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  • Still have any Gods? If so, who or what?
    Quoth the raven, nevermore

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  1. Wester - thanks for the advice. I'll definitely look up the argument diagram you referenced. Illusion - I agree with what you're saying. Quid pro quo. I actually suggested that the other day, but it sorta backfired as she asked if I was trying to 'convert' her to my way of thinking. I guess what it comes down to is this. I don't understand....not in the LEAST...someone not even being willing to consider the idea that maybe - just MAYBE - the religion they've been spoon fed since they left the womb could be based on a lie. Now granted...it took me better than 30 years to look into it for myself, but that's jsut because I never questioned it (thank you, brainwashing). But once I thought to question it, it became and all consuming passion to get at the TRUTH (a word Xians love to throw around). I guess maybe to admit that is to admit that you were gullible enough to believe a thinly veiled fairy tale. Hey - I don't like to admit that either, but I bought it hook, line and sinker. Not anymore.
  2. So I spent the lousy 99 cents and downloaded a copy of Why I Believed on my iPad. What a great book. I'm having a hard time putting it down. Dawkins and Sagan are going to have to wait for now.
  3. BAA - nope, not me. I've never been to christianforums.com. RR - this sounds like a book that's right up my alley. I'm fortunate that the friendships I've made in Xian circles are with good human beings - not judgemental, bible-beating bigots like so many on this site have come across. So the idea of a book that would be both beneficial for me to read, as well as being mild enough so as not to offend a believer (like my wife) that I may want to have read it - sounds great!
  4. Florduh - I honestly don't think it would come to that, but point taken. Our marriage was built on mutual love and respect...not religion (even if it was a prerequisite at the time). Mcdaddy/Ellwood - I will be using the don't blame me, blame God argument. Love it. Point of clarification for me, as I haven't told my full story. My wife's father is a retired pastor - as conservative (GARBC) and intolerant as you can possibly be. Also, we have 4 kids, so that factors into all of this as well.
  5. I agree with all that. I guess ultimately, my marriage trumps my belief (or lack thereof) in Christianity. While I wouldn't be dishonest with my wife, I'd sooner show up every Sunday and keep my mouth shut than to risk losing my marriage. I love my wife very much, and we have a great relationship. Just feel - like so many others whose stories I've read on this site - like I'm between a rock and a hard place.
  6. Thanks TrueFreedom and Geezer. As to denomination, it was a non-denominational church. Not super conservative by any stretch, but they definitely believe in the inerrancy of the God-inspired Bible. And your (Geezer) point is valid - it's his job, so there's not much chance that he'd look at it objectively. Even if he didn't believe it himself, I don't think he'd admit it--though I'm sure he does. Again, I wouldnt' be going in order to suckle wisdom from his teet, but rather would be doing it for my wife. I'm sure it would be an 'agree to disagree' outcome, with no hard feelings on either side.
  7. Hey all – I’m new to the site. Been ‘lurking’ for a month or two, and I’ve found a ton of great info. Not quite ready to bang out my Extimony just yet, but…eventually. In any event, I have a few questions, and was hoping for some advice. First off, I’m reading a ton right now. Currently have Sagan’s ‘Demon Haunted World’, Dawkins’ ‘God Delusion’ and Wright’s ‘Evolution of God’ on loan from the library. Wondering if anyone has other suggestions in this genre. Another “book” I read recently is Citsonga’s letter to his parents. Unbelievably well written. The epitome of someone who thinks critically, and uses logic and reason to their fullest extent. I printed it off and gave it to my wife to read (she’s halfway through). She’s not there yet, and may never be. I’ve gotten to where I’m at over the course of a couple years. I can’t ask her to make the same journey in a couple months. In any event, she wants me to talk to the pastor of another church (that used to be at our church years ago). He’s a great guy (reasonable, intelligent, and not at all in-your-face), and I wouldn’t mind talking to him, but I know he won’t have answers to my questions. I guess that kind of feels good…to be in a place where I’ve now seen both sides of this, and I’m confident that I’ve arrived a the proper conclusion. But my question is, does anyone else have experience talking to a pastor like this? I’d be doing it because I love my wife, and she’s asking…not because I’m still seeking. Just not sure what the outcome would be. Thoughts? Thanks again for all the useful info.
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