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Goodbye Jesus

On Atheistic Evangelism


00LukeMan

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So here's the thing, I deconverted somewhat recently and am in the process of sorting through many aspects of my life. In many ways I imagine I am overreacting against Christianity and will later swing back to a more simple middle ground rather than an extreme. Because of this, I try to act cautiously.

 

Currently however, I am excited. Learning of the incorrectness of Christianity and religion in general has been a fascinating and liberating experience (though definitely not without its dark spots). For me, the truth is very important and something I want to share with others. Since I now feel I have learned something more true and abandoned something false, I want to spread the word to everyone I can.

However, I am not a fan of evangelism when done by religions, so I feel somewhat unjustified in doing so myself. I would love to see my friends grow out of their religion, but it would be extremely rude of me to push them to do so.

I have been very careful to not push my friends regarding their beliefs or mine. In response to one's question I said "All I want you to do is think critically and examine evidence, I don't care what conclusion you come to as long as you are thinking it through. If you do come to a different conclusion, I would be fascinated to hear about it."

 

What are your thoughts on the matter of evangelism, both religious and irreligious? I frequently hear Christians complain about the outspoken evangelistic nature of New Atheism, calling it hypocritical since the New Atheists are so against religious evangelism.

 

So I suppose I have three questions:

 

Do you think it is wrong for people, religious or irreligious, to attempt to change the beliefs of others?

 

If it is okay in some contexts, is there a way I could try discuss the topic gently with my friends (and perhaps family one day?)

 

Did you go through a period of overreaction only to settle down, or will I likely be this enthusiastic for good?

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Goodbye Jesus

If Christians are minding their own business then leave them alone.

 

If someone confesses that they are losing their faith then show them that it is going to be okay.

 

If Christians are preaching hatred and discrimination then put their theology to shame.

 

Don't be the atheist who tells everyone he is an atheist the moment he meets them.

 

But as long as you live under your own roof it's okay to be openly secular.

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I do appreciate street epistemology.  If you go that route it may become something that you continue to enjoy and improve in.  As far as worrying about what other people believe in general, that concern will probably fade.

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I believe in the freedom of religion, so long as it's not bigotry disguised as religion, which seems to be the trend these days. When it comes to atheism, live your life in a positive, giving way ...and people will pick up on that...you won't have to say much. I'm not a fan of 'preaching,' and even if someone wishes to be a theist, he/she would be wise to stop spewing their doctrinal notions all over the place...but rather just live their lives too in a positive way, and others will see it. I don't SEE enough positive actions coming from religion in the world...maybe if I did, it might change my view on religion, because as it stands I see it as completely irrelevant to living a good life.

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Peter Boghossian, a Philosophy professor, wrote a really good book about "street epistemology" that I think might interest you.  It's called A Manual For Creating Atheists.  It's not as evangelical as it sounds, it just outlines a way of asking questions to get people thinking about evidence, logic and critical thinking.  There are some YouTube videos showing conversations along these lines.

 

When xians complain about "New Atheists" "evangelising" I just laugh.  Atheists don't actually need to evangelise, because when people start to have doubts, they hit the internet and that's when they find the information and resources that can help them process stuff.  I think it's great that you want to encourage your friends to think critically.  They are lucky to have you in their life.

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So I suppose I have three questions:

 

Do you think it is wrong for people, religious or irreligious, to attempt to change the beliefs of others?

 

If it is okay in some contexts, is there a way I could try discuss the topic gently with my friends (and perhaps family one day?)

 

Did you go through a period of overreaction only to settle down, or will I likely be this enthusiastic for good?

Morning Luke, I think "evangelism" is the wrong word.  I think we encourage people to be "freethinking", to ask their own questions.

 

I think its a ok to attempt to change the belief of others, as long as the intentions are good.

 

I think it depends on the circumstances.  I had a door to door JW, and I just gently said "No thanks.  I used to go to church but dont anymore."

 

With a friend down the pub, who is a skeptic, I said "Where is this Heaven? where is God?" and we discuss religion and have a laugh about the absurdity of it.

 

Yes I went through a short period of being annoyed about it, but think this is what most here go through after deconverting.  Cheers, Adam

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Thanks everyone.

 

Mymistake, that's pretty much what I'm going for. I don't want to be pushy or rude, I just want to encourage growth in those who are close to me. I certainly don't announce my beliefs to everyone.

 

FreeThinkerNZ, thanks very much for the recommendation. That looks like just the thing I've been looking for. I don't want to tell people what to think, I just want to show them how (Serenity paraphrase).

 

Adam5, you're right, freethinking is probably the better term. And I agree that context is important when it comes to discussing beliefs.

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When I debate non christians, I dont try to prove them wrong or prove im right. I just want them to think for themselves.

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Personally, I object to anyone who seems to think themselves on a mission to change others' beliefs, whatever it is to which they seek to convert their victim.

 

But I have no problem with challenging such a person's beliefs.  So, basically, those who do this get what's coming to them; those who mind their own business can be left alone.

 

Nor have I any issue with discussing with those who are, of themselves, interested in question of their beliefs.

 

Beyond that, it seems to me that religious evangelism has done untold harm to individuals and cultures.  I suspect (though am not aware of any objective proof) that unlooked for pressure to change beliefs would have the same effects.  Let's assume an atheistic culture decides to enforce its' ideology on a culture with imbedded religious views - arguably, that has and may still be happening (I think China & Tibet).  How can that not cause unnecessary suffering?

 

Unasked for or unprovoked evangelism - whatever you call, it, whatever the viewpoint being evangelized - seems to me to be akin to a crime against the humanity of the person evangelized.

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I see it as a service to humanity to introduce questions where people have become entrenched in an exclusive world-view. Some of my family will not question Christianity openly, but will make evangelistic comments on FB posts. I will then reply with a short but truthful blurb about what the Bible actually says (god condoning or ordering genocide, rape, incest, etc). This is mostly to make my family think. They've read the same scriptures, but may not have allowed themselves to see the brutal reality of what they have glossed over.

 

Religion has been given a default "good and protected" attitude in our culture for a very long time. I hope to see it relegated to the likes of a cosplayer that really wants to be regarded as Batman or a Klingon in normal life.

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