Thumbelina

Believer
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About Thumbelina

  • Rank
    Scared for the lemmings

Profile Information

  • Gender
    Female
  • Location
    Earth, for now :)
  • Interests
    I'm attracted to bothering atheist types atm.
    http://www.provethebible.net/index.htm
  • More About Me
    Curious as to why anyone would want to leave Christ, He's not only Omniscient and loving etc. but pretty cool too :)

Previous Fields

  • Still have any Gods? If so, who or what?
    Yeah, Jesus

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  1. Thumbelina

    Hell no

    There's more I want to say but too tired now. I have to address the child rapist analogy but not now. The person who mentioned it had a good point too.
  2. Thumbelina

    Hell no

    Posted May 31 Pulling more crap out of thin air, I see. The pre-Law stories in the Bible do NOT show the people already having the Law orally. That simply is not how the story goes in the Bible, as anyone who reads it can see. Your dishonesty is mind-boggling. There you have it, folks: More mumbo jumbo from Thumby. Though her style is different from others, the act of going off on tangents instead of actually answering the questions is standard Christian apologetics. If the Christian worldview was true, then they would be able to give direct and sensible answers instead of doing silly dances like this to skirt the subjects. This is the dishonest garbage that we ex-christians have left behind. Sorry, Thumby, but what you're doing here is not demonstrating Christianity to be truth, but rather showing how ridiculous it is. Anyone with half a brain can see that you are failing miserably as a witness for your "God." **************************** When reading the bible one has to be a deep sea diver and not just a mere water skier-- figuratively speaking. You have to prayerfully and humbly study the texts and you'll discover their rich mean in. The Holy Spirit reaches people who are as meek as little children (one can't depend on preconceived ideas to understand scripture). Just because the bible doesn't say the law was not written down before Sinai, it does not mean the law didn't exist. I did say that the aim of the law is loving God, and loving one's neighbor as oneself. Prior to sin the law was basically stated in the affirmative; in Genesis it shows this when God gave Adam and Eve simple commands. First He stated His commands in the affirmative--- of every tree you can freely eat (ahem, freedom to choose) --- and then He stated His command in the negative without giving too much detail and putting ideas in their heads--- of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat ... or you will surely die (more choice). In Galatians 5:22-23 Paul lists the fruit of the Spirit and he wrote that against such-- positive attributes there is no law. In other words, the law is not against right doing. The law points out sin, if it is kept it won't condemn anybody (only Jesus can impart righteousness to sinners though). As created beings sinned and continued to do so, God then had to use some negative language to describe how to keep His law of liberty (James 1:25) and to state the penalties for breaking said law. After Adam and Eve sinned Jesus stepped in to offer GRACE, Jesus told the serpent/Satan, in Adam and Eve's presence, that He would put enmity between him & the woman & between his seed & her seed. After more than 1,000 years of sinning & rebellion Jesus basically reiterated in the last part of the 2nd commandment that there is enmity between Satan's seed & His seed. Satan's seed has God's disapproval & God's seed has His approval. The book of Job mentions God's seed (sons of God) & distinguishes them from Satan which means adversary (see Job 2:1). The sons of God & enmity theme is throughout the bible. Was Job there at Sinai? Even if the law was not stated verbatim like in Exodus 20, the principles have always been there. The law is eternal as God because it shows His holy nature/character. I said what I meant & meant what I said in my post. God had a holy line from the onset of sin, albeit, a minority. Things got really bad for a time so God had to destroy the earth & start over again with Noah & family. Before Sinai the people received the law orally, mainly by prophets : "God who at various times and in different ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets ... " Hebrews 1:1 Also see Numbers 12:6. The fathers passed down the law to their families. Some pre Sinai prophets or patriarchs were Enoch, Noah Abraham, Isaac & Jacob. The gospel is simple & yet the bible is so profound. In Luke 3:23-38 it traces a holy line all the way back to Adam; those people were WILLING to do God's will so He entrusted them with His oracles of truth/law. The law shows what God is like, it is there to be OBEYED so there'll be PEACE in God's universe. Unfortunately, some of the law had to be stated in the negative because a God of love HAS to execute justice. He can never immortalize evil & sin, therefore, the wages of sin is death. He has to get rid of the cancer of sin, & death/hell is the only way to do it. Btw. check out Exodus 16:28 and its CONTEXT; did they get to Sinai YET when God asked what He asked? Throughout the bible God had to basically say what is written in 1 John 2:7. God is EVER reiterating to hard-headed humans-- I know He does it to me. God never changed His covenant, Hebrews 8:8 says God found fault with the people-- always reneging on their promises & backsliding. They were dense & didn't understand that God was coming to die for them/us. When Jesus came it opened more eyes to the truth so the new covenant is that they/we would trust Him to help them/us overcome sin & not trust in themselves/ourselves & therefore, His law will be written on their/our hearts.
  3. Thumbelina

    Hell no

    Have you ever heard about the old covenant & why it failed?
  4. Thumbelina

    Hell no

    At least you don't sound like militant atheist here. Atheism does not offer hope ( live a SHORT life in a devolving, polluted planet) & it limits God (Hebrews 11:6). Believers invite God so they're confident of His care & promises. However, believers should never force or attempt to legislate their beliefs. ... & vice versa for atheists & others.
  5. Thumbelina

    Hell no

    If you add the faith factor then I can say, truer words have never been spoken (2 Timothy 3:15).
  6. Thumbelina

    Hell no

    I had to go back & trace the convo'. You sarcastically asked why I had to apologize for God's failure. I answered that I'm giving an apologetic. Edit: I did give an apology (a regretful acknowledgement of an offense) & an apology (apologetic). I was validating your feelings, man. The apologetic was to show that you have misunderstandings that caused disillusionment (?).
  7. Thumbelina

    Hell no

    There's a thread somewhere in the den that mentioned the simplicity of the Christian religion or some sort of such. It is simple. I said that God's laws always existed, Mr. Sinai was not where it started. Look, the people were in bondage to pagans for centuries & they lost sight of the law of God that was passed down from their fathers. Sinai was basically a reiteration of what they should have known. Satan sinned/lied from the beginning- he's the father of lies- could he have been accused of lying if God's law did not forbid being a false witness? Pharaoh ADMITTED that he sinned against God BEFORE the Israelites left Egypt; could he have sinned if there was no law that he broke? Jesus used the method of asking questions to reason with people; it's a good teaching tool. What should one do if one uses that method with biblical questions that are are posed but the asker won't answer the questions? Again, could God accuse anybody of any sin if there was no law that they broke? If there was no law against wearing neon yellow ribbons in public could a police officer arrest someone just for wearing said ribbons? To rightly understand the bible, precept must be compared to precept. In logic something cannot be true & false at the same time in the same context. Contextualization has been a major problem when trying to understand the bible for many unbelievers. I cannot force them to study it the way it says to (see Isaiah 28:10). However, what is in my power to do is pray that God can give enlightenment through His providence.
  8. Thumbelina

    Hell no

    I'll pray for you, hope you eventually get it. Even though many of you are blasphemous you can be nice & funny too. It'll be a shame for you to lose out on eternity, that way you can be with God & explore the universe & not just speculate about it 😉.
  9. Thumbelina

    Hell no

    I'm sorry, ma'am. I spoke generally. Many people are scared of a fire & brimstone God. Sometimes fear comes out in the form of anger. Maybe on both our parts we shouldn't generalize but use 'many, some or most' in our assertions? Is that a fair compromise? Edit: I retraced the conversation, I did not speak generally. I know some of these conversations may be hard for some but from a Christian perspective, atheists & the like are like that Harry Truman guy who got destroyed by the volcano. We need to sound the alarm at least.
  10. Thumbelina

    Hell no

    In 1 peter 3:15 it says to give an apologetic for the hope we believers have. Did you forget the topic of this thread? 😃
  11. Thumbelina

    Hell no

    The bible simply declares that God exists; its contents, rightly understood, assists in showing the veracity of the claim. I'm sorry, I keep using bible-speak; the bible says taste & see that God is good, I tasted it but you have to taste it for yourself. I already told you that to understand God's love you have to prayerfully search the scriptures. The bible says faith comes by hearing & hearing by the Word of God. Based on the comments here in these forums, & elsewhere, I can see why some people felt disillusioned & then they apostatized-- became ex-Christians.. Many people ARE terrified of hell even though they claim unbelief & disbelief; I spoke to some of them. They were taught that God will burn people forever & ever & ever. If I truly believed the bible teaches that I would abandon God too. The bible says God exalts His Word MORE than His name/title. His Word shows His character; God is interested in others reflecting His character more than Him showing off His omnipotence. God gave those type of scenarios in the bible & the miracles did not change many of them. The people followed Jesus primarily for the food & the miracles (see John 6); they misunderstood His Word & those same people who SAW His miracles shouted crucify to have Him killed. God mostly chooses to use reasoning about the morality of His laws to attract people because He cannot force worship; for people to live with a Holy God they have to be like Him & abhor sin. I'm just trying, in my own way, to explain what I understand based on what the bible teaches.
  12. Thumbelina

    Hell no

    I'm sorry your studies led to disbelief. Just because the bible is descriptive at times does not mean it's being prescriptive.
  13. Thumbelina

    Hell no

    God has an expressed will & a permissive will. You described His permissive will; He gives people up to what they truly want to do, but there are consequences. God has to permit all events. Unbelief limits God (Psalm 78:41). He permits the devils to take over those who reject His grace (Proverbs 8:36). Therefore, the bible describes it as Him sending evil.
  14. Thumbelina

    Hell no

    Ay, you're being a foolish virgin, I can't give you my oil. You can start by RIGHTLY dividing the word of truth.
  15. Thumbelina

    Hell no

    Hello 😃. Red neck said: "In what bible does Leviticus come before genesis? Because god was accusing people of sin long before he ever said a god damn word about any fucking law." Therefore, the chronological order statement was relevant. The law (10 commandments) was written for Moses by God's own hand on Sinai. The law is eternal as God Himself. The added laws, like the ceremonial laws written by Moses, were ADDED because the people were transgressing the perfect 10. The perfect ten was the umbrella over those. The handwriting of ordinances were nailed to the cross but the ten commandments, written in stone, are eternal. The principles are eternal. Genesis 4:7 happened before Moses existed. God told Cain sin lieth at his door. What is sin in that context? Cain did open the door wide to sin, what did he do that was considered sin? Lucifer,-light bearer- became Satan-adversary. The bible uses figurative language, metaphors, analogies etc., a LOT. As God how will you explain to dumb people who do not quite understand the heineousnes of sin & it's origin, when the only frame of reference they have are what they observe? God told Adam & Eve not to eat or they will be like God, knowing good & evil, except their knowledge was experiential. Job, the first book written, mentions Satan. Satan, serpent ... that fiend is a stinker! It seems the oral tradition was possible in those days prior to Moses writing down God's word.