My Introduction And Background Story

[LogicalFallacy]

Hi all

 

I found this site some time ago, (Searching for “how to tell my parents I am on longer a Christian”) I lurked for around 3-4 months before joining about a month ago. I had intended to introduce myself earlier, but instead ended up commenting on a few threads and putting off the intro.

 

I am from New Zealand and have been a fundamentalist Christian my whole life. (Well as far as what sort of Christian I was, fundamentalist is closest to what I can define. My church gathers much of its teachings from William Branham – not sure if any of you have heard of him, but based on what I know it’s pretty fundamentalist.)

My church is very small, and within that small group is a smaller ‘chosen’ group… of which I am part of… kinda ironically. I relay this as it might help some of you give some pertinent advice.

 

I would describe myself as a very logical person, and one that requires evidence to believe anything. This might sound like a paradox considering I did believe everything in the bible literally… up until around a year ago… although probably the cracks started appearing at various points over the years as brain got in way of faith. I always manged to boot the brain back to its proper submissive state in the past. What really threw me is reading on the internet one day about what Branham said vs reality. This created something of a gaping hole in my faith. I patched it up, but with more research into all aspects of what I believed the hole got bigger.

 

I reached the point some months ago when I actually admitted to myself that I didn’t believe… any of it. (‘It’ being Christianity as a whole) I remember the moment very clearly and to be honest it wasn’t a nice feeling. My gut wrenched and I felt sick for a few days due to anxiety. I also felt, and still do feel, very alone. I wrote a piece in my dairy that went (Actually reads rather poetic now I re read it):

 

“I can see my future, as if looking through the mists of time. A storm is coming, rising from behind the horizon. I know not how long it will take to get to me, nor how strong it will be, but it is a storm and it is coming. The most terrifying thing about this storm is not the potential devastation it may cause, but that from what I can see, I must face it alone. I make here a simple, but as of writing now, a true statement. I am alone in the world. “

 

So at that point in time I was very worried about being alone – my entire social network consists of that small church. I have no outside friends. It doesn’t help that I’m an introvert and find it very difficult to start conversations meet new people etc. Once I know someone, been introduced etc, I’m good… until that point… meh. I’m also worried about the potential backlash… they may be very understanding, or may not be at all!

 

So that’s a bit of my story and background. I now face the task of leaving the church… extracting may be a better term. Another point is my father is the pastor… and a bit of a firebrand so this could be interesting to say the least. I don’t need to worry about ‘me’ as such. I’m single, have my own house, and financially independent. (The church calls it blessed, I say I made some right decisions in life and worked hard, and a bit o luck on the way!)

 

I have read many of the great posts members have posted, and particularly noted Lyra’s helpful advice to others. I am unsure on whether to tell my family of my choice to follow reason by going for a nuclear option or try a subtle bit by bit ‘revelation’. I am not good at diplomacy or subtly – as my family tends to tell me. I tend to take things as they are and speak as they are – not what social convention would like them to be.

 

So after that long intro, glad to be here. If you got this far thanks for reading.

 

 I’ve got a long way ahead, and possibly some difficult times ahead from an emotional and social point of view.

 

Any advice, tips, thoughts on handling how to tell friends and family I’m leaving much appreciated. (PS staying in church and living a lie isn’t an option. That’s not me, and my bank balance disagrees with it as well!)

 

LogicalFallacy

[Wings]

Hi Logical, 

 

welcome to the boards and thank you for sharing your story. I need to get back to work (eastern time zone here), but wanted to share a welcome before I go. 

Many of us lurk on these boards (errrr, myself included and I deconverted and left my fundamentalist church a little over 4 years ago).  My experience leaving was a bit of a disaster (I got found out on facebook and it was a little messy), but whatever happens in the end my advice is cliche but personal: 1. Find your non-negotiables and limits and stick to them (you have to live with yourself longer than anyone, so do what's right for you); 2. Time dulls (if not heals) the disappointment, pain, broken relationships, etc.

 

I can only speak to my own experience, but new, strong, wonderful friendships and experiences grew out of or were strengthened by leaving. Other relationships I couldn't save and, very painfully, had to let go. Be flexible and try not to plan too much-- you may be surprised by those who support and those who don't support you. And you know your own audience, so act in that context (all of our advice can't trump what you probably know deep down can/may/will happen).

 

In my case, I sucked up a lot of the pain and peoples' negativity by choosing to be kind and loving in my responses and approach- ie. I got nasty email, I just said, thanks for your input. One of my non-negotiables was not to engage, because my family and 'friends' were the kind of fundamentalists that I wasn't going to change anyway. I've since gotten some therapy and still deal with the fallout sometimes, but I don't regret that choice for me, because it made everything die down much more quickly (my community was also small and tightknit and likes to feed off drama). Four years on, like I said, the pain dulls, the good relationships stay, the bad relationships go, and you kind of start to forget what the big deal was :-) 

 

Anyway, you are always welcome to turn here to talk or vent or ask for advice. This forum has been a source of strength for me many times over. 

 

All the best on your journey! 

[Geezer]

Welcome! Glad you found us. It is difficult to leave anything you have become deeply involved in & leaving your church almost always destroys your social structure. You are viewed as one of "them" because you are no longer one of "us". Kind of sounds like cult thinking doesn't it?

[LogicalFallacy]

@ Wings - thank you. Yes, I feel I try and plan and predict the future way too much and this causes unnecessary worry about what might happen... in the end usually what does happen is so far different all the planning and worry was for naught. Thanks for your advice. I'll take it on board as I work towards leaving.

 

@ Geezer - thank you. Yes, one of my concerns is how my family and friends are going to view me, because I know full well what they think of the 'world' as the term is used. Cannon fodder is another term... so I could just become cannon fodder to them. I have looked at definitions of cults, and its really painful to admit, but there are some similarities. Not enough to be one, but enough to be concerned.

 

An interesting point is that the close nit group can be rather judgemental about those who leave, and the relationships they have with those who stay, but have never had anything like this so close to home.

[older]

...

 

Any advice, tips, thoughts on handling how to tell friends and family I’m leaving much appreciated.

...

 

 

Is it necessary to make an announcement? Could you just quietly withdraw? Be busy with other things?

[LogicalFallacy]

Hi Older

 

Hmmm by doing those things I would be making an announcement - just not an explicit one. If I say just didn't turn up for church several times I would get questioned. Only so many times you can say you are sick. Saying busy is not an option because Church has always come first. If I said I'm too busy it would work once or twice before suspicions started. It comes down to the dynamics of the church - my father is the pastor, we meet 3 times a week, have dinners together. Any withdrawal will be noticed and questioned leading to an announcement of sorts. And I'd rather ben honest with them... I think they'd take it harder if I lied.

 

 

I mean its possible it could work. They would ask what was going on (Even after missing one meeting), then I could say I can't reconcile Christian beliefs to reality therefore I won't be attending church any more.

[searchinwithnoagenda]

Hi Older

 

Hmmm by doing those things I would be making an announcement - just not an explicit one. If I say just didn't turn up for church several times I would get questioned. Only so many times you can say you are sick. Saying busy is not an option because Church has always come first. If I said I'm too busy it would work once or twice before suspicions started. It comes down to the dynamics of the church - my father is the pastor, we meet 3 times a week, have dinners together. Any withdrawal will be noticed and questioned leading to an announcement of sorts. And I'd rather ben honest with them... I think they'd take it harder if I lied.

 

 

I mean its possible it could work. They would ask what was going on (Even after missing one meeting), then I could say I can't reconcile Christian beliefs to reality therefore I won't be attending church any more.

Not knowing all the details of your situation, could you volunteer at a homeless shelter or soup kitchen type of thing during church hours and respond to any inquiries that you were more satisfied putting into practice things geebus taught rather than just talking about it?

[LogicalFallacy]

Hi searchinwithnoagenda

 

Thanks for the suggestion, however that idea definitely won't wash with my church. We are not into caring for the sick and homeless and good works etc. Its all about your spiritual walk with God. It's kind of funny in that different churches interpret the bible completely differently. As soon as I say I'm going to help at the local Salvation Army instead of attending church.... nah I'm not even going there. Also I personally wouldn't feel comfortable doing it for a rather large number of reasons.... that can probably all be traced back to my personality type.

 

To be honest (And possibly I have tunnel vision or blinders on) but there is very little I can do without basically announcing, in one form or another, that I no longer believe what the church says. That's how ridged it is. I have been trying some subtle hints like Lyra says, and that seems to be at least laying the ground work.

[older]

Ohh, you're in a tough spot. You might think about going into it with the expectation that they would accept your position without drama. If not, don't let them draw you into it. As my sister often says, "just smile and nod." Stay calm, be polite and don't let them bait you into an argument.

 

Them: How can you do this to us?

You: I understand that you are upset, but I've given this much thought and I have to be true to myself.

Them: You realize you're going to Hell, don't you?

You: I knew you would take this hard, but I can't keep it to myself any longer.

Them: God will punish you!

You: I realize that this has upset you greatly, but I did not make this decision lightly.

Them: This is the stupidest, most ignorant thing you've ever done!

You: I can see how you would see it that way.

Them: You have betrayed God, you have betrayed this family and everything we've ever taught you.

You: I understand that you're upset. I hope you'll accept me for the way I am.

Them: We'll never accept that you've turned away from God.

You: I understand that you're upset, but my decision has been made carefully and with much thought.

etc.

 

Don't apologize. It's "I understand you're upset," not, "I'm sorry you're upset." This situation is not your fault and you have nothing to apologize for.

 

This is an assertiveness technique called "fogging." You give a calm response without giving in. Don't be defensive or argumentative. "Fogging is so termed because the individual acts like a 'wall of fog' into which arguments are thrown, but not returned." Here's the link: http://www.skillsyouneed.com/ps/assertiveness-techniques.html

A Google search for Assertive Techniques will bring up more information.

 

If someone goes on an extended rant, use what I call the tire technique. Just like letting air out of a tire, just sit there and let them rant. Don't react or say anything. Finally all the air is gone and they stop. Then if they ask what you have to say for yourself, you say, "nothing."

 

 

Another poster here had similar worries and in the end it was accepted without drama or trauma. Hope you have the same result.

Keep us posted on the developments.

[LogicalFallacy]

Ohh, you're in a tough spot.

Aye

 

You might think about going into it with the expectation that they would accept your position without drama. If not, don't let them draw you into it. As my sister often says, "just smile and nod." Stay calm, be polite and don't let them bait you into an argument.

I hadn't thought of that. Up until now my mind-set had been to prepare for WW3 and plan accordingly.

 

Them: How can you do this to us?

You: I understand that you are upset, but I've given this much thought and I have to be true to myself.

Them: You realize you're going to Hell, don't you?

You: I knew you would take this hard, but I can't keep it to myself any longer.

Them: God will punish you!

You: I realize that this has upset you greatly, but I did not make this decision lightly.

Them: This is the stupidest, most ignorant thing you've ever done!

You: I can see how you would see it that way.

Them: You have betrayed God, you have betrayed this family and everything we've ever taught you.

You: I understand that you're upset. I hope you'll accept me for the way I am.

Them: We'll never accept that you've turned away from God.

You: I understand that you're upset, but my decision has been made carefully and with much thought.

etc.

 

Don't apologize. It's "I understand you're upset," not, "I'm sorry you're upset." This situation is not your fault and you have nothing to apologize for.

 

This is an assertiveness technique called "fogging." You give a calm response without giving in. Don't be defensive or argumentative. "Fogging is so termed because the individual acts like a 'wall of fog' into which arguments are thrown, but not returned." Here's the link: http://www.skillsyouneed.com/ps/assertiveness-techniques.html

A Google search for Assertive Techniques will bring up more information.

 

If someone goes on an extended rant, use what I call the tire technique. Just like letting air out of a tire, just sit there and let them rant. Don't react or say anything. Finally all the air is gone and they stop. Then if they ask what you have to say for yourself, you say, "nothing."

Thanks for those tips. It might help. Both my father and I can be hardhead, very opinionated and get loud and angry when things go south. Quite possibly simply letting him fire full bore if it came to that may be a good technique. I suppose its like not feeding the fire - you let it burn itself out.

 

Another poster here had similar worries and in the end it was accepted without drama or trauma. Hope you have the same result.

Keep us posted on the developments.

Thanks older, will do.

[Chilledmilk]

Hey Logical. Great to see you post this. I don't have any advice as I'm in a similar boat as you (as you know). It will be good to share our coming out stories in the future. I hope it goes well for you.

[Lyra]

Thank you for your kind compliments on my thread. It means a lot to me that I was able to help someone.

 

Since you're an introvert and are afraid of finding yourself friendless (a very reasonable and valid thing to be afraid of!), it's probably wise to start the process of making friends before you start distancing yourself from the church. This doesn't have to be a long or excruciating process.

 

Meetup.com is your friend - it's a site that helps you make friends by connecting to activity groups for your interests (not forums, but groups that meet in-person in your area). You can use it to look up atheist groups, and groups based on hobbies (like writer groups, board game groups, art groups, nature/outdoor groups, or whatever else you are into), or based on volunteer causes or activism. Go to a few of  these meetups, talk with people about your story and about things you have in common, and let it go from there. It will generally take several times of going to the group events, and then you'll meet a few people who you hit it off with and can hang out with on a more friend-like level. Then, when you start making regular plans with these folks and have a new social net in place, you can begin to gradually (or quickly, whatever works for you) detach from your old church pals. Or, who knows, maybe some of your old church pals can start questioning too!

 

Also, a social tip for introverts is this: ask open-ended questions about the other person's passions/interests, and let them talk. This is a win-win for everyone, because most people love to talk about themselves, but you won't have to. But it's important that you ask them about what THEY like, so you aren't just grilling them about obnoxious stuff. Ask them what kinds of things they care about (like hobbies), and then when they open up about it, just ask follow-up questions and let them go on about themselves. When you discover mutual ground, talk about things you both like to strengthen the bond. 

[LogicalFallacy]

@ Chilled. Thanks man, yep will certainly be doing an extominial (Is that a word??) once I leave and things settle down - hopefully my experience will be of some use to someone else de-converting.

 

@ Lyra. Hey, thanks for the advice. You have some great ideas on how to handle difficult situations. It's great to read ideas and experiences from others of things that I hadn't even considered.

 

Will keep everyone posted on progress.