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TEG last won the day on November 13

TEG had the most liked content!

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About TEG

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    Photography, coding, ancient philosophy, fretted instruments, Spotify.
  • More About Me
    Ex-fundamentalist, raised in the christian churches/churches of christ.

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  • Still have any Gods? If so, who or what?

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  1. I used to tell people that I am an atheist. A common response was, “You mean you are an agnostic”; and I would say, no, I mean atheist. Then I would have the talk with them that every agnostic, like every other person on earth, is either a theist or an atheist; and sometimes I would get into active vs. passive atheism. Now, to save all that, I just say that I am not a believer. I think it is a better description.
  2. This has got to be a joke, or else someone just being stupid on purpose. Moses and Elijah represent the law and the prophets. The Matthew passage continues on: Jesus answered and said to them, “Indeed, Elijah is coming first and will restore all things. But I say to you that Elijah has come already, and they did not know him but did to him whatever they wished. Likewise the Son of Man is also about to suffer at their hands.” Then the disciples understood that He spoke to them of John the Baptist. [Not Mohammed, not the Quran.] I don’t know why anyone would continue to argue with someone like this. I don’t know why I am even posting this.
  3. Looks like you have a decision to make: go on like this, or make a change. p.s. You aren’t telling him the truth; how do you know he is telling you the truth?
  4. I specifically am not interested in a unique personal experience; if I had a vision that no one else had, I would think I was hallucinating. I do not think it is too much to ask for god, the holy spirit, whatever, to reveal himself to all mankind, in a way that convinces us of the truth. A bible that makes sense would be a good start; believers who are truly transformed by said holy spirit and do not fight academic or literal wars with each other would be a nice touch; maybe a miracle or two, like in the bible. (Like what I posted before.) As it is, why should we believe in YOUR god as revealed in YOUR scripture, rather than any other god or any other scripture? My understanding of your entire argument is, believe what I believe because I say you should. (And if you don’t, you’re arrogant, unintelligent, emotionally damaged, dishonest heathen.) My guess is that you do not believe in Zeus. If so, you can understand why we do not believe in your triune god.
  5. I still want to believe in . . . something. I grew up expecting eternal life, heaven, etc. and it was depressing to realize that this is it. But wanting something doesn’t make it true.
  6. A lot of clergy don’t believe in god. One in 50 Anglican clergy in the UK believes God is merely a human construct, according to a new survey today. Just eight in ten believe there is a personal God and a further three in 100 believe there is some spirit or life force. https://www.christiantoday.com/article/one-in-50-clergy-dont-believe-in-god/42082.htm Archbishop of Canterbury admits doubts about existence of God https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/sep/18/archbishop-canterbury-doubt-god-existence-welby Are you a religious professional who no longer believes in the supernatural? Have you remained in vocational ministry, secretly hiding away your non-belief? http://clergyproject.org/
  7. Are you sure it wasn’t because of the baptists’ totally wrong view of baptism?
  8. Jesus was an apocalyptic preacher and miracle worker whose goal was to reform judaism and the nation. (“I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel.”) Peter’s sermons in the book of Acts describe him as a man who was elevated to the right hand of god after his resurrection. As the gospels were written, he became the son of god at his baptism (Mark), then at his virgin birth (Matthew and Luke), then he became a pre-existent creator (John, and some references in the epistles). It was not clear to the early church whether or not christianity was something new, or just a super-judaism that still required circumcision etc. It was the apostle Paul who turned it into a universal religion, free of the old testament law. Christians were persecuted by the Romans for rejecting the Roman gods until Constantine altered the course of history by adopting the cross as his battle emblem; acceptance of the christian religion followed. Then, as the state religion, Constantine wanted uniformity and standards, hence the first council of Nicaea, and all the subsequent councils that invented things like the trinity, and picked the books that became the official bible. So in a sense, the Romans invented what most people today call christianity. It has come a long way from what christ taught. Believers call it “progressive revelation”; I call it “making it up as you go along.”
  9. Been there, done that. Still do. I am open to the idea. But as I have posted before, there is no universal human religion. If there were some sort of real god or spiritual world that was accessible to man, there would be some universality to religion. We all see the same moon; why don’t we all see the same god? Anyone in the world doing simple experiments would come up with the same acceleration due to gravity, or the same pythagorean theorem. Kids peeking through knotholes at a baseball game may see it from different angles, but they would all describe the same game. But religions are as diverse as mankind, because they are the products of man’s mind, not the result of divine revelation or spiritual discovery. If I saw something that convinced me otherwise, I really would change my mind. (I am talking about finding a religion that is really “true.” If what you are looking for is a church, religion, new age philosophy, etc. that just feels good, by all means do it.) p.s. That was my 100th post; I am now a “Thinker.”
  10. Here are some things that would make a difference to me. And I mean this in all sincerity, because this is exactly the kind of thing that I thought about long and hard before leaving the fold. Better evidence in the bible. After his resurrection, Jesus could have walked into downtown Jerusalem and talked to Pilate and company, leading the Romans and secular historians to document it more firmly as a historical fact. (Of course you could still argue the swoon theory.) But the appearances in the gospels and acts were just to a few, and believers at that. Paul says he appeared to 500 people at once; who were these people, why did no one else ever mention it, and could they not have included someone like Pilate or Josephus? The gospels also say that during the crucifixion, there were 3 hours of darkness, and an earthquake opened the tombs and many dead people were raised. Where is THAT in Josephus or any other secular historian? Nowhere. The gospel writers made it up. As it is, I do not know of anything that would convince me otherwise. The creator of the universe could have revealed the true nature of the solar system to the author of Genesis. It would have been a weird story of a spherical earth and the other planets revolving around a large distant sun, amid even more distant sunlike stars. Waiting for science to confirm it. As it is, the genesis story is a primitive myth, plain and simple, like those of any other culture. No evidence of any sort of divine revelation. As to the present day, Jesus and some of the prophets performed miracles. Faith healers make people walk again, but when did one ever make a missing limb reappear? Or reassemble the parts of someone killed by a bomb? There have been a number of christian martyrs in the mideast lately; how about a miracle like the hebrew children in the fiery furnace, on video for the whole world to see? Pople John Paul II ascribed his survival of the assasin’s bullet to a miracle, because it wounded him but missed killing him. I am sorry but that is not a miracle, it is one of many possible real-world outcomes. A MIRACLE would have been for the bullet to stop and hover in midair, for all to see, then fall harmlessly to the ground. (Like in the x-men.) These are all things that anyone could see. If I had a vision or some such, that was not linked to any real-world event, I would think I was hallucinating. People in delirium in the hospital see this kind of thing all the time. Real example: a hole opening up in the floor waiting to swallow them. If everyone, including family, friends, and hospital staff had seen and documented this hell hole, I think I would have to acknowledge it. I could go on. Bottom line: if you step back and look at it with unbrainwashed eyes, christianity, like all religions, is a bunch of fairy tales that people actually believe. Sad, but true.
  11. In 20-20 hindsight, if I thought she were in actual danger, I would have told the teacher, or her therapist; one responsible adult; then let it go at that. Not try to be a “helicopter” friend or some sort of savior. Like I said, 20-20 hindsight. Learn from it and move on.
  12. I can understand the conflicted feelings that you are having. If it makes you feel any better, people have certainly done worse. I would: 1) chalk it up to inexperience, and whatever developmental condition that you have; 2) consider it a learning experience; and 3) maybe get some therapy concerning boundaries with other people.
  13. I can’t help noticing that at least 4 of us on this thread are ex-church of christ. Are we well-represented here because it is a particularly toxic church?
  14. It sounds like you have the right idea about your cultlike, phony church. But you haven’t answered the more basic question: do you believe in god, or not? Some people reject the church but still believe in god. Other people, like me, just can’t see any reason to believe in any sort of god, and lots of reasons not to. Until you decide, my guess is that you are going to remain conflicted, anxious, and depressed like you are now, and are going to have a hard time with any sort of recovery.
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