Is christianity ever OK?

[Merlinfmct87]

One of the messages in the story of Gideon is that god will give clear physical signs as directed by the petitioner when the petitioner is in doubt...

That sort of personal response has been in short supply for many in these forums.

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Your words really hit home with me TFT... it's a common comment that the members(in my case, Reach and Lokmer) kept calling God up and got a busy signal... much the same way a bad blind date doesn't call back the next day.

 

Merlin

[Merlinfmct87]

The proverbial last nail in the coffin:

 

What's going to happen to you when you die? I have no idea.

What's going to happen to me when I die?  I have no idea.

The book that I follow tells me what is going to happen but of course that all depends on whether the book is true or not.

 

Not one person will ever know the answer to that.

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Context: Here.

 

Merlin

[Guest Euthyphro]

OK, before I respond to the rest of your post, what are you smoking?

 

TAP has not stated that she believes Jesus is the one and only way. She has also stated that the afterlife is not something we can know with any certainty or scientific evidence... indeed she actively disagrees with that idea.

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I am suspicous of every xian because of what the bible says and past experiences. But you are right. I should have remembered who I was talking to.

 

You're speaking to someone else here Euthyphro... the nutcase you are yelling at certainly exists, I've verbally decked his kind many times(and have been sorely tempted in real life), but TAP most certianly does not fit the profile.

I am naturaly paranoid of Xians. I was just saying just in case. Still... that was not a reasonable thing for me to do. Or very nice. Thank you. I will probably continue to say whats on my mind in the future but I hope folks will call me on my shit. I know I can be very irratonal sometimes.

 

Fact - she has not tried ONCE to convert someone or anything of the sort. She respects this site's purpose very much and will not interfere with it. I'd say that alone should earn her some respect, hmm?

Yes Sir, I realize that she deserves respect and I did apologize to her. Maybe it wasn't the best apology but I sensed I was being a stinker.

 

Save the vitrol for when the shoe fits... and stop shooting yourself in the foot.

I am suspicious of even the nice Christians. I am not proud of that.

 

I really must read this on my own... I don't like second-hand reviews much.

I think this is something we all should do... look at the past not only for new and better ideas(better status of women in ancient civilizations, or logic and debate being the point of school) but also look at the mistakes made(rampant slavery and/or racisim, bigotry, hate, destruction of knowledge because of fear, etc.).

I totaly agree here. I have said some of these things myself.

[Merlinfmct87]

I am naturaly paranoid of Xians. I was just saying just in case. Still... that was not a reasonable thing for me to do. Or very nice. Thank you. I will probably continue to say whats on my mind in the future but I hope folks will call me on my shit. I know I can be very irratonal sometimes.

 

This is something I can fully understand... the main reason I don't fall victim to it myself is very simple... I never believed.

 

It's no suprise that the reason I don't have a deep fear of christians is because they haven't harmed me to any great extent--certainly no more than any other group.

 

In any case... you're very, very welcome.

 

I am suspicious of even the nice Christians. I am not proud of that.

 

Just be aware of it man... that does a lot.

 

This site will show you the best and worst humanity has to offer... it seems to attract both in ample quantity. Fortunately the nutcases leave within a few weeks.

 

So, long story short, this place is great for curing that.

 

I totaly agree here. I have said some of these things myself.

 

No shit! I'll start a thread about it tomorrow then... I love this subject!

 

Merlin

[zfunkman]

There are many good messages in there.......

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I do believe you have to take a real good look at the "bad side" of biblegod. There are a lot of serial killers, were if you failed to look at their "attrocities/bad side" and only looked at their "good side", you would find no reason to put them in jail. Ted Bundy was supposedly a fun loving family man but on his "bad side" he liked to kill women and this is how we remember him. At least he never claimed to "love" the women he killed. I find it odd that xtians actually support all the killing of women and children by biblegod and just accept it as "gods way". They accept and support that god will send most of humanity to be tortured for eternity in a place that god personally set up for such a reason. I've read the bible and found the "bad" to definately outweigh the good. I find the bible to be rather sick and twisted. It is time for humanity to "grow up" and move beyond wtitten religion in order to find TRUE morals, compassion, consciousness, and right and wrong. Until this happens we are doomed on to the path of destruction. There is no "one true religion" and as long as anyone thinks there is, there will be a problem.

[Reach]

I would like to see a list, if there is such a thing, of any positive contributions that Christianity has made to the world. Anybody?

[♦ ficino ♦]

I would like to see a list, if there is such a thing, of any positive contributions that Christianity has made to the world. Anybody?

 

Christian emperors are credited with ending gladiatorial combat in the amphitheater, and later, with ending combat of humans against animals there.

[white_raven23]

Religion period has done more harm than good. Christianity, Muslim, Judaism, I don't care the about the flavor. They are all guilty of great harm.

 

Now I'm not saying anything about spirituality. That's an intimate and personal thing, which many people confuse with religion, or being religious.

 

Religion is for distracting and controlling the masses. It's the oldest "Big Brother" we've got.

[Kryten]

I think that when religion is NOT IN POWER it can have some benefit.

The good:

It can give some people who have serious problems a new direction and focus, and help/force them to behave or give them self-discipline. Can be helpful to some people, although some good non-religious counseling might be just as effective or even better. I've seen teens who just want to party every night and do bad things really become better people after they join a church-based program. Sure, they are deceived, but it helps some of them straighten up. Kind of like joining the army-- gives the kids structure and discipline, but eventually they all leave, one way or another. But it was still a good thing for a while... For them. Maybe. But at least in the military they would get paid instead of paying the church... Hmmmm.

 

That said, I voted for the "bad outweighs the good". When the church (read: majority of Christians and church leaders) has power, they want to control everyone-- what they do, what they think, what they watch on TV and what music they listen to, etc. If the church was in control, they most likely would automatically take 10% (tithe) off the top of everyone's income. They would limit all television to PG or G, censor everything, and suppress free thought and the internet. This site would be banned. Teaching evolution or any real science would be eliminated in favor of "biblical science" (ha!). I won't even talk about women's rights or sex or all the things that would be banned!

Fortunately, they are NOT in power.

 

However, the church does push those agendas as far as they can. It is a fundamental part of Christianity to NOT accept anyone who does not believe the same way they do. All other beliefs are from Satan. There is no room for acceptance and tolerance within the church. Just watch Pat Robertson for a while and see what his vision for this country is.

[Ouroboros]

I think that for some people there is a built in need to believe something outside themselves and outside this world. They need the crutch to support their own feeble mind of accepting the world as it is.

 

So in that context, religion is like a drug, medicine, to help people survive in a hostile environment.

 

But blessed is the person that doesn’t need it.

[Mr. Neil]

Most Christians simply haven't read the Bible, so they exercise moral responsibility based on the principle of reducing unnecessary harm. My attitude is that if you can somehow get away with calling yourself a Christian while leaving people alone and not imposing your theology on civil rights, science, and the law, then that's certainly okay.

 

What I don't like are fundamentalists like Gene Cook, who have absolutely no regard for moral responsiblity. I hate these people. The kind of people who would willingly commit an act based on what the Bible says is okay, regardless of whether or not that act is harmful. That is dispicable, and that should be denounced.

 

Obviously, I don't believe in respecting beliefs on principle. If you justify bad behavior with your religion, then someone aught to be able to say something.

[zfunkman]

Christian emperors are credited with ending gladiatorial combat in the amphitheater, and later, with ending combat of humans against animals there.

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Then they started the Spanish Inquisition.

[Eponymic]

Then they started the Spanish Inquisition.

 

After they started the Dark Ages & negated at least a thousand years of progress.

[DeathWorship]

i said no, because it's not for me..

 

but i also believe that outside of my conciousness, nothing really exists, so only my choices matter. for other people, i guess if they aren't fire and brimstone christians than its okay.. because i feel that, if i'm truly an atheist, and i truly believe that the choices we make in life have NO merit when we die [because i dont believe in an afterlife].. then what does it matter what someone chooses to believe? if christianity works for them, great, as long as they aren't in my face screaming about hell and damnation.

 

someone could believe in only Satan and Woody Allen and those are the ONLY 2 people on the planet and that could be fine, because the outcome would be the same, nihility.. oblivion.

 

i myself just choose not to buy into the christian thing.. or the religion thing for that matter, no supernaturality in my life..

[Amethyst]

I would like to see a list, if there is such a thing, of any positive contributions that Christianity has made to the world. Anybody?

 

The UCC church that I left participated in Habitats for Humanity. They also donated stuff like clothing, food, etc. to the homeless rather than just talking about it, like most churches do.

 

Religion has helped people cope with difficult circumstances, such as death. Is it the best way to cope? Probably not. But I'm not entirely against it if it works for some people, as long as they don't shove it down my throat.

[Guest Peyton]

But I'm not entirely against it if it works for some people, as long as they don't shove it down my throat.

 

That reminds me of something a lesbian colleague said to me one time. "Religion is like a bloke's cock. I don't have problems with either, provided no one tries to shove them down my throat!"

 

I really seriously shouldn't have written that I'll blame the fact it's wayyyyyy past my bedtime and I'm overtired!

[Lokmer]

In all honesty, most of the good that Christianity has done (that I can think of) has been directly related to saving people from oppression and/or abuse by other Christians.

 

-Lokmer

[NimbusBirdMgp]

The fact is that it will always do more harm than good.

Because, when you really look at it, many of the harms they are solving, they created in the first place.

 

Also, it will never do more good because at its base, the Bible itself is a promoter of confusion, fear, and other harmful negative beliefs (sexism, racism, etc).

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It does look Even. But the more it is looked into. I agree with the statement Eponymic mentioned in his Post. It has been this vicious circle of having the harms effected by Christianity and all they are really doing is solving the problems that Christianity in an earlier period created. I went with - No

[EdwardAbbey]

Christianity would be good only IF it were treated as a harmless myth. But since it is treated as if it is absolutely true, then, it is not a good thing.