Jump to content
Goodbye Jesus

If You Rejected Christianity But Accepted Another Religion (Like Hinduism: Bhim?): Why?


Lyra

Recommended Posts

Hello,

 

I intend just respect and curiosity with this question - I'm not setting out to "harrass" anyone, but I'd just simply like to know and understand. 

 

If you reject Christianity, but accept another religion (like Hindu or Judaism or anything else) as "The Answer," then why?

 

I'm not talking about if you're really just secular at heart, but follow the traditions of the other religion in order to appease your grandma at holidays or something. I mean if you actually, truly believe in the Truth ™ of your religion and believe that its claims are actually valid.

 

I can understand still believing in a god(s), or being open-minded to a higher consciousness. I myself believe in a higher consciousness, but I see it in an agnostic deist type of way. I'm referring to not just if you are open to a higher power, but if you actually believe in a religion, take its religious texts seriously, have sincere faith in its claims, etc.

 

Even if the other religion doesn't have the problematic aspects of, say, Islam and Christianity, isn't it still being dogmatic about something that none of us can know?

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Super Moderator

I believe in bullshit, but only because I've stepped in it a time or two back on the farm.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

But the bullshit that you stepped in was tangible, verifiable matter. I'm talking about the people who believe in invisible, unseen bullshit. It's supposedly stacked up in big, brown, steaming piles somewhere but invisibly, in another dimension, where we must have faith in its presence.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I explored Deism soon after rejecting Xianity or more accurately after rejecting the Bible. I ultimately couldn't reconcile the difference between there being no creator & a hands off uninvolved creator. I think it's pretty normal to try and fill the spiritual hole that leaving Xianity creates.

 

With time the need to fill that spiritual void went away & I have no desire to have any kind of an invisible buddy in my life anymore.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Super Moderator

After leaving a religion like Christianity, I think most people, including myself, are still looking for/hoping there is at least some sort of woo that is real. Many will decide they found it.

 

Personally, I left Christianity because it didn't hold up to scrutiny. I have found no other religious belief system that fares any better, so I stopped wasting time and moved on with real life. For me it's not about whether the dogma is comfortable or the believers are nice, but does the belief make any logical sense? Is there any evidence that it's true?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hello,

 

I intend just respect and curiosity with this question - I'm not setting out to "harrass" anyone, but I'd just simply like to know and understand. 

 

If you reject Christianity, but accept another religion (like Hindu or Judaism or anything else) as "The Answer," then why?

 

I'm not talking about if you're really just secular at heart, but follow the traditions of the other religion in order to appease your grandma at holidays or something. I mean if you actually, truly believe in the Truth ™ of your religion and believe that its claims are actually valid.

 

I can understand still believing in a god(s), or being open-minded to a higher consciousness. I myself believe in a higher consciousness, but I see it in an agnostic deist type of way. I'm referring to not just if you are open to a higher power, but if you actually believe in a religion, take its religious texts seriously, have sincere faith in its claims, etc.

 

Even if the other religion doesn't have the problematic aspects of, say, Islam and Christianity, isn't it still being dogmatic about something that none of us can know?

 

Ah, it's good that you clarified the part in bold. My response may not be so interesting to you, but I'll provide it anyway. :)

 

I was born and raised Hindu, and rejected Hinduism to become an evangelical Christian. The reason I returned to it when I de-converted was due to my desire to reconnect with Indian culture. I'm currently on the fence about belief in a deity and I haven't arrived at any easy answers in the past few years, but one of the intellectual traps we fall into when we practice Christianity is thinking that all religions emphasize the importance of intellectual assent to religious doctrine. Belief requirements are fairly optional in Hinduism, and it is much more a way of life than what Westerners would term a "religion." I may never regain a belief in God, but I enjoy doing pujas, celebrating holidays, and engaging in Hindu rituals with other Indians. And in typical Eastern fashion, pleasing mom/dad/grandma does bring a degree of personal satisfaction as well.

 

Don't get me wrong, Hindu culture contains no short supply of idiocy. There are plenty of people running around claiming that ancient Indians had space ships and nuclear weapons (this is not a joke), and that infuriates me to no end. But at the end of the day I was born a Hindu and will always consider myself one.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Bhim, thank you for taking the time to share your experience. :) I think it sounds wonderful and very healthy how Hinduism is just a way to honor culture and celebrate life, as opposed to the "real stakes" of heaven and hell that so many Christians take so seriously. You're lucky that you don't have anyone breathing fire down your neck about whether or not you believe in their dogma in order to avoid eternal torment, lol. ;)

 

Geezer and Florduh, I agree very much about religion needing to be rational and hold up to scrutiny. That's what I meant as well. My point here is that even if a religion was pure lovey fairies and unicorns, it's still not believable or rational to believe in, so I wanted to see if anyone had an explanation for why they still may cling to a religious faith even as a non-Christian. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Super Moderator

Yes, culture plays a big role. America's primary identity is a Christian culture, and that's just how it is no matter what you believe or don't believe. American atheists do, for the most part, engage in Christian rites and rituals regarding things like Christmas, Easter and weddings/funerals. It's pretty much inescapable. I know atheist Jews who also embrace their heritage and customs. Many Jews I know even celebrate Christmas in one way or another because it's damn near inescapable. Playing along with cultural norms doesn't equate to actually practicing the ubiquitous religion of the realm.

 

Our problem with all this in America is that some Christians are just so damn pushy!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't actually know of anyone who was a fundamentalist Christian, deconverted, and became a fundamentalist adherent of another religion. Seems like it would be a strange sort of lateral move. Surely once you've seen the man behind the curtain you'll be a little bit more suspicious of anyone else who claims to be a wizard. But maybe that's just me.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

disillusioned: who said anything about fundamentalism?

I can see several plausible reasons for giving up fundy Christianity for another, less dogmatic religion. A mistake many ex-Christians (and Westerners in general for that matter) do is to assume that all religions are basically the same, and that even though they're secular or deconverted, they still have this Christian "lence" through which the perceive the World. Such a basic thing like non-literalism for instance... to many (former) fundies, literalism and legalism was such a big part of their faith they can't even imagine a religion without it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Super Moderator

disillusioned: who said anything about fundamentalism?

 

The OP

 

I'm not talking about if you're really just secular at heart, but follow the traditions of the other religion in order to appease your grandma at holidays or something. I mean if you actually, truly believe in the Truth ™ of your religion and believe that its claims are actually valid.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

disillusioned: who said anything about fundamentalism?

 

I can see several plausible reasons for giving up fundy Christianity for another, less dogmatic religion. A mistake many ex-Christians (and Westerners in general for that matter) do is to assume that all religions are basically the same, and that even though they're secular or deconverted, they still have this Christian "lence" through which the perceive the World. Such a basic thing like non-literalism for instance... to many (former) fundies, literalism and legalism was such a big part of their faith they can't even imagine a religion without it.

 

The bolded is spot-on. I know of a number of people who are ex-Christians and still consider themselves to be spiritual. Bhim is a Hindu. I've met a few Buddhists. I know several deists. But the thing that these people all have in common is that either they do not take the truth claims of their religion too seriously, or their "religion" does not make too many specific truth claims (for example, deism). But the OP specifically said she wasn't asking about these people. She spoke of those who "actually, truly believe in the Truth ™ of your religion and believe that its claims are actually valid" and "take its religious texts seriously, have sincere faith in its claims, etc.". This seems about as apt a description of fundamentalism as I can think of, hence my reply.

 

I suppose I could see a scenario where a Christian moves to something like Mormonism, which acknowledges the validity of some of Christianity but insists it isn't the whole story. I don't know anyone who had done this though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

disillusioned: who said anything about fundamentalism?

 

The OP

 

I'm not talking about if you're really just secular at heart, but follow the traditions of the other religion in order to appease your grandma at holidays or something. I mean if you actually, truly believe in the Truth ™ of your religion and believe that its claims are actually valid.

 

 

 

 

So the choice is between cultural religiosity and fundamentalism? I'd say that's a false dichotomy and, if I may say so, very Christian way of looking at things.

 

 

disillusioned: who said anything about fundamentalism?

 

I can see several plausible reasons for giving up fundy Christianity for another, less dogmatic religion. A mistake many ex-Christians (and Westerners in general for that matter) do is to assume that all religions are basically the same, and that even though they're secular or deconverted, they still have this Christian "lence" through which the perceive the World. Such a basic thing like non-literalism for instance... to many (former) fundies, literalism and legalism was such a big part of their faith they can't even imagine a religion without it.

 

The bolded is spot-on. I know of a number of people who are ex-Christians and still consider themselves to be spiritual. Bhim is a Hindu. I've met a few Buddhists. I know several deists. But the thing that these people all have in common is that either they do not take the truth claims of their religion too seriously, or their "religion" does not make too many specific truth claims (for example, deism). But the OP specifically said she wasn't asking about these people. She spoke of those who "actually, truly believe in the Truth ™ of your religion and believe that its claims are actually valid" and "take its religious texts seriously, have sincere faith in its claims, etc.". This seems about as apt a description of fundamentalism as I can think of, hence my reply.

 

I suppose I could see a scenario where a Christian moves to something like Mormonism, which acknowledges the validity of some of Christianity but insists it isn't the whole story. I don't know anyone who had done this though.

 

 

I think one can be devout and take one's religion very seriously without being a dogmatic and hard headed fundamentalist. It's all in the approach and perspective really. People tend to think that fundamentalistic literalism is the default position and the "True" way, but it really isn't. The literalism of many evangelicals is a relatively modern thing that got a strong foothold in the 19th century.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It largely depends on the process in which one uses to reject xianity. If you questioned the validity of it based on science and logic, you're unlikely to ever accept another religion that also makes unsupportable claims. If you left for other reasons, you may be willing to hang onto the concept of faith. 

 

I personally have no need for religion in my life. I had more than enough of it when I was a kid to last me this lifetime. I'm perfectly happy to look at this life we live in cold hard terms of objective reality without supposing or needing something behind the scenes pulling strings. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hello,

 

I intend just respect and curiosity with this question - I'm not setting out to "harrass" anyone, but I'd just simply like to know and understand. 

 

If you reject Christianity, but accept another religion (like Hindu or Judaism or anything else) as "The Answer," then why?

 

I'm not talking about if you're really just secular at heart, but follow the traditions of the other religion in order to appease your grandma at holidays or something. I mean if you actually, truly believe in the Truth of your religion and believe that its claims are actually valid.

 

I can understand still believing in a god(s), or being open-minded to a higher consciousness. I myself believe in a higher consciousness, but I see it in an agnostic deist type of way. I'm referring to not just if you are open to a higher power, but if you actually believe in a religion, take its religious texts seriously, have sincere faith in its claims, etc.

 

Even if the other religion doesn't have the problematic aspects of, say, Islam and Christianity, isn't it still being dogmatic about something that none of us can know?

 

I highly identify (probably mostly emotionally) with advaita and pantheism. And as a chaos magician I identify and relate to paganism, believing or withholding belief as I choose. Neither of these practices involve a fixed doctrine, advaita being about the most doctrine free of anything I can think of. And paganism is pretty free-form. Witches do their own thing, I think.

 

Depending on the religion , I think people can have a belief system without pushing it on others. My particular set of beliefs are probably pretty wacky to someone else. smile.png

 

I think dogma rears it's head when a religion becomes an organized body of people and finances are needed, like to have a church meeting place. But who knows? Are Universal Unitarians very dogmatic? I know they have some guiding principles ... but I dont think they are really hardcore about beliefs.

 

There's also the consideration of one's level of participation in a religion. The less time I spend actively thinking and doing stuff related to my beliefs the less I'm going to care about what other people think about it.

 

To sort of answer your question, yes I can and do believe in something nobody can know and cannot be detected with science. smile.png But these particular systems of belief/practices come with a tradition of non-evangelization.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I had a hard time my whole life as a Christian (except when I wasn't in a manic phase) with fundamentalism, but I latched onto it because it was the easiest way to make "friends" with the people in church who would be at every function anyway.

 

I finally realized that my decision to leave church and disbelieve Christ-inanity had nothing to do with it being bullshit (although it certainly is). My decision was finally made when I realized that I had accepted and forced myself into the scene all along just to try and conform to the wishes of (and duck the disapproval of) family.

 

All that said, while I think Xtianity is horseshit, I also think literal, historical belief in mystical religious stories is horseshit across the board - so I gravitate towards the stories that I like and the imagery and customs I can appreciate, all while ignoring the zealotry that has brought nothing but harm to our world.

 

I love the Baghavad-Gita; I've read it several times. I love Hindu idols and the colors and scents and foods surrounding Hindu temples. I also (surprise, surprise) love Buddhist ideas and visiting Chinatown neighborhoods and checking out the Buddhist temples there.

 

I wouldn't become anyone's TrueBeliever again for all the money in the world, though; I've seen enough of what it can do to people.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Super Moderator

Rituals, costumes, trinkets and community activities are one thing. It's quite another if you really believe some god, spirit or even you yourself can perform "magic."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Lyra's question was two parts...

 

1. Do you believe in some other doctine or religion AFTER waling away form xianity.

2. Why do you have these new beliefs.

 

BHIM posted a reasonable reply in that, if I interpreted it correctly, Hindu is less a belief than a way of life for him.

 

A couple others have stated new belief systems - post xianity - but did not state why. Sure there were a few references to other belief systems being less impactful on one's life, less demanding, not evangelical ets. But no hard-core reasons were stated for the belief it'self.

 

We're listening...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Lyra,

 

Sorry if I stepped on your toes there but I'm really interested in the responses.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd say it's quite a different thing to believe in a pan(en)theistic/deistic form of God or some sort of "divine principle" that may be symbolically represented and interpreted through myths, and believing in myths literally. I believe this is a fundamental difference between esoterically minded religions (like many schools of Sanatana Dharma) and the legalistic, dogmatic literalism of fundamentalist Islam and Christianity.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I truly believe that I was born not only to eventually discover and embrace a certain mythical, mystical tradition, but to actually EMBODY, at this time in history, that mystical tradition - to actually BECOME this figure of myth, of legend, of folktale.

 

I really, honestly accept that my journey has been from ignorant acceptance to careless agnosticism, to hedonism, to fear-based conformity to fundamentalism (all relative to Christ-inanity) and now, finally, to the shedding of those layers and the breaking of those shackles.

 

My calling is to stand as proof that these mythical beliefs, these "fairy tales" are more real, powerful and life-affirming than the glut of nonsense produced by the devotees of biblegod.

 

As I posted in my initial statement under "Rants And Replies", titled "Greetings!", I insist that I am more real, thus believable, thus worthy of trust and love, than biblegod. I already embody more genuine, demonstrable characteristics of my "persona" than biblegod has ever conclusively shown, and that list will only grow and the difference only manifest more clearly over time.

 

So, yes - I have accepted and do "believe", in a sense, in a spiritual/mythical/mystical tradition - and my very existence and acceptance of those tales as "truth" is de facto a confrontation with biblegod.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Guidelines.