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TABA last won the day on April 9

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About TABA

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  • Birthday September 24

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  • Location
    West Virginia
  • Interests
    Life, the Universe and Everything
  • More About Me
    From childhood Catholic to lukewarm conservative Christian. But now the spell is broken. I've come to realize I was probably always an atheist by nature.

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  • Still have any Gods? If so, who or what?

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  1. This is timely: a brand new debate between WLC and Roger Penrose... https://www.premierchristianradio.com/Shows/Saturday/Unbelievable/Episodes/Unbelievable-Sir-Roger-Penrose-and-William-Lane-Craig-Debating-God-and-the-Universe
  2. Not as bad as it might be then, fortunately. This reminds me of something most people don’t realize: it’s actually rather rare for children to be abducted by strangers. It’s almost always somebody related to the child somehow.
  3. Mr Spock would tell you that humans are easily swayed by emotion and sometimes astonishingly resistant to reason and logic. And not just in the area of religion and theology.
  4. Devout Christians are overwhelmingly resistant to reason coming from outside. Those of us who left the faith are here only because at some point we cracked open the door ourselves and reason got a foot in the door. But that door has to be opened from inside. How that happens varies. Many Christians have to deal with their belief that non-Christian loved ones (or even likable strangers) appear to be headed for Hell and all that that entails. That’s a hard thing to deal with it. That can cause some to start to question. Others stretch Christian doctrine almost beyond recognition to allow for people they care about to escape the fire: “at the end of the day, only God knows who is saved and I know he’s a loving, just God”. That works for some. But for others a big crack appears in the structure. I’ve seen a good many Christians concede that there are some troubling issues with Christian doctrine and with scripture, only to say “I choose to believe anyway”. They tend to be rather liberal Christians, and rather harmless. Fundamentalists can’t afford to admit to any contradictions or dilemmas, because then the whole basis of fundamentalism would collapse.
  5. My main response would be is that it’s important to distinguish between people who just drift away from Christianity and theism without explicitly rejecting the theology, and those of us who thought long and hard before rejecting it. The former group might be retained or drawn back with the right kind of music, fellowship, etc, but not the latter.
  6. Welcome Moonobserver! (Fun Fact: ‘astronomer’ can be rearranged to read ‘moon starer’ ) While I’m personally neither a Theist nor a Deist, your version of Deism seems much more appealing than theism or most religions for sure. Being free of dogma is a big plus. Anyway, welcome and I hope you’ll tell us more about yourself and your deconversion process - assuming you were once a Christian.
  7. TABA

    Good news

    I’d love to think that people were leaving Christianity - and other theistic religions - because of critical thinking which they would be expected to carry over into other areas of their lives. Like the fine people who inhabit Ex-Christian.net. But I suspect that’s not the case often enough.
  8. Hi Danny, Welcome to our community: I'm glad you introduced yourself. I'm so sorry for the anguish and heartbreak you've been through. It breaks my heart when I see two people, who by all rights should be together, forced apart by religious dogma. I see it again and again, and it's all so unnecessary. You've seen how being immersed in religious faith can make a person resistant to reason and evidence. We've often referred to the Faith Virus: it really does take over part of the mind and keep a person from evaluating religious claims the same way they would evaluate other things. As well as the emotional ordeal you've been through, you've also been on quite a journey intellectually. Your arrival at atheism (most of us consider ourselves agnostic atheists) is very typical, and I'm convinced it is almost always the eventual outcome when religious claims are evaluated with an open mind. I know it will be a good while before you are over the pain, but I think your life will be better for having made this journey. I hope you feel at least a bit better after having shared your story here. You are certainly among friends: this is a very supportive group of people. Again, I'm so sorry for what you've been through. We're here for you, and I look forward to hearing more from you. All the Best, TABA
  9. I don’t think I saw any arguments that were new to me, but then I’ve encountered a LOT in the past six years or so, through my reading, podcasts and being around here. Some arguments I was uncomfortably aware of even when I was a Christian. I learned a lot more during my deconversion process, and still more since then. All part of the process of gaining intellectual immunity to Christianity. I’ve wondered why they let you go on for so long, and then why they stopped you when they did. I’m sure they were taking flak for allowing you on in the first place. Maybe they thought God would give them the tools to reduce you to a slobbering mess, or to reconvert you, or at least make you go away. The wide range of arguments that you presented must have been alarming. Plus you didn’t fit the stereotype of the venom-spitting atheist. I honestly can’t see the upside for them in allowing it. Again, good work!
  10. TABA

    Hello to all.

    PMFJI, but isn’t it still generally accepted that the universe had a definite beginning, i.e. the Big Bang? “The Big Bang theory is the prevailing cosmological model for the observable universe from the earliest known periodsthrough its subsequent large-scale evolution.” https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang
  11. TABA

    Hello to all.

    Also regarding our friend @bornagainathiest, according to Christians he is now either burning in Hell or has simply been annihilated because of his “rebellion”, depending on which Christians you ask. And yet, strangely, his words have been allowed to live on to inspire and motivate the rest of us to carry the torch, encouraging others along the same path. Seems careless of a deity, if you ask me.
  12. I’m up to page 30 of 46 so far. Given limited time, I had to skim through some parts, especially the scripture passages offered to you by the believers. I have to say Well Done, Spectrox; I doubt that anybody could have done a better job than you did. I admire the care, energy and time you took to read and respond to the great many posts, and your consistency in following your own rules of conduct. I do think the people who hang out in those forums are the ones most resistant to any questioning of their beliefs, however, so I wonder how much good you were able to do. I think the broader population of less committed theists would be much more inclined to listen to and think about objections to Christianity, especially when presented as politely and respectfully as you’ve done here. If nothing else though, you gained the grudging respect of some of the Christians, possibly the first time some of them have had dialog with an atheist, and that helps all of us in some way. Anyway, good work and I look forward to reading the rest of it! By the way, I hope you’ll engage with Christians in our Lions Den sometimes. Not to deconvert them but rather to keep the arguments against Christianity front and center for our ever-present audience of lurkers. Cheers, TABA
  13. Indeed. As @Joshpantera in particular has often pointed out, Christianity in general, and Protestantism and Fundamentalism in particular, offers a particularly weak and ultimately unsatisfying form of spirituality.
  14. TABA

    Hello to all.

    Hello WalterP and a warm welcome to our community! I think you’re going to be a valuable addition to the group and I look forward to hearing from you on a regular basis! I’m GLAD your introduction is as long as it is: I love it when new people join us and especially when they tell us about their background, both in Christianity and their journeys away from it. It also occurred to me while I was still in the faith that the benefits of being Christian or theist were indistinguishable from effects that can be created entirely within the human mind. Believers do good and believers do bad, just as non-believers do. Believers succeed and fail, just as any human does. There’s no doubt that theistic faith has motivated people to achieve great things (also horrific things, needless to say), but I concluded as you did that it’s all faith and no God. I wish I had known BAA as well as some of us here were fortunate enough to have known him. But how fortunate we are that the thoughts of this mortal atheist are still available after his death to you and me. There really is a form of life after death. I’m interested in science and cosmology too, but I’m not nearly as well-informed or as articulate as some others around here. Anyway WalterP, welcome again, congratulations on the journey you’ve made, and thank you for joining up and sharing with us!
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