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Everything posted by lunaticheathen

  1. I really hope it was a plain honest mistaken assumption, but really, therapists shouldn't even be concerned with your religious beliefs. It's completely against their own rules. You can't call someone crazy for religious belief, or complete lack of it. Besides, like I said, it shouldn't even be a concern if you are "like any other christian" or not. Shouldn't even be a concern IF you are christian or not. I'd be wary of this shrink, or any shrink that told me /insisted that I was really a christian. If a shrink told me I was "really a christian", I'd fire the bastard. And yes, you can fire shrinks. I've fired a few.
  2. That idea never made sense to me either. And Calvinist predestination. I mean, if everything's already decided, why be moral or worried about who believes at all? Someone once told me that those "destined" to be saved would also already be moral, upright people by default. But, this boy was also Calvinist, and a real jackass. So, who really knows.
  3. Ha ha, you are channeling Ignatius J. Reilly. "I have sought escape in the Prytania (theater) on more than one occasion, pulled by the attractions of some technicolored horrors, filmed abortions that were offenses against any criteria of taste and decency, reels and reels of perversion and blasphemy that stunned my disbelieving eyes, that shocked my virginal mind, and sealed my valve." *squeeeees* I now have an forum-based lit-crush on Vigile for quoting A Confederacy of Dunces. And yes, banning "front hugs" is even more psycho than the fundie school I went to. Creepy.
  4. Marty, your problem reminds me of something my father told me, in regards to a general frustration I seemed to always have with people. "You're smarter than the majority of the population, and that is entirely YOUR problem. Not theirs." See, you are more thoughtful and smarter. But you are the one that has to deal with that info, and the knowledge that most people are ignorant, sometimes very willfully so. It's best to just let go. There will always be stupid people, and, like my dad said, that's your problem, not theirs.
  5. As a pagan, I have often wondered why christians would have such disgust for the "unwashed heathens" while using their symbols and holidays. Even when I practiced christianity, I never harbored ill will towards anyone from another faith. I suppose it's part ignorance, part fear. I dunno, I just keep getting the urge around this time of year to comment "it's not a Jesus tree, you know."
  6. Well, to kind of fill the void of replies, I'll just post my personal experience with this idea. My dad once accused me of studying/practicing pagan things just to piss my mother off. I replied to this with a raised eyebrow, and "Dad...really...you know be better than that. You know I'm not that petty." Being that my dad is generally a very rational dude, he dropped it. Other fundie types who harassed me over the years, especially when I ran a campus pagan group at my uni (in Alabammy no less! GAWD!) have accused me of this, as well as eating cats and babies. But there ya go, generally, it's not a very thought-out argument, in my humble experience.
  7. They also are fabrications of imagination just like other myths and deities. Maybe imagination is bigger than most think. Don't claim to know the truth, just know what I think I know...I think. :-P
  8. The zealous Christians will always cruise to convert "lost souls", no matter what you call yourself. The "ex" issue has been adequately dealt with here, so I won't elaborate on what I see as good points. However, I have been known to hang out in various religion-themed chat rooms on the web, and I can tell you, even when a "positive" qualifier is used for a room, and has nothing to do with Christianity, the christians come...and come...and beat the door down and knock you in the face with the bible. Witnessing is just too important to them to be content with just those who left, or are somehow "negative" about their faith. They invade Jewish rooms, Hindu rooms, Pagan rooms, Buddhist rooms, you name it. Then they pick fights with each other in the Christian rooms. I will mention that the Muslims are hardly better though. As someone who identifies with the pagan label, however loose that is, it doesn't matter if they know that I am also an ex-Christian or not. To the deeply devoted witness, I'm still a non-Christian, and must be dealt with. There is simply no pleasing some people. (note that I am NOT talking about all christians - just the ones who participate in this behavior)
  9. I found myself in pagan beliefs when I shed all the false layers of christianity/general Abrahamism from my beliefs and thoughts. The more I live, the more I believe that I was pagan to begin with. And not just because I love nature, or I like shiny silver stars or anything. It goes far deeper and wide than any "superficial" reason. And perhaps my path leading me to it wasn't filled with pure logical reasoning, but I tend to be an emotional person. It's part of who I am, just as I think being pagan is part of who I am. I was the weird kid who talked to trees. Yes, I really did. I cried when trees were cut down, but found solace in the fact that they would rot and make other life possible. I also accepted at a very young age that I would die, and hoped that my body too would nourish the Earth. I prayed to the Moon. I still love standing in the Moon's light and just letting everything else fade out. I adore the Ocean. I believe both the Moon and the Ocean has spoken to me. As well as forests. I've seen spirits and ghosts. I've talked with dead relatives in dreams, as well as deities, dreaming and waking. I've been called crazy, down right schizophrenic before, and I really don't care. Denying what I heard and knew was far more painful and damaging that listening ever has been. No entity has ever told me to kill myself or others. Nothing I've heard/seen/experienced has ever done anything but encourage me to love more, be more aware, and conserve our beautiful planet. Christianity encouraged me to fear others, hate myself, and despise this world. Which is the real mental illness, really?
  10. I see amazed is interested in making anyone but him "back up" their statements. Anyone who slept through western civ would know that being christian was a matter of life and death at the time his "devout christian scientists" lived in europe. I'm not doing his homework for him, especially since he's more interested in trying to make ID into science, when it's just bad philosophy in a cheap prom tux. He can stay ignorant, however disgusted it makes me.
  11. Like a sailor takes directions from the skies. Yeah, they move, but one can calculate from other, relatively "unmoving" objects. Like I said, I don't think shepherds could do it, but seasoned astronomers, sure. And like I said before, the inclusion of the Magi was most likely a ploy to make the story more credible, if anything.
  12. I wouldn't think to dispute this. Yes. They believed the universe was orderly because the Christian God is a God of order. They also believed there research would bring glory to Him. Do you believe in 6 day creation, or guided evolution? It's not quite clear. I don't know about this. I think its possible to be 6 literal days and yet it could be far longer. Either way i do believe He is behind it all. There is just to much order and complexity to be explained without some kind of vast intelligence and power behind the universe. What do you think? Ok, I think that being a devout Christian as vital to being a great scientist is simply not true. The scientists amazed has named lived at a time when NOT being Christian meant one thing - death. And please don't forget that the Church looked to execute Galileo for his findings, because they weren't exactly what the Church thought of the world! The era before that wasn't called the Dark Ages just because they lost their candles. I believe curiosity made science possible, not due to any belief in a god or some search to glorify him or his "creation." I believe that's making far too many assumptions about men no one here knows personally. And there's no way of knowing if their "belief" guided their research, or if they peppered their studies with mentions of god to just save their necks. In any case, religious belief, these days, is divorced form scientific inquiry. I'm sure there are christian scientists out there, happily digging into what they see as "creation", but I have no doubt that there are also scientists of every other belief and non-belief doing great or greater things. And 6 days? PUH-leeeeeese.
  13. The shepherds "following" the celestial event, whatever it was, does sound rather unlikely, but I can buy the Magi doing so. Simply because they were in fact, ancient astrologer-priests. They would be more likely to pick a direction based on some celestial event, and follow it. But then again, the choice of the Magi was likely just more effective storytelling on the part of the writer. Also, the Magi were pagan.
  14. I didn't chose atheism either. I had no choice; when I began to look at reality versus religion, the whole scheme fell apart and I was basically left with atheism. But, not being omniscient, I could say I'm agnostic, but I don't. The odds of gods, given the way the universe works, seems impossibly small, so for all practical purposes, I'm left with atheism. I like the moon, but it's a rock (with water!). Oh, and Wecome! Thanks for the welcome, everyone. I don't feel like being pagan was a choice for me either, but I suppose that's a whole other topic for another forum. It chose me. In any case, it's better for me than being christian.
  15. Holy shit, he found me out! I left only because I wanted to sin my heathen ass off! OF COURSE! Now I will praise bananas and kiss Kirk Cameron's has-been godly bottom! ...Except no...*giggles* Anyway, I have posted a testimonial on why I left the fold. Basically, because it was driving me insane, making me hate myself for no good reason, and basically made no sense anyway. But, really, if Jesus did die for our sins, shouldn't we get our money's worth? *evil grin*
  16. I'm sure I still have unresolved issues with my bout with christianity - not to mention the other crap that came with it at the school I was in. I still get angry, feel hurt, cry over things long past. But we're all a work in progress. I am certain that being shoved into conservative christianity around puberty is paramount to child abuse, at least on a mental level. It tells you that your sexually awakening body is evil, to be distrusted, and all of your natural urges are filthy, sinful, and evil. Which makes you doubt how good of a person you really are. Which is, of course, complete bullshit. If this god gave you hormones that turn on at this age, why would they be bad? Those are my issues though. I don't know if you have similar ones, but I was hit hard with conservative christianity right at puberty, so those problems were right up front for me. Best of luck with everything.
  17. Not really, Christianity itself doesn't lead to "a massive amount of good" but the charitable institutions and organizations that are built around it. Atheists participate in the same sort of activities just through means that aren't explicitly atheist, as charity and conversely violence are not related to the atheistic viewpoint it is only a statement on your belief in the existence of deities. Well I suppose it's a good thing you are religious then . May I ask how your religion or belief in God prompts you to sacrifice for others? For myself I suppose I give and I sacrifice my own well being for others out of a sense of empathy and compassion. I recognize the similar positions of sorrow and grief we all experience and it moves me to do what I can to ameliorate it in others. I do this specifically because I believe this life is all we have (or at least all I can be sure of us having) so it behooves us to do what we can to make it bearable for everyone, not just ourselves. I sacrifice for others based on my religious convictions that what i do in this life will impact my life in the afterlife. Christ commanded it and i do find it personally rewarding and know that such actions please God in whom i will be held accountable to. If there is no afterlife and any accountablity before God how i live here i would not be that motivated to help many outside my family. Its to costly in time and resources if this is all there is. Wow, so you need someone looking over your shoulder to feel the need to do good? I find that rather childish.
  18. Wow, the physical abuse on top of the mental abuse absolutely seals it. You are certainly being the ONLY reasonable person, as far as I can tell. Fuck that bitch! Seriously! But, you can't tell the others what to do, and I wish you could get your siblings out of that situations. I suppose the best you can do is be with them in the fallout.
  19. So, there seem to be lots of atheists here. I guess that's not too surprising, but as always, I have to be different. I never really considered atheism to be an option, but that's neither here nor there, I suppose. Anyway, I wasn't raised in a particularly religious household, though you wouldn't know it from my mother's reaction to me leaving christianity. I did, however, go to a very conservative christian private school during my junior high years and half of high school. The peer pressure to believe, be like them, and the idea that I was dirty and never good enough, and since my prayers were never answered, I wasn't sincere enough, got to me until I was suicidal, and acted on those impulses. By far not the worst story, I know, but it still sucked. Though it took a "good christian boy" sexually molesting me in the hallway to get me to start questioning my faith. It took a couple of more years and a copy of "Mer de Noms" by A Perfect Circle to fully reject christianity. Yet, my first stop was to join the Bahai faith. I guess I still wasn't comfortable abandoning the Abrahamic idea of god yet. I finally got bored with the "obligatory" prayers where I felt nothing, and found that, as always, I loved talking/praying to the Moon. So I tried out a pagan path. It fit me beautifully. I finally felt like me, and dreamed very vividly of lovely things. It hasn't been all roses, I was certainly disliked in ol' Alabammy for being a "heathen satan worshipper" but all told, I'm far happier with my spirituality now. I'm trying still to resolve my anger against those christians who helped me hate myself, and still battle depression, even 8 years after leaving their poison faith. But me, like my life, is a work in progress.
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