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Margee last won the day on February 1

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About Margee

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    Moderator for Testimonials and Ex-Christian Life

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    Learning how to be an ex-Christian and be comfortable with it!
    This is my 'Please Forgive Me' letter - It is my testimony and I hope it helps someone....You'll have to copy and paste.

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    Hi! I've come to you for a little help. I was a 'Fundi' for 30 years. I took the bible literally. The more I studied, the more questions I had. I became known as the 'pastors worst nightmare'. I asked too many questions. They (the church) continued to tell me just to have faith. It's been 3 years since I've gone to church. Nobody knows how I feel. How do you tell your friends and family that you don't believe anymore?

    It's been a long time coming. It all started when I read Charles Templeton's book,''Farewell To God-My Reasons For Rejecting Christianity''.(He was Billy Grahams dearest friend) His book answered just about every question that I ever asked when I belonged to the church, but they would not answer because they couldn't. I even went as far as having 3 phone conversations with Charles before he died and he sent me his autographed book.

    I have bargained, begged, cried, screamed and 'prayed' for God to give me the 'sign' that 'he' exists and it has not happened. I have prayed to 'him' in agony I've said to 'him', 'Don't you see, you're ready to lose me, don't you care'? I have gone as far as leaving letters to 'him' under my pillow (to reveal himself to me in a dream) so 'he' could see how sincere I am! How's that for being crazy?

    Sincere is what I have been! And I'm darn angry now!

    I started to study websites like 'evil bible.com' and 'Why God won't heal amputees?' I have dabbled with the law of attraction, psychics, astrology, energy fields, and every new age 'thing' a person could try to find a faith that might be more reliable than the christian god.

    If I ever even dreamt that I would be writing this letter.... The girl who studied her bible for years - I would have told you that the devil had complete control of me! I tried and tried and tried to make sense of this for all these years. I have heard horror stories of 'suffering' even within our own community of the church (let alone the whole world) and I always asked this God ; ''Why-Why-Why, can't you do something?? Can you not see what's happening down here? Can't you see how cruel nature can be? Don't you see what all these 'Holy Books' are doing to people down here? Can't you see the rapes, murders - the insanity of it all?''

    How does one deal with the pain of no God? My search is almost over - but - what now? So I don't believe in God anymore.... What now? How does one deal with this? I've read that some of you are 'free'. I don't feel that way. No afterlife - no seeing my only sister who died 13 years ago - no seeing mom or dad? No reward for trying to be so good all these years? How does one deal with this 'Dark Night of The Soul''?

    Thank you so much. Sincerely, Margee

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  1. Well freedwoman, I'll start by throwing in my 2 cents for what it's worth. Lol What you posted is very true, unfortunately. The bible was written by men for men. That's the way it was. Because of their physical strength, they thought they were superior. All of the books lead us to the conclusion that women’s voices were silenced and unwanted by this superior man society. We were the inferior species (according to Genesis, we were just a mans 'helper') and these powerful men could do what they wanted including having concubines and basically doing what they chose. For instance, take the Adam and Eve account, the story of the concubine raped and killed by the Benjaminites, and other 'texts of terror' for women, there are glimpses of women being blamed, raped, and killed throughout the 'holy book'. The male authors of these stories typically show little or no compassion. And now in 2020, the famous saying goes, 'women’s rights are human rights'. Women are entitled to all of the same rights as a man. But still, almost everywhere around the world, women and girls are still denied them, often simply because of their gender and religion. Woman have been fighting for a long time to get these rights. Lots of woman have died trying to free woman. For some men and woman it has caused 'war' between the sexes. I believe it's why tons of relationships don't work anymore. Woman are speaking up, not afraid to leave a bad relationship and are becoming independent knowing that we can now in this day and age, make it on our own. Lots of men are happy for us and lots still aren't. I don't blame men for any of this.Things have just really started to change for woman in the last hundred years. Hopefully men will evolve alongside the woman. I understand that some woman have taken it too far and are actually man haters now. This causes it's own set of problems. My hope is for us all to learn from one another. Most men are (mostly) logical but can also be emotional.... and most woman are (mostly) emotional but can also be logical. We can't help that either. Study the brains of men and woman.The brains are different. We are both men and woman 'wired' differently. Neither can you men help that you are physically stronger than us and have a stronger sexual desire to populate the world. Most woman lose this after baby making time. It is what it is. Blame god.. Hopefully, we can all talk to each other, evolve and learn what it's like being a woman and what it like being a man without any dynamite blowing us both up. Lol
  2. Welcome to Ex-c BookOfMicah! So glad you found us. I loved reading your post (You are an excellent writer!) and I am looking forward to hearing more of your journey!
  3. Margee

    I Am Free

    Welcome to Ex-c freedwoman! So glad you found us! Looking forward to hearing more about your journey!
  4. And @BarnOwl....this is the key above. Before you can allow yourself to be exactly who you are (a loving, kind gay man) you will have to deal with the whole bible first and that may take some time. But we have experts here who can help you so much to figure out what the books are actually saying. I was one of the lucky ones that the whole entire books of the bible came crashing down once I learned the foolishness of the first book of the bible, Genesis. Once I read and saw the craziness of it, the whole house of cards came down for me. Because isn't Genesis the first book to read? The story starts there, right? Well once I decided (with the help of Ex-c) that the god of Genesis was a fable, then I knew we were not born in sin and we did not need a savior. I don't need to know one more thing about the rest of the books that 'man' put together and called the bible. The books have some great knowledge but it was all written by man, not god. But this took me a long time to accept. And I raged for a long time that I had allowed myself to be brainwashed with this story of salvation for years. So you take your time. Things will come together for you because someone is going to say something that makes total sense to you and you will start to become more comfortable with learning some truths about the lie we have been told. You hang in there. We got your back! You will eventually come to truly love yourself. I can't wait to watch you grow! (hug)
  5. I definitely feel connected to the whole earth and universe. I love evolution and I love the fact that we are all just stardust. We are the 'conscious' earth animals. (just a little smarter than other animals! lol) But we can't fly. I wish we could fly!! I love to watch birds. It's all pretty amazing.
  6. BarnOwl, What a great thread. You got some really good things to think about. Everyone on this thread is very aware that most fundamentalist churches believe that homosexuality is a sin. Some are 'softer' on the issue which has been stated on this thread. Also it has been stated for you to not rush or push anything. Go slow. Day by day you will ''see'' something that makes sense to you (remember, you are now forming your ''New World View'') and you will be able to slowing fit the puzzle pieces together. And we can help you do that. I continued to go to church for quite some time even while I was questioning everything and it was scary for me because I didn't know WHAT to believe anymore??? I was in agony. This deconversion is not easy for some people. It wasn't for me. Losing my faith was the single most heart-breaking experience of my life. I WANTED there to be a god. Even when I joined here, I wanted someone to tell me there was a god! So do not feel alone in this journey. You are with people who really do understand the cognitive dissonance you and your brain are going through. Speaking of sin, we better hope that every single soul on the face of this earth is covered under the blood of Jesus! It ain't just homosexuality!! Relax. It will all come together for you. go do something fun! (hug) ................................................................................................... The Official List of Sins (New Testament) Here, as laid out by the Sin book, are the 124 sins listed in the new testament (in alphabetical order). Definitions will accompany those that are not self-evident. Though I may edit it somewhat, all definitions are taken straight from the pamphlet. For those who are interested in context, the pamphlet lists the source of each. I will not list them here, but if you want to know email me. I'll let you know whatever information you need to look it up. Anyway, get out paper and a pencil and see how you measure up! 1. Abusers of Self: Self polluters, having unnatural lusts 2. Adultery (Note: Only for those who have been married) 3. Anger 4. Backbiters: Those whospeak evil of those who are absent 5. Banqueting: A drinking party 6. Becoming a Stumbling Block to a Weak Brother Through Our Liberty: Taking liberty to do things without thinking of the effect on a weaker brother's conscience. 7. Being Angry With One's Brother: Expressing unkind thought or action toward others 8. Bitterness 9. Blasphemy 10. Boasting 11. Brawling 12. Brother Going to Law Against Brother: No definition given, so I'll wing it. Bringing legal action against another. If someone has a better definition, please let me know. 13. Burying our Talents: Not making wise use of what God gave us 14. Calling One's Brother A Fool: Ridiculing another 15. Chambering: Unmarried people living and sleeping together 16. Clamor: Loud, continued noises 17. Complaining 18. Contentious:Quarrelsome 19. Corrupt Communications:Unprofitable or impure language 20. Covenant Breakers: Lightly breaking a solemn or legal pact. 21. Covetousness 22. Craftiness: Cunningness 23. Debate 24. Deceit 25. Defiling the Body 26. Defraud 27. Denying Christ 28. Desiring the Praise of Men: Doing things to gain praise. 29. Despiteful 30. Dishonesty 31. Disobedience to Parents 32. Divisions: Forming splits or schisms in groups 33. Divorce 34. Double Tongued: Making insincere statements 35. Drunkenness 36. Eating the Bread, or Drinking The Lord's Cup Unworthily: Taking communion while living in sin 37. Effeminate: Unmanly or womanish man. 38. Emulations: Ambition to excel 39. Envy 40. Evil Concupiscence: Longing or desire for forbidden things. 41. Evil Eye: Having selfish motives 42. Evil Thoughts: Worthless, injurious, or depraved thoughts 43. Extortion 44. Fathers Provoking Children to Wrath: Frustrating children through harsh treatment and/or failure to communicate. 45. Fearful: Discouraged, anxious, faithless 46. Filthiness 47. Filthy Lucre: Recieving personal gain through unrighteousness. 48. Finding Faults With Others While Having a Greater Fault Ourself 49. Foolishness 50. Foolish talking : Silliness. 51. Giving False Witness 52. Fornication 53. Giving Offense: Causing another to fall spiritually by our example. 54. Greediness 55. Guile: Deceit 56. Haters of God 57. Hatred 58. Having Evil Treasures in the Heart: (The definition doesn't make any more sense). 59. Having Pleasure in Them That Do Things Worthy of Death: Enjoying the company of sinners. 60. Hearing the Sayings of Christ, but Not Following Them 61. Heresies: Religious opinion different from established Scripture. 62. Highmindedness: Arrogant 63. Hypocrisy 64. Idle Words: Words of no value. 65. Idolatry: Loving someone or something more than God. 66. Implacable: Refusing to be appeased 67. Inordinate Affection: Passion, lust. 68. Inventors of Evil Things: Those who contrive evil ways to satisfy their carnal lusts. 69. Jesting: Talking to make others laugh. 70. Judging 71. Knowing to Do Good, but Doing it Not 72. Lasciviousness: Lustful, wanton, exciting lust. 73. Laying Up Treasures on Earth: Pursuing material success at the expense of spiritual things. 74. Living in Pleasure: Fond of luxury and sensual pleasure/gratification. 75. Lovers of Self 76. Loving Another Person More Than Jesus 77. Lusting After a Woman 78. Lying 79. Maliciousness 80. Malignity: Being harmful or dangerous, bad character. 81. A Man Prophesying or Praying With His Head Covered. 82. Mockery 83. Murder 84. Murmering: Grumbling, secretly complaining 85. Presumptious 86. Pride: Self esteem. 87. Puffed Up: Overestimating of one's ability or knowledge. 88. Purloining 89. Railing: Slander 90. Revellings: Overindulgence at feasts, merrymaking. 91. Rioting 92. Seditions: Stirring up opposition against authority. 93. Self Will: Arrogant 94. Speaking Against the Holy Ghost 95. Sorcery: Practicing magic with aid from evil spirits. 96. Speaking Evil of Dignities: Speaking ill of those to be honored. 97. Stealing 98. Stiff-Necked and Uncircumcised in Hearts and Ears: Obstinate 99. Strife: Quarreling, seeking superiority 100. Striker: Ready to Fight 101. Swearing: To take oath (as in court). 102. Teaching for Doctrine the Commandments of Men: Neglecting God's commandments by manmade interpretation or commandments. 103. Traitors 104. Trusting in Riches 105. Not Entering by the Door Into the Sheepfold: Seeking salvation through means other than the blood of Christ. 106. Unbelief: Lack of faith. 107. Uncleanness 108. Unforgiving Heart 109. Unmerciful 110. Unrighteousness: Moral wrongfulness. 111. Unthankfulness 112. Vain Jangling: Babbling. 113. Variance: Strife 114. Voluntary Humility: False humilty. 115. Wantonness: Lustful, morally unrestrained. 116. Whisperers: Secretly spreading false or slanderous information. 117. Whoremongers:One who associates with whores, a male prostitute. 118. Witchcraft 119. Wickedness: Evil practices, crime. 120. Without Normal Affection: Hardhearted. 121. Without Understanding: Unwise 122. Wrath 123. Woman Cutting Her Hair 124. Woman Prophesying or Praying With Her Head Uncovered http://www.angelfire.com/empire2/psuclass0/sinlist.html
  7. I don't have time to post this morning on this issue BarnOwl.... but I am going to copy and paste this article because this is something so important for you to read in the first book of the bible. I find the article to be hilarious. My gay son and I had a great laugh over this part of Genesis. Read and enjoy the silliness/ridiculous verses coming from the author/storyteller in genesis of the ''all powerful god '': ................................................................................................................................. In Genesis chapter 1, God created every animal with a mate, including man. But in chapter 2, God does something a little unusual, He creates a mate for every animal except man, and then asks man to choose a mate from the animals! What the hell was that about!? The Bible doesn’t go into much detail, so I’m just going to imagine the story went down like this… “Choose ye now a suitable helper from one of my many animal creations,” God ordered in a somber tone. At first Adam was a bit apprehensive. “Surely,” he thought, “This must be the first practical joke! Why else would God make a mate for everyone but me?” But Adam didn’t want to seem rude. After all, he was new at this, and God knew everything about everything. Adam politely shopped around, inspecting all the animals, pretending to fancy some more than others. He paused for a moment by the horse, and pretended to be impressed by its smooth curves and flowing mane. He gave God a small nod as if only to acknowledge His fine work, and God felt proud (indeed, God had worked a second longer on the horse, and was pleased that Adam had taken notice). (I broke out in hysterics when I read this part) As Adam strolled along, God leaned forward, intensely curious which of His creations Adam would choose to know (yes, in the Biblical sense). Finding no suitable mate, Adam returned to God and sheepishly said, “Uh, yes Lord… all these are really great… very fine work, indeed… but, um… I, I just can’t see myself being with any of of them. May I have something else?” “Something else!?” God roared, “How dare ye object to all I have set before thee! Is my work not sufficient for thee? Have I erred in my judgement? For this request I shall forever curse thee with a mate as demanding as thee, and she shall forever be your undoing.” And with that, Adam fell into a deep sleep.” (More Laughter) All kidding aside, this Genesis story is difficult to believe for several reasons: It stands in stark contract to Genesis 1, where Adam and Eve are created as mates from day one… er… day six. The idea that a perfect creator would, in His perfect garden, ask Adam to choose a partner from the animals, is just… bizarre. It’s difficult to imagine that God actually had an alternate plan for Adam had he actually chosen to propagate with one of the animals. The Bible says Adam was a man, so like the other male animals, he must’ve had male genitalia. What was the point of making only half of a human reproductive system? It wasn’t fair of God to give Adam an order he knew Adam would have to disobey. Apologetics meets bestiality We could try to salvage the story by suggesting that God never actually intended Adam to choose an animal, but instead God wanted Adam to learn for himself that none were suitable. But this still puts Adam in the awkward position of having to question God’s wisdom and instruction (which God could’ve avoided by simply including a woman in the line-up). In fact, the next time Adam questions the soundness of God’s instructions, he gets evicted from Eden! Perhaps, as Adam ate the forbidden fruit, he thought to himself “Well… God was wrong about the whole animal thing, maybe He’s wrong about this, too.” A match made in Eden? “Did you hear something?” “Ya, it’s probably just God, He likes to watch.” It does make me wonder… what would’ve happened if Adam had selected one of the animals as a suitable partner? Where would we be today? What would our children look like? Perhaps we men have made a horrible mistake by not choosing an animal helpmate as God instructed. Perhaps, if we had, we’d still be romping around Eden with a beautiful horse, or swan, or lioness! Conclusion I think the simple truth is that the storyteller wanted to emphasize how women are a unique fit for men, and that this event never actually took place… because… it’s just too bizarre. But suggesting that this was not a literal event is a slippery slope; if we say this didn’t happen, then what about other bits? Like the talking snake? Or the 6 day creation? How much of it isn’t true? Did any of it happen at all? It’s safer for the believer to try and find alternate explanations for the story than to doubt its authenticity. But I have yet to hear an explanation that makes this story seem any less awkward. https://500questions.wordpress.com/2011/10/04/22-was-god-really-hoping-adam-would-find-a-suitable-partner-among-the-animals/ REPORT THIS AD
  8. Wow. The ole' guy finally died. But what a great life he lived! And left us some fantastic movies to watch. Great actor. Thanks for letting us know.
  9. So sorry it didn't go over very well AP. And this is what family (or friends) will do when you tell them something you know isn't going to go well. People like to make others feel guilty. It's part of wanting for them to stay in control and to control YOU. Even when you call somebody out on their own bullshit, you will get defensive answers as to why they did what they did (or believe what they believe) and they will normally blame everything around them except themselves. People ''pass the buck'' all the time. It's passive aggressive behavior and it will produce guilt in you if you accept it. Especially when you are trying to tell someone that you are not a believer anymore. I wouldn't say too much more to any of them. Go quiet for awhile. And be peaceful to know that you stood up for yourself!! Every time you stand up for yourself, it becomes easier. Just remain loving and kind and show them YOU are in control now!! Keep us posted. (hug)
  10. So wonderful to hear that you are doing well. And thanks for sharing this good news. We know the terrible struggle you had. Enjoy the Serenity my friend!
  11. But he is such a sweet, little christian, I can't even make myself get mad. Lol He's adorable.
  12. Welcome aboard AcrobaticDetective! So glad you joined us. Looking forward to hearing more from you! You've come to the right place! As we say here at E-xc, Welcome home!
  13. Welcome BarnOwl. I'm so happy you found Ex-c! Just remember my friend, you are going to be confused about all of this at first because your mind is pulling you back and forth. Once you learn more about the christian god, you will be able to become free to be who you really are! Stay with us. Post. Read. Ask us questions. And remember.....jesus himself never said one word in the new testament about being against any loving, gay person. Don't you think if this topic of being gay was that important, Jesus himself would have said something about it? Yet he didn't. So breathe and relax for tonight. Get ready for the journey you are about to take. It will be a little bit of a roller-coaster ride as you find your new life and form a new 'world view'. You got this!.
  14. Well somebody has to?? I think your problem was that you really didn't know god. Not like me. I had the real god. And besides I think you wanted to sin. You allowed Satan into your vessel and you didn't resist him. You need at least an hour of prayer.
  15. Excellent article. I think every one of those things have been said to me by people who learned the truth about me. I learned very early on that this was going to be a journey of frustration. And that was one of the reasons that I eventually decided to keep my lack of believing to myself. And no matter how i tried to explain myself back then, my friends would always tell me that god had a great calling on my life and that he would bring me back into the fold even though I was so doubting any of it anymore. (because of his grace of course!) My friends are always telling me that they are praying for me. And somebody should be praying for me....gawd knows I need it!!! Lol
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