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Goodbye Jesus

Happy Deconverts...but What With Unhappy?


Lost

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Maybe it's funny, but I kinda sick of reading all the time on this forum about people who once were believers in Christ and after deconversion they feel so free and happy and laugh and joke about their stupid religious past, maybe have some breakdowns and dark times, but in general go easy through deconversion process. Really? Your past was all misteake? Brainwashing? Indoctrination? Faith that you can compare to Santa Claus or Dragons?

Yeah..I read that..it was important to you...but now it's all joke?

 

What about Unhappy Deconverts?

 

I tried to find posts of ones on this forum, but I can't. I found few confused and people who can't labelled themselves?

 

What about people, who have nothing, but their faith in Christ and church's community and they just read something about evolution or ex-christian article, something on the Internet? Doubts attacted them so hard that they went through serious identity disorders? Can't work, can't eat, can't talk to others, can't do anything about it...about the thing that society knows nothing about?

 

People who ended up even in mental hospitals, cause of simple doubt?

 

Of course, professional help of therapist can save them...many of you say...but what if for some there is no way out?

 

They simply have sensitive nervouse system, had sad, lonely childhood, were kicked by everyone around, no support, maybe they have beauty and knowledge in brain that is high  than others, but that is useless, cause they lost foundation that they always believed that they will have...

 

What with them?

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I think many of us experienced differing degrees of sadness and even deep states of depression. I know I did. We all can relate to everything you're saying but many of us have been in this new position for years. Time does heal and sometimes that's the only medicine there is. You must reinvent yourself. It will happen regardless but if you take initiative to invest in the new you by exploring the world from your newfound perspective you may find interests you had no idea even existed before. But sure, there's a time to mourn. A part of us died when we left. That was the same for all of us. But you must push forward and seek new purposes in life that fulfill you. 

 

 

And, If your community is nothing but adults who still believe in magic... It might be a good idea to consider leaving. It certainly won't be easy, but I bet it's easier than dealing with that shit for the rest of your life. 

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I've been active here for awhile now & I don't recall any examples of anyone indicating their de-conversion was easy. It has been my experience that de-conversion is a process not an event & it is usually a lengthy process, as in years, that is often difficult.

 

The loss of friends is normal. Difficult family issues are common, and fractured families are also a real possibility. Feelings of hopelessness, dispair, & loneliness are also common.

 

I've seen it compared to moving to a new city or state & basically starting life over from scratch. De-conversion is anything but easy. However, once a person gets through all of that, and that often takes years, they are usually glad they left religion & at that point they are much happier than they were as Christians.

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I made a mistake. Had a lapse of judgment. I delved deeply into Christianity, its roots, its evolution, its Bible. Study of all that opened my eyes to reality once again, and I just couldn't believe anymore. Not a decision, a consequence of learning and thinking, observing and trying my best. Christianity prospers through its use of fear, gullibility, and basic human insecurity. The religion preys on weakness and is the cause of countless mental disorders. I know many nice people still in the faith, smart and educated people. It just doesn't make sense to me. My bad, but not ashamed or unhappy.

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Lost, I really feel that deconversion will depend on the personality. I was a very gullible person all my life ( and very sensitive) and wanted the whole world to be happy.

 

I felt the same way as you when I first joined. I thought everyone was so comfortable in their non-belief but I kept reading and found others who struggled for a long time to face the truth. I can't say I'm any happier after deconverting as when I was  searching for the truths about the bible. As a matter of fact, there is something valid when they say, ''ignorance is bliss''. I preferred believing in prayer and a  loving, kind god. I  still cannot listen to religious christmas carols with out shedding some tears. It still affects me. But I have grown to accept the truth about the evidence that I do not see  a masterful, protective god and am learning very slowly how to enjoy life even though I don't believe anymore. My survival skills have actually strengthened. Losing my faith to me was like finding out that the 'love of my life' never loved me after many years of loving him. It hurt like hell and I cried a lot.....

 

It can be a bumpy ride for some. Hang in there with us and we'll try to help you find other things to occupy your mind with. Life isn't all that bad without god although I will always miss the false security I had as a believer that a powerful god was going to eventually straighten up this world and stop all the suffering. I live now knowing that we are human animals and we are probably on our own and we alone have the ability to make our own happiness. You are not alone hon. It will get better with time. You'll be able to accept life on life's terms.

 

Big (hug)

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Lost, one more thing I wanted to say. And this is only my opinion so that's all it's worth. I always thought we should be happy everyday....... but I am at the point in my life where I believe the default brain of humans is for survival and we are always in a state of 'alertness' to survive. When we finally get to relax a bit, we feel thing thing called 'happiness'. (We have survived something and now we can breathe a little) I believe that 'happiness' is the silver lining in the cloud and we get to enjoy that for a short time until the next form of survival hits us and were back at making something work out for ourselves. In other words, I believe that happiness is a by product of surviving the many changes (and suffering) we have to endure here on earth. So when you do feel that wonderful feeling, milk it for all it's worth. Just another bit of my 2 cents.

 

(hug)

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I made a mistake. Had a lapse of judgment. I delved deeply into Christianity, its roots, its evolution, its Bible. Study of all that opened my eyes to reality once again, and I just couldn't believe anymore. Not a decision, a consequence of learning and thinking, observing and trying my best. Christianity prospers through its use of fear, gullibility, and basic human insecurity. The religion preys on weakness and is the cause of countless mental disorders. I know many nice people still in the faith, smart and educated people. It just doesn't make sense to me. My bad, but not ashamed or unhappy.

This:

 

Isn't interesting how people ask, why do you choose not to believe in God? Why did you open you mind to the Devil?

 

Well sorry, I didn't, what happened is I ran across information that did not accord with the Bible, looked for answers, and got my beliefs smashed to pieces.

 

With what I now know I can't believe, even if I tried I couldn't. You looked at the same info and you believe even more? That's great, our minds obviously work differently. It doesn't seem God has revealed himself to me at this point.

 

@ Lost: There are very few who get out of religion without a scratch. And for some the journey out is harder and more painful than some, and for others its much longer than others. I think it's just because we are all so different and live in vastly different circumstances.

 

However, I can say I feel confident in myself, despite ongoing external stressors from family/friends etc. It's only been 3 months for me... and them. I hope in time to normalise things. Head up, stay strong, and stay connected with the community here.

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There is a balance. On the one hand, many of us suffered (or are suffering) for our deconversions. Loss of family, always a loss of social interactions, loss of a complete world-view, decades of emotional and financial investment in what turned out to be a scam, marriages break up, loss of jobs, loss of trust by family and friends, and more.

 

Others of us find that after years of being out of Christianity, we wonder how we ever fell for it in the first place. So much of the blatant mythology that we used to defend now stands out like a sore thumb and seems to beg to be mocked. It is truly sad that so many in our nation and world are taught that this mythology is critical for survival, and so many of our lawmakers are devout followers of a non-existent god that they feel compelled to please.

 

So some of us will openly mock the faith we once held dear, some of us will simply expose the fictitious and damaging nature of the faith, others of us miss the good things we found in the social circles and family bonds that seemed strong. And there are mixes of all of the above. The forums, in addition to being a place of solace and questioning, are a place for many to blow off steam and anger at the faith because it was all a terrible lie (and several of us suffered tremendously under it).

 

I try to temper my words now, particularly when posting to public forums, because my desire is to make the process of leaving the faith easier for those who are questioning, and to prod some into questioning who thought their faith was unshakable.

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No matter how dark the storm, it always ends and the sun comes out.

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Nothing but their faith is a play on words. Faith is nothing but an empty belief. It takes indoctrination to give it assumed value. It's a handful of magic beans. If it means something to someone, they probably have a ways to go on their deconversion journey. I personally don't think it can ever be bad to stop believing in he'll, or believing I was born with a flawed nature, that I need saved.

 

I don't want to discount childhood trauma and the like, i'm just unconvinced faith is a valid approach or rather, not the best possible approach to coping.

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I wanted to die when it started to look like what I thought was my God, my Protector, my Best Friend, might not have been what I thought. It was terrifying to attempt standing on my own. 

 

But - with time, lots of time, and support (incl. on this board), life slowly started to make sense to me. 

 

There have been many passer-byers here for whom it didn't make sense. Some have left what sounded like suicide notes here, some ran off very fast after their first few painful posts because they thought people here were being bullies when sincerely trying to help. Some had to unfortunately be banned because they refused any and all words of consolation and wisdom and kept harassing other board members. 

 

It's not a joke at all to them. It's still not a joke to me either - I may talk some big joke-like blasphemy here but it doesn't mean I take my experiences lightly. 

 

I also like Fuego's answer above. 

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unhappy deconverts?

 

some left this forum,

some struggled and making the best of it,

some went back to cheesus

 

the rest lived happily ever after

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Margee, I think all those Vig's negatives mean that he is speaking for abandoning belief in hell & flawed nature, not against. Had to read the sentence quite a few times though!

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Margee, I think all those Vig's negatives mean that he is speaking for abandoning belief in hell & flawed nature, not against. Had to read the sentence quite a few times though!

Thanks Yunea. I had to read it a few times myself.

 

Sorry Vig, I misunderstood. I guess I read that too early this morning and it looked like you were saying that it's not a bad thing to keep believing in hell... I knew I had to be reading it wrong. You would never say that. I deleted my questioning comment.

 

((hugs)) to all

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Thank You ALL for sharing Your own opinions and experiences and feelings about this subject :) Special thanks to Margee for a deep insight and understanding of my own frustration and for...hugs :) <3

 

I think that for some people with doubts about christianity it was impossible and still is to complete give up on faith and church, cause their lives were or are too tragic and filled with pain that they simply don't have strength inside anymore...they need someone to lean on, higher power.

 

After loosing faith you can go (I guess) to meet ups, Atheists groups and even Atheists' churches, clubs..but it's useless when You come there and mostly there are folks who mock and laugh at something that for a broken You was the only hope in life after many traumatic events.

 

Maybe it's not normal, but I feel an anger that I had to loose faith and that God is not real.

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We are all individuals with different stories and paths that lead us out of faith. For me, I was never comfortable in my faith. I could never get my head around prayer or my relationship with god or Christ. For over 40 years I struggled as I listened to other seemingly blissful Christians talk about their "friend" Jesus and their loving faithful father in heaven. I tried every which way to gain that closeness with either of them and never could get there. So, for me, the light bulb moment was a monumental relief! I no longer had to struggle or worry about pleasing this god that I never really had a relationship with in the first place. They would talk about the "peace that passes all understanding" and I ONLY experienced that AFTER the light bulb went on! So you can imagine my disdain for anything religious at this point. However, I have compassion for those still struggling and want to help and encourage in any way possible. Please continue here with us and let us hug on you all you need. :).

 

As to your above post, I haven't found any atheist groups in my area (one of the more conservative states in the union), and am so pretty alone (hubby is still on the fence). I also have chosen to protect myself by not revealing my disbelief in its entirety to my family or friends yet. So it's not all roses yet. As to those atheist groups you mention that are so ridiculing, I think it makes a huge difference whether they are deconverts or lifelong atheists. If you've never been through deconversion, it is hard to empathize or even understand what we are going through. That's why I stay here, even when I don't always agree with things people say. These people "get" me and have been where I've been to a great extent.

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This morning, I was listening to my nephew.  He's become steadily more of an annoying fundie for some time now.  He talks in increasingly cloying terms about the "lovely" son of god.

 

This morning, for the first time, I heard him get emotional as he repeated the words "wonderful Lord Jesus".  His voice was breaking.  In the end he was blowing his nose due to the emotion (at least, I assume that was the cause - he had no other signs of a cold).

 

And something struck me.

 

This person is intelligent.  Eventually, he's going to have to confront issues as to the factuality and consistency of what he believes.  And the more he is locked into this belief system, the harder it will be.  He will have a choice.  Willful blindness or utter disorientation.

 

It's a choice we've all faced.  The level of emotional attachment (as well as the related issue of family pressure) dictates the degree of disorientation.

 

But I doubt that anyone escapes it in leaving the religion.  It just becomes an issue of how long it takes to re-adjust, and whether the individual finds it preferable to return to the delusion instead.

 

In my nephew's case, I fear he's heading for a very rough time.

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I still struggle with the effects of leaving religion three years later. While it is true that I have found greater happiness in some areas, I have lost it in others. I still believe that where I am now is better than where I was overall, even with all of the difficulties. 

 

Six months after I de-converted, I hit rock bottom emotionally. I was depressed. I cried almost every single day and I felt utterly hopeless. In pictures from that time in my life, I wonder how people didn't ask me what was wrong. I look ghastly. I'm pale and I look tired and worn. I was at a religious college at the time (the story is on here in the archives, I'm sure) and I couldn't TELL anybody really how I felt. I had to put up with religious bullshit every single day. I felt different from everyone around me.

 

I studied psychology in school and I do a yearly battery of psychological tests to gauge my standing in different areas like life satisfaction, personality, and etc. Before I de-converted, I scored around a 4.9 out of 7 in life satisfaction, but during that down time in my life, my scores dipped to 2.0. Since then, I've managed to come back up to pre-de-conversion levels, but it has taken time. In depression inventories during the Dark TimeTM, I scored as being moderately to severely depressed, racking up almost 40 points when today I would only score about a 4-6. Seeing the yearly progress in those data points has helped me put things into perspective. That slowly I have accumulated more reasons to be satisfied with what I have.

 

It took me about a full year to really get out of that and since every individual is different, no one will have the same recovery times.

 

Today, even though I'm generally satisfied, there are areas that bother me still. Being around my extended family really hurts. I find that I can't warm up to them anymore like I used to. I don't know if any of them know--they might suspect. It might be because of my age, but my grandmother always cries when she sees me. She always tells me  that Jesus will always take care of me if I trust him. I lost a lot of friends, too. My support system is still just two people where before I had many people who were available to care for me. I've become more distant from my parents and sister because religion is the sole most important thing in their lives and since I no longer share that with them, it's hard to be as close as we were before. I have small existential crises every six months.

 

Would I want everything I had back in exchange for living that lie? I was so much happier then. No. I've always been of the mindset that truth can be brutal and ugly, but I would much rather try to live my life according to concepts that are true.

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Many will choose the comfortable lie over the truth. Some simply cannot do that, it's not even a choice we have.

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I still struggle with the effects of leaving religion three years later. While it is true that I have found greater happiness in some areas, I have lost it in others. I still believe that where I am now is better than where I was overall, even with all of the difficulties. 

 

Six months after I de-converted, I hit rock bottom emotionally. I was depressed. I cried almost every single day and I felt utterly hopeless. In pictures from that time in my life, I wonder how people didn't ask me what was wrong. I look ghastly. I'm pale and I look tired and worn. I was at a religious college at the time (the story is on here in the archives, I'm sure) and I couldn't TELL anybody really how I felt. I had to put up with religious bullshit every single day. I felt different from everyone around me.

 

I studied psychology in school and I do a yearly battery of psychological tests to gauge my standing in different areas like life satisfaction, personality, and etc. Before I de-converted, I scored around a 4.9 out of 7 in life satisfaction, but during that down time in my life, my scores dipped to 2.0. Since then, I've managed to come back up to pre-de-conversion levels, but it has taken time. In depression inventories during the Dark TimeTM, I scored as being moderately to severely depressed, racking up almost 40 points when today I would only score about a 4-6. Seeing the yearly progress in those data points has helped me put things into perspective. That slowly I have accumulated more reasons to be satisfied with what I have.

 

It took me about a full year to really get out of that and since every individual is different, no one will have the same recovery times.

 

Today, even though I'm generally satisfied, there are areas that bother me still. Being around my extended family really hurts. I find that I can't warm up to them anymore like I used to. I don't know if any of them know--they might suspect. It might be because of my age, but my grandmother always cries when she sees me. She always tells me  that Jesus will always take care of me if I trust him. I lost a lot of friends, too. My support system is still just two people where before I had many people who were available to care for me. I've become more distant from my parents and sister because religion is the sole most important thing in their lives and since I no longer share that with them, it's hard to be as close as we were before. I have small existential crises every six months.

 

Would I want everything I had back in exchange for living that lie? I was so much happier then. No. I've always been of the mindset that truth can be brutal and ugly, but I would much rather try to live my life according to concepts that are true.

Not exactly like me but very close. Much of what you write here is exactly how I feel / felt.

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I'm happy that You ALL are interested in this subject. I read your stories, opinions, advices since I posted this new thread. I think that You seem to be much more sane, mentally stable than me. I feel like no one shares my state of mine and my lifestory. I feel really sad and sick inside thinking that while dying I will feel that this whole insanity will be continued after my death-sitting alone in the darkness, maybe burning and feeling like the only one person who had to go through strange, weird thoughts and feeling during life that no one on earth could describe and share.

 

Today, during Social pedagogy on my Public Health studies I listened students who were presenting slides (Power Point presentations) about issues of the world...all the time at school and university people talk about alcohol, drugs, violence, wars...unemployment, illiteracy and suicide were interesting...but they all think that there is no deeper issues? And of course glorification of physical illnesses makes me sick.

When people will be talking about issues that we go through or different states of mind or weird emotions, identity issues?

 

I come from the country in the middle of Europe (of course deeper issues maybe exists for some members of sweet place that I live in, who knows?) that actually most Americans don't know much about. People in my country say that Americans study mostly history of their Great Nation and their knowledge of other countries on map is poor. Yeah...Paris, Germany, Italy, Spain, UK, and Russia-this is what You want to visit...but what with other countries in the middle of the Europe or on the East?

 

Don't feel really motivated today to write more, but I  just want to thank You ALL for your interest in this subject and thanks for sharing Your experiences with me :)

 

I will write more soon...

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I come from the country in the middle of Europe (of course deeper issues maybe exists for some members of sweet place that I live in, who knows?) that actually most Americans don't know much about. People in my country say that Americans study mostly history of their Great Nation and their knowledge of other countries on map is poor. Yeah...Paris, Germany, Italy, Spain, UK, and Russia-this is what You want to visit...but what with other countries in the middle of the Europe or on the East?

 

I may be your neighbor. Depends which country you're talking about. I live in St. Petersburg and have spent a lot of time in Riga and Tallinn and have friends there. 

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Mentally stable? I'm DDNOS (like DID but a bit less symptoms). I pretend to be stable so people don't worry about me, but inside I have alter personalities who want to hurt themselves right now. I am in intensive therapy.

 

Just saying it is very easy to look at other people and say, "you all have it so much easier than I do". I have done that a lot in my life. But things like suicide, breakdowns, self harm are never just suicide, breakdowns and self harm. There is a lot of hurt that is just like the kind you are going through, whatever it is. People just don't find it easy to be open about it. I think it might be the same thing why pets so often pretend they are ok to their owners... In the wild their pack abandons the sick if they're too sick and slowing the others down. On some instinctive level we may be doing the same.

 

I don't mean to sound harsh but I know I likely did. Apologies for that. I get the lonely feelings and all, the feeling that others really, truly, don't understand, I really do. I know you may not believe it,too.

 

All the best to you, sincerely.

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I'm happy that You ALL are interested in this subject. I read your stories, opinions, advices since I posted this new thread. I think that You seem to be much more sane, mentally stable than me. I feel like no one shares my state of mine and my lifestory. I feel really sad and sick inside thinking that while dying I will feel that this whole insanity will be continued after my death-sitting alone in the darkness, maybe burning and feeling like the only one person who had to go through strange, weird thoughts and feeling during life that no one on earth could describe and share.

 

No one will be able to share your life story 100%, but I can guarantee that you are not the only one in the world who feels or has felt the way you do. Doubting something as big as your faith is a horrible feeling. I went through that myself before de-converting. I screamed at the walls and I begged God to just come back so I wouldn't feel the darkness anymore. I felt like I was being punished for being curious. It felt like I was going insane and I thought about it all the time.

 

Today, during Social pedagogy on my Public Health studies I listened students who were presenting slides (Power Point presentations) about issues of the world...all the time at school and university people talk about alcohol, drugs, violence, wars...unemployment, illiteracy and suicide were interesting...but they all think that there is no deeper issues? And of course glorification of physical illnesses makes me sick.

When people will be talking about issues that we go through or different states of mind or weird emotions, identity issues?

 

Do you mean psychology? Because, yes, psychology underlies all of those issues. Without an understanding of psychology and how humans' brains work, we can't find helpful solutions to those things. Your profile says you are interested in nursing, but I don't know what you're studying in school. It sounds like you might be interested in some psychology coursework and that would be very helpful to someone in nursing anyways because studying psychology can help with empathy skills. Some psychology classes are all about emotions and identity issues.

 

 

 

I come from the country in the middle of Europe (of course deeper issues maybe exists for some members of sweet place that I live in, who knows?) that actually most Americans don't know much about. People in my country say that Americans study mostly history of their Great Nation and their knowledge of other countries on map is poor. Yeah...Paris, Germany, Italy, Spain, UK, and Russia-this is what You want to visit...but what with other countries in the middle of the Europe or on the East?

 

I actually really want to visit Bosnia because I have four friends I met in college who are students from Bosnia who have invited me to come to their country some time. I would also like to see Moldova for myself. But yeah, you're right about plenty of Americans not knowing anything about smaller countries in Europe. It's unfortunate, but that's why I work to broaden my horizons. Bosnia is supposed to be absolutely beautiful and I would never have considered going there if I hadn't met my friends.

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Hmm...  Well, I am late to this thread, but I am going to throw my experience into the mix, for whatever it's worth...

 

When I first left fundamentalism, I was thrown into complete crisis.  And I do mean, COMPLETE crisis!!  I lost my entire peer group, my entire social life, my entire identity.  100% of my life had revolved around the church in one way or another, and it took me YEARS to figure out how to live without it.  Within the first few months of leaving, I fell into DEEP depression.  I am not proud of what I am about to share, but for the sake of sharing my experience, this is how bad I was...  I was in so much anguish that I couldn't even deal with my own children.  My kids were 3 and 1 at the time, and I would lock myself in the bathroom, and curl up into a ball of sobs on the floor, my children crying on the other side of the door, needing one thing or another...  I'd be in there sometimes for an hour or so.  If I couldn't pull myself together, I would call my husband (now soon-to-be-ex-husband) and beg him to come home and take care of the kids because I really could not function.  (This only caused my husband to shut down and withdraw, not step up and help me out in times of crisis....which, in hindsight, was kind of the beginning of the end of our relationship.)  I eventually dragged my butt into a counselor's office.  They quickly deemed me "too severe" to help and referred me to a psychiatrist.  A shrink with a medical degree.  Long story short, I was prescribed mood stabilizers, anti-anxiety meds....an entire cocktail of stuff....  (But that damn shrink never bothered to identify that I was in crisis, not insane.)  I was on many of the meds for years.  They helped me get through the day, but I was a slug.  I had no energy, no motivation....  I was a zombie.  

 

So I clung to mainstream Christianity for a few years.  I wanted so badly to still believe there was a good god and good Christians out there.  I wanted god's help.  I wanted Jesus to be real.  I wanted all of it.  

 

But pretty much as soon as I went off the meds for good (almost 4 years ago), all my zest for life came back....  And, I realized that I would never be happy with Christianity and there was no possible way to fake it, force it, or stuff myself into that box AND be happy.

Some people are happy with religion.  Some people aren't.  I don't understand "good" religion, because that wasn't my experience, but I respect those who genuinely feel like religion is a good thing for them (as long as they aren't being preachy assholes to me or anyone else about it).  And I respect those who are happy, productive people without religion, too.  (I certainly identify more with these people at this point in my life.)

 

At the end of the day, I think we're all just searching for what makes our world make sense to us, and what makes us happy.  Some need god to achieve that.  Others don't.

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