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Goodbye Jesus

It's Been A Long Time...


Lycorth

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I was last active here in November of '07. I had no idea how deeply religion had impacted my life and my thought processes, nor how religion addiction still had a tight grip on me. In that time, I had returned to Catholicism, left it briefly, returned again to it, and finally left it - hopefully for good, this time!

 

Back in September of '09, my son was born. As my then-wife neared her delivery date, both she and I felt drawn back to Christianity. She followed me into the Catholic Church, and was accepted into the Church in the Spring of '10. She would slowly give up practicing the Catholic religion shortly thereafter, going back to her own liberal interpretation of religion, whilst I took a traditionalist route and explored the Traditionalist movement within the Church - finding and attending regularly a Tridentine Mass, taking my son to church with me, and trying to justify my religious views against all the criticisms I had learned of in my days as an ex-Christian as well as all the evidence against religion I had learned of since that time (as well as the lack of evidence for the claims of the Church). 

I left the Church for a short time, largely due to personal issues, then returned to my psychological addiction one more time, going back to the Tridentine Mass and trying as hard as I could to justify my faith. As the months wore on, it became harder and harder to rest comfortably in my faith, knowing in the back of my mind much of it was a stubborn desire to live out something Medieval (I have been a long time amateur Medievalist, so going to church services with rites that have largely been unaltered since the Middle Ages had a certain and powerful appeal to me) as well as be "more Polish" (as Poles have been stubbornly addicted to Catholicism ever since the 10th century; part of being Polish was being Catholic) and, though I was loathe to admit it to myself, assuage the fear of eternal torture in case the angry god of the Church was not pleased with me - the fear of Hell was stronger in me than I had realized.

 

Eventually, my marriage fell apart, though not for religious reasons (not according to my ex-wife, oddly enough). I persisted in my religion, finding panaceas in my faith, in telling myself God will sort everything out, looking for some sense to the ruination of my life. I started getting in touch with many of my old online friends (and made some new ones), and in many deep discussions with friends who happened to be staunch atheists, I had to confront the same doubts and issues I had with Christianity, being articulated by other people, people with whom I was communicating in real-time. It was hard to look at those doubts and concerns and keep on ignoring them, and it built up to such a head that, one morning in Mass, I was sitting there in church, growing more disgruntled by the moment. By the time church let out, I was done - I left and never returned, setting my mind to going back down the path of freethought, deciding to take the dangerous adventure that is leaving behind organized religion and making sense of the world with my own mind and with the facts that others have discovered, choosing to face the fear of hell and the discomfort of changing my mind in regards to long-ingrained habits and customs and such nonsense.

 

That was November of 2014. In that 13+ months, I haven't felt more free, more at ease; deciding that theism is nonsense and there is nothing to worry about since there is nothing that can be proven about the claims of any and all theists has lifted a burden from my mind that was like pure lead. In that year since quitting theism cold turkey, I've revived my studies of Zen Buddhism and Germanic Heathenry, though carefully, since there is theism to be found in both Buddhism and Heathenry. Zen in particular lends itself well to atheism, especially as Zen in the West is largely divorced from the nonsensical rituals and superstitions that were attached to it in the East; the practice of zazen has been amazingly calming and centering, and the study of Zen perspectives on critical thinking, non-attachment, and mindfulness has been truly enlightening (I've also just begun practicing yoga, which, though not a part of Zen, has proven to be also as amazingly strengthening and centering for me); Zen is a great way to pull one's head out of one's ass and keep it out! I've also resumed studying Heathenry, the ethics and customs and zeitgeist of pre-Christian Germanic cultures, particularly the heroism and self-reliance so often vaunted in their ancient literature and religious mythology. While I've been tempted at times to give in to theism and superstition in regards to Heathenry, I know it fails the same tests that other religions have failed, and rest easy knowing that science will point out the truths about the universe more accurately than any mythology ever will.

 

Also, there's a bright star on my horizon - I've become involved with an old friend, and she and I have very similar dispositions, as well as nearly identical positions on religion and science. Things have gone very well for us, and we are planning to begin a life together over this coming summer, with my boy as part of the new family we shall bring together. Not only will I relocate my son to a full and loving home where he will be well looked after, it will be in a progressive, liberal community where he will not be taught the fear of Hell or any other religious superstition, so perhaps one day he will not have to go through the years of soul-searching and back and forth religious addiction his father did. Life has enough things to trouble the mind - inventing trouble via religion will only make life harder to live.

 

EDIT: Religion ruined my life. My addiction to it, to needing to please and serve God, led me to hamper my personal life, give ear and heed to crazy cultural and political ideas (and the equally crazy cultural and political leaders who promote them), and waste years of my life, all because of a religion that is as ridiculous as it is pervasive. If I had only understood how religion would shape every choice I'd make, or how I'd allow that to happen, I'd have run screaming from religion as soon as I could run or scream.

 

I don't know how often I will post or how often I will even be here. I'd like to come back more often, knowing other people here have struggled with religion - or are struggling now. I know enough these days to know I have little wit, and know far less than I ever thought I did, but if my opinions and ex-timony can help someone for whom the fear of Hell is too strong and the anxiety of placating an implacable god is too powerful, then I am all too glad for the opportunity. This forum serves a very good purpose, and its cause is objectively right and just. The world needs more truth and less religion, more facts and less superstition, and the only way to get there is to give people who are struggling to get away from religion or who need advice as they continue down the road leading finally away from it. To that end, I am honored to be a member of this forum, and hope that in the future, my contributions will be better and more sensible than they were in times past. 

 

Thank you to Dave for creating this place!

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Welcome home! Thanks for sharing your story.

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Welcome.  Or perhaps "Welcome back".

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Welcome back!  And it's happy to hear about your relationship with your old friend and your mutual desire to raise your son free of superstitions!

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Lycorth, thank you for posting. I was really happy to read about the opportunity that you and your kid have for a new family in a different community. That is awesome and I'm sure it will make a big difference for both of you. 

 

It is also really cool that you're into the Medieval and that's one thing that drew you back to Mass. I can totally see that. It seems like often religion has more to do with identity or community for people than it has to do with morality or "salvation". Its can be as harmless as the clothes we wear or it can lead us to behave destructively towards ourselves and others. The Catholic Church is pretty far out with all its ancient symbolism and rituals. I definitely get a sense of time travel when I attend a mass. The churches in Europe are stunning in this regard.

 

I've read many people posting about a fear of Hell. If its helpful, I'll share what I know as far as mythic allegories go. Hell, Sheol, Hades, the Underworld, Amenta, all of these represent our current material experience here and do not refer to something beneath us. The realm of torture and death is in this life, the lake of fire is where we are alive right now. 

 

As far as my understanding goes, the message of myths and ancient stories, including the bible, was the union of spirit (masculine god) in matter (feminine goddess) which resulted in "death" for the god, but life for the universe. As divinity was fragmented (Jesus breaking bread aka "his body") matter was brought to life. This union of spirit and matter produced a "son" which brought or represented life. Jesus, Bacchus, Horus, Hercules, many others dramatize this idea. 

 

Since you're into Norse heathenism, I'll share some interesting links with you. Both the Norse Yggdrassil and this Chinese bronze tree found at Sanxingdui have a dragon or worm wrapped around the roots and a bird on the top branch. Some jokers at Creation.com are trying to use the Chinese tree as proof that the Tree of Knowledge in Genesis literally existed. Silly. I think that the parallels among these three symbols are quite fascinating. 

 

The stories of Arthur and Gwenevier, as well as Tristan and Isolde are very interesting in this regard, since you're into Medieval culture. 

 

I only share what I have learned in case people find it interesting and useful, because it has been useful to me. I do not believe that the Bible is a historical document in any sense, nor a moral guide, I believe it is a symbolic account of how its writers believed humanity originated. 

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It was hard to look at those doubts and concerns and keep on ignoring them, and it built up to such a head that, one morning in Mass, I was sitting there in church, growing more disgruntled by the moment. By the time church let out, I was done - I left and never returned, setting my mind to going back down the path of freethought, deciding to take the dangerous adventure that is leaving behind organized religion and making sense of the world with my own mind and with the facts that others have discovered, choosing to face the fear of hell and the discomfort of changing my mind in regards to long-ingrained habits and customs and such nonsense.

 

Another ex-Catholic whose faith abandoned him during a church service!

 

The main difference between our journeys is that mine was one shot. I had no prior ex-Christian episodes, and did not discover the ex-Christian community until 3 weeks after I left the church. Also, my fear of hell departed with my faith; for years I'd been trying to find some way for the RCC to be wrong about hell, so when I realized that they were wrong about everything, I was sooo ready not to be afraid of it.

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