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Showing content with the highest reputation on 08/04/2018 in all areas

  1. 3 points
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    I saw this online a little while ago and it really spoke to me: <https://kiddy.org.uk/i-love-you-from-the-perspective-of-a-narcissist/> I've had personal bitter experiences with people I later realized were narcissists, and I think the discussion belongs were in ex-christian.net because I believe narcissism and toxic Xianity go hand-in-in-hand. Think about it - an all powerful - all confident being who promises everything and delivers nothing and it's always your fault, and somehow, albeit the supposed all-powerfulness of this entity, it is insecure enough to judge you largely on whether you validate his existence and power through perpetual self-flagelation on your part. Many pastors and authoritarian believers are narcissists - which I think is no accident. The belief system, taken in a certain way, becomes validation and rationalization for this kind of behavior. A scary part of this is that I personally couldn't identify the individuals as narcissists until many years later (although I knew *something* was wrong with them), because they trained me so well to admire them and defend them and rationalize every bad decision they made, I did so even *after* I came to disagree with their beliefs. When I explained their behavior to sane, kind individuals many years later it was almost completely obvious - these narcissists didn't ultimately care about anything more than elevating themselves. When such individuals are as close to you as family members, it's not so simple as dismissing them and cutting them away. It took a lot of work for me to understand what they are, why they do things, and how to move along in a way that was safe for me. Good boundaries and good emotional support really helped with this. I once thought it was my problem for not being able to forgive them... but someone really close to me once said "Are you forgiving who they say they are or are you forgiving who they actually are?". Self-deception is not forgiveness, and it's important to be honest with ourselves about who certain people are, in actuality, in order to move on. Anyways, I'm curious as to what kinds of experiences other X-Xians have had with narcissism, as I suspect it's not an unusual situation for us. -DT
  3. 2 points
    Florduh is not chasing you away. He suggested that you take a break from the Ex-C forum for a while because he sincerely believes your recent participation here is not helping you. To me at least, that sounds like a friend trying to help.
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    Thank you for sharing your story with me, @ag_NO_stic! I suspect we've had very similar experiences. One thing my parents would do would be to punish me out of the blue without explanation or reason, because "I should know better" and "I should think about what I had done" (whatever that was). I realized at an early age I had to constantly make sure they were happy, or they would literally interpret anything as an affront to them. It sure gave me a lot of anxiety problems in the long run! In a lot of ways the bible is a mish-mash of out-of-context musings and stories, with varying degrees of moral interest and relevance. I think people usually project a personality onto it that happens to suit them, for the most part. Narcissists like to believe in a narcissistic God because it presents their own behavior in a light of sanctimoniousness...
  6. 2 points
    Seek help from a secular mental health professional of your choice.
  7. 2 points
    Yes, a lot. I had a roomie that rarely saw anything wrong with his own behavior, would get into my room and go through my stuff (likely looking for porn that wasn't there) to the point of removing insulation from my windows and putting it back sloppily. He'd had other roomies accuse him previously and he said to me "You don't believe I'd do that, do you?" I've learned over time that people who say that are typically guilty and looking for an ego boost. And sometimes even normal Christians are told to become more invasive in the personal lives of others. I had multiple ones try to prevent me from marrying my wife (now of 20 years) because "she isn't ready, god wants her to be single, and we need to "counsel" her for more years until she sees how holy we are and maybe becomes married to one of us". All that last bit was silent, but I pushed one until he admitted he was attracted to her. My narcissist roomie above actually sent me a card saying I wasn't ready to get married, that I was violent, blah blah blah. I didn't give into his manipulation, so he constantly tried to gaslight me in the eyes of others that I was some kind of nut case. They even wrote to our marriage counselor trying to get him to stop the marriage. He told us that we were one of the more mature couples he'd ever known, and the letter was bizarre to him. It was a cult, and the church started taking steps to disband it. It started as a singles group, but became an oddly uber-fundy group. Glad we moved to a different city and eventually out of church completely.
  8. 1 point
    I don't think so. If it was you wouldn't have a billionaire trying to feed people. It depends on what you think socialism is and what it should be achieving. In America at least you guys have made it public enemy number one despite the fact that most Americans cannot accurately describe socialism. They seem to think authoritarian regimes define socialism when it's more true to say those regimes have tried their version of it. There seems to be a disconnect between what could be achieved and what bad leaders do in regards to socialism and even communism. We actually haven t had a pure communist country. The countries we call communist are not actually communist. They are authoritarian regimes who use mixes of state owned and private owned property to run the economy. We could have a decent discussion about capitalism vs socialism vs communism but it seems folks here are happy to circle jerk with capitalism very good socialism bad communism evil as the extent of discussion.
  9. 1 point
    This is rather interesting. Not quite "science" enough for that section, this dealing with human interactions with robots... New study finds it’s harder to turn off a robot when it’s begging for its life ..snipped kL
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    Get away now. There's no fixing it nor is there any point in trying. I'm sorry for your situation and I hope you find the courage to change it immediately. Best of luck to you.
  12. 1 point
    I'd be concerned that any chemical that's safe to put down the drain will just make the leaves clot into a worse mess.
  13. 1 point
    Please tell me we are not having a circle jerk in this thread? Anyone who's done even a cursory study of capitalism vs socialism would realize pure forms of both end up people at the top having everything and people at the bottom struggling. The common factor in the failure of both is human nature. However a mixing of the two often produces results that are more desirable than pure forms of either.
  14. 1 point
    Interesting point! It also makes me wonder if that's why some of us leave....We recognize it in our parents and want nothing to do with it! They can't see it, so leaving is unfathomable and almost a personal affront to them! I'm sorry you had to go through it too. It sucks.
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    I empathize with your stress about theology, truly. You might need to slow down, breathe, and cool your circular thoughts/worries for a little bit, however.
  18. 1 point
    @SerenelyBlue You can believe whatever you like. I'm sorry someone in your life really drilled it into you that you have to prove or argue that you're right (and that we're wrong). I can't help but notice how much time you've been spending on this website, though, and wonder whether you're here (despite everything you say) because you're lonely and the people here are giving you attention? The way you spend your time, and the people you spend it with, really reflects who you are, you know? If Xians are so much better and wiser than us, then why don't you open up to them and spend more time with them? I suspect, though, that you already tried that. Remember, *you* came here, first, in the beginning, asking for our comfort. No one made you come here.
  19. 1 point
    Hey, DestinyTurtle! I've been enjoying your contributions so far, keep it up! As for your post, it hit me right in the feels. My mother displays narcissistic tendencies and I'm actually pretty fucked up by a childhood spent navigating her expectations. I don't have to give you some long drawn out thing, but her love was always given based on meeting her standards. My biggest problem with her is that she (no matter what phase of life she's in) always expected me (a CHILD) to see things from HER perspective. It didn't matter how my 10 year old self saw the house, if she got home and I hadn't cleaned it to HER standards....I got in trouble. I can't tell you how many times, "I should've known better" in a situation I couldn't possibly have known. I think it's why I'm such an empath now. I always always always wondered why mom couldn't see things from my perspective if I was expected to see hers. There's always another side of the story, but not to a narcissist lol. It's eerie how many similarities there are between a narcissist and the christian god. I got a double whammy it seems.
  20. 1 point
    When every aspect of daily life goes back to "Jesus said" and The Bible instructs us to" and "I felt led" and "I'll pray about it" and "The Holy Spirit......blah blah blah...." well, you just can't relate to such people, nor they to you.
  21. 1 point
    An argument against allowing anyone to just say whatever they like: https://thespinoff.co.nz/politics/12-07-2018/all-the-times-our-new-free-speech-coalition-really-hated-free-speech/ The crux of it is that these free speech advocates are not really free speech advocates - they just want stuff they want to hear allowed as free speech. It's an interesting position. The only rational position is free speech absolutist when talking about free speech - anything else and you are simply talking about acceptable speech. And the problem there is acceptable to whom?
  22. 1 point
    Keep in mind -- her RIGHT foot is the one that had surgery! Her dad pranked her while she's medicated.
  23. 1 point
    I'd be tempted to tell her "You were never a true friend," although that's stooping to her level.
  24. 1 point
    You realise the only sources we have for Jesus on a cross are from four contradictory self serving letters written by people trying to convince other people of their "truth"? Even if it was historically unambiguous that a man named Jesus who claimed to be Christ was crucified, that in no way tells you whether he actually was the son of God. Here's another thought - why is Christianity so much like other religions if its God inspired and the one true religion? Other religions had God's having sons, and gods dying and rising long before the gospels were written. Why is God copying humanity? You go read God myths from the surrounding Greeks, Romans, Babylonians, and Egyptians and tell me that the stories told in the bible are different and unique. They aren't - they are the same stories simply rehashed by the people for their audience.
  25. 1 point
    And I sense the presence of a heavily self deluded man, obsessed with reaching out for help while going through mental gymnastics. We're trying to help you orient yourself out of this delusion you're suffering. And it requires that you face off with the suggestions everyone is asking you to face off with.
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    I currently am seeking help from a secular mental health professional, but the wait is 2 months, it does not fix the damage that has been done to me by both religion and possibly by me.
  28. 1 point
    ...It can destroy families ...
  29. 1 point
    This sort of behaviour. Big assertions and bible quoting as if that's the end of the argument.
  30. 1 point
    I agree with your assessment. Interestingly, many denominations accuse other denominations of being authoritarian. My protestant father, for example, discussed the authoritarianism of Catholicism, probably referring to their institutional authority. He paraded his brand of Protestantism as a self-directed, critically thought approach to Xianity, and encouraged me to read the bible and come to my own conclusions about the true teachings of the bible. I did read the bible, and came to my own conclusions, but as it turned out he resented me unless I came to the exact same conclusions as him (which, apparently, I didn't). So, basically, it was about his own theological authority, and the call for me to think for myself was all pretense. I think in a similar vain many authoritarians don't think of themselves as authoritarians, they just think they happen to be lucky enough to be more right than anyone else, and that other people are morally and intellectually questionable if they don't see that. Scripture in many ways functions as background static that can be rearranged in a multitude of ways to rationalize a pre-existing authoritarian belief on the pretense of scriptural authority. A claim of Revelation is in many ways a last-resort copout that uses one's absolute self-confidence as a blunt-instrument for perpetuating their beliefs in an emotion-driven manner.
  31. 1 point
    Wow. That takes a lot of balls to admit. Cudos! I myself have worked through many narcissistic tendencies that I probably inherited by imitating my parents as a child, and I agree with you about the influence of the social context for men. Sometimes people develop a personality type because that's the only template they've been presented with.
  32. 1 point
    Many Narcissists have a honed in ability to outwardly perform sociability or kindness in order to get something specific or otherwise achieve a good reputation from people (in order to get something from them). It's only when they don't want anything from you (and that person believes there's little chance he/she will in the future) that you start to see their true colors. The result is that people who peripherally know the narcissists I know in a social or professional context often believe he's a really nice person, but it's actually a performance.
  33. 1 point
    The Christian religion, in essence, is based on a recipe of scripture, authority and revelation. Each component can become quite addictive for certain personalities. The scripture element provides a written source of claimed truth and encourages the believer to "accept" or "interpret" that text either (i) as stated by another believer (see authority, next) or (ii) as desired with whatever pre-existing apologetics, logical fallacies, lies and misrepresentations are available. The believer uses the scripture to claim truth, knowledge, righteousness, among other things, all under the shortcut scam called "faith". The authority element trains believers to accept someone else's claims, written or oral, with admonishment for any use of skepticism, critical thinking or original thought. The indoctrination of the authority element is quite prevalent and pervasive. Failure to adhere to this authority is punishable in various ways. The revelation element allows believers and proselytizers to escape from reality, avoid rational challenges and feel self-important by pretending to receive special information to which others cannot have access.
  34. 1 point
    I can't say I've come across too many narcissistic Christian's, but then I probably have and I never knew how to identify that behaviour. My step mother always says to me " You've got love yourself" yeah go fuck yourself bich!
  35. 1 point
    I totally agree. I am a recovering narcissist of sorts, made much worse by Christianity. We men get especially groomed into narcissism: our wives were created for us, we are their "head", etc Also, Christianity teaches you will live forever, elevating the ego further.
  36. 1 point
    I dont know if its narcissism, but anyone who actually believes that god took the time to "bless them" with an awesome parking spot at Walmart or to make sure it didn't rain on their wedding day, if they really examine their line of thinking, how does that not appear supremely egotistical? Meanwhile there are entire continents of people suffering and dying without any intervention from god. Yet Christians refuse to see the injustice in this.
  37. 1 point
    Many aspects of Christianity, as well as many other religions, enable those with grandiose or narcissist propensities.
  38. 1 point
    Acquaintances: “I appreciate your kind gesture.” Friends and family: “That is your prerogative- I respect your beliefs too.” Close friends: “Please pray for another free taco day at T.B. while you’re at it!”
  39. 1 point
    "Those who believe in the power of prayer would have no reason to announce their prayers. The fact that you feel compelled to tell me that you're praying for me makes me question how much you yourself really trust the efficacy of prayer."
  40. 1 point
    ^ This is what I do. I usually just "take the high road" and say thanks. I am super nice and polite and usually say I appreciate the sentiment. Then I put a hex on them later.
  41. 1 point
    Just nod your head and say okay. Once this acquaintance realizes how futile that prayer was, it will only serve to slightly compromise their own faith. Sometimes you don't have to do anything except carry on as usual.
  42. 1 point
    Man, learning to not say anything when it could only be detrimental is hard.
  43. 1 point
    There is a saying, "Two hands working gets more done than 12 hands praying." I had a very serious medical diagnosis which I revealed to some close family. They said they'd pray for me. I said what they could do is vote for politicians who support stem cell research, which their brand of Christianity opposes. I got a rather cold stare in return. I probably should have just said, "Thank you for your concern." When dealing with those you don't care about offending (i.e. street preachers), some folks say, "And I'll think for you."
  44. 1 point
    Sometimes I go with a flat "thank you" and a smile. I mean... it's kind of disingenuous of them to use the pretense of prayer as a veiled criticism... but it doesn't do any harm to me as a person and in a lot of ways it's their horribly awkward way of saying "We care about you". Also it's exhausting to correct or attempt to enlighten every person's passing weird semi-blessing.
  45. 1 point
    Fwee just reminded me of one of my favorite bands. Would it be weird if I said I wish my ex-c friends were here instead of out there in internet land right now?
  46. 1 point
    How about: "Thanks for the thought. Instead, I would prefer if you would spend that time doing a kindness to someone else, such as helping an old person in or out of their car, talking to a homeless person for a moment or smiling at a young child in the store."
  47. 1 point
    He has a better plan for you! Just trust him.....
  48. 1 point
    Hey, @megasamurai, Mrs MOHO was of the mindset that I deconverted so I could enjoy the things that xtianity forbade. She got an earful for about an hour the night I came out - the second time around - of the real reasons I have for leaving the fold. She listened. She had the usual replies but she listened. Now I am showing her, each and every day, that, aside from not attending church, I am the same person I have always been. My political beliefs have not changed, I'm not hanging out with swingers, I don't eat babies, I'm not championing the plight of the disenfranchised-gay-baby whales, and I have significantly cut back on the number of kittens I drown on Tuesday nights. I think we all need to make a consorted effort to appreciate that the fundies in our lives may be frequently bombarded by those seeking to keep them in the fold and just be as nice and pleasant as is reasonable. I'm not saying be a pollyanna or Mr./Ms Congeniality. Just don't be pricks or pricketts and maybe, just maybe, they will begin to question those who would turn them against us for their own personal benefit.
  49. 1 point
    I'm still waiting for that, myself!
  50. 1 point
    I deconverted because Satan promised me great wealth and power... lying bastard!