Jump to content
Goodbye Jesus

Did God err in making Adam ruler over Eve?


Greatest I am

Recommended Posts

  • Moderator
On 10/12/2017 at 6:31 PM, Greatest I am said:

Gnostic Christian. Can you read?

Or at least find something worthy of reading to say..........????..........?????

 

Regards

DL

Cocky little Gnostic Christian! <_< -_-

 

You must use 'love' when you are any kind of christian. :nono:  The Gnostic bible tells me so!! :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 2017-10-12 at 7:31 PM, LogicalFallacy said:

We don't even need bible believers to studying its origins. They can just read its content:

 

If nothing else this portion should give great pause to anyone with half a conscience:

 

Numbers 31:

 

14 And Moses was wroth with the officers of the host, with the captains over thousands, and captains over hundreds, which came from the battle.

15 And Moses said unto them, Have ye saved all the women alive?

16 Behold, these caused the children of Israel, through the counsel of Balaam, to commit trespass against the Lord in the matter of Peor, and there was a plague among the congregation of the Lord.

17 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.

18 But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.

This is the verse. Or the verses. The verse that I read and told Christianity to go to hell, and that I was done with it. And this is the verse I shall quote when I hear about virtuous woman of the faith etc or about how women are subject to their husbands. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/12/2017 at 2:00 PM, Greatest I am said:

Did God err in making Adam ruler over Eve?

 

Scripture are clear. Sin and death entered this world through Adam, and he was thus to blame for original sin.

 

Yet God rewarded Adam with dominion over Eve even though Eve was not responsible for sin and death entering the world. Gen3:16 and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

 

This shows God continuing the policy of punishing the innocent instead of the guilty that is shown in scriptures. 1Peter 1:20 He was chosen before the creation of the world, but was revealed in these last times for your sake.

 

God seems to be rewarding Adam for sin while punishing Eve for the events in Eden even though she was innocent of sin as she did not have any evil intent and was deceived by Satan, a force that she could not possibly resist thanks to God giving Satan the power to deceive the whole world after God put Satan in Eden with Eve.

 

If making man ruler over women that was an error, it would help explain the 5,000 years of war we have had to endure with undeserving men as rulers.

 

Gnostic Christianity, a Universalist belief system, believes in full equality for all souls. Christianity obviously does not believe in equality if it preaches that men are to perpetually enjoy ruling over women. Not to mention the inequality of gays.

 

Did God err in making Adam ruler over Eve and thus punishing the innocent instead of the guilty?

 

Regards

DL

 

1 Timothy 2

9In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array; 10But (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works. 11Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. 12But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. 13For Adam was first formed, then Eve. 14And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. 15Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.

 

Of course, they were really both "deceived" according to Genesis.  Both ate the forbidden fruit.  I have the audacity to question Paul and a literal interpretation of Genesis anyway.  How dare I.  When Paul wrote stuff down, did he really intend for his writings to span all generations and were they infallible?  Anyway, it sounds like you want a Matriarchy, which I find as undesirable as Cheauvanism.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, ToddJ said:

 

1 Timothy 2

9In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array; 10But (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works. 11Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. 12But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. 13For Adam was first formed, then Eve. 14And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. 15Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.

 

Of course, they were really both "deceived" according to Genesis.  Both ate the forbidden fruit.  I have the audacity to question Paul and a literal interpretation of Genesis anyway.  How dare I.  When Paul wrote stuff down, did he really intend for his writings to span all generations and were they infallible?  Anyway, it sounds like you want a Matriarchy, which I find as undesirable as Cheauvanism.

 

 

 

The book of Genesis is a redacted version of the Babylonian creation myth. It was copied & edited during the Jewish Babylonian captivity by five anonymous writers/scribes. Basically it's Babylonian theology that was edited & redacted so that it would appear to have Jewish origins. 

 

Whatever the source it is clearly a myth that attempts, in story form, to explain how life began & how evil entered the world. There is nothing sacred about it. 

 

Oh yeah, it is likely Paul was a literary figure too. Evidence suggests Simon Magus & Marcion were the authors of Paul's authentic Epistles & they wrote them in the 2nd century. Polycarp is the likely author of 1st & 2nd Timothy. Polycarp was a bitter enemy of Simon & Marcion who were Gnostic's. Polycarp was Catholic.

 

A great book to read on this subject is "The Fabricated Paul" by Hermann Detering 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Moderator
On 10/13/2017 at 1:56 PM, TheRedneckProfessor said:

Demonstrate that god did in fact make Adam and Eve, then we will talk about God's mistakes.

 

I actually wonder if atheists sometimes miss the entire argument instead of hitting it on the head like you did TRP?

 

Take the versus I quoted above. When it all boils down its not that there are these terrible versus in the bible, but the real crux is the man (Moses) who apparently said them never existed! So I wonder if debating about what various versus say, or if God knew Eve would sin etc is simply entirely fruitless in a conversation with a believer.

 

I think the vast majority of conversations about religion can simply be boiled down to demonstrate YOUR God exists. Then we can have a conversation about the various aspects about this God.

 

This is the point I have reached in my personal attitude towards religion in general... though I still do love discussing some of the bigger topics.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Super Moderator
12 hours ago, LogicalFallacy said:

 

I actually wonder if atheists sometimes miss the entire argument instead of hitting it on the head like you did TRP?

 

Take the versus I quoted above. When it all boils down its not that there are these terrible versus in the bible, but the real crux is the man (Moses) who apparently said them never existed! So I wonder if debating about what various versus say, or if God knew Eve would sin etc is simply entirely fruitless in a conversation with a believer.

 

I think the vast majority of conversations about religion can simply be boiled down to demonstrate YOUR God exists. Then we can have a conversation about the various aspects about this God.

 

This is the point I have reached in my personal attitude towards religion in general... though I still do love discussing some of the bigger topics.

In this forum, I have a lot of fun going around and around in circles with guys like End3.  I get plenty of opportunities to flex my logic muscle, as it were; and opportunities to poke holes in the religious mindset.  I enjoy such conversations when I know all parties are being genuine and sincerely trying to make sense of life, the universe, and everything (42).  

 

But in the "real" world, my response to religious discussion usually does boil down to "put up or shut up".  Most folk just aren't willing to look past the pat christianese apologetic.  They have convenient little answers that satisfy them; and don't really want their little part of the vineyard disturbed.  It's sad.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/13/2017 at 5:17 AM, Margee said:

Yes. Who stood outside this 'garden'  and wrote the whole account out?? It was only supposed to be god, adam, eve and the talking serpent?? Who was the stenographer?

 

I'm so happy that I think Genesis is the silliest book in the whole bible. What a stupid story. Once one recognizes that it's a complete fable, the whole entire bible falls apart.

 

Genesis may be the silliest/ stupidest story of the Bible, but I  I think Revelations is a close second.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 5 months later...
On 10/12/2017 at 12:00 PM, Greatest I am said:

Did God err in making Adam ruler over Eve?

 

Scripture are clear. Sin and death entered this world through Adam, and he was thus to blame for original sin.

 

Yet God rewarded Adam with dominion over Eve even though Eve was not responsible for sin and death entering the world. Gen3:16 and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

 

This shows God continuing the policy of punishing the innocent instead of the guilty that is shown in scriptures. 1Peter 1:20 He was chosen before the creation of the world, but was revealed in these last times for your sake.

 

God seems to be rewarding Adam for sin while punishing Eve for the events in Eden even though she was innocent of sin as she did not have any evil intent and was deceived by Satan, a force that she could not possibly resist thanks to God giving Satan the power to deceive the whole world after God put Satan in Eden with Eve.

 

If making man ruler over women that was an error, it would help explain the 5,000 years of war we have had to endure with undeserving men as rulers.

 

Gnostic Christianity, a Universalist belief system, believes in full equality for all souls. Christianity obviously does not believe in equality if it preaches that men are to perpetually enjoy ruling over women. Not to mention the inequality of gays.

 

Did God err in making Adam ruler over Eve and thus punishing the innocent instead of the guilty?

 

Regards

DL

Assuming we believe this story is true, there is confusion to who caused sin first. Some say eve and some day Adam. Romans 5:12 says that Adam was to blame. 1 Timothy 2:14 says eve sinned first and that’s why women can’t have authority over men. But ecclesiasticus 25:24 says that through the woman came sin and through her we all die. It seems like the authors couldn’t even agree but if you think about it, Adam was given dominion over everything. Women weren’t even a thought until a man got lonely. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The creation story is obviously a myth. Why would anyone, except a fundamentalists, assume it's true? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Guidelines.