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Christopherhays last won the day on August 30

Christopherhays had the most liked content!

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About Christopherhays

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    classic cars and motorcycles, football, photography.
  • More About Me
    I was homeschooled through high school by an extremely legalistic Baptist church, stuck around through college, and now I’m finally “ex-Christian” :)

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  • Still have any Gods? If so, who or what?
    I’m Agnostic

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  1. My best friend had his entire family, pastor, and community telling him that the God he loved would send him to hell if he didn’t repent and try to change. They put him through countless counseling sessions over the years and he repented continuously but couldn’t change. He was driven to complete hopelessness because he believed the ridiculous dogma that he was raised to believe. You’re going to tell me that was all his choice and you wearing a cross necklace isn’t a choice? This is why I get upset. You repeatedly exaggerate you’re own persecution but refuse to recognize the persecution of others! Yes I think it’s horrible that you can’t wear the necklace. It’s not a pissing contest and all persecution is horrible. Just don’t belittle other people’s hardships and expect me to sympathize with you.
  2. He said Christians are persecuted worse than anyone else. I told a story of my best friend who was persecuted and driven to suicide by Christians. He defended the Christians in this story and said ‘the real persecution is when I can’t wear my cross necklace.’ He also said he chose Christianity because of its moral superiority but ignored everyone’s questions about Christian morality. I haven't talked to any other Christians on this site so I can’t comment on that but if I got a little heated I do apologize. It’s just frustrating when someone deliberately ignores the tough issues.
  3. Its so typical for Christians to never take accountability. Are you seriously going to sit here and say that Christians don’t persecuted anyone? “Did they execute him for his sexuality” well if they did it would’ve been biblical! “If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They are to be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.” Leviticus 20:13 you say he should’ve left the community like it’s that simple. I choose being homeless rather than stay in the community. It’s not an easy decision and he never doubted the faith like I did. He never slept with a man either. He was a good Christian who struggled with same sex attraction and went to years of church therapy that tried and failed to “fix” him. ‘Where does it say to throw your kids out if they aren’t Christian” how about the 50 times it says “expel the wicked from amount you” even the New Testament says to expel the wicked. My family didn’t kick me out either. My dad called me the greatest of all fools for doubting god and then stopped talking to me. My brother tried to expel a demon that was apparently living in me. My mom would cry every single day and audibly pray for me to change. They wouldn’t eat meals with me anymore and stopped inviting me to things when they went out. The anxiety of living there was so horrible for my health that I chose to leave. This isn’t a pissing contest. I’m not going to complain that I’m worse off than anyone else. But I won’t sit hear and listen to someone complain about Christian persecution without pointing out the hypocrisy. I have a good friend that’s a missionary in China and my brother is a missionary in the Middle East. I know the persecution is real and it’s horrible. But how about a little accountability? Can you tell me the church should stop trying to change homosexuals? I’ve asked 4 times and you haven’t even said that slavery, rape, murder, and infanticide are wrong!
  4. Yes all persecution is wrong but don’t act like Christians are worse off than the rest of us. I was homeschooled for 18 years so my family could force feed me their choice dogma. I left a month after turning 18 to live on the streets! I was left scientifically illiterate, socially unprepared, completely broke, and without a friend in the world... that’s what Christianity has done for me. I still live in a car as I crawl out of the ditch I inherited! Persecution starts when people don’t accept other perspectives and opinions. No one is less accepting than Christians. They are literally throwing out their own children because they disagree with the dogma! My best friend growing up committed suicide because our community couldn’t accept his same sex attraction. After so many failed attempts to make him “normal” he lost hope. that’s what Christianity is doing! Forgive me if I don’t feel so sympathetic when you all whine about what’s unfair.
  5. Just yes or no. Are slavery, murder, rape, and infanticide wrong? Do you support the Israelites participation in these practices?
  6. Lol you may be on to something. I just saw him in another thread talking about how badly Christians are persecuted
  7. Did we scare @Masihi away? I thought we were making progress lol
  8. @Masihi I’ve asked 3 times why you think Christianity is more moral than Islam. You’ve clearly stated that homosexuality is always wrong but can you equally state that slavery, rape, murder, and infanticide are wrong?
  9. I have soooo much to say to this lol... I’ll try to be as brief as possible. So the early church would put oil on people to heal sickness? And now your priests are drawing cross pictures on babies foreheads and eyelids... both of these practices are ridiculous! Don’t you think if prayer healing and oil actually did something than hospitals would use it? Do you pray and poor oil on stuff when you’re sick or do you see a doctor? These practices are actually scientifically proven to be ineffective. I’ve seen people kneel in front of a painting and pray to some unrealistically depicted dead guy. Sure I know he thinks he’s praying to some saint but in reality he’s praying to a painting. “Jerusalem was sacked and attacked way more times than Babylon” exactly! It’s almost like their gods were more effective . My point is god could’ve preserved things so we could have evidence but he didn’t. “There is no such thing as blood magic and by the way you seem to have a lack of understanding...” I understand perfectly and yes you’re entire theology is based off blood magic. “The blood of goats and bulls and the ashes of a heifer sprinkled on those who are ceremonially unclean sanctify them so that they are outwardly clean.” “In fact, the law requires that nearly everything be cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.” (Hebrews 9:13 & 22) You’re saying I’m choosing to go to hell instead of heaven? Provide one piece of evidence that such places exist and then I can make my choice. Otherwise you’re basically saying ‘you choose to be killed by fairies because you didn’t ask the unicorns for help.’ I don’t want to go to hell or be killed by fairies. If you can convince me these are real threats I promise I’ll seek salvation. “I’d also ‘like’ to mention Christianity historically never had and still has no criminal laws” this is a ridiculous statement! Organized Christianity burnt literally thousands of people at the stake for being heretics, witches, scientists etc. “in Islam there’s no concept of separation of church and state” separation of church and state isn’t in the Bible either! The first church didn’t have power in the state, once they gained power they started selecting kings, forcing religious practice, and sentencing people to death. The fact that there was “no concept of separation of church and state” is why the reformation happened! “I could go over certain biblical passages with you...” okay let’s start with Deuteronomy chapters 20 & 21. I’m especially concerned with the wartime rules on slavery, rape, murder, and infanticide. All of which are commanded or endorsed. Finally, I doubt either you or st Gregory know the truth. You’re making guesses and reading ancient books. The real truth is found by testing, observing, and experiencing the world. I’ve tried very sincerely to observe, experience, and test the claims of god, and the truth I’ve found is that everything exists exactly as it should if your god doesn’t exist.
  10. So I was trying to post an answer in the ‘ex-Christian spirituality’ thread (or something like that) and there’s no option for me to post a reply. No reply button and no text box at the bottom of the screen. Am I missing something?
  11. @Masihi how do you deal with the morality of the Bible? Murder, slavery, rape etc. as I mentioned in my last comment. If you were concerned about the morality of Islam why aren’t you concerned about Christianity?
  12. Okay I don’t trust the early apostles at all... you have faith that god told them to put oil on babies and pray to paintings, I don’t have faith in that. I’d need better evidence than “3rd century John Doe did it” before I started swinging around incense and chanting nonsense. I agree that the Bible is well preserved compared to some things... but it’s also horribly preserved compared to others. The code of Hammurabi for example is older than Moses and multiple accounts of it still survive from Hammurabi’s own lifetime! Meanwhile Moses’ Ten Commandments are preserved out of order on a first century goatskin. No one claims the Odyssey is the word of God. If God inspired something why wouldn’t he preserve it? You left Islam because it was morally questionable? Please apply that same critical thinking to the Bible. God commands the killing and enslavement of woman and children multiple times in the Bible. He gives one city the option of being slaves or murdered. Another city he says to kill everyone except the virgins who you can take home and rape. Still another city he says to kill every man, woman, child and animal. Your god will cause me to be tortured forever because I don’t have faith in blood magic. What amount of finite crimes deserves infinite torture? If my worst enemy were lit on fire I’d feel morally responsible to try and help them. God on the other hand is tossing good people into lakes of fire to be burned forever. can you say that it’s immoral to rape, enslave, and murder people? If you have to skirt around those issues but you firmly know that homosexuality and doubt are evil, than what good is your morality.
  13. I totally agree with you! Jesus never wrote a thing! It’s extremely doubtful that anyone who knew him wrote anything either. The gospels are not eye witness accounts. Paul lived at the same time and same place as Jesus and somehow never met him? Who actually knew Jesus? Jude is a forgery and not helpful anyway. James is probably a forgery but it’s about morality not history anyway. Luke calls peter and John ignorant and illiterate yet they allegedly wrote books in complex foreign languages? If the source to a gospel is Peter or Mary than why not say so? People in Ancient Greece did name sources when writing history, they didn’t when writing fiction. None of this is even relevant though, because even if eye whitenesses did write something we don’t have it. The earliest writing of the gospels that survives is a tiny scrap of John dated to 150ad. Over three lifetimes after Jesus lived! My church believed over half the books of the New Testament were written by Paul. If you recognize that most of these are forgeries than you’re on the right track! The early Christian church that brought us the Bible was forging books all the time! There’s dozens of gospels assigned to different eye whitenesses and they’re all fake. The apostolic tradition that says to rub oil on babies eyelids and all the other nonsense is a human tradition! What’s the difference between the Pharisees washing their hands before a meal and some bishop putting ash on his face? They’re both human traditions. If Jesus put a stop to the beneficial tradition of washing hands he would stop the other nonsense.
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