Guest Catholic Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 I would like to correct what you said on your show about Catholics teaching that anyone who is not Christian or specifically Catholic goes to hell. that is not true and it never has been the position of the church in fact over 1500 years ago St Augustine refuted that claim terming it "invencible ignorance" (ironically the discovery of this doctrine took me from Nietzcheist Atheism to Catholic in a 2 month time frame) here is a Link to the teaching http://www.romancatholicism.org/jansenism/...n-ignorance.htm also here is a what the catechism of the Catholic Church has to say you can find a copy of it at www.vatican.va IV. ERRONEOUS JUDGMENT 1790 A human being must always obey the certain judgment of his conscience. If he were deliberately to act against it, he would condemn himself. Yet it can happen that moral conscience remains in ignorance and makes erroneous judgments about acts to be performed or already committed. 1791 This ignorance can often be imputed to personal responsibility. This is the case when a man "takes little trouble to find out what is true and good, or when conscience is by degrees almost blinded through the habit of committing sin."59 In such cases, the person is culpable for the evil he commits. 1792 Ignorance of Christ and his Gospel, bad example given by others, enslavement to one's passions, assertion of a mistaken notion of autonomy of conscience, rejection of the Church's authority and her teaching, lack of conversion and of charity: these can be at the source of errors of judgment in moral conduct. 1793 If - on the contrary - the ignorance is invincible, or the moral subject is not responsible for his erroneous judgment, the evil committed by the person cannot be imputed to him. It remains no less an evil, a privation, a disorder. One must therefore work to correct the errors of moral conscience. 1794 A good and pure conscience is enlightened by true faith, for charity proceeds at the same time "from a pure heart and a good conscience and sincere faith."60 i do not mind if you speak illy of the Catholic Church but it is rather important that you are honest about what she teaches and believes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 That's because the Catholic Church is getting soft as it limps into senility Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyFeline Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 Dude, first off... shoddy apologetics aren't going to do much here, besides get a lot of people sharpening their aim by shooting them down. Either back up your claims (with something BESIDES "Well, I'm going to be a priest soon!" or "It saved me!"), or don't make them... And, two... Learn to fuckin' write, man. For someone who's supposedly so "educated", you sure don't have a very firm grasp on basic things like spelling and grammar... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 I would like to correct what you said on your show about Catholics teaching that anyone who is not Christian or specifically Catholic goes to hell. <<<snipped all that extra writing>>> You're forgetting one minor detail in what The Church teaches, or doesn't teach for that matter. You will never hear The Church teach that Hell does not exist. Do you know why they won't teach that? Because it is true, that's why. We don't give a crap if your Church Fathers pen out a super amendment that says every single person that was ever born will be welcomed into Heaven. You act as if we're not aware that it's all make believe, or that your little bit of information here is going to have us racing to the nearest Catholic church so that we can eat Christ's flesh and drink his blood. That just isn't going to happen, so you're pretty much waisting your time with your -- should I say -- excuses? (bust on my grammar all you want, LF. I still get my point across. ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Catholic Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 as for spelling forgive me im dyslexic so i dont spell demder too good. my question was more so of what you thought about the doctrine not what you thought of my apologetics. as for grammer meh, oh well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 but it is rather important that you are honest about what she teaches and believes. Really? Why? Why is it important? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 I think it's a noble idea to broaden the concept of who can be saved, but it's also un-Xian and very much against the Holah Babble. Like all fellow doctrines, it's just more Xian trash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 I think it's a noble idea to broaden the concept of who can be saved, Since when does nobility have anything to do with building upon and adding more to a lie? There's nothing noble about this theology. Especially the Catholic theology. I mean, c'mon... The Catholic church states that you're guilty of heresy if you do not believe or claim that those little bread wafers and wine are ACTUALLY/LITERALLY the flesh and blood of their dead saviour. They used to kill people for saying, "This isn't blood." or, "This isn't flesh." Those types of honest to goodness doses of reality were met with a, "Damned be ye, heretic! Off with his head!" Catholicism was spread through brutal fear induction. Not because it, or any of it for that matter, are true. Nobility is the furthest thing from Catholicism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Catholic Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 I think it's a noble idea to broaden the concept of who can be saved, but it's also un-Xian and very much against the Holah Babble. Dont make a claim unless your going to back it up. you wanna talk Trash fine but you better be ready to back it up. now DO IT! first remember that Catholics are not "bible alone" we have Tradition as well. secondly I would like to know where the bible says if your not Christian your going to hell. and Third Jews believed that someone could not be jewish and be rightous. bluntly... if your going to talk shit back it up. Like all fellow doctrines, it's just more Xian trash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 He must have let The Holy Ghost answer that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 Nobility is the furthest thing from Catholicism. True, Fwee - I think I had an uncharacteristic moment of trying to be nice. Guess I'm just paying the price for staying up too late I'll have to watch it, yes, precious, I will... Catholic - Don't try the big, tough guy act with me. I will talk trash because your religion is trash. Any dimwit who's read the Holah Babble knows that Jeezus demands absolute obedience on pain of eternal damnation. Matt 12:30 He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad. Luke 19:27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me. Mark 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. Matt 13:40-42 As therefore the tares(weeds) are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world. The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. Shall I go on? Now take your simple-minded ass and go bleat with the rest of your fearmongering pedophiles like a good little sheep, or else try to back up your demented bitch of a god with some real facts to prove it's existence. The burden of proof is on you, bitch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 Now take your simple-minded ass and go bleat with the rest of your fearmongering pedophiles like a good little sheep, or else try to back up your demented bitch of a god with some real facts to prove it's existence. The burden of proof is on you, bitch Now that's my muhfuckin' Varokhar! Don't forget now. We're dealing with a True Christian Catholic this time around. His bible probably doesn't even have those verses in them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Catholic Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 Now take your simple-minded ass and go bleat with the rest of your fearmongering pedophiles like a good little sheep, or else try to back up your demented bitch of a god with some real facts to prove it's existence. The burden of proof is on you, bitch Now that's my muhfuckin' Varokhar! Don't forget now. We're dealing with a True Christian Catholic this time around. His bible probably doesn't even have those verses in them. Hello Judas, you really should know what your talking about. Catholics have 7 more books than protestants (because the Protestants took them out) we have the verses they have. Nobility is the furthest thing from Catholicism. True, Fwee - I think I had an uncharacteristic moment of trying to be nice. Guess I'm just paying the price for staying up too late I'll have to watch it, yes, precious, I will... Catholic - Don't try the big, tough guy act with me. I will talk trash because your religion is trash. Any dimwit who's read the Holah Babble knows that Jeezus demands absolute obedience on pain of eternal damnation. Matt 12:30 He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad. Luke 19:27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me. Mark 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. Matt 13:40-42 As therefore the tares(weeds) are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world. The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. Shall I go on? Now take your simple-minded ass and go bleat with the rest of your fearmongering pedophiles like a good little sheep, or else try to back up your demented bitch of a god with some real facts to prove it's existence. The burden of proof is on you, bitch Round Two DING!!!! you must forget that verse that those mormons love to use "i have sheep not of this flock". what about them? you should take things within context rather than Protestanize the verses. Matt12:30 just because someone does not hear of Christ does not automatically disqualify him for salvation. it does not make him against Christ just because he didnt hear about Christ. Lk 19:27 again this does not refer to those who have not heard of Christ but those who would makethemsleves the enemy of Christ. MK:16:16 ok that is taken completely out of context, you have to know something before you can believe it. again not revering to those who have not heard of Christ. MT:13:40-42 same as above you have not provided one verse that would disprove invencible ignorance. please try again. yes we shall try again. oh kind of testy arnt we... i like the firy ones... boy arnt we ignorant, Science cant Disprove or prove Gods existance that Job is the job of Philosophy not science. and who says the burden of Proof is on me? you? who are you to put the burden of proof on me? i say its on you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 Now take your simple-minded ass and go bleat with the rest of your fearmongering pedophiles like a good little sheep, or else try to back up your demented bitch of a god with some real facts to prove it's existence. The burden of proof is on you, bitch Now that's my muhfuckin' Varokhar! Don't forget now. We're dealing with a True Christian Catholic this time around. His bible probably doesn't even have those verses in them. Hello Judas, you really should know what your talking about. Catholics have 7 more books than protestants (because the Protestants took them out) we have the verses they have. Judas... He said, "Judas". Please, don't mistake me for someone who gladly follows instructions given to him by a make-believe saviour. If you don't know what I'm talking about, then CLICK HERE. There's a good chance that you may learn something while you're here. That is, IF you haven't already been around here for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Catholic Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 Now take your simple-minded ass and go bleat with the rest of your fearmongering pedophiles like a good little sheep, or else try to back up your demented bitch of a god with some real facts to prove it's existence. The burden of proof is on you, bitch Now that's my muhfuckin' Varokhar! Don't forget now. We're dealing with a True Christian Catholic this time around. His bible probably doesn't even have those verses in them. Hello Judas, you really should know what your talking about. Catholics have 7 more books than protestants (because the Protestants took them out) we have the verses they have. Judas... He said, "Judas". Please, don't mistake me for someone who gladly follows instructions given to him by a make-believe saviour. If you don't know what I'm talking about, then CLICK HERE. There's a good chance that you may learn something while you're here. That is, IF you haven't already been around here for a while. Judas you are either a fool or an idiot im not sure which. the "lost gospel of Judas" was kown about before it was ever uncovered it was recoreded and refuted accurately by the early church fathers. have you read any of the doc.? this is where your idiocy comes in, when did judas have time to write it? after he hung himself? secondly the text has already been dated to about the year 150. its an invalid text. try again. read some real books instead of trying to pretend to know what your talking about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 Judas you are either a fool or an idiot im not sure which. the "lost gospel of Judas" was kown about before it was ever uncovered it was recoreded and refuted accurately by the early church fathers. have you read any of the doc.? this is where your idiocy comes in, when did judas have time to write it? after he hung himself? secondly the text has already been dated to about the year 150. its an invalid text. try again. read some real books instead of trying to pretend to know what your talking about I seeeeee youuuuuu! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 This one makes me giggle Calling everyone "Judas" doesn't add weight to your argument, bucko. And dropping the verses you did doesn't prove me wrong - it only proves that the Holah Babble is rife with contradictions on even the most basic points of Xian doctrine. That alone is the biggest problem with your deathcult, the fact that it is utterly full of contradictions. That's why there are so mant sects. One sect zeroes on things the others don't, and all of them can back it up with Scripchah. And like little babies, they fight over who has the best version, never realizing they're all sitting in the mud playing with turds It's all a contest to see who has the biggest turds. That's all the different sects of Xianity boil down to. And no, little one, the burden of proof isn't on me - it's on you. You come here and run your yap, so you're the one who needs to back things up. I just shot down your whole argument and all you've done is stutter out a few verses that display the wholly contradictory nature of the Babble. There's no Round Two, dummy, there's only yet another Xian who stepped in his own shit But keep 'em coming - you're helping us to display the faulty nature of your deathcult. At least you can boast of that, along with each and every single other Xian to come here, fire in the tum-tum for Jeezus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mythra Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 I saw the term "invincible ignorance" in the title, and I thought - what a great term to describe christians. Then I read the thread and realized that the author is just another member of the invincibly ignorant. Isn't it ironic? Yeah, I really do think. Judas II. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted June 4, 2006 Share Posted June 4, 2006 Judas II. Oh, no you don't - Catholic called me Judas and Fwee is Judas II (by his order of accusations) - you're Judas III. Get in line, dammit! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted June 4, 2006 Share Posted June 4, 2006 Judas II. Oh, no you don't - Catholic called me Judas and Fwee is Judas II (by his order of accusations) - you're Judas III. Get in line, dammit! Why don't we just form a little group called The Judii Knights? The name hasn't really been taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted June 4, 2006 Share Posted June 4, 2006 Judas Christ, get a grip guys. Judas is the savior, didn't y'all know? He sacrificed himself for our sins, in the tree by hanging himself. (Now I really must have commited the unforgivable sin...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted June 4, 2006 Share Posted June 4, 2006 Why don't we just form a little group called The Judii Knights? I'm all for it So long as I get a green lightsaber, of course. No, two. Judas Christ, get a grip guys. Judas is the savior, didn't y'all know? He sacrificed himself for our sins, in the tree by hanging himself. (Now I really must have commited the unforgivable sin...) Only if you put your face in place of hers: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fweethawt Posted June 4, 2006 Share Posted June 4, 2006 Why don't we just form a little group called The Judii Knights? I'm all for it So long as I get a green lightsaber, of course. No, two. Are you sure that you don't want a pink one with a steady red pulse? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lycorth Posted June 4, 2006 Share Posted June 4, 2006 Are you sure that you don't want a pink one with a steady red pulse? No, make that blue - blue is Odin's color. And I want an option to go from steady pulse to strobe. That would fucking rule in a totally dark environment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 5, 2006 Share Posted June 5, 2006 I would like to correct what you said on your show about Catholics teaching that anyone who is not Christian or specifically Catholic goes to hell. that is not true and it never has been the position of the church in fact over 1500 years ago St Augustine refuted that claim terming it "invencible ignorance" Hmmm, this has never been the position of the catholick church? Well, then why, when my catholick grandmother converted to lutheranism in order to marry my grandfather, was she told by her CATHOLICK priest that she would burn in HELL forever for leaving the CATHOLICK church? Hmm? Can you answer me that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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