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Goodbye Jesus

This Whole Atheist Thing... Christians Make It Harder


NoOne

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I'm just going to list all this bullcrap because I'm not in the mood to write my usual long essays...

 

1) My mother and younger siblings are still Christians, very devout too. My mother said I had to go to church on Easter, and I'll have to go when my younger brother gets water baptized in May. She doesn't know that I'm an atheist but I think she knows I'm not a Christian anymore. Her faith, unfortunately, is starting to annoy me. She doesn't want to believe that Christians, Jews, and Muslims all worship the same god, even though I know that basic fact and I'm a 9th grader. Typical Christian who thinks Christians are disrespected and made up of too much, though they make up 80% of the country and control everything, and thinks that they should start bombing "disrespectful" people like Muslims do. She always want to talk about God, and still makes us all pray. Really, it's just making me delay telling her what I really think and honestly making me hate Christianity more. My younger sibs are cool though.

2) My older bro...he's not a Christian, he's ex-C technically speaking. I would say he's still a theist of some sort, most likely a Universalist. He knows I'm an atheist, but more of an agnostic atheist kind. He just really doesn't like atheists though. I remember reading these memes with Bill Nye and the Neil guy (forgot his name, whoops...the black guy) saying "Bro, do you even science?" and I thought it was funny. So I asked my brother in a joking way and he said, "no because I'm not a douchebag, religion-obsessed atheist". He's told me that he sees atheism and religion the same way, people claiming that they know everything, like how we were created and what will happen when we die. He thinks atheists are just as evangelical as theists. Yes, there are atheists like that and there's no use trying to refute that. But I'm not like that and I don't appreciate being generalized. He's a very outspoken person, I sometimes sugarcoat my beliefs when I talk to him.

3) In my art class, the day right before winter break, I got onto a religious debate with two Christian kids, Jack and Michelle (not their real names). They found out that I was an agnostic (I just indentified as that back then) because we were discussing it in a larger group and they took some sort of offense to that probably think that agnosticism is just atheism and ganged up on me. They got in trouble when we all came back after the break and they both apologized (I didn't have to because I didn't get in any trouble :) ) Michelle used to be my friend, but she would always exclude me and I didn't like that so I stopped talking to her. She's a lesbian and a Republican...? Then Jack is just kind of annoying, he always talks about the Bible. And it's not even in a way where it's to share or express beliefs, it's just annoying and to start something with someone. I remember on Thursday at the end of class, he asked me if I would get a tattoo, and I said "yeah but on my shoulder or back so I could hide it if I had to". Then he's all like "well you shouldn't, the Bible says don't mark yourself" to which I replied "I don't believe in the Bible, I kind of figured that you would've known that." Then he just got all uncomfortable and left while I stayed behind to help my art teacher. Bitchy and uncalled for? Yeah I know it was. I just got annoyed. I feel like he knows I'm not a jackass about my lack of faith but he wants to take me there so it can be the innocent Christian against the intolerant agnostic atheist.

 

Yeah I'll just stop there. I don't want to hate Christians' beliefs and become an angry and spiteful anti-theist, but I swear, they're all pushing me there...

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I had two coworkers ragging on gays being sick and evil in the lunchroom and I finally had enough and said "Time out! Don't go there. you are promoting your religion and calling these people evil. This is a county workplace, so stop it." One of them realized he'd crossed the line right away and understood that I could have family or friends that are gay (which I do), and that I could have gone to HR instead of speaking up. I was nervous and emotional when I spoke, and I hope to get past that and speak more clearly, but had to speak. The other guy approached me at the end of the day and apologized. So it all turned out good. I know that neither of them would say similar things about blacks, but somehow their beliefs still group gays into a "bad" thing.

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FYI: The black guy's name is Neil DeGrasse Tyson.

 

:)

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FYI: The black guy's name is Neil DeGrasse Tyson.

:)

I was somewhat there...I should get a cookie for that.

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Guest Furball

I had two coworkers ragging on gays being sick and evil in the lunchroom and I finally had enough and said "Time out! Don't go there. you are promoting your religion and calling these people evil. This is a county workplace, so stop it." One of them realized he'd crossed the line right away and understood that I could have family or friends that are gay (which I do), and that I could have gone to HR instead of speaking up. I was nervous and emotional when I spoke, and I hope to get past that and speak more clearly, but had to speak. The other guy approached me at the end of the day and apologized. So it all turned out good. I know that neither of them would say similar things about blacks, but somehow their beliefs still group gays into a "bad" thing.

Good for you fuego for speaking up. I am proud of you. These christians think they have the right to judge and condemn everyone elses beliefs and lifestyles, yet if anyone says anything to them about their beliefs and lifestyles they cry afoul and say they are being persecuted. Upvoted.

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I had two coworkers ragging on gays being sick and evil in the lunchroom and I finally had enough and said "Time out! Don't go there. you are promoting your religion and calling these people evil. This is a county workplace, so stop it." One of them realized he'd crossed the line right away and understood that I could have family or friends that are gay (which I do), and that I could have gone to HR instead of speaking up. I was nervous and emotional when I spoke, and I hope to get past that and speak more clearly, but had to speak. The other guy approached me at the end of the day and apologized. So it all turned out good. I know that neither of them would say similar things about blacks, but somehow their beliefs still group gays into a "bad" thing.

 

Good for you fuego for speaking up. I am proud of you. These christians think they have the right to judge and condemn everyone elses beliefs and lifestyles, yet if anyone says anything to them about their beliefs and lifestyles they cry afoul and say they are being persecuted. Upvoted.

Oh I love when Republicans cry persecution, it's unbelievably ironic.

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I am both jealous and sympathetic of your deconversion at your age. I'm 21 and have basically just begun life without religion, and I envy your head start in free thinking. On the other hand, it means more time with a believing family and I'm coming to understand how hard that can be (still in the closet here).

 

Talking with a friend of mine, he brought up the common image of aggressive atheists trying to debate or mock everyone. My best guess is that most atheists (and agnostics, though the two are not mutually exclusive) are probably quiet and polite, but a loud minority makes more impact than a quiet majority. I agree with him that in personal conversation, ridiculing and arguing is not very helpful. However, I also respect the right of atheists to make their beliefs known just as much as religious people do (constantly). It was helpful to me to see that there are people out there who really don't believe, who find the whole idea laughable and are not afraid of making fun of something that doesn't exist.

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I am both jealous and sympathetic of your deconversion at your age. I'm 21 and have basically just begun life without religion, and I envy your head start in free thinking. On the other hand, it means more time with a believing family and I'm coming to understand how hard that can be (still in the closet here).

 

Talking with a friend of mine, he brought up the common image of aggressive atheists trying to debate or mock everyone. My best guess is that most atheists (and agnostics, though the two are not mutually exclusive) are probably quiet and polite, but a loud minority makes more impact than a quiet majority. I agree with him that in personal conversation, ridiculing and arguing is not very helpful. However, I also respect the right of atheists to make their beliefs known just as much as religious people do (constantly). It was helpful to me to see that there are people out there who really don't believe, who find the whole idea laughable and are not afraid of making fun of something that doesn't exist.

Thanks for the sympathy and admiration lol :D I'm kind of jealous that you're 21, that's where life officially begins to me. And to be honest, I actually love the super strong atheists like Dawkins or Hitchens, they put religious people in their place. I just don't think it needs to be done all the time and to the extent that they do it. Most religious people I know are like most atheists I know...quiet and respectful. I'm not going to lie though, my Twitter has a ton of retweeted atheist memes that make fun of theism and religion.

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It is a constant source of amazement to my U.K self that you of the American continent have these workplace issues.  I cannot imagine these conversations in any office where i have worked, or even in any of the schools or colleges I've attended (save when associating with the Christian Union).

 

Family is another matter of course.  Whatever their belief system, families have a habit of seeking conformity.

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Welcome to my life. I can remember being in high school standing next to my best friends locker filled with really graphic pretty horrible pro-life images and I was just chatting merrily away. I just saw people the way they are. I think it was a pretty accurate way to see the world. I had friends who were fiery religious people I would just though wow they're passionate.

 

I really truly did not have any biases. Over the years things added to my frustration levels.

 

Now I am now looking to mellow out so I actually thought deeply about the subject of the angry atheist. I'm actually here because I have fundamentalist evangelical inlaws and I seek to find a way to deal with them peacefully.

 

it's interesting you mention the way it accumulates because that's how I feel. It took decades of frustration for me to get at the point where the level of anger I experience feels uncomfortable in my own life.

 

Outside of my own personal issues I thought about the cultural meme that atheist are angry .At first I bought into the belief that hitchens and dawkins are superior acting jerks. But then I examined that belief. I thought about it. Have you watched any debates? In reality the way they present themselves is pretty civil. I never saw them lose their their temper. I would almost call their disposition affable.

 

People also mention the hate online. Safe to assume there are internet haters anywhere at anytime so that also wouldn't suprise me. But then I thought about that. Go read the comment section on religious or atheist topics. I have to say I don't see a disproportionate amount of jerks. In fact I see a disproportionate amount of shockingly insightful responses.

 

Even this site I've observed people are really cool to newcomers. When somebody comes in here unsure about their beliefs people tell them to take their time and think about things their own way. Nobody seems to pressure them or tell them what to think. Even when people talk about frustrations and rant they seem pretty collected and I don't see a lot of people saying things that are truly out of line.

 

I guess my point is that I question the meme that atheist are categorically angry.

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Then Jack is just kind of annoying, he always talks about the Bible. And it's not even in a way where it's to share or express beliefs, it's just annoying and to start something with someone. I remember on Thursday at the end of class, he asked me if I would get a tattoo, and I said "yeah but on my shoulder or back so I could hide it if I had to". Then he's all like "well you shouldn't, the Bible says don't mark yourself" to which I replied "I don't believe in the Bible, I kind of figured that you would've known that." Then he just got all uncomfortable and left while I stayed behind to help my art teacher. Bitchy and uncalled for? Yeah I know it was. I just got annoyed. I feel like he knows I'm not a jackass about my lack of faith but he wants to take me there so it can be the innocent Christian against the intolerant agnostic atheist.

 

I think your response was appropriate. It sounds like he asked that initial question hoping you'd give an answer he could criticize biblically. It's perfectly reasonable to point out to people when they're being antagonistic and trying to provoke a conflict that you're not interested in.

 

I guess my point is that I question the meme that atheist are categorically angry.

 

Any categorical generalization falls flat when confronted with reality. Every group is made up of individuals who all think and act differently. Atheists especially, since we're united by common disbelief, rather than shared faith. Having no scripture or manifesto to huddle around, we end up being a very diverse and diffuse group.

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Thanks for the support, I knew I'd find it on this site :)

I just don't know how to explain or justify my lack of belief especially now because I'm so young that everyone thinks it's some teenage "heathen" phase. My aunt called on Sunday, asked if I went to church (which I didn't) and when I said no, she said one is allowed a heathen phase so it's okay. She said that I'll come back one day.

Yeah...phase...

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Thanks for the support, I knew I'd find it on this site smile.png

I just don't know how to explain or justify my lack of belief especially now because I'm so young that everyone thinks it's some teenage "heathen" phase. My aunt called on Sunday, asked if I went to church (which I didn't) and when I said no, she said one is allowed a heathen phase so it's okay. She said that I'll come back one day.

Yeah...phase...

 

I was 17 and out on my own when I decided I was atheist. I got the same response from my parents. In time, they'll find they can't maintain the delusion that you'll be back. As long as they don't try debating and arguing with me, I figure it doesn't much matter one way or another. Maybe one day they'll make an honest attempt to understand us. But that seems doubtful, from where I'm standing.

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I sit here and read. You young people blow me out the door!! You amaze me!! You are all so brave to go against something this big!! The challenges you must face are so big and yet it will be you guys who start the whole ball rolling for the next generation of young people. You may help to save someone young person in the future from the devastation of religion. All of you...keep your head held high and stay strong. We're here to help you. I wrote this letter to the young people in 2012 and I hope you all get encouragement from it. Love to you all and big hugs!! Thanks for continuing to teach me!!

 

 http://www.ex-christian.net/topic/50092-a-letter-to-the-young-people-on-ex-c/#.VTbHpCFVhBc

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I swear though, it's so annoying at times. My mother has such a dinosaur, ancient, borderline bigoted way of thinking. I'm getting really fed up with it. I can't wait until I'm 18 and can do what the fuck I want.

I have to vent on here and another forum later, it's past midnight here...

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