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Goodbye Jesus

Can Anyone Please Help Me ? Needing Help How To Tell Friends How I Really Feel?


harvester77

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Over one year ago I had a awakening. I still believe in God and creation. I DO NOT believe in mainstream big bang or such as that. I believe we consciousness energy spiritual beings we are not here by chance per say but we have more power than that we are told we do. I am not mad but there is a spiritual realm and spiritual beings we are. I have more own reasons for this. Anyway I have been a Christian on and off all my 38 years of life. I went to church for the last 3 years and made some great friends but also met the most hyprocrites ever. I started questioning after coming from the middle east and seeing that Christians in the middle east love and are sad for their fellow Palestianians and how churches in England love and adore Israel and one Christian even said how the Palestinians are horrible and basically deserve the killings.Its not all true that they are the terrorists, you finally open your eyes to the cages and how they are killed with the excuse that they are Gods chosen people yet don't believe in God or even Jesus yet Christians believe that God the all loving all knowing could be so tribal and territorial. It is so scary how when you read the OT God seems more like satan and then you read some more and learn some more and you realise the whole thing is a croak of bull. I have friends who go on and on how God is talking to them blah blah yet they never take leaps of faith in this life but yet believe and trust God so much. I could go on and on as you all probably know but my dilemma is how to tell my friends that I just don't believe in it all anymore and cant make sense of it with all the atrocities in the world. a friend doesn't like her job yet she says Go put her there to bring people to him? Why cant an all knowing powerful God do that. I believe that the bible is heavily corrupted and cant make sense of It. So contradictory.They are all so materialistic yet what did Jesus really teach? The church is false and so are the people in it. They are nice yes but no nicer or kinder than many others of any other faith. I find the whole thing amazing as I was deeply brainwashed myself. In fact its when I stepped away I realise all this is too big for the God that claims he is in the OT especially. I do like Jesus's teachings though and lots of what he says about love and peace etc. I do not believe in the whole salvation thing or even original sin as the bible says it but I do believe that there is evil from different dimensions and we are definitely hacked. There is Satanism and definitely some of those in power do go to Bohemian grove look it up and worships owls so I am not of the belief we are just here from a big bang as I said. We are all one and connected. I just cannot believe in this tribal God who has chosen people yet created us all? When debated with friends or telling them how do I start? I know they will say I am under attack from satan and start praying for me! That scares me so I need to be careful. I know deep down they have often questioned it too.

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excuse my English second language

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Welcome, and your English is fine.

 

Sounds like you may have been reading Alan Watts or 'Conversations With God.'

 

I agree, if there is a "god" it's not represented by the Abrahamic god. I have found no evidence for any gods, though I suppose it is possible. However, the Bible god can be dismissed for sure.

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So you reject the Big Bang (what about evolution?) while also rejecting the OT and biblical literalism. May I ask why? I never had any problem reconciling a spiritual world view with science, but hey, that's just me.

 

Hope you don't mind me asking, but what's your cultural background, more specifically? Maronite, Syriac/Assyrian, something else entirely? Just curious.

 

Anyways, Welcome to exC!

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hello I am Italian but not catholic background my family are actually not that strict.I have a more evangelical background. I do believe in evolution to a certain extinct  but I believe our history/science has been heavily manipulated. I DO NOT believe in Charles Darwin. I actually believe our world / universe is more holographic not quite physical and we more spirtual but we just havent evolved enough to understand ourselves. My stepdad was in the military and left years ago there was often talk about remote viewing and all sorts of experiments on the paranormal so there is definitely something more to everything than just us in the physical world. I am still learning to be honest I have many questions on everything and doubt it will all be answered in this lifetime. . I just cant believe I sat in church listening to pastors and actually  believing it all or did I? I did have many questions but was always told to read the word and God will speak to you.

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Oh, I thought you were of Mid-eastern ethnicity since you mentioned something about "coming" from there. Guess I misunderstood, sorry.

 

I'd spend some time away from wild speculations and conspiracy theories if I were you. They aren't very conducive to one's mental wellbeing. Try focusing on the here and now, doing something creative that occupies your mind enough to give it a rest from stressful speculations.

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I am very well travelled and with that I have seen many fascinating things in the world that makes the human mind question things and do not thiknk that a questioning mind is being a conspiracy theorist and I hate that word as it just keeps humans behind in the belief we are not allowed to question things. I am also very creative oart of my job that takes me places too but thanks for your advice. I would like stories on people who have told friends and how to go about it? As I hold dearly my friends but deep down cant believe the bible or the God of the Abrahamic religions.

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Also my mental health is great and always has been. I do have a sense of inner peace about that thankfully. I am quite lucky in that respect.  A questioning mind does not affect ones mental health.

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Harvester: When debated with friends or telling them how do I start?

 

Why debate them?

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Welcome Harvester. Good to have you here at Ex-c! I'm sure you will be able to find some comfort on this site. Hang around for awhile. It takes time to figure out what you believe or don't believe. Keep posting and reading. You're going to be OK.

 

(hug)

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Thanks Margee. I dont want to debate but maybe I wrote it wrong the first time It will lead to that you do not know my church friends lets just say i post something on facebook for all my friends regarding inner peace and one posts about salvation when that was not the topic. It is not about religion but they will manipulate my post to be so. Everything is about sin, the grace of God, salvation there are convincing themselves. I cannot even post simple nice quotes without something to do with Sin or salvation being commented. I am getting pretty fed up now as its more persistent.

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 I know they will say I am under attack from satan and start praying for me! That scares me so I need to be careful. 

 

 

Yes, they always resort to praying for you and when that doesn't work, they usually bring out the "You're going to hell" card.  If that's the best they can do, then it's obvious they don't want to logically or intellectually discuss religious ideas.  They just want to let you know that THEY are special.    My opinion: there's no sense in putting yourself through the trouble.    

 

 

Welcome to Ex-C!    

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Thanks Margee. I dont want to debate but maybe I wrote it wrong the first time It will lead to that you do not know my church friends lets just say i post something on facebook for all my friends regarding inner peace and one posts about salvation when that was not the topic. It is not about religion but they will manipulate my post to be so. Everything is about sin, the grace of God, salvation there are convincing themselves. I cannot even post simple nice quotes without something to do with Sin or salvation being commented. I am getting pretty fed up now as its more persistent.

 

So many people have quit using Facebook for this exact behavior of their christian "friends".   They just can't resist the urge to christianize everything they see or hear.   It definitely gets old reading and hearing their same old tired routine!

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Thanks Margee. I dont want to debate but maybe I wrote it wrong the first time It will lead to that you do not know my church friends lets just say i post something on facebook for all my friends regarding inner peace and one posts about salvation when that was not the topic. It is not about religion but they will manipulate my post to be so. Everything is about sin, the grace of God, salvation there are convincing themselves. I cannot even post simple nice quotes without something to do with Sin or salvation being commented. I am getting pretty fed up now as its more persistent.

I find that I have to ignore a lot of stuff on facebook. I don't want to get into controversy with anyone. You cannot talk anyone out of their faith. They , themselves must begin to question things, just like we have. I sent around something last week about the world should be about loving each other and not about who is right in religion. I got all kinds of 'likes' from my christian friends. I love these guys but they are hypocrites because I know them personally and they do NOT believe that. Don't take anything on Facebook personally. Stay out of all battles. Slide right by them like I do. Save yourself all kinds of energy. You look after yourself right now!!

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Why tell them anything?  That is, why make it a point to make it an issue?  Sooner or later, your friends will be having a conversation and someone will ask you what you think about some religious or Biblical concept.  And you can reply that you aren't as certain about those things as you once were.  Or you can say you have been asking some hard questions and you don't agree with all the things you once believed. 

 

I read a book not long back by Gregory Boyd, titled "Benefit of the doubt".  It's about how certainty, especially moral certainty, is detrimental to learning.  For example, when we are certain we have the truth, especially moral truth, we actively avoid reading or learning anything that would challenge that certainty.  It's written from a Christian perspective, but that concept doesn't apply only to Christians.  It is a fact that many of the proponents of global warming are attempting to get the U.S. Justice Department to criminally prosecute people who disagree with them.  And it appears that the Justice Department is amenable to this.  Regardless of what you think of anthropogenic global warming, criminal prosecution for disagreement with your theories is not science in any sane meaning of the word.  But the  proponents of this approach have claimed not only the factual but moral high ground, and dissenters are essentially heretics.  They've turned it into a religion.

 

The point is that your friends probably have an investment in moral certainty.  They aren't going to just drop it because you did.  How long did it take you to change your mind about Christianity?  Is it reasonable to expect them to get there any faster than you did?

 

You don't need to argue with them - people don't change their faith because they lost an argument.  Just wait until it comes up in conversation, present where you are and why you got there, and tell them that you views have changed.  No need to try to convince them, and you might even say that if it becomes hostile ("I'm not trying to change your mind.  You asked me what I thought, I'm telling you").  You aren't going to "criminally prosecute" them for their beliefs, you would ask them the same consideration. If there are very many of these friends, I suspect most of them won't be hostile.  Concerned, maybe.  Might try to change your mind about it.  But they won't all be hostile.  A few phrases that you might adapt (in your own words of course):

 

I'm not telling you that you are wrong.  I'm just saying that I'm not in a place to accept it without more evidence anymore.

I'd be willing to accept an alternate conclusion, but I need something to back it up.

I just can't believe what I used to believe; the facts  as I understand them don't support it.

I need an answer to why God did xyz or why God allowed the pedophile priests to do what they did or why God allowed the Christians in Mosul to be murdered or why God appears to be completely inactive (add your own to this list).  I can't just accept "It's a mystery" anymore.

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thank you all for your wonderful advice.

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Guest Leah

Everyone has their own illusion of reality. You have to ask yourself: is this reality I am concocting actually true, or am I living a lie by basing my actions and thought processes on these beliefs? You really do not want to be living a lie, unless... unless you like really want to be living a lie.

 

Ask yourself questions like these: Are the beliefs I hold true, or am I just making them up to feel better/solve my problems? Do I want to feel comfortable in life, or is there a "greater purpose"? Do feelings matter as much as I give them credit for mattering? Do I care if there is a greater purpose, greater than some of the thoughts and feelings I am currently having? And lastly... has anything in my life given me evidence of a greater purpose that I once held to dearly but now am cringing at the thought of, but I still know that the thing I experienced was true regardless of my current state of faith-lacking and perhaps maybe I should pay attention to that thing which happened rather than blow it off due to my insecurities and other negative feelings to which I equate this "faith"?

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