As A Christian What Are Some Things You Didn't Accept As Sin?

[Geezer]

Even as a born again Christians brainwashed into one of the more legalistic versions of Christianity there were some things I secretly didn't believe were sinful. I never confessed this publicly to anyone, but I didn't accept this stuff as sinful either. I kept my opinions to myself for obvious reasons.

 

1. The exclusion of women from virtually all Church and Worship related activities. I never really believed that came from God. In mind my that was clearly a Middle Eastern tradition that was incorporated into Christianity. In the book of Romans Paul acknowledges at the end of the book one of the other recognized apostles was a woman. Conservative apologists claim it was really a guy with a feminine name. Kind of like the name Jamie in our culture it could be either masculine or feminine. Not so say historians the name Paul mentioned as an Apostle was strictly feminine. There are no records indicating It was ever used or given to a man.

 

And we know women served as Deacons because the book of Acts says so. The church I was affiliated with acknowledged the early church had female deacons but still refused to allow women to serve as deacons even though they claimed to follow the bible literally and acknowledged even examples were to be interpreted as commands, except in this case. They couldn't come up with a biblical reason they just decided woman couldn't serve as deacons. They followed the bible literally except when they didn't and they said they didn't have to give a reason if they didn't want to, and in this case they didn't want to.

 

2. The hatred of homosexuals. Again, in my mind, that evolved from the Middle Eastern Jewish culture. That was one of the more obvious, you're forgiven of your sins, but not really,... examples that are present throughout the various versions of Christianity. Some repetitive sins were okay or at least acknowledged as just something that all humans struggle with. It wasn't a big deal if relapses occurred. One denomination referred to this as back sliding. Homosexuality clearly didn't qualify as "backsliding". Any failure automatically meant the guilty party was destined for hell.

 

I never understood the biblical concept of grace. You sins were forgiven as long as you didn't do them again. What was the purpose of the cross in the Christian faith if the individual believer had to stop sinning? And how is that not earning your way to heaven? If a person had to earn their way into heaven by being sinless then what did Jesus supposedly die for? Those numerous contradictions and inconsistencies that are replete throughout the bible and Christianity was a major factor that eventually contributed to killing my faith.

 

3. Premarital sex, or actually any sex outside of marriage. Why would God care who anyone is sleeping with? The bible is filled with illicit sex from cover to cover. If sex outside of marriage is a fatal sin then why didn't God execute King David? Doesn't the Bible say God isn't a respecter of persons. Well, obviously, that just ain't so. And what about the old testament and all the multiple wives and concubines? Why was banging a concubine okay in the OT but sex is only okay between married couples in the NT? The contradictions seemingly go on forever in the Bible.

 

According to the NT a person must commit themselves to one mate for life and never have sex with them first. Seriously? That is just plain crazy. That may have worked in Bible times when women were little more that chattel but that ain't gonna work in today's world. Hell, people even test drive a car before they take it home with them. People are really expected to marry someone and "hope" they turn out to be a good sex partner. You'd have a better chance winning the power ball.

 

I never really accepted the belief that sexual intercourse between consenting adults was a sin. I obviously never said that to a fellow believer for fear that hell would consume me, but I didn't believe having sex was a sin.

 

4. Alcohol - Drinking alcoholic beverages was a major no no with the group I was associated with, but the Bible is filled with examples of people consuming alcohol beverages, and drunkenness. Even Jesus drank wine and no the wine he drank wasn't Welches grape juice. And his momma ask him to turn water into wine so everyone could keep on partying. Grape juice my ass. It was the real deal and people got drunk drinking it. Clearly drinking alcoholic beverages was commonplace and apparently no one thought it was a sin until Christianity decided it was.

 

 

Those are just a few of my pet sins that I never accepted were actually sins. I'm sure others have more examples.

 

 

 

[Lilith666]

I can't think of anything the parents' church saw as sinful that I didn't, but I was outraged over the bible's (at first Paul's, but later on in the OT as well) comments and instructions about women and marriage. I used to be insanely jealous of men and wished I were one, so I wouldn't have to be lower down in the hierarchy. Eventually I decided the best option would be not to marry at all, and therefore not have to abide by the "submission" order in Ephesians 5 - I was raised to believe that obeying the bible strictly is of utmost importance. Many Christians would probably consider my rebelliousness and anger over Christian gender roles sinful.

[yunea]

Great thread.

 

Um. Wanting to be together with a non-Christian. I was warned about that many times, was told stories about how a relationship may not be God's will even if the guy converted into Christianity. Then again someone prophesied over me something vague that sounded like God gave his ok for me and the guy. Oh, the confusion.

 

I once heard a sermon about warning your friends that copying cd's is a sin. That was problematic! I even knew people at church who copied gospel for each other! And I was supposed to go tell them to remember it was a sin? I continued copying cd's myself, too.

 

Then of course my favourite one when I was Pentecostal. Mind you I was a teen with myriad problems (no clue I may be on the autism spectrum, etc). Love thy neighbor as you love thyself!

I was unable to take that literally because I hated my own guts. Which, on one hand, made me more than ready to become a new creation, and I anticipated the touch of Jesus with my whole being. But somewhere there I should have loved myself to be able to love my neighbour? Or what?

I didn't think I was sinning even though I wasn't exactly obeying what was said to be one of the most important things in the Bible. Heh.

 

During my New Agey Jesus follower years I of course had a very different view of sin, so it's not relevant here.

[mwc]

     I went back and forth on a lot of stuff but one thing that I was certain of growing up was that god had a sense of humor since humans had one.  This was a constant source of grief for me.  Church leaders are uptight pieces of shit.  They make their stupid little jokes but boy do they have limits when it comes to religious crap.  Suddenly it's all serious and god can't take a joke.  I was sure this wasn't the case and god had to have the best, the more perfect, sense of humor of everyone and would be the best at taking (and making) a joke.  I was punished severely for this blasphemous take on their rotten god.  What do you expect?  The bible never has god laugh or upbeat (he is outside the bible).

 

          mwc

[Lilith666]

I got the impression that God was extremely serious and had little personality. I could never imagine Jesus laughing, telling a story, or having inside jokes, or doing anything normal that did not involve preaching and doing miracles. What are some jokes the church people didn't like, mwc? Do you remember any reactions to your blasphemy?

[mwc]

     I was in a Baptist school and anything that made fun of the religion was off-limits.  Making funny comments about anything in the bible was a huge no-no a got me in trouble many times.  The reactions were always some form of punishment (detentions, swats, etc.).  I was always in trouble.  I wish I could remember some specific jokes I made but it has literally been decades and my memory isn't quite that good.  All I know is I thought they were pretty damn funny at the time (as did a lot of people in class).

 

     On an slightly unrelated note I do know in English class one year I wrote a series of short stories about Willie the One-eyed Wonder Worm and his two friends, who carried his gear and waited outside, that liked to go spelunking in the sugar caves to lick the walls until it made him sick enough to throw-up.  The teacher would read these as fine examples aloud to the class and once the principle was subbing and did the same.  I thought I was up shit creek but these people were so stupid they couldn't catch the obvious references (along with most of the class).  Needless to say those that did just about pissed themselves laughing.  I knew my audience.

 

          mwc

[Geezer]

Did Jesus ever get an erection? If he was "fully" human it would seem that he would have had to have sexual feeling. And he would have had to eliminate his body waste too. In other words God had to poop & pee. Think about that. The creator of all that is had to take a dump. That image kind of puts that deity thing in a different perspective doesn't it?

[StarGazer]

Seeing as how I'd spent a good four years as a aware bisexual, and an advocate for LGBT rights, I found it virtually impossible to 'turn' on my beliefs. So yeah, I kept that as a 'Only God can judge them' issue. 

[00LukeMan]

Sexual orientation is the one that comes to mind. My parents avoid the topic of sex so carefully that I never got much indoctrination about orientation. They would say constantly that extramarital sex was wrong, but that was it for most of my life. I was a teenager when I found out that there were orientations other than straight and by that time (with the help of shows like Doctor Who) I couldn't see anything wrong with that. As a Christian, my position on the issue was "I don't have a problem with it, but for some reason God does."

Now that I've woken up, if they're an adult and consent to it, you can fuck and/or marry whomever you please.

[Lilith666]

Haha Geezer. I used to scare myself, wondering if Jesus ever masturbated. And considering that he must have had to pee, and poop. It was horrifying. God taking a piss.

[amateur]

I never had any concept of mutually-consented sexuality of any variety as being sinful.  

 

I grew up in a Methodist church and everybody in it joked about how "in the old days" the Methodists weren't allowed to dance or play cards or drink.  But our youth group held dances in the church, and everybody played cards, and we were actually nice kids that didn't drink, but our parents did and nobody thought about it twice.

 

I used to wonder when the rules changed from "the old days" when dancing and cards and drinking weren't allowed.  Nobody ever explained that, or the timing.  None of those things ever seemed sinful to me in the least.

 

I used to have long, ponderous thoughts about the idea of "thou shall not kill."  Was it ok if a soldier killed someone?  A policeman?  How about killing in self-defense?  Manslaughter, accidents?  What about killing animals (all it said was "thou shall not kill," not specifically people)?  Should I be a vegetarian?  Should I not kill bugs or spiders (not that I did that; I always loved bugs and spiders)?  What if I accidentally step on a bug?  Then the concept of "killing" would lead me to, "What about being mean to somebody and making them feel like they can't do something?  Is that killing their spirit and is it a sin?"  Anyway, I over-thought that concept to the point where I decided it was a useless exercise to figure out by myself (I was, what?, maybe 15 or 16 years old?  What did I know?), so I quit worrying about it.  I haven't physically killed anybody ever and never felt a need to, so I'm cool with it.  But I do eat meat.  And I do sometimes, accidentally usually, kill bugs.  That makes me sad, but I don't think it's a sin.

[bunzooh]

on drinking alcohol. I never agreed with that either. In fact, I grew up drinking wine in a common cup at communion (Episc) ... and the fundie habit of putting grape juice in little bitty cups drove me crazy. It's very similar to how the Mormons do it, only they have water in little cups...

 

Anyway, during my Xtian career, when I got out of Episc and went all bible-thumpy, I never agreed with that. It bugged me bad, especially since the bible says things like wine is a blessing and the benefits of wine for the stomach are mentioned in the NT. and I attended a VERY conservative reformed church that considered wine the only biblical possibility for communion...and they served it in little cups! hahahaha!

 

But as for what was considered sin by the majority, little kids exploring their bodies, or even "touching bums" (which my boy did when he was four with a boy from church)...oh, if the other mom had been the one who found them doing it, there would have been spankings. which nauseates me to this day.

 

And masturbation. I went through a brief period where I thought it might be wrong, but as there was no outright prohibition, and sexual purity was about two people getting it on, that was never something that I thought of as wrong or sinful.

[Jeff]

I love the verse in the OT that says you can use your tithe for "strong drink" (KJV).

They deny first then ignore it. Alcohol... Deal with the first "miracle" church. Seriously. Read the actual story. It's booze.

[FlowerDemon]

I didn't understand why it was such a bad thing to cuss sometimes. Here are a couple of Bible verses that speak of this, even though it is mentioned many times throughout the Bible: 

 

James 3:9-12 "With the tongue we praise our Lord and Father, and with it we curse men, who have been made in God's likeness. Out of the same mouth come praise and cursing. My brothers, this should not be. Can both fresh water and salt water flow from the same spring? My brothers, can a fig tree bear olives, or a grapevine bear figs? Neither can a salt spring produce fresh water."

 

Ephesians 4:29 

Let no corrupting talk come out of your mouths, but only such as is good for building up, as fits the occasion, that it may give grace to those who hear.

 

I understand what the verse means, but what if you get mad and say "Oh shit" about something? As a Christian, I felt guilty about talking like that, and I would pray for God to help me remove unclean speech from my mouth and to only use words that are good, and offer praise to God, and are positive and uplifting. At the same time...I didn't get why it was such a bad thing to curse. I use the words I use to express myself when I talk. Do I really need to ask for God's forgiveness if I say "Oh FUCK!" when I stub my toe on the side of a door? I don't think so. I was expressing how much it hurt.

[dichotomy]

Good thread. There were times where I believed what I was told, but pretty quickly I realised that despite the teachings I did not agree that the following were sinful or "of the devil".

 

1. Magic - one of the churches I went to was particularly against this kind of thing and was very anti stuff like friendship bracelets, harry potter, card tricks and buffy the vampire slayer etc. It baffled me then, it baffles me now!

 

2. Homosexuality. I did tow the party line for a while but never felt comfortable with it.

 

3. Pre-marital sex or cohabitation. I actually thought sex before marriage made sense.

 

4. That women should submit to men and that those who didn't were manipulative or sinful.

[amateur]

 

I understand what the verse means, but what if you get mad and say "Oh shit" about something? As a Christian, I felt guilty about talking like that, and I would pray for God to help me remove unclean speech from my mouth and to only use words that are good, and offer praise to God, and are positive and uplifting. At the same time...I didn't get why it was such a bad thing to curse. I use the words I use to express myself when I talk. Do I really need to ask for God's forgiveness if I say "Oh FUCK!" when I stub my toe on the side of a door? I don't think so. I was expressing how much it hurt.

Yeah, I get the idea, too.  But there has to be some common sense involved.  For instance, screaming at one's grandma, "You're a fuckhead!" seems really rude in general (but one might need to know the grandma, who may indeed be a fuckhead), but screaming, "Fuck!" when seriously whacking a toe into something is just a natural reaction.  And why do they let jesus off the hook?  Jesus talked about love being the most important thing, yet he also said racist things concerning other tribes and people living in different areas, and he said those horrible things about how slaves should cheerfully obey their masters.  If those two things (the all-importance of love towards everybody vs. racism and acceptance of slavery) aren't fresh water and salt water flowing from the same stream, what is?

 

Also, in the early-90's I had to sit thru an entire sermon about why yoga was wrong for xians to do.  Focusing on a mantra, focusing on your own inner power, connecting with some supernatural world -- that was yoga and it was wrong and un-xian.  I was like, "What?"  I am sad to say I sat thru the whole sermon and didn't get up and leave.  I didn't agree with it, but I didn't leave.  Not that I would have left out of anger, just out of "I have better things to do on this pleasant Sunday morning than listen to things that don't involve me (I had never practised yoga at that time) and I didn't think were true."

[Storm]

I never bought into the whole "devil made me do it" sin mentality. I was able to recognize that I did a pretty good job of getting myself into situations where I sinned without the devil's help. I chose to accept responsibility when I f'ed up. It ultimately made me feel like a more genuine Christian because I accepted the responsibility of my sin.

 

Now that I think about it, I suspect that this mentality probably played a role in my deconversion.

[dichotomy]

I never bought into the whole "devil made me do it" sin mentality. I was able to recognize that I did a pretty good job of getting myself into situations where I sinned without the devil's help. I chose to accept responsibility when I f'ed up. It ultimately made me feel like a more genuine Christian because I accepted the responsibility of my sin.

 

Now that I think about it, I suspect that this mentality probably played a role in my deconversion.

 

Absolutely. For all it's focus on sin, confession and being unworthy, Christianity is terrible for discouraging individuals to take personal responsibility, for good or for bad. If something good happens in your life, if you succeed, "glory to god" if something bad happens or you make a mistake "satan has tempted you". 

I find it fascinating how a religion can simultaneously make people feel like shit and give them a false sense of importance.

[FlowerDemon]

 

 

I understand what the verse means, but what if you get mad and say "Oh shit" about something? As a Christian, I felt guilty about talking like that, and I would pray for God to help me remove unclean speech from my mouth and to only use words that are good, and offer praise to God, and are positive and uplifting. At the same time...I didn't get why it was such a bad thing to curse. I use the words I use to express myself when I talk. Do I really need to ask for God's forgiveness if I say "Oh FUCK!" when I stub my toe on the side of a door? I don't think so. I was expressing how much it hurt.

Yeah, I get the idea, too.  But there has to be some common sense involved.  For instance, screaming at one's grandma, "You're a fuckhead!" seems really rude in general (but one might need to know the grandma, who may indeed be a fuckhead), but screaming, "Fuck!" when seriously whacking a toe into something is just a natural reaction.  And why do they let jesus off the hook?  Jesus talked about love being the most important thing, yet he also said racist things concerning other tribes and people living in different areas, and he said those horrible things about how slaves should cheerfully obey their masters.  If those two things (the all-importance of love towards everybody vs. racism and acceptance of slavery) aren't fresh water and salt water flowing from the same stream, what is?

 

Also, in the early-90's I had to sit thru an entire sermon about why yoga was wrong for xians to do.  Focusing on a mantra, focusing on your own inner power, connecting with some supernatural world -- that was yoga and it was wrong and un-xian.  I was like, "What?"  I am sad to say I sat thru the whole sermon and didn't get up and leave.  I didn't agree with it, but I didn't leave.  Not that I would have left out of anger, just out of "I have better things to do on this pleasant Sunday morning than listen to things that don't involve me (I had never practised yoga at that time) and I didn't think were true."

 

For sure. I definitely watch what I say around certain people and try to not curse in situations that aren't appropriate, for example if I'm at work, or with certain family members. Would you mind elaborating on the racist things Jesus said? When I was a Christian I read Mark, Matthew, and John..but didn't read all of Luke, and I don't remember anything racist that he said specifically. I would like to know more about that. 

 

And as for slaves obeying their masters, when I was a Christian this is how I looked at it "Since Jesus suffered for us we should suffer for him. if we were to be a slave, we should bear it and serve others like Jesus did when he died." But now that I have stepped back from religion and allowed myself to look at it honestly, that doesn't make sense. I wasn't even alive when Jesus was supposedly killed, but yet he died for my sins and I have to suffer for him now? Why does the Bible even hint at slavery being ok? Why would God make his bible in a way that humans end up using it to justify slavery? It just doesn't all add up. Honestly if I was a slave, I would obey my master ONLY because I would rather AVOID any extra beatings. It would have nothing to do with "Because it's God's will for me to kiss up to my master." 

 

The thing about Christianity is, it points out how you are such a sinful person, and that in reality, you don't even deserve heaven. But because God is so merciful and graceful, he gives you what you don't deserve (heaven, eternity with Jesus), and he doesn't give you what you do deserve (hell, eternity in torture with Satan). It guilt trips you to the point where if you ended up being a slave, you would bear it, believing that you deserve it because Jesus went through misery for your own sins, so you oughta do the same. 

 

Christians say that since God always forgives, Christianity isn't a guilt-trip religion. At first, I was convinced this was true. But then I noticed the "convictions" I was getting about the way I was living and how it conflicted with parts of the Bible. I tried to change my life to line up with scriptures. In some areas of my life, though, I refused to change them, because even though they went against the Bible, they didn't harm myself or other people. They weren't destructive ways of living at all.

 

And then it's like, you have to confess your sins to god, apologize for offending him, even though he's omnipotent and already knows what you've done and what you're about to say. The fact that you have to say sorry to god shows that it is, in fact, a guilt-trip religion. You know you will be held accountable for sin everytime you commit it, and god is always waiting for you to confess what he already knows, so he can forgive you.

[amateur]

David R. Henson wrote:

Mark 7:24-37

Was Jesus a racist?

This might be an uncomfortable question for Christians to ask, but, given this week’s lectionary text, I think it’s one we must ask. And we must ask it unvarnished.

Our immediate response likely is, “Of course not! Jesus couldn’t possibly have been racist!” But Jesus’ exchange with the Syrophoenician woman seems to tell a different story. In it, Jesus calls the woman, who was desperate for a miracle for her child, a dog, a dehumanizing ethnic slur common at the time. No matter what theological tap dance we might create to avoid this uncomfortable truth, eventually, we have to face this stark truth.

Jesus uttered a racial slur.

 

amateur here:  And, yes, Jesus did help her but only after she begged and groveled.  That was dehumanizing.

[Lilith666]

People who know little about Christianity and haven't read much of the Bible: "Christianity is about love! The nasty people are just misusing it! Jesus would be ashamed of the way they act!"

Us: "Jesus was racist."

Haha

[FlowerDemon]

David R. Henson wrote:

Mark 7:24-37

Was Jesus a racist?

This might be an uncomfortable question for Christians to ask, but, given this week’s lectionary text, I think it’s one we must ask. And we must ask it unvarnished.

Our immediate response likely is, “Of course not! Jesus couldn’t possibly have been racist!” But Jesus’ exchange with the Syrophoenician woman seems to tell a different story. In it, Jesus calls the woman, who was desperate for a miracle for her child, a dog, a dehumanizing ethnic slur common at the time. No matter what theological tap dance we might create to avoid this uncomfortable truth, eventually, we have to face this stark truth.

Jesus uttered a racial slur.

 

amateur here:  And, yes, Jesus did help her but only after she begged and groveled.  That was dehumanizing.

I read up more on this. Matthew 15:22-28 tells the same story. Verse 24 :"He answered, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel.” 

So basically Jesus is saying that he did not come for all of mankind, only for the Jews. Also, Matthew 10:5-6 hints at this once more:

5 These twelve Jesus sent out, instructing them, “Go nowhere among the Gentiles and enter no town of the Samaritans, 6 but go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

I read about this on a Muslim website...most of the time I disregard websites that have writers who claim what their religion is over another's, but this article is pretty straight forward about Jesus being racist. http://www.answering-christianity.com/jesus_mankind.htm

[★ Citsonga ★]

I didn't understand why it was such a bad thing to cuss sometimes. Here are a couple of Bible verses that speak of this, even though it is mentioned many times throughout the Bible: 

 

James 3:9-12 "With the tongue we praise our Lord and Father, and with it we curse men, who have been made in God's likeness. Out of the same mouth come praise and cursing. My brothers, this should not be. Can both fresh water and salt water flow from the same spring? My brothers, can a fig tree bear olives, or a grapevine bear figs? Neither can a salt spring produce fresh water."

 

Ephesians 4:29 

Let no corrupting talk come out of your mouths, but only such as is good for building up, as fits the occasion, that it may give grace to those who hear.

 

I understand what the verse means, but what if you get mad and say "Oh shit" about something? As a Christian, I felt guilty about talking like that, and I would pray for God to help me remove unclean speech from my mouth and to only use words that are good, and offer praise to God, and are positive and uplifting. At the same time...I didn't get why it was such a bad thing to curse. I use the words I use to express myself when I talk. Do I really need to ask for God's forgiveness if I say "Oh FUCK!" when I stub my toe on the side of a door? I don't think so. I was expressing how much it hurt.

 

I'm not so sure those are even talking about what we call cussing. The "cursing" could be meant more along the lines of calling down curses rather than the specific words being used. The thematic content may have been the issue here. Regardless, the English language didn't exist then anyway, so it wouldn't be referring to English "curse" words.

 

As a Christian, I avoided "cuss" words out of respect for others' views, but apart from ones like "goddamn" and "Jesus Christ" I didn't see "cuss" words as inherently sinful. Why would it be OK to say "crap" but wrong to say "shit" when they mean the same damn thing? I'd rather hear someone in a good mood say, "Hot damn!" than someone in a bad mood using every slang word conceivable to avoid "cuss" words.

[SCM]

For me the main thing was obey your parents and obey authority. note both these principals are great if taken in healthy dosage with a little mutual respect going both ways. 

 

I went to a christian school for ten years and the teachers would use the line "obey those in authority over you, for god has placed them there" every damn time, on small issues like running in a walk area or not eating all your lunch. they were very insecure over their power over a bunch of primary school kids, and made so many tiny insignificant rules up we didn't have room to breathe or live. you can't do something bad (or good sometimes) and just offend the teacher, no your crime is now against god. not saying yes mrs _______ at the end of every teacher conversation or failing a math test is now rebellion, or the devil's sin.

 

in the house if you disobeyed your parents you were disobeying god, and since I was instructed to obey god, if I didn't obey my parents every single time to the exact letter or ever said no it was disobeying parents which meant disobeying god, which meant disobeying you parents which meant disobeying god again. it was so much fun to never have any recourse against stupid decisions which had become god-ordained by virtue of being spoken from someone in authority.

 

to be honest I've never found any remorse in disobeying someone. to my mind we are both people, equal in that respect. it might be a good idea to listen to you in one or most circumstances,(like if they are more experienced/knowledgeable about something, or the government), but obeying another human being seemed/still seems preposterous to me.

 

to reconcile my opinions with the bible text and the church culture, plus the realities I lived with I did impressive mental gymnastics to let me do what i want to do instead of what stupid or uncaring people tell me to: I decided that I knew god better than my peers, and strived harder to please him in my life than others, so therefore I must have the closest connection to god, and what I'm doing must be god's will, acting through me. god was now on my side instead of theirs, and thus began 2-3 years of boldly defying authority in the name of god! 

[Margee]

When I am really honest with myself as I think back, I didn't think anything was really a 'sin' because our church also preached 'grace' so much. So if you sinned, you could go the the alter and get forgiveness. I mean, even the bible says that prostitutes and murderers would get to heaven before you?? Because these prostitutes and murderers would get down and beg for god's forgiveness and get it. So I think I always knew that the good lord above would forgive me for my 'sins'. Even the pastor couldn't answer my questions about horrible people. He could not answer me when I asked him if Hitler was in heaven or hell..