I'd Love To See People Throw Out Some Answers To This Series Of Questions

[L.B.]

I've never had a straight answer from a Christian (in 40 years of being in churches and even serving in leadership of some) regarding these questions.

 

I'd love it if some of you Exxies would take a stab at what Christians might say to these questions - or what someone might have said to you in the past.

 

I'm not holding my breath until any TrueBeliever types come along and try, so I thought I'd let you all have some fun with this.

 

In all seriousness:

 

1. Are Roman Catholics the only Christians, a kind of Christian or not Christian at all?

 

2. Are Protestants the only Christians, a kind of Christian or not Christian at all?

 

3. Your version of the story is obviously not the only one, so upon what evidence do you claim that your version is the true one?

 

4. If your version is 100% true, then are you admitting that everyone who does not attend your kind of church and hold to your version of the story is doomed to hell?

 

5. If your version is not 100% true, what parts of it are wrong, yet not wrong enough to condemn YOU to hell?

 

6. If other people's versions are not 100% true, same as the last question.

 

7. if the differences between your version and the church down the street are NOT grounds for a right/wrong dichotomy, why are you all not uniting?

and finally,

 

8. If your differences ARE grounds for a right/wrong, absolute separation between you, how can you prove your group is correct or the other group is not?

 

You cannot rationally hold that something is true in an absolute, cosmic sense and yet still allow for people who believe otherwise to be seen as fellow "believers".

 

If, however, ALL of these things are just what you "choose to believe", then there is de facto NO AUTHORITY that can bind ANY belief on ANY person in your religion - thus, your god is as much of a mythical personal belief as is the tooth fairy.

 

Friends, please reference the Question Number when replying to a specific question.

 

I submit and wholeheartedly believe that there is NO definitive theological/doctrinal answer for any of these questions.

 

I'm not JUST saying I think the entire premise is bullshit (which I totally do): I'm saying that there's NO WAY any Christian group can even answer these things absolutely AT ALL. I hope that makes sense.

 

I mean to say that even if I WERE investigating Christ-inanity as a belief system worth adhering to, I don't believe any of their claims could stand up to these questions.

 

There is nothing, NOTHING to substantiate the claims of any one Christian group over another besides subjective reasoning, arguments and the inner voices of their mental instability (sorry, I mean the Holy Spook who is Himself and somehow also magically two other people, who are both also somehow magically each other).

[buffettphan]

I'm not holding my breath until any TrueBeliever types come along and try, so I thought I'd let you all have some fun with this.

 

 

If you want any TrueBeliever types to try to answer, and if you haven't already done so, you might also want to post this in the Lion's Den where christians are allowed to comment.  Glad you're not holding your breath on getting any real responses though.  

 

Ex-christians, carry on.

 

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I agree with your statement "that there is NO definitive theological/doctrinal answer for any of these questions."   If/when christians realize this, many of them end up here.   

[★ Citsonga ★]

7. if the differences between your version and the church down the street are NOT grounds for a right/wrong dichotomy, why are you all not uniting?

 

I guess when Jesus prayed that they would all be one, he either didn't pray hard enough or he had some secret sin in his life.

[mwc]

1. Are Roman Catholics the only Christians, a kind of Christian or not Christian at all?

     They are xian but they've been led astray much like the Jews were led astray.  An example of this would be their saint "worship" (which they see as otherwise but outsiders can plainly see is wrong).

 

 

2. Are Protestants the only Christians, a kind of Christian or not Christian at all?

     Protestants as a whole would represent real xians.  But not all Protestants are true xians of course no matter the sect.

 

 

3. Your version of the story is obviously not the only one, so upon what evidence do you claim that your version is the true one?

     How can you say this?  It *is* obviously true for anyone that has faith.  To loosely paraphrase Paul, we're seeing a dim version of things as they're supposed to be, so the discrepancies don't really exist only our perception of them.  It's our human nature that is getting in the way of our seeing things the way they should be.

 

 

4. If your version is 100% true, then are you admitting that everyone who does not attend your kind of church and hold to your version of the story is doomed to hell?

     No.  Everyone will have a chance to come to god through jesus.  Ultimately, if they believe that jesus died for their sins then the details of the "story" don't really matter.  For example, if they believe in going to church on Saturday and we believe in going on Sunday then we should all try, to the best of our ability, to follow our hearts, but it's the belief in jesus as lord that will determine whether or not you go to hell.  Jesus taught against the legalism of the Pharisees and while we should all follow the rules he laid down to the best of our ability the rules aren't what save us from hell but faith in christ who can forgive such transgressions if he so desires.

 

 

5. If your version is not 100% true, what parts of it are wrong, yet not wrong enough to condemn YOU to hell?

     It's up to god to condemn me, or anyone to hell.  If I am judged and not found in the book of life then I will be sent to the lake of fire.  However, by faith in jesus I am told my name will be in the lamb's book of life and I will be spared.  Faith is the answer.

 

6. If other people's versions are not 100% true, same as the last question.

     Whatever they believe they cannot escape what the bible teaches.  If they wish to do more than what is required that is wonderful and has other benefits but to escape damnation one only needs to be in the book of life.

 

7. if the differences between your version and the church down the street are NOT grounds for a right/wrong dichotomy, why are you all not uniting?

     There is still time for this.  But I doubt it will happen while that tricky old devil is still allowed to work his magic.  He preys on the desires of the body which then clouds our ability to see clearly those things Paul was referring to.  The holy spirit helps us to see clearly but the flesh is weak and the devil powerful so we fall to our old ways quickly and lose sight of these good things easily.  After the devil is defeated and the new Earth comes about we will unite and you will see the awesome body of Christ and it will be like nothing you could ever imagine.

 

8. If your differences ARE grounds for a right/wrong, absolute separation between you, how can you prove your group is correct or the other group is not?

     Only god can make these decisions.  However, humans are petty and it's simply easier for us to go about our business unimpeded in our own churches instead of constantly bickering with our fellow xians over these issues.   As long as we all believe in jesus as christ, as well as a few basic tenets, I think we're all good and can let that old devil work his tricks somewhere else.

 

     It's been awhile but hopefully these answers make you happy.

 

          mwc

[Vigile]

Imagine all those generations of people in hell who were unfortunate enough to be born in between the magical early church and Martin Luther. 

[Guest]

^My mother always told me as a child when i asked that question that those people were deceived, and would go to heaven as long as they had Jesus in their hearts. Basically, ignorance with the right intentions is fine, but rejection equals hell.

[Vigile]

^My mother always told me as a child when i asked that question that those people were deceived, and would go to heaven as long as they had Jesus in their hearts. Basically, ignorance with the right intentions is fine, but rejection equals hell.

 

In that case, proselytizing is the worst possible thing one could engage in. Worse than German SS guards turning on the ovens. 

[Guest]

 

^My mother always told me as a child when i asked that question that those people were deceived, and would go to heaven as long as they had Jesus in their hearts. Basically, ignorance with the right intentions is fine, but rejection equals hell.

In that case, proselytizing is the worst possible thing one could engage in. Worse than German SS guards turning on the ovens.

I always thought so. This, however, was the view held by hundreds of Christians o associated with throughout my life. Very interesting.

[midniterider]

 

1. Are Roman Catholics the only Christians, a kind of Christian or not Christian at all?

 

A fundy would say Catholics are misguided, not Christians, or 'the harlot'. Please buy the small booklet in the Jesus bookstore that debunks all non-fundy denominations.

 

2. Are Protestants the only Christians, a kind of Christian or not Christian at all?

 

Basically yes they are the only Christians, though the answer will be couched in some false humility.

 

3. Your version of the story is obviously not the only one, so upon what evidence do you claim that your version is the true one?

 

Christian: "Jesus died on the cross, end of story. Don't all denominations believe that?" Believers don't require evidence. Evidence is not important to a believer. But to get a non-believer off their back they might say that one's story is irrelevant as long  as you believe in da Jesus!

 

4. If your version is 100% true, then are you admitting that everyone who does not attend your kind of church and hold to your version of the story is doomed to hell?

 

Christian says: You're overthinking it. Just let Him into your heart.

 

5. If your version is not 100% true, what parts of it are wrong, yet not wrong enough to condemn YOU to hell?

 

See #4.

 

6. If other people's versions are not 100% true, same as the last question.

 

Christian puts fingers in ears by now.

 

7. if the differences between your version and the church down the street are NOT grounds for a right/wrong dichotomy, why are you all not uniting?

and finally,

 

Does the bible say churches should unite? (If there indeed is scripture for that then the Christian says you took it out of context, misunderstood it, etc)

 

8. If your differences ARE grounds for a right/wrong, absolute separation between you, how can you prove your group is correct or the other group is not?

 

Christian: Oh we've prayed about it. Believe me, we often pray for discernment. Jesus is guiding us. I can feel it.  (Translated: We don't think about stuff like that. Now get off my back. ) Christians don't feel compelled to prove anything to mere mortals. They answer to a higher supernatural imaginary friend.

 

You cannot rationally hold that something is true in an absolute, cosmic sense and yet still allow for people who believe otherwise to be seen as fellow "believers".

 

As a Christian we did not concern ourselves with any other denominations other than the occasional prayer for them. I do remember one occasion where missionaries visited our church and were so happy that they were able to finagle some indigenous people to replace the name of their tribal god with "Jesus." That was kind of the best they could do as the tribe refused to let go of their tribal beliefs. The congregation applauded this questionable 'success.' Rational thinking is not a big part of religion. It's just a feel-good thing.

 

If, however, ALL of these things are just what you "choose to believe", then there is de facto NO AUTHORITY that can bind ANY belief on ANY person in your religion - thus, your god is as much of a mythical personal belief as is the tooth fairy.

 

Christian: I choose to believe in Jesus whether it makes any sense or not. (This stance may change in time. Or it may not. It depends on how much value they assign to logic, rationality, critical thought, God's failure to answer prayers, etc)