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Everything posted by Geezer

  1. When people will not accept, or even consider, verifiable evidence and facts that challenge their “beliefs” it becomes pointless to engage them.
  2. I’m sorry for your loss and the difficult situation you are now facing. We lost our DIL to cancer a year ago next month. Our family is still mourning her loss. The separation from those we love is the most difficult aspect of death, even though we know our loved ones suffering has ended.
  3. It is scary to think about how easy it is to indoctrinate people, and how many people on this planet are hopelessly brainwashed already. And how many of them are really dangerous people that are willing to kill others in the name of their god.
  4. I’ll give Jesus all the benefit of the doubt. Let’s say his ordeal began the night before he was crucified and the Bible says He hung on the cross for approximately six hours. I’ll give Jesus 24 hours of torment, stress, & physical pain. Truthfully, Jesus execution was suffered by thousands of other people that hung on the their cross much longer. A horrible way to die, no doubt about that, but that method of torture was common and many people suffered it. Because sin supposedly put Jesus on the cross to be crucified, sinners will be tortured forever. How is that fair?
  5. However oil is made it would seem that the process continues to create more oil. Just think about how much gasoline is consumed around the world in one day, and then think about how long we have been extracting oil from the ground. Now add in all the other things we use oil for. Mankind has consumed a gargantuan amount of oil since we figured out all the things it can be used for...or maybe God just keeps on making more oil for us. And only God knows how much oil the Devil uses to keep the fires of Hell burning.
  6. Belief without supporting evidence is simply an opinion. Christianity requires faith precisely because there is no historical evidence that even one word of it is true. The world operates on the laws of science and physics not on faith. And those laws confirm the nonsense found in the Bible is simply not possible. That is why religious faith requires deep indoctrination to obtain it. Surely you you have better things to do than waste you time here.
  7. Geezer


    Nope, we get it. Been there done that ..... got the tee shirt. Welcome, consider this your new home. Leaving your faith is one of the most difficult things anyone will ever do. Lots of help and good information here to help re-enforce your doubt. Most of the folks here know more about Christianity, and it’s false teaching, than those faithful Christians that fill up the pews every Sunday. Take some time and just read the board. So much good information on this site but it takes some time to absorb even a little bit of it. Many of the folks here have been studying and researching the origins and evolution of the Bible and the Christian faith for years. Some are former Preachers, Elders, Deacons, Bishops, & Christian educators with graduate level degrees in theology. Welcome aboard, so glad your found this site.
  8. Christians have historically “interpreted” scripture in ways that confirm their own groups beliefs & traditions. Some versions allow female pastors/ministers by interpreting scripture that prohibits female preachers as “cultural” rather than a command from God. There are versions of Christianity that openly accept gay members & Pastors. I assume they have “interpreted” scripture in a way that allows them to be receptive to the gay community. Christianity is nothing if not flexible. Cherry picking scripture is as old as Christianity itself. If a person can’t find a version of Christianity they like, then they really haven’t put much effort into their search.
  9. Dr. Robert M.Price, Hermann Detering, David Fitzgerald, & Dr. Richard Carrier convinced me that it is more likely, rather than less likely , that both Jesus and the Apostle Paul were literary figures not real people. I also found sufficient evidence that convinced me the Gospel Story itself was fictional. After years of study and research it became obvious to me that Christianity is a manmade religion and the Bible is simply a collection of theological myths. Therefore, no version of Christianity appealed to me. Atheism was my only alternative.
  10. This site contains a lot of information, but it’s difficult and confusing to navigate and find what you are specifically looking for. If that is true for folks that have been active on this site for years, it must be a nightmare for folks that are new to the site. But then again I’m an old fart and not particularly computer savvy. There is an amazing amount of good information on this site though and I’m continually finding new stuff.
  11. The question that begs an answer is what was the original source for these oral stories? Dr.Richard Carrier, IMO, makes the best case that I’ve heard for the Gospel being a mythical story. In other words somebody just make up the Jesus story and it caught on and then became an oral tradition. That isn’t so far fetched because there were already numerous dying/rising God/men stories already in circulation. The Jesus story could easily have been a modified version of anyone of these other existing stories.
  12. The purpose for the doctrine of a final Judgement day is to scare the hell out of the faithful and to make sure they understand it simply isn’t possible to do enough or give enough to make it to heaven,...but that doesn't mean they shouldn’t do more and more and more hoping they might squeeze enough good works in to barely make the final cut.
  13. The Church of Christ, that I was unfortunately a member of for way too long, interprets the Bible as literally as possible. Tithing was Old Testament Law, but Christians are under the New Covenant because the Law had been nailed to the cross. Tithing is OT Law the New Covenant says to give as you have prospered. In the c of C that was interpreted to mean give as you believe God has blessed you financially (In other words 10% is the bare minimum and does not reflect giving as you have prospered). No one actually said that, but people understood that’s what it really meant.
  14. Just to muddy the water a little more. Apologist generally date the Gospels from AD 50 to AD 90. Historians favor dating the Gospels from sometime after AD 70 to AD 125 + or - a few years. Pauls’s Epistles were not “discovered” until the second century by Marcion. That has led to speculation that Marcion was the author of Paul’s Epistles. Historians know for certain that Marcion and Simon Magus created a Gnostic version of Christianity that was the most popular version for quite some time; and many present day denominations continue to embrace that concept. Believers that favor salvation by faith thru grace not of works prefer Marcion’s theology. Since no writings prior to the second century have apparently survived that has opened the door to a lot of speculation. It also must be considered that there were other stories about dying and rising God/men that came to save their people, long before the Jesus story appeared on the scene. The Jesus story wasn’t unique.
  15. In Dr. John Dominic Crossan’s book, The Birth of Christianity, he concluded oral tradition could not possibly have been accurate for a long list of obvious human characteristics and flaws. Even though great effort was made in ancient times to memorize stories they become flawed and inaccurate over time due to normal human frailties.
  16. I’m sorry MOHO, I sincerely wish that was not true, but something registered with us and we were able to turn on our brains back on....so there is hope.
  17. Anyone ever play the game of Telephone? That might shed some light on how accurate oral tradition might be. Now add decades, even centuries, of transmitting these stories orally? It’s likely any resemblance to the original story would be an accident. Even written copies are subject to changes, edits, and redactions over time as well as being lost or destroyed.
  18. Religious indoctrination is so good and effective believers simply do not see the things you’ve listed. The indoctrination process has effectively turned their critical thinking skills and their brains normal cognitive dissonance responses off. And it’s difficult, to the point of being almost impossible, to turn their brains back on. Group think now controls them. They have essentially become programmed robots.
  19. Born again Christians do not think logically or rationally nor do they respond to evidence that challenges their “beliefs”. They believe historians and scientist are controlled by Satan, so therefore everything they say is the Devil speaking through them to deceive believers so the Devil can steal their souls. I have found it virtually impossible to have an intelligent conversation with a born again Christian fundamentalist. They are part of a cult and therefore only respond to other cult members. The only possible way this woman could ever be romantically interested in you would require you to become a member of her fundamentalist cult, but because the only scriptural divorce fundamentalist recognize is one based on adultery. And since both of you are divorced both divorces would have had to be based on adultery for the church to accept them as scriptural. Otherwise you both both would be living in sin and that would be unacceptable. I see little or no hope that you two will ever be able to have a romantic relationship again.
  20. A major problem in determining the historical accuracy of scripture and the Christian faith is that writings prior to the second century have been lost and or destroyed. Therefore, there are no eyewitness recordings of anything. All the “evidence” that exists is hearsay and therefore unreliable. Based on the information available I lean towards the probability that it is more likely, rather than less likely, that the Gospel story is just that....a fictional story and that would make the characters in that story fictional too. I think that also applies to Paul and his Epistles. The real authors of the Epistles created Paul as their fictional author. The surviving evidence suggest that Marcion and Simon Magus created the Christian religion using the fictional Gospel story as their inspiration. Marcion’s Churches were originally the most popular Christian Church until the Catholic Church excommunicated him. And when Christianity became the official religion of the Roman Empire the Catholic Church ruled unopposed for centuries building up tremendous wealth and power. I think the probabilities indicate Christianity is based on a mythical story, with a mythical God/man hero, that came to save the world, and thanks to the Roman Empire it remains the most popular religion in the world today.
  21. Just a note, all scholars do not accept that Paul was a real person. The Fabricated Paul by Hermann Detering & The Colossal Apostle by Robert M Price are two examples of scholarly works that question whether the Apostle Paul was a real person. I think both noted authors present a strong case for Paul being a literary character. The alternative is that Marcion and Simon Magus wrote the Pauline Epistles and were the real creators of Christianity. Obviously the mentioned books would have to be read to become familiar with the evidence they present and then the reader will have to decide for themselves.
  22. Good video, thanks for bringing it to my attention.
  23. My journey out of religion has been completed but I stumbled on these videos and have invested hours watching them. They are the best I’ve ever encountered about why Christianity, or any religion, isn’t true. The creator of these videos is a clinical psychologist and he is amazing. I’m not going to link them just go to You Tube and in the search box type in Theramin Trees. You will find he has made a video for just about any question people ask about religion. These videos are truly excellent. It’s like gettin free therapy session for why leaving religion is the right choice. I will note he grew up in a religious fundamentalist home. I can can also recommend videos produced by Recovery From Religion. They have some excellent videos too.
  24. Geezer


    Welcome.I’m certain you will find this site helpful. Another good place to find help dealing with religious people is Recovering from Religion. They have a lot of good You Tube videos too.
  25. That is precisely the problem. Sex feels good, it’s pleasurable. Anything that feels good and gives pleasure must be sinful. I thought everyone knew that. The sight of a beautiful naked woman incites a man to lust for her. Therefore, beautiful naked woman are sinful. That implies the human body is sinful and thus sex is sinful. A basic truth of life. If it’s fun then it’s sinful or illegal and probably both. Religion is all about being miserable and feeling guilty all of the time.
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