Going To Hell

[Guest biscuit]

Since deconverting and crossing the line of no return, I've now had experiences which have led me to believe that there is a hell which is very real and that's where I'll end up.

 

I think that a lot of the problems I had with being a believer was that I was taught to read the bible literally, as well as being taught that it's inerrant - which its not, because there are definitely contradictions in it. 

 

Has anyone else gone so far that they can't repent, and then later thought that actually there was salvation? 

 

 

[Becks]

Since deconverting and crossing the line of no return, I've now had experiences which have led me to believe that there is a hell which is very real and that's where I'll end up

Hi Biscuit, can you talk about what experiences make you believe there is a hell?

[Guest biscuit]

Hi Becks, I'm sending you a pm.

[florduh]

Please check for my pm.

[mymistake]

Since deconverting and crossing the line of no return, I've now had experiences which have led me to believe that there is a hell which is very real and that's where I'll end up.

 

I think that a lot of the problems I had with being a believer was that I was taught to read the bible literally, as well as being taught that it's inerrant - which its not, because there are definitely contradictions in it. 

 

Has anyone else gone so far that they can't repent, and then later thought that actually there was salvation? 

 

 

Of course different thoughts cross my mind.  However once we investigate the concept of Hell it turns

 

out to be unfounded.  You are welcome to PM me as well if you like.

[sdelsolray]

Since deconverting and crossing the line of no return, I've now had experiences which have led me to believe that there is a hell which is very real and that's where I'll end up.

 

I think that a lot of the problems I had with being a believer was that I was taught to read the bible literally, as well as being taught that it's inerrant - which its not, because there are definitely contradictions in it. 

 

Has anyone else gone so far that they can't repent, and then later thought that actually there was salvation? 

Learn how to deal with your religious fear.  You were indoctrinated with it.  You remain in its grasp.  Is that what you want?

[Guest biscuit]

@sdelsolray - have you committed the unforgivable sin?  Since I think I had, I have had experiences which have led me to believe that that's where I'll end up. 

 

Lots of people who deconvert don't commit that particular sin, so I don't think have the same issues. 

[wyson]

biscuit, if you can, tell us what those experiences are so you can get some alternate viewpoints.  No one will judge you here, because we have all been through the same indoctrination.

[Becks]

Biscuit, one of the ideas to reprogram your mind when deconverting is there is no such thing as sin. Therefore there is no unpardonable sin. There is no hell to punish us and no heaven. I don't care if you drank blood and said incantations to sell your soul to the devil, it won't change your fate after death, some people on this site believe in some kind of afterlife, but not the bible version or eternal torment. You may be feeling fear but try to combat that with thinking through the fearful thoughts and see if they are truly based on reality, we are here for you!

[directionless]

Hi, biscuit. I hope you get over these worries soon. It makes me sad to think of all the people throughout history who have had similar worries due to Christianity and other religions.

[qadeshet]

Which is more frightening, the Christian Hell or Heaven? According to the NT, there is no food or drink in Heaven, because there is no hunger or thirst. There is no Free Will because you can't sin or even ask to leave. There is no fatigue so no sleep. No marriage or sex in Heaven. Just an eternity prostrate before The Great White Throne singing hymns of praise to a cruel and vengeful god. If I had to choose, I would rather burn in Hell.

 

Valerie Tarico has a great article describing why Heaven would be worse than Hell.

 

10 Reasons Popular Versions of Christian Heaven Would be Hell

[Lilith666]

There.

Is.

No.

Hell.

 

How ridiculous is it that anyone would be sent to suffer for eternity--not ten years, not a thousand, not a million, but forever--for believing the wrong things? Wouldn't the powers that be or God or whatever rather send people like Dzhokhar Tsarnaev and Dylann Roof, who murdered total strangers because they felt like it? But really, do you honestly think there's another dimension somewhere with people burning and not dying, who have been there for years or centuries and will be there for literally numberless centuries afterward?

 

Look. The idea of hell is entirely made up. Where is the evidence for this place? Point out for me one empirical fact that suggests the existence of hell, then get back to me.

[Thackerie]

Which is more frightening, the Christian Hell or Heaven? According to the NT, there is no food or drink in Heaven, because there is no hunger or thirst. There is no Free Will because you can't sin or even ask to leave. There is no fatigue so no sleep. No marriage or sex in Heaven. Just an eternity prostrate before The Great White Throne singing hymns of praise to a cruel and vengeful god. If I had to choose, I would rather burn in Hell.

 

Valerie Tarico has a great article describing why Heaven would be worse than Hell.

 

10 Reasons Popular Versions of Christian Heaven Would be Hell

 

Totally agree!

[Guest biscuit]

Thanks for your replies and I appreciate what you are saying, but basically after I got so far away from believing that I got into the unpardonable sin, I later had some experiences where I felt entities entering my body - which might sound crazy and psychological, but after a time I realised it definitely had happened.  I then had a series of experiences which I don't really want to explain in a lot of detail, but essentially it was clear evidence that I'd opened myself up to negative energy and experiences of possession.  On top of this other things happened which is why I had this realisation.

 

I do understand that other people who've said the unforgivable sin haven't had this experience, but I only know what's been happening in my own situation. 

 

Lots of people who deconvert don't commit the unforgivable sin, and still have a positive view of Jesus.  They may go on to other beliefs, but they never went over that line. 

 

I guess the only thing that would convince me now is if anyone who had done this was able to share their NDE - although I know that's not conclusive evidence. 

[wyson]

What is the unpardonable sin?  Is it blaspheming against the Holy Spirit?  I think the Holy Spirit is totally imaginary and a crock of shit.  There.  I'll join you.

[Guest biscuit]

@Wyson - that's not it - it's attributing Jesus' miracles to a demon, not that I'm saying to.

 

I know of a couple of people who say that they haven't had a problem, but I have.  I can only go by what's been happening..   

[florduh]

Please, biscuit, you've had a break with reality. Get help, seriously.

[wyson]

@Wyson - that's not it - it's attributing Jesus' miracles to a demon, not that I'm saying to.

 

I know of a couple of people who say that they haven't had a problem, but I have.  I can only go by what's been happening..

 

Well what has been happening then?

[Guest biscuit]

Thanks for your advice Florduh - I'm taking things sensibly this week and will get plenty of rest.  I know it sounds like it's mental health which can be challenging enough at times, but I believe it's not.

[wyson]

Thanks for your advice Florduh - I'm taking things sensibly this week and will get plenty of rest. I know it sounds like it's mental health which can be challenging enough at times, but I believe it's not.

From everything I have seen you post, I also think you are having mental health problems. One good test is... are my thoughts shared with anyone else, or is it me percieving things in a special way, in a way that is unaccessible to others? If other people have had a similar experience, and I'm sure they have, did they experience it in the same individual way?

 

Individual psychotic breaks and hallucinatory experiences are very, very common.

 

Of course if people saw demons enter you, having evidence thereof, say video evidence and you have physical evidence that you went between worldly realms that other people can see, hear and touch that can't be explained by science you might be onto something.

 

On the other hand,

 

If it was you, by yourself in a darkened room...

 

I would see a professional and tell them exactly what you have been thinking and ask for a second opinion.

 

Our brains run a simulation of reality outside. Did you know you see upside down for instance? Your brain flips the image upside down and then fills in colour information, which is different according to your cultural ideas about colour. And your brain eliminates the pause between someone speaking (lips moving = light) and their voice reaching your ears (sound) so they appear synced.

 

Its very, very easy for this apparatus to misfunction. I have seen it myself when I have had psychotic breaks with reality. But its all in your mind. The reality outside is normal. The test being... did someone else see what I saw? Is there any evidence other than myself / my mind for what I think / believe?

[Guest biscuit]

@Wyson - without going into it a lot basically I've had symptoms of possession, as well as voices indicating that I'm going to hell, and sensations of entities moving on my body (which yes I realise could possibly be similar to psychosis, however the symptoms of possession which have happened have been overwhelming). 

 

I know to any skeptic its going to sound psychological or emotional, but because I couldn't control stuff can't see any other conclusion - it's never happened before, and actually I have had trouble feeling emotions.  I realise this may not convince anyone, but since you asked this is my answer.

[Thackerie]

 

Thanks for your replies and I appreciate what you are saying, but basically after I got so far away from believing that I got into the unpardonable sin, I later had some experiences where I felt entities entering my body - which might sound crazy and psychological, but after a time I realised it definitely had happened. I then had a series of experiences which I don't really want to explain in a lot of detail, but essentially it was clear evidence that I'd opened myself up to negative energy and experiences of possession. On top of this other things happened which is why I had this realisation.

 

I do understand that other people who've said the unforgivable sin haven't had this experience, but I only know what's been happening in my own situation.

 

Lots of people who deconvert don't commit the unforgivable sin, and still have a positive view of Jesus. They may go on to other beliefs, but they never went over that line.

 

I guess the only thing that would convince me now is if anyone who had done this was able to share their NDE - although I know that's not conclusive evidence.

I've read that NDE's can be induced by drugs. There are many hypotheses which explain how people experience NDE's as their brains are in the process of dying.

 

 

NDEs prove nothing about any kind of afterlife. They're about "NEAR death," not actual death. No one has ever actually died and come back to report on it.

[wyson]

@Wyson - without going into it a lot basically I've had symptoms of possession, as well as voices indicating that I'm going to hell, and sensations of entities moving on my body (which yes I realise could possibly be similar to psychosis, however the symptoms of possession which have happened have been overwhelming). 

 

I know to any skeptic its going to sound psychological or emotional, but because I couldn't control stuff can't see any other conclusion - it's never happened before, and actually I have had trouble feeling emotions.  I realise this may not convince anyone, but since you asked this is my answer.

Ok but did anyone else see the entities? Do you have evidence?

 

I'm not saying you didnt feel these things, what I am asking if its just your perception, or if you have evidence, or it was witnessed by another person.

[Guest biscuit]

@ Thanks wyson - I have had experience of mental health issues so I'm familiar with what can happen and how our minds can play tricks on us.  However, this was different.  I know writing about it may not convince anyone.  I haven't mentioned absolutely everything. 

 

 

No, the entities weren't witnessed by anyone else - it was what I could feel.  And there are no witnesses to when I lost control. 

[wyson]

Brains can malfunction, but this is often not visible to the outside. It can only be inferred through symptoms of the type you describe. The sufferer tries to make sense of the malfunction by forming a narrative using structures (hellfire and brimstone, demons and gods in Christians cases) that they are familiar with.

 

The spectrum of brain disorders is massive. Tumours that induce hallucinations, strokes, parkinsons, alzeheimers. You could have had a micro stroke or TIA.

 

Seriously get checked out by a doc.