Are You Part Of A Cult?

[♦ ficino ♦]

In my fundy days, we were taught that these are cults: Mormons, JWs, Children of God (are they still around?), Hare Krishna, Scientology, Moonies, and the like.  Some Protestant fundies also considered the RC church a cult.

[mymistake]

I guess the Holy Spirit sent Ironhorse somewhere else on very urgent business.

[Storm]

Ironhorse, I do have a specific question for you. This is meant in all seriousness.

 

What do you do when you experience a cognitive dissonance?

 

Everyone experiences them. They are a part of life. Are you aware that they are happening? Most everyone in this forum experienced cognitive dissonance regarding their faith and it led most of them to the conclusions we share now. Maybe you are afraid to admit the truth that every Christian experiences doubts and disappointment with their faith. Even John the Baptist expressed unsurity with Jesus. Many other biblical characters experienced doubt and angst at what they believed. Its a part of life.

 

In my experience, faith didn't cut it. I couldn't just believe something that had no evidence or made no sense to me.

 

I am asking you to be honest here. My questions are genuine. I would appreciate your answers if you are willing.

[Guest Furball]

anyone else notice that ironhorse's member title is apostate?

[2PhiloVoid]

So, I ran across this article, in of all places, the CARM website. I found it interesting in that it describes Christianity almost to a T.

 

For those that want the quickie version, I present:

 

 

 

1. Submission:

     1. Complete, almost unquestioned trust in the leadership.

     2. Leaders are often seen as prophets, apostles, or special individuals with unusual connections to God. This helps a person give themselves over psychologically to trusting someone else for their spiritual welfare.

     3. Increased submission to the leadership is rewarded with additional responsibilities and/or roles, and/or praises, increasing the importance of the person within the group.

2. Exclusivity

     1. Their group is the only true religious system, or one of the few true remnants of God's people.

3. Persecution complex

     1. Us against them mentality. Therefore, when someone (inside or outside of the group) corrects the group in doctrine and/or behavior, it is interpreted as persecution, which then is interpreted as validation. 

4. Control

     1. Control of members' actions and thinking through repeated indoctrination and/or threats of loss of salvation, or a place to live, or receiving curses from God, etc.

5. Isolation

     1. Minimizing contact of church members with those outside the group. This facilitates a further control over the thinking and practices of the members by the leadership.

6. Love Bombing

     1. Showing great attention and love to a person in the group by others in the group, to help transfer emotional dependence to the group.

7. Special Knowledge

     1. Instructions and/or knowledge are sometimes said to be received by a leader(s) from God. This leader then informs the members.

     2. The Special Knowledge can be received through visions, dreams, or new interpretations of sacred scriptures such as the Bible.

8. Indoctrination

     1. The teachings of the group are repeatedly drilled into the members, but the indoctrination usually occurs around Special Knowledge.

9. Salvation

     1. Salvation from the judgment of God is maintained through association and/or submission with the group, its authority, and/or its Special Knowledge.

10. Group Think

     1. The group's coherence is maintained by the observance to policies handed down from those in authority.

     2. There is an internal enforcement of policies by members who reward "proper" behavior, and those who perform properly are rewarded with further inclusion and acceptance by the group.

11. Cognitive Dissonance

     1. Avoidance of critical thinking and/or maintaining logically impossible beliefs and/or beliefs that are inconsistent with other beliefs held by the group.

     2. Avoidance of and/or denial of any facts that might contradict the group's belief system.

12. Shunning

     1. Those who do not keep in step with group policies are shunned and/or expelled.

13. Gender Roles

     1. Control of gender roles and definitions.

     2. Severe control of gender roles sometimes leads to sexual exploitation.

14. Appearance Standards

     1. Often a common appearance is required and maintained. For instance, women might wear prairie dresses, and/or their hair in buns, and/or no makeup, and/or the men might all wear white short-sleeved shirts, and/or without beards, or all wear beards.

 

Just a simple examination of the church I attend irregularly, I can list 1 through 11 as things that are taught in the church to varying degrees and the last three are taught more subtly, but they are taught. 

 

How is Christianity not like any of the aspects listed in this article?

 

So, upon seeing this, how does your church stack up or how does your belief stack up, all you Christians out there?

 

Does what you believe classify you as a cult?

 

I would say that if you can answer yes to more than 50% of these, I suspect you should have an issue with what you believe.

...and I would say that the CARM website is over-posturing in how it delineates the concept of 'cult.'

[sdelsolray]

 

...and I would say that the CARM website is over-posturing in how it delineates the concept of 'cult.'

 

Because CARM is inviting obvious comparisons of its dogma to the list, resulting in an objective and rational claim that CARM is a cult and internalized (by CARM) as persecution?

[ironhorse]

Storm,

 

I don't really stress over not understanding what seems to be contradictions (or errors) in the Bible or

my inability to know everything concerning God. I can't explain the Trinity. There are many things I don't know. 

 

I have had my periods of doubt. I have mentioned them here before. It is normal, I think, for believers

to go through this at times. There are stories in the scriptures of people having doubt.

 

But to me, the message in the scriptures and the person of Jesus are the only things that make sense to me.

It is the only religious faith, for me, that answers the basic questions in a simple yet profound way.

[duderonomy]

anyone else notice that ironhorse's member title is apostate?

 

I'm not sure, but I think that might go by post counts.

[2PhiloVoid]

 

 

...and I would say that the CARM website is over-posturing in how it delineates the concept of 'cult.'

 

Because CARM is inviting obvious comparisons of its dogma to the list, resulting in an objective and rational claim that CARM is a cult and internalized (by CARM) as persecution?

 

 

Sure...could be. Weirder things have happened...

 

Peace

[bornagainathiest]

Storm,

 

I don't really stress over not understanding what seems to be contradictions (or errors) in the Bible or

my inability to know everything concerning God. I can't explain the Trinity. There are many things I don't know. 

 

I have had my periods of doubt. I have mentioned them here before. It is normal, I think, for believers

to go through this at times. There are stories in the scriptures of people having doubt.

 

But to me, the message in the scriptures and the person of Jesus are the only things that make sense to me.

It is the only religious faith, for me, that answers the basic questions in a simple yet profound way.

 

Do you not see and understand the inherent contradiction of your own words, Ironhorse?

.

.

.

There are many things you don't know, can't explain and don't understand about the Bible.  

 

Yet, the message of the Bible is one of the two things that make sense to you.   

.

.

.

So please tell us how you make sense of what you don't know, can't explain and don't understand.

 

I'm sure we'd all be fascinated to read how you reconcile these things!