my current frame of mind can be reassured by that.

 

Hopefully you don't all think I'm a crazy person now.

This was my main problem with deconverting as well. I don't think I've ever "solved" it. I just live with two possibilities: either there really is nothing deeper to life than survival and reproduction or there is some sort of cosmic morality after all and Christianity along with many other religions is just a mistaken manifestation of some deeper sense of meaning. Critics could say the latter is just wishful thinking, and I cannot really deny that. But I can just as well state that the former is arrogant to assume as true, as you simply cannot know, and the sense of 'something' can be found in people all around the world.

So essentially what I am saying is the good ol' "In your heart of hearts you know there is god".

You guys just need to think of it in a different way. Know that you must cherish this one life that you have even more. Live life to its fullest and knowing that life EXTREMELY short and can but cut down at any moment, that you pick this time, while you're alive, to make changes in others lives and doing your best to leave this earth better than how you came into it =).
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I'll be honest with you all. As I journey through my own deconversion I have found myself asking the same question in the OP's first post.

 

"If God doesn't exist, if all of this is a lie, then what's the point? Why go on living?"

 

Granted its not a nice thought, but it comes none the less. I think for me at least Christianity became a large part of who I was. I've struggled for acceptance much of my life, gone through difficult times and found loving myself for who I am a challenge. God and Christianity gave answers to all that - I was set apart because I was God's child, I found belonging within the Church, everything that happened to me happened for a reason and I was special because God loved me.

 

Now that all of that crumbles away I find myself empty and lost. I am no longer special, what worth I believed I had was in a being that didn't exist. Things just happen, there is no rhyme or reason for them. There is no great plan to be a part of, no special mission and its loss is keenly felt.

 

Of course there is a part of me that knows this will pass in time, that it is simply the grief of losing what was once so important to me. But for now it is very real and painful.

 

I'd like to make clear that I in no way wish to go on a crazed murder spree, nor do I feel my morality has suffered. These are very inward focusing thoughts and perhaps those of you thay can't understand my current frame of mind can be reassured by that.

 

Hopefully you don't all think I'm a crazy person now.

This was my main problem with deconverting as well. I don't think I've ever "solved" it. I just live with two possibilities: either there really is nothing deeper to life than survival and reproduction or there is some sort of cosmic morality after all and Christianity along with many other religions is just a mistaken manifestation of some deeper sense of meaning. Critics could say the latter is just wishful thinking, and I cannot really deny that. But I can just as well state that the former is arrogant to assume as true, as you simply cannot know, and the sense of 'something' can be found in people all around the world.

So essentially what I am saying is the good ol' "In your heart of hearts you know there is god".

You guys just need to think of it in a different way. Know that you must cherish this one life that you have even more. Live life to its fullest and knowing that life EXTREMELY short and can but cut down at any moment, that you pick this time, while you're alive, to make changes in others lives and doing your best to leave this earth better than how you came into it =).

 

I agree with this, but I would add that it's ok to postpone changing others' lives and leaving the earth a better place while you focus on the basics of your own life first.  Depending on what your experience of xianity was like, and your current circumstances, there can be a lot of recovery and healing needed before you can start looking outward to help others.  Our first responsibility is to ourselves and then our family.  

 

Xianity teaches that it should be J.O.Y - jesus first, yourself last, and others inbetween.  This is bullshit.  We need to learn to put ourselves first, and that means food, clothing, shelter, education, health, savings etc.  Some xians don't even invest in insurance because of their religious beliefs.  

 

Once we have our own house in order and we're making progress towards our goals, then we can think about helping others and leaving the world better than we found it.  For most people, this can be achieved through raising our children well.  Anything else is a bonus, IMO.  We don't need to feel under pressure to do stuff, that's xian bullshit that we can leave behind now.

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I'll be honest with you all. As I journey through my own deconversion I have found myself asking the same question in the OP's first post.

 

"If God doesn't exist, if all of this is a lie, then what's the point? Why go on living?"

 

Granted its not a nice thought, but it comes none the less. I think for me at least Christianity became a large part of who I was. I've struggled for acceptance much of my life, gone through difficult times and found loving myself for who I am a challenge. God and Christianity gave answers to all that - I was set apart because I was God's child, I found belonging within the Church, everything that happened to me happened for a reason and I was special because God loved me.

 

Now that all of that crumbles away I find myself empty and lost. I am no longer special, what worth I believed I had was in a being that didn't exist. Things just happen, there is no rhyme or reason for them. There is no great plan to be a part of, no special mission and its loss is keenly felt.

 

Of course there is a part of me that knows this will pass in time, that it is simply the grief of losing what was once so important to me. But for now it is very real and painful.

 

I'd like to make clear that I in no way wish to go on a crazed murder spree, nor do I feel my morality has suffered. These are very inward focusing thoughts and perhaps those of you thay can't understand my current frame of mind can be reassured by that.

 

Hopefully you don't all think I'm a crazy person now.

This was my main problem with deconverting as well. I don't think I've ever "solved" it. I just live with two possibilities: either there really is nothing deeper to life than survival and reproduction or there is some sort of cosmic morality after all and Christianity along with many other religions is just a mistaken manifestation of some deeper sense of meaning. Critics could say the latter is just wishful thinking, and I cannot really deny that. But I can just as well state that the former is arrogant to assume as true, as you simply cannot know, and the sense of 'something' can be found in people all around the world.

So essentially what I am saying is the good ol' "In your heart of hearts you know there is god".

You guys just need to think of it in a different way. Know that you must cherish this one life that you have even more. Live life to its fullest and knowing that life EXTREMELY short and can but cut down at any moment, that you pick this time, while you're alive, to make changes in others lives and doing your best to leave this earth better than how you came into it =).

I agree with this, but I would add that it's ok to postpone changing others' lives and leaving the earth a better place while you focus on the basics of your own life first. Depending on what your experience of xianity was like, and your current circumstances, there can be a lot of recovery and healing needed before you can start looking outward to help others. Our first responsibility is to ourselves and then our family.

 

Xianity teaches that it should be J.O.Y - jesus first, yourself last, and others inbetween. This is bullshit. We need to learn to put ourselves first, and that means food, clothing, shelter, education, health, savings etc. Some xians don't even invest in insurance because of their religious beliefs.

 

Once we have our own house in order and we're making progress towards our goals, then we can think about helping others and leaving the world better than we found it. For most people, this can be achieved through raising our children well. Anything else is a bonus, IMO. We don't need to feel under pressure to do stuff, that's xian bullshit that we can leave behind now.

I agree, whole-heartedly. Some of the recent ex Christians, should also look at it this: We are our own kind of special. We, Atheists, are the minority to either be born free or had that extra power to wake up from the brainwashing, especially if at an early age. Compared to the BILLIONS of religious people, we were the ones able to make it out alive. Now we owe it ourselves and to the next generation to keep the truth alive, and yes even doing it with just the family can and will go a long way. Soon, long after we are dead, religion will either be the minority or even extinct and the planet, if not hit, can get better(no thanks to the many religious that have no care about what they do or happens, to the planet. Simply because they think this life doesn't matter and it's all about the after-life).
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I've been deconverted since April of this year 2014. I agree with lots of people here, that there's a lot of things we have to fix ourselves first. I didn't feel meaningless or anything but have dealt with other kinds of guilt. The particular guilt of having raised a child in Christianity, and in my early days, having gotten the Wife into some more extreme aspects of it. I think we all have stuff we have to try and let go of, and Xianity never really gave you a tool for learning how to do that. And now we must. I daresay this is probably one of the toughest challenges I have faced, and the path between problem and resolution is not always straightforward or even logical at times.

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