padhyde Posted July 17, 2006 Share Posted July 17, 2006 Many people pose questions to help them to clarify their beliefs about the existence of god or christianity. What questions did you think helped you the most? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Meadows Posted July 17, 2006 Share Posted July 17, 2006 Many people pose questions to help them to clarify their beliefs about the existence of god or christianity. What questions did you think helped you the most? "Why is that bible God says and does things that I, and most other human beings, would ordinarily think as being evil" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dra_Mucd_Uha Posted July 17, 2006 Share Posted July 17, 2006 How is the Christian faith any better/more truthful than the faith of other religions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigile Posted July 17, 2006 Share Posted July 17, 2006 How can infinite punishment ever be defined as a just solution for finite crime? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minstrel Posted July 17, 2006 Share Posted July 17, 2006 Don't know if this was the chief question... But, it was significant... Why did the Angels (who looked on the daughters of men, and thought they were good looking, so they had sex with them and thus generated offspring) receive eternal punishment... But, it was not only OK, but the Divine Plan of God Almighty...for God The Holy Spirit to have sex with Mary, and produce Jesus? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All Gods Fail Posted July 17, 2006 Share Posted July 17, 2006 For me, it was the entire story of Genesis - the question it brought to mind was, "How could anyone take this literally?" Even as a fervent xtian I didn't literally believe in stories of the creation, the flood, etc. I knew better. They're so obviously fables... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wideawake42 Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 How could God throw millions of Hindus, Muslims, Buddhists, etc., in hell for not believing in Jesus Christ as their personal savior, when many of them are just as sincere about their religion as I am? (Gandhi really bothered me. I could never picture Gandhi or the Dalai Lama in hell.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest earl1940 Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 Many questions through the years, especially Genesis, but also the judgment and mean-ness shown by so many Christians. But what helped me the most intellectually was much reading and research into political matters. Thus, one important question for me was: Qui bono? Who profits? Once I saw the ties between politics and religion, I crossed a line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 "Who loves my family most, me or God?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minstrel Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 "Who loves my family most, me or God?" das a gut vun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leftofpunk Posted July 24, 2006 Share Posted July 24, 2006 Since this topic has sort of fizzled out I'll pose the question a little re-wored and ask. What was that first seed that either turned you away from christianity or made you first question it? Also, how did you deal with the fact that by simply questioning it, you "could" have been damning yourself to hell? In addition to that...what event lead to that initial seed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigile Posted July 24, 2006 Share Posted July 24, 2006 That's easy, the unjust application of the hell doctrine. The fact that god would judge others to hell for not accepting his son (whatever that means) whether they had ever heard the gospel or not, yet at the same time allow people like me to hear the gospel message literally 1000s of times, is self-evidently unjust. The apologetic line about how he will judge others according to their hearts just makes no sense at all. As far as fearing hell for questioning, I'm not sure that I did. I questioned many issues prayerfully and asked that god give me wisdom. I reasoned that knowledge was not a bad thing and that my faith would stand or fall based on the facts. If the facts pointed elsewhere, then I had nothing to fear in the first place. As my faith began to wither, I begged god to restore it. Eventually I realized it was no use. Faith shattered is like humpty dumpty, you can't put it back together again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Japedo Posted July 24, 2006 Share Posted July 24, 2006 Since this topic has sort of fizzled out I'll pose the question a little re-wored and ask. What was that first seed that either turned you away from christianity or made you first question it? Also, how did you deal with the fact that by simply questioning it, you "could" have been damning yourself to hell? In addition to that...what event lead to that initial seed? The underworld and Hades were around a lot longer then the Christian dogma of hell and torment. Hell was adopted by the Xtin Cult from Pagan worship just like every other aspect of the belief was. There is not one thing unique or different between Christianity and various sorts of sun/son worship. As far as the bible goes, the mass of contradictions and an extremely unjust god did it for me. Examples: - Killing two cities of people for sex crimes when No law from god had been given yet. Saving one righteous family after the father offers his own children to be raped by a mob. Then after the family is saved Lot is allowed to have sex with his kids and plant his seed.... and this is some how righteous. - Jacob lied and swindled his birthright from his brother and was rewarded and blessed for it. His brother Esau was screwed over and no justice for him I guess. - Not giving Pharaoh Free choice but controlling his heart hence controlling the outcome ending in the result of the death of many citizens of Egypt. - A God that supposedly never changes is the same yesterday, today and forever yet Changes constantly. - 3=1 Each separate but each the same. - God has sex outside of species and outside of marriage and somehow that's okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest earl1940 Posted July 24, 2006 Share Posted July 24, 2006 Many people pose questions to help them to clarify their beliefs about the existence of god or christianity. What questions did you think helped you the most? A few years ago in one of my political clubs, we asked the question of members: "If you had one question to ask, what would that be?" My answer then was: Would the real God please stand up? What I saw in the O.T. and the N.T. were two very different gods. I still see that, but now see them as part of the myths found there, rather than taking it seriously. That was preceded by many other things, and much has happened in my thinking and observations since. But everything points in the same direction for me: Away from Christianity and the bible and myths, and toward factually and logically supported knowledge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minstrel Posted July 24, 2006 Share Posted July 24, 2006 How could I enjoy heaven, if my son (who said he didn't know what to believe about God/Jesus) was in Hell? Every question that took me further...was accompanied with pleadings for forgiveness or correction...if I was asking questions that I should not be asking. But, every time, I found justification in - "If God has something to hide...then He isn't Good and Perfect anyway." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Truth Seeker Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 Since this topic has sort of fizzled out I'll pose the question a little re-wored and ask. What was that first seed that either turned you away from christianity or made you first question it? Also, how did you deal with the fact that by simply questioning it, you "could" have been damning yourself to hell? In addition to that...what event lead to that initial seed? I had a good friend who became an atheist because he was raped by a preist when he was a child. In his young mind he determined that a loving god would not have allowed this to happen. In other words, a good man became an atheist and was condemed to hell BECAUSE he went to church.....while on the other hand, an evil man, who has raped little kids, and lived the most evil life imaginable could, on his death bed, accept Jesus as his savior, and be rewarded with eternal happiness. How is this possible? This was my initial question that led me to countless others, eventualy leading to my deconversion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Checkmate Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 First question/first seed, huh? Well, as near as I can recall it was the issue surrounding denominationalism and multiple Bible translations. If it was supposed to be "one Lord, one faith and one baptism", then why are there upwards of 30,000 different denominations/sects worldwide arguing over "correct" doctrine? Why is there no unity amongst Christians? Added to that, there are what...two DOZEN Holy Bible translations to choose from and argue over? And even when Christians agree on what Bible to read from, they STILL interpret it differently. I wondered then, "Where is God during all of this confusion?" "Why would God allow His Word to be so mangled and misused?" "Why would he allow people seeking Him to be led so horribly astray?" According to the Bible, this same God got angry when his people brought discredit upon his name. He even killed Ananias and Sapphira for lying about their offering. So...why is he so silent now? His sheep are going astray like a mother fucker and "God" stands mute. It was this thought process that led me to question everything else, until, like Dominoes, the entire work collapsed. The religion, like ALL religions, was revealed as nothing more than a man-made house of cards that gullible and frightened children lived within as they hid from the scary realities of life. I concluded it was having "faith in Christ" that is "building your house on sand". If you wanted a secure foundation, then you'd better try building from REAL materials and not use your imagination. Because the crushing waves of Life have very little respect for "Faith Castles" built in the sand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lola Getz Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 Since this topic has sort of fizzled out I'll pose the question a little re-wored and ask. What was that first seed that either turned you away from christianity or made you first question it? Also, how did you deal with the fact that by simply questioning it, you "could" have been damning yourself to hell? In addition to that...what event lead to that initial seed? For me, it was when I wondered how people can burn in hell for eternity if they no longer have bodies. It was a thought that came to me, unbidden, like a bolt out of the blue. So much is made by Christians of the fact that when you die, your spirit (soul, whatever) leaves your body, which is then an empty shell to be disposed of in this world - well, then, why should I be afraid of hell if there's no physical part of me to burn? Once I started thinking about that, then I began questioning everything. Then there's all that Rapture BS that makes me giggle like a schoolgirl every time I contemplate it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest indy107 Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 For me it was The DaVinci Code. (the book) When they mentioned that Constatine and his group of buds sat down and 'voted' on everything i used to read and believe in the Nicene Creed...... uh.....voted? I never really thought about where the Nicene Creed came from before - but to hear it was voted on? That started the wheel a turning.... Indy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
padhyde Posted August 6, 2006 Author Share Posted August 6, 2006 I have just checked in for the first time for a while and seen where this had got to. A key question for me was to ask myself if it was possible that our universe was intentionally created by a being that knew what it was doing. I presume that an all powerful god would fit that description. I then reflected on creation. Just look at our physical world and contemplate the tragic indiscriminate premature loss of life it causes. Can you imagine the kind of death caused by an earthquake? Look at the differences in quality of life across the world according to the physical environment you are born into. Where is the justice and fairness? Look at the world of nature. Thousands of species can only exist by destroying other species for their own survival. Indeed over 90% of species that have existed are now extinct. That was not a very bright piece of creation was it? Think about the nature of humans. Look at history and what is happening today. Are we really the creation of a loving and compassionate ‘heavenly father’? Would you give your children ‘guidance’ that leads them to destroy each other because your ‘guidance’ was so confusing? Don’t you think that you might make yourself known in order to clear up the confusion? I concluded that our universe was the product of an incredible natural event the consequences of which are still unfolding. I’m glad I’ve had a chance to witness it for a few brief moments. For all its horrors, I’m lucky enough to have been able to enjoy it. Even more since I abandoned belief in any religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Starlace Posted August 6, 2006 Share Posted August 6, 2006 Since this topic has sort of fizzled out I'll pose the question a little re-wored and ask. What was that first seed that either turned you away from christianity or made you first question it? Also, how did you deal with the fact that by simply questioning it, you "could" have been damning yourself to hell? In addition to that...what event lead to that initial seed? The first seed that really turned me away from Christianity was that the idea of the religion and the things they spoke of in church when I was a little girl scared me half to death. God scared me. I couldn't believe I had to worship a God that came across so harsh. The way he was portrayed in the children's books and children's sermons was fine, but when I was in "big church" and heard the preacher talk about him and when I overheard my family talk about him he really came across as a cruel and frightening being. I didnt deal with "damning myself to hell" very well at all. In fact, I just didnt deal with it. It scared me that I could think such a thing so I just didnt think it. Because of the age I was at the time I cant EXACTLY say what it was that lead to that seed, but I am pretty certain it had to do with something that someone mentioned earlier, great good doing people who WERENT Christians going to hell. That really got under my skin as a young girl and no one could ever give me a straight explanation for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WakingUp Posted August 6, 2006 Share Posted August 6, 2006 1) Why are the vast majority of people going to Hell for never having heard about Jesus? If God so loved the world, he should not have made Hell for most of his creation. 2)Why did an all powerful God have to allow his son to be killed to redeem me? Jesus says to forgive seventy times seven, he doesn't say we have to kill to forgive? The Ten Commandments say "thou shall not kill". 3)Why is Jesus's birth and death similar to many of the mythical Gods of that time? 4)Why don't I see answered prayers in my life? I have prayed and prayed for some of the same things for 45 years and no answers. "Ask and you will receive" does not happen in my life. There is a signficant lack of answered prayer in the lives of most believers. The excuse that God does answer it's just that most of the time it is "No or Wait" doesn't cut it anymore. 5)The inconsistency of scripture and the lack of anyone being able to explain those inconsistencies. WakingUp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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