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Goodbye Jesus

Can We Overcome Our Genetic Predispositions?


Guest end3

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End3, you are over thinking everything. A problem recognized, is half corrected, right?  You poop, therefore you am.

 

Get over yourself already. That's not subjective poop coming out of you, that is real poop, here in real life. You poop. I poop. Jesus, if he existed at all, pooped. I know from the Holy Scriptures that he ate fish after his resurrection. Where did that fish waste go, or is there no waste in a resurrected body? Is Jesus so magical that he can appear to his disciples for forty days after his resurrection and never poop, even though he eats?  

 

Natural and yet undiscovered. Instinct. Indeed.

Jesus dude, it boils down to chemistry. If this is the case....and chemistry follows natural law, then there has to be chemistry that allows us to change our programming. Not sure why you can't recognize this. Or, it could be God. Don't sign yourself up for behavioral genetics class....you'll fail.

 

 

 

Holy Word Salad, Batman!

 

End start with the fact that we can change our programing.  Then you won't need to invent a God to explain it.

 

Hey, one positive benefit...maybe we may someday understand the genetics behind NZ's bitchiness or the chemistry to overcome her bitchiness...

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Example: It's a natural tendency to be attracted to some, maybe many of, members of the opposite sex (or same sex, whatever) but if we acted on instinct alone then we would be shagging constantly - with lots of people.  This is not the case in humans.. and most primates.

 

Very few higher animals work on just instinct… that's what the brain is for. I think maybe you should study some biology. Even rats have shown signs of making compassionate choices… rats. We have much more cognitive freedom than rats. We haven't lived on instinct alone probably since we evolved from reptiles.

 

I'm not sure if you know what instinct really is.

 

I also get the feeling that you may think we are very different from other creatures.. but such is not the case, it's a continuum, a spectrum. 

 

"Any behavior is instinctive if it is performed without being based upon prior experience (that is, in the absence of learning), and is therefore an expression of innate biological factors. Sea turtles, newly hatched on a beach, will automatically move toward the ocean. A joey climbs into its mother's pouch upon being born. Honeybees communicate by dancing in the direction of a food source without formal instruction. Other examples include animal fighting, animal courtship behavior, internal escape functions, and the building of nests."  

 

"The role of instincts in determining the behavior of animals varies from species to species. The more complex the neural system of an animal, the greater is the role of the cerebral cortex and social learning, and instincts play a lesser role. A comparison between a crocodile and an elephant illustrates how mammals for example are heavily dependent on social learning. Lionesses and chimpanzees raised in zoos away from their birth mothers most often reject their own offspring because they have not been taught the skills of mothering.[citation needed] Such is not the case with simpler species such as reptiles."

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instinct   

 

Now.. there are many other things that influence our behaviour… our upbringing has a HUGE impact on how we do things, think about things and the choices we make, our culture, our social circles… our own beliefs - our worldview. Our health, are we hungry, tired, lonely? Do we ingest mind-altering substances… are we in debt? or have plenty… psychologically we are very complex, and we respond, sometimes without thinking about it (subconsciously, but NOT on instinct) to our environment.. external and internal.  When we don't explore these things and challenge them or don't take care of ourselves then we most definitely can fall into habits and patterns that are not always healthy or the best thing to do, or choose.

 

I suggest you read some Abraham Maslow. Maybe Freud… and Jung. And BIOLOGY. To start.

What I gathered from RS was that it literally boils down to programmed chemistry/physics. If this is the case, and we may never know, what chemistry allows us to contradict the programmed chemistry? Obviously it can go either way. But this leaves me at a loss for how this is possible. I can envision environment, especially diet could literally change our body out of necessity, but it only seems reasonable that behaviors would fall under the same set of rules.

 

I realize my thoughts are repetitious, and I should move forward with my own search, but sometimes I just like to ponder. Thanks for the response R. In other words, some things drive me to go look and some things not so much. Thanks again.

 

No… you fail.

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Hey, one positive benefit...maybe we may someday understand the genetics behind NZ's bitchiness or the chemistry to overcome her bitchiness...

 

 

 

 

It's not hard to understand that your abrasiveness, sexism, racism, willful ignorance, and avoidance tactics annoy some people.  I think you understand it clearly and are only pretending you don't.

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No problem. I just do not want to misrepresent myself or have anybody think that I am a research scientist publishing robust STEM literature. I'm co-investigator in a couple of small but really neat studies and I have published some case study based literature but that's probably not going to impress folks who have made substantial contributions.

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End3, you are over thinking everything. A problem recognized, is half corrected, right?  You poop, therefore you am.

 

Get over yourself already. That's not subjective poop coming out of you, that is real poop, here in real life. You poop. I poop. Jesus, if he existed at all, pooped. I know from the Holy Scriptures that he ate fish after his resurrection. Where did that fish waste go, or is there no waste in a resurrected body? Is Jesus so magical that he can appear to his disciples for forty days after his resurrection and never poop, even though he eats?  

 

Natural and yet undiscovered. Instinct. Indeed.

Jesus dude, it boils down to chemistry. If this is the case....and chemistry follows natural law, then there has to be chemistry that allows us to change our programming. Not sure why you can't recognize this. Or, it could be God. Don't sign yourself up for behavioral genetics class....you'll fail.

 

 

 

Holy Word Salad, Batman!

 

End start with the fact that we can change our programing.  Then you won't need to invent a God to explain it.

 

Hey, one positive benefit...maybe we may someday understand the genetics behind NZ's bitchiness or the chemistry to overcome her bitchiness...

 

No genetics or chemistry involved here, I make a deliberate choice to be assertive with you because it's fun.  BTW, bitch is a sexist slur, but I know you don't care about that.

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Look mammals are born with genetic coding that provides a brain.  This is the hardware.

 

As an organism lives it programs that brain through experience.  This is software.

 

The programing changes as the experience changes.

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No genetics or chemistry involved here, I make a deliberate choice to be assertive with you because it's fun.  BTW, bitch is a sexist slur, but I know you don't care about that.

I think your confusing assertive with bitch based on my genetics, chemistry, and experience....but it's my fault of course.

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No genetics or chemistry involved here, I make a deliberate choice to be assertive with you because it's fun.  BTW, bitch is a sexist slur, but I know you don't care about that.

I think your confusing assertive with bitch based on my genetics, chemistry, and experience....but it's my fault of course.

 

 

 

End, when she slaps you that doesn't make her the bitch.  Think about it.

 

 

Edit:

You know End, it really pisses me off that these nice science topics get started and then you crap all over them simply because you couldn't hang.  Your God was invented back when people didn't know where the sun goes at night.  I'm sorry your religion doesn't measure up but get over it.  Choosing to be ignorant doesn't make your God real.  And the knowledge we choose to embrace doesn't' make us wrong.

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Think about it like this, End3.  I, like most all humans, was born with a genetic predisposition to consume sweets and carbohydrates, because, besides ethanol, glucose and fructose are the easiest molecules for the human body to metabolize into energy in the form of ATP.  I was also born with a genetic predisposition to diabetes, because it is one of the diseases that is common to both sides of my family.  However, three months after my diagnosis of Type 2 diabetes, my doctor ordered me to stop taking my medicine and start "cheating" a little on my diet.  My a1c levels were actually slightly lower than normal.  This happened because I went against my genetic predisposition to consume sweets and carbs.  Now, although genetically predisposed to diabetes, I am no longer diabetic (so long as I overcome my baser drives and stick to a healthy diet).

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No genetics or chemistry involved here, I make a deliberate choice to be assertive with you because it's fun.  BTW, bitch is a sexist slur, but I know you don't care about that.

I think your confusing assertive with bitch based on my genetics, chemistry, and experience....but it's my fault of course.

 

 

I think you meant to say "you're" instead of "your".

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No genetics or chemistry involved here, I make a deliberate choice to be assertive with you because it's fun.  BTW, bitch is a sexist slur, but I know you don't care about that.

I think your confusing assertive with bitch based on my genetics, chemistry, and experience....but it's my fault of course.

 

 

 

End, when she slaps you that doesn't make her the bitch.  Think about it.

 

 

Edit:

You know End, it really pisses me off that these nice science topics get started and then you crap all over them simply because you couldn't hang.  Your God was invented back when people didn't know where the sun goes at night.  I'm sorry your religion doesn't measure up but get over it.  Choosing to be ignorant doesn't make your God real.  And the knowledge we choose to embrace doesn't' make us wrong.

 

I'm with you MM. Not sure why some of us can not just carry on a conversation without crapping on the page. I'll try not to respond to those. Thanks.

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When FTNZ writes something you don't like End, that's crapping all over the page.

 

When you insult her by calling her a bitch, that isn't..?

.

.

.

Insulting behavior is just a genetic predisposition of yours that you have no control over?

 

An involuntary reflex that you can't ever take responsibility for?

 

Which you can never 'overcome'...?

 

 

 

 

 

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Meh... guess I'm back on 'ignore' again.

 

If i was ever off it.

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No genetics or chemistry involved here, I make a deliberate choice to be assertive with you because it's fun.  BTW, bitch is a sexist slur, but I know you don't care about that.

I think your confusing assertive with bitch based on my genetics, chemistry, and experience....but it's my fault of course.

 

 

 

You know End, maybe it is your fault.  FTNZ is always a lady to me.

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 Do we know where genetic coding originates from? Have scientists been able to pinpoint this yet? I am still learning this stuff at a beginners level, so please don't shoot me for asking. -Cat

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No genetics or chemistry involved here, I make a deliberate choice to be assertive with you because it's fun.  BTW, bitch is a sexist slur, but I know you don't care about that.

I think your confusing assertive with bitch based on my genetics, chemistry, and experience....but it's my fault of course.

 

 

 

End, when she slaps you that doesn't make her the bitch.  Think about it.

 

 

Edit:

You know End, it really pisses me off that these nice science topics get started and then you crap all over them simply because you couldn't hang.  Your God was invented back when people didn't know where the sun goes at night.  I'm sorry your religion doesn't measure up but get over it.  Choosing to be ignorant doesn't make your God real.  And the knowledge we choose to embrace doesn't' make us wrong.

 

I'm with you MM. Not sure why some of us can not just carry on a conversation without crapping on the page. I'll try not to respond to those. Thanks.

 

 

 

That "some" would be you.  I was talking about your attitude and your response.

 

Every time we get a good science thread going you have to say something like:

 

I'm just ignorant but we may never know because it's all subjective to the objective relationship of grace because God.

 

That is you crapping on the thread.

 

See post 16, 21 and 23

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 Do we know where genetic coding originates from? Have scientists been able to pinpoint this yet? I am still learning this stuff at a beginners level, so please don't shoot me for asking. -Cat

Yes… The newest theory is that proteins formed (which is fairly easy with the right conditions), and some of these were captured in small mycells (little balls of lipids, which form naturally). In some of them, the proteins interacted with each other to produce energy-generating reactions, and perhaps served as templates for formation of more of the same protein. We now know this is as least theoretically possible, because of prion diseases, in which small proteins get into cells and cause generation of the same protein chain, independently of the DNA coding mechanism.

 

So, under this theory, you have mycells full of enzymes, energy-generating (as in glycolysis or the TCA cycle) and only later did RNA or DNA come to play a role, as a more convenient and stable way to code for the proteins. This makes a lot of sense biochemically, and is easier to visualize chemcically than the classic theory. And, it makes sort of an elegant and chemically poetic argument that the origin of life was the thing that really makes life today-the proteins and the protein reaction-and relegates DNA to just a convenient way for the proteins to replicate.

 

credit: - Neuroprof

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So, End3, I write a post in which I share how I overcame two different, yet connected, genetic predispositions and you have no response?  Is it because you don't understand how someone could do such a thing without the love of jesus that you're not responding?  I know you're not too busy wrestling your own demons because you have responded to others (albeit, rather rudely).  So, why not respond to mine?  Have I graduated to "ignore"?

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 Do we know where genetic coding originates from? Have scientists been able to pinpoint this yet? I am still learning this stuff at a beginners level, so please don't shoot me for asking. -Cat

 

I am not a biology expert but I can try giving you my understanding. You can check my answer via google or libraries.

 

Genetic coding of any living materials (and virus?) come from our genes. Genes are part of DNA and DNA is basically series of amino acids. Amino acids are build with hydrogen, carbon, oxygen, nitrogen and sulfur.

with that knowledge, now scientists have found deep sea vents, hydrothermal vents, have a chemical compound that is a precursor of an enzyme. This can mean some billion years ago the earth might have condition similar to hydrothermal vents and they "cooked" some chemical compounds to make some amino acids. From there, the snow ball rolled to make RNA, DNA. Then single cellular organisms occured. Then multicellular organisms occured. Evolution.

 

You can google Miller Urey experiment. 

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One must be carful, particularly when it comes to certain viruses and bacteria. RNA may be the "primary" genetic material in some of these "organisms." RNA is rather tricky and many contemporary experts believe RNA probably predated DNA. If you look at RNA, it has queer properties. It can both act as genetic material and also has the ability to have catalytic activity. Catalytic activity is almost always the result of protein. Therefore, the first few chapters of the "story" of life on this planet remain "blank," but an incredible story is likely to be written as we progress and develop a more robust understanding of fundamental biochemistry.

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Think about it like this, End3.  I, like most all humans, was born with a genetic predisposition to consume sweets and carbohydrates, because, besides ethanol, glucose and fructose are the easiest molecules for the human body to metabolize into energy in the form of ATP.  I was also born with a genetic predisposition to diabetes, because it is one of the diseases that is common to both sides of my family.  However, three months after my diagnosis of Type 2 diabetes, my doctor ordered me to stop taking my medicine and start "cheating" a little on my diet.  My a1c levels were actually slightly lower than normal.  This happened because I went against my genetic predisposition to consume sweets and carbs.  Now, although genetically predisposed to diabetes, I am no longer diabetic (so long as I overcome my baser drives and stick to a healthy diet).

Thank you, I understand this. I'm not sure you are understanding my question though. MM also says I am crapping on a science thread (MY science thread), when I say "I don't know and am ignorant"....which is not a crime mind you.....but the reality is I'm not sure anyone knows the answer to what I am asking. And your response does not answer, for me anyhow, my question.....so I will restate to the best of my ability...with added ignorance of course. Hell, at least I admit to such. So here goes.

 

I guess my question is, if there are parts of the body that would have no control over genetic susceptibility, then why does the brain have any more capability to overcome susceptibility than the rest of the body? I'm not looking for a general answer like Ravenstar suggested. I am looking for a mechanism like RougeScholar put forth.

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So, End3, I write a post in which I share how I overcame two different, yet connected, genetic predispositions and you have no response?  Is it because you don't understand how someone could do such a thing without the love of jesus that you're not responding?  I know you're not too busy wrestling your own demons because you have responded to others (albeit, rather rudely).  So, why not respond to mine?  Have I graduated to "ignore"?

No, she started the shit unprovoked. I just want to discuss the thread. For the love of God, I have no understanding why, after a given period of time, people can't put their shit away. Which is likely why I am seeking this understanding, because I would like to put MY shit away. Given we could understand this question, I'm gathering we could throw our crutches away....like feminism. Lol, sorry, I couldn't resist.

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 MM also says I am crapping on a science thread (MY science thread), when I say "I don't know and am ignorant"....which is not a crime mind you.....but the reality is I'm not sure anyone knows the answer to what I am asking.

 

 

No, not for admitting that you are ignorant.  Rather for the way afterwards that you assert that it must be a specific thing because God.

 

I suck at chemistry.  You don't see me barging into a chemistry thread saying "I know I am ignorant but clearly base and acids are just two sides of the same coin because the Flying Spaghetti Monster".

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No, she started the shit unprovoked.

 

(blah blah blah)

 

....like feminism. Lol, sorry, I couldn't resist.

 

 

 

The part in blue is the provocation.  You do this all the time.  When you provoke the response is not unprovoked.   Wendyshrug.gif

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MM also says I am crapping on a science thread (MY science thread), when I say "I don't know and am ignorant"....which is not a crime mind you.....but the reality is I'm not sure anyone knows the answer to what I am asking.

 

No, not for admitting that you are ignorant.  Rather for the way afterwards that you assert that it must be a specific thing because God.

 

I suck at chemistry.  You don't see me barging into a chemistry thread saying "I know I am ignorant but clearly base and acids are just two sides of the same coin because the Flying Spaghetti Monster".

 

Look, it's pretty simple, it either happens through chemistry AND God or just through chemistry. I never asserted that it was because of God, I said it could be.....but if you will notice, the overwhelming majority of my thoughts point to the mechanics of chemistry. Why the hell can y'all just not leave the "stupid Christian" part out and go with the flow....the very reason I put her on ignore.....because she thinks it's fun being a bitch supported by her anti-Christian and feminism crutches.

 

And, any anti-God person would know that I am actually arguing for something that they espouse anyhow. How profoundly stupid is that? But, reductionism doesn't disallow God....it just makes a better case for sin.

 

So, let's please carry on. I will try to put my crutches away as well. Thanks.

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