Jump to content
Goodbye Jesus

Creationism And The Validity Of The Bible


Penguin

Recommended Posts

 

But I must also acknowledge that we should not tar everyone with the same disparaging (ignorant goat herders) brush. 

 

That doesn't apply to everyone.  There were many other cultures who were very advanced for the time.  For example look at how well developed the Chinese were back when the Hebrews were writing the Genesis creation myth.  Many of the Hebrew ideas were stolen from older, more advanced cultures such as how the Ten Commandments were taken from Egypt.  I call the early Hebrews goat headers because they started out as migrants with an animal husbandry based economy.  Look at how much their early religion is based around which animal you have to slaughter to appease the gods.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

But I must also acknowledge that we should not tar everyone with the same disparaging (ignorant goat herders) brush. 

 

That doesn't apply to everyone.  There were many other cultures who were very advanced for the time.  For example look at how well developed the Chinese were back when the Hebrews were writing the Genesis creation myth.  Many of the Hebrew ideas were stolen from older, more advanced cultures such as how the Ten Commandments were taken from Egypt.  I call the early Hebrews goat headers because they started out as migrants with an animal husbandry based economy.  Look at how much their early religion is based around which animal you have to slaughter to appease the gods.

 

 

MM,

 

Please understand that I was not singling you out when writing about the disparagement sometimes heaped on ancient peoples who herded sheep or goats.

I was attempting to challenge that general mindset.  If had been singling you out I would have quoted you.  You'll note that I didn't do that.  Sorry for any offense caused.

 

Thanks,

 

BAA.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

 

But I must also acknowledge that we should not tar everyone with the same disparaging (ignorant goat herders) brush. 

 

That doesn't apply to everyone.  There were many other cultures who were very advanced for the time.  For example look at how well developed the Chinese were back when the Hebrews were writing the Genesis creation myth.  Many of the Hebrew ideas were stolen from older, more advanced cultures such as how the Ten Commandments were taken from Egypt.  I call the early Hebrews goat headers because they started out as migrants with an animal husbandry based economy.  Look at how much their early religion is based around which animal you have to slaughter to appease the gods.

 

 

MM,

 

Please understand that I was not singling you out when writing about the disparagement sometimes heaped on ancient peoples who herded sheep or goats.

I was attempting to challenge that general mindset.  If had been singling you out I would have quoted you.  You'll note that I didn't do that.  Sorry for any offense caused.

 

Thanks,

 

BAA.

 

 

 

No offense taken.  No worries.  I'm happy to explain or clarify whenever needed . . . and sometimes even when not needed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

 

 

But I must also acknowledge that we should not tar everyone with the same disparaging (ignorant goat herders) brush. 

 

That doesn't apply to everyone.  There were many other cultures who were very advanced for the time.  For example look at how well developed the Chinese were back when the Hebrews were writing the Genesis creation myth.  Many of the Hebrew ideas were stolen from older, more advanced cultures such as how the Ten Commandments were taken from Egypt.  I call the early Hebrews goat headers because they started out as migrants with an animal husbandry based economy.  Look at how much their early religion is based around which animal you have to slaughter to appease the gods.

 

 

MM,

 

Please understand that I was not singling you out when writing about the disparagement sometimes heaped on ancient peoples who herded sheep or goats.

I was attempting to challenge that general mindset.  If had been singling you out I would have quoted you.  You'll note that I didn't do that.  Sorry for any offense caused.

 

Thanks,

 

BAA.

 

 

 

No offense taken.  No worries.  I'm happy to explain or clarify whenever needed . . . and sometimes even when not needed.

 

 

Thanks MM.  goodjob.gif

Link to comment
Share on other sites

In the Word is no lie,

the truth comes from God.

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

In the Word is no lie,

the truth comes from God.

 

Well, you convinced me, Justus. I can't argue against extra-large font and pretty colors. That's an amazing defeater for all of the actual evidence that Ravenstar listed in #24. lmao_99.gif

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

In the Word is no lie,

the truth comes from God.

 

 

 

So "I will return soon" wasn't a lie even thought 723,925 days later Jesus still has not returned.  What is the true meaning of "soon"?

 

 

By the way I didn't make up that number.  723,925 really is 365.25 x the number of years since 33 AD.  The Bible is a pack of lies.  There is no God.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

So "I will return soon" wasn't a lie even thought 723,925 days later Jesus still has not returned.  What is the true meaning of "soon"?

 

 

By the way I didn't make up that number.  723,925 really is 365.25 x the number of years since 33 AD.  The Bible is a pack of lies.  There is no God.

 

 

mm, you're going to need to give The Lord Jesus some slack on this unfulfilled prediction--he did admit that "the Father only"  (Mt. 24:36) knew the day and hour of the Second Coming, and the Father didn't seem willing to share that information.

 

Though it sure seems that if God is Three in One, Jesus should have been privy to everything the Father knew. But then again, when The Lord Jesus became a man-child he forgot all the divine eternal stuff he knew before the Virgin Birth, I guess. He became dumb, so we may become wise.

 

Now I've just confused myself. huh.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

In the Word is no lie,

the truth comes from God.

ISN'T THAT SPECIAL!

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

In the Word is no lie,

the truth comes from God.

 

The Word is untrue from Genesis 1:1...

 

...therefore, there is no god.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

There are tons of great thinkers in ancient history, not one of them was Hebrew, unfortunately - though the Jewish people have made up for that in modern times in the sciences. (check the ethnicity of Nobel prize winners…overwhelmingly Jewish - probably because they value education so much) Though the ancients were working with very simple tools, observations and cultures where the supernatural was accepted some of the concepts and ideas and practices (medicine anyone - mathematics?) is actually quite astounding. All pagans.. or even atheists.

 

The astronomers/astrologers of ancient Sumeria and Persia, the alchemists of many countries, the surgeons and architects of Egypt, the lawmakers and engineers of Mesopotamia, the mathematicians of Greece, the philosophers and naturalists. The Chinese… even the Mayan and Inca - with their fabulous cities, temples and agriculture. (Christian) Europe was in a very dark place for over a thousand years before they started studying the writings of the great Greek and Roman thinkers - THAT is what sparked the renaissances.

 

There is little of scientific or naturalist value in the Bible, or astronomical - though there's plenty of astrology wink.png .

 

Let's look at some of the more glaring stuff:

 

There is no light without the sun, there are no days and nights without the sun GE 1:3-514-19, plants won't grow without sunlight (except for certain fungi) GE 1:12, 16, every plant is NOT good to eat GE 1:29,

 

All of humanity comes from woman (actually all sexually reproducing creatures - though some are hermaphroditic) - so having a man created first is absurd - females can also reproduce through parthenogenesis - males can't.

 

There are two different creation stories in the Bible, one of them ripped off almost word for word from Babylonia (Akkadia? Chaldea? can't remember which one - same place though)

 

Rainbows are refractions of light and have existed as long as light and a refractory substance has, GE 9:12-16

 

 

 

No light without the sun?

 

The Principle of the First day:  Genesis  Gen 1:3

And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

 

Enough said, like the scriptures say, in Genesis 6:3, you got a 120 years in flesh on earth- why waste them on a God you don't think exists  

 

P.S.  Man - male or female  [Gen 5:1-2]

 

 

 

In the Word is no lie,

the truth comes from God.

 

Well, you convinced me, Justus. I can't argue against extra-large font and pretty colors. That's an amazing defeater for all of the actual evidence that Ravenstar listed in #24. lmao_99.gif

 

 

Seems like she would have mentioned that man could not be made out of dust and wind, while it makes a great song , the fact is that man can't be formed form dust considering that for 1, do you know how hard it is to stake up that man particle of dust and blowing air into them with the whole dang thang falling down?  

 

Second man is composed of solid, liquid and gas right?  But Jesus said marvel not, unless you are born of the water and the Spirit you can see the Kingdom of God, but you have about as much chance of of being born by female without a male and you do as being born by the Spirit without the Word [Let us make man in our image, after our likeness]  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

In the Word is no lie,

the truth comes from God.

 

The Word is untrue from Genesis 1:1...

 

...therefore, there is no god.

 

Like Thomas Paine said, it is error only not truth that shrinks from inquiry

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

In the Word is no lie,

the truth comes from God.

 

The Word is untrue from Genesis 1:1...

 

...therefore, there is no god.

 

Like Thomas Paine said, it is error only not truth that shrinks from inquiry

 

 

Like Alan Guth predicted in 1980...

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_microwave_background#mediaviewer/File:Cmbr.svg

 

...and which was confirmed in 1990.

 

No need for further inquiry.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Fyi Justus...

 

That confirmed prediction doesn't rely on faith, divine revelation or private interpretation... it's true for everyone, whether they accept it or not. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

 

 

In the Word is no lie,

the truth comes from God.

 

Well, you convinced me, Justus. I can't argue against extra-large font and pretty colors. That's an amazing defeater for all of the actual evidence that Ravenstar listed in #24. lmao_99.gif

 

 

Seems like she would have mentioned that man could not be made out of dust and wind, while it makes a great song , the fact is that man can't be formed form dust considering that for 1, do you know how hard it is to stake up that man particle of dust and blowing air into them with the whole dang thang falling down?  

 

Second man is composed of solid, liquid and gas right?  But Jesus said marvel not, unless you are born of the water and the Spirit you can see the Kingdom of God, but you have about as much chance of of being born by female without a male and you do as being born by the Spirit without the Word [Let us make man in our image, after our likeness]  

 

 

Hoo Boy, slow down there a bit, you're killing me with this! Really, I can't catch my breath.

 

Justus, I'm calling Poe. I haven't been on this site long enough to say for sure who you really are, but you've got to be a Poe. At any rate, keep it up, I need the laughs, and I'm willing to play along for a while.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I was just pointing out that I didn't even know that they had found a 4th state of matter. 

 

I know that 7th grade science just let us know about three of them.  After they said

that lobsters couldn't be raised out in the desert of west texas there really wasn't 

much point to it all after that.  

 

It's been 40 years since 7th grade and I don't even hear about plasma as a state of

matter being even be added till a couple of years ago, seems that would have made the news or something.  

 

The plasma or ionized gas is kewl and all but seems like it would still be gas. I wonder

what's next the Sun just going to be ball of gas?  But I won't bug you no more.

 

Please don't tell me Poe means  Phylogeny-ontogeny- and epigenesis hardware:

I don't want to recall all those alien clone research project memories.  I know that

they are false memories but where did they come from?  LOL

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

The problem with this type of interpretation is that it just doesn't square with what the scriptures actually say.  "There was an evening and a morning, the first day", is what is actually written in the text.  You can make the argument that a day with god is like a thousand years based on the new testament; but that still doesn't alter the fact that genesis makes plain that a day consisted of an evening (singular) and a morning (also singular). 

 

This also applies when christians use the same argument to explain how long Adam lived.  god said that Adam would die the day he ate of the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil; but genesis 5:5 clearly states that Adam lived for 930 years. 

 

 

1. don't forget the fact that the sun and the moon and the stars were not made until the fourth day

 

That doesn't change the fact that the prior days are listed as comprising of a single "evening" and "morning." The fact that whoever wrote Genesis 1 apparently didn't understand that the sun was the source of daylight (as opposed to merely an object to "govern" the day) is irrelevant. Another thing to consider is that the commandment about keeping the Sabbath holy is given with a direct correlation between the 6-day work week and the 6 days of creation (Ex 20:8-11), thus suggesting that at least at that point the Hebrews themselves took the creation days in the Hebrew scriptures as literal days.

 

2. the christian apologist would say that they did die that day. they died spiritually. that is they died spiritually to god, hence god having to walk in the garden afterwards to physically talk with them, whereas before he could spiritually talk with them.

 

That also doesn't work. Nowhere in the Old Testament is "death" described as spiritual death. That is a New Testament concept that came about a very long time after Genesis was written, and Christians are butchering the Bible when they try to take a concept from a much later time in a different culture and language and then force it back onto the much older text. It is disingenuous and completely ignores the actual context in which the original was written.

 

Another telling factor is that in Genesis 3, what the serpent claims will happen if they eat the fruit (their eyes would be opened and they would become like God) in the beginning of the chapter is EXACTLY what happens in that very chapter, and it is what God himself admits happened at the end of the chapter. The serpent did not lie to Eve. Contrary to Christian claims, the Bible itself has the serpent actually telling the truth. Contrast that with God telling them that they would surely die the day they eat the fruit, and which character turns out to be the liar?

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

That's a different problem from the problem of age. I think evangelical apologists like William Lane Craig are fine with holding to the age of the Earth as 4.5 billion years, or whatever, and of the universe as 13.7 billion. They just do an exegesis of Genesis whereby six days does not mean six days. Craig also holds to the ToE, if I'm not mistaken, but argues that there was a historical Adam and a historical Eve. I think you can get away with being an inerrantist AND holding a form of the ToE if you spin the language of Genesis.

 

The problem with this type of interpretation is that it just doesn't square with what the scriptures actually say.  "There was an evening and a morning, the first day", is what is actually written in the text.  You can make the argument that a day with god is like a thousand years based on the new testament; but that still doesn't alter the fact that genesis makes plain that a day consisted of an evening (singular) and a morning (also singular).

 

Many Christians do use that "thousand years as one day" argument, but it's a complete distortion of the biblical text. The days in Genesis were written in Hebrew to a Hebrew audience in a telling of an alleged past event, while the "thousand years" equation with a "day" is from the Greek NT book of 2 Peter written at a much later time in a different culture to a Christian audience and pertains to patience while waiting for the supposed future coming of the "Lord." To try to force the claim of that text onto the much older text written in a completely different context is a total bastardization.

 

The author of Genesis 1 could not have known that someone would come along hundreds of years later and make a 1,000 years = 1 day equation in another language, religion and context. Trying to redefine Genesis 1 terminology that way is ludicrous. Christians who resort to this sort of game are either mindbogglingly disingenuous or completely ignorant of how the Bible came to be (it's a collection of writings spanning a long period of time rather than a single work that dropped out of Heaven).

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Super Moderator

^^^That's where the whole "all scripture is god-breathed" argument comes into play.  god had it planned out all along.  GONZ9729CustomImage1539775.gif

Link to comment
Share on other sites

^^^That's where the whole "all scripture is god-breathed" argument comes into play.  god had it planned out all along.  :HaHa:

Like I said, they're completely ignorant of how the Bible came to be. ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Guidelines.