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My Girlfriend Is So Close To The Truth


Guest JohnFensworth
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Guest JohnFensworth

Hey, fellow ex-christians! I've been coming to this website for a while now, and I think I could use some advice right now, so I'll explain my situation.

 

I am eighteen years old, and I have been out of christianity for about a year and a half. But this post is mainly regarding my girlfriend, so I'll talk about the situation with her as well. We met each other at the beginning of this last school year (so around beginning of September).I was a senior and she was a sophomore. She had asked me out in October, but I was a very different person at that time, so I said no, but I'll not get into great detail regarding that specifically. We were friendly with each other throughout the whole school year. Then we finally officially started dating at the end of May, because, like I said, I had for one reason or another changed a lot.

 

Anyways...

 

Obviously, we've been going out for a little over two months now, and we are very, very close already. On a few occasions throughout these two months, without any prompting on my part, she has mentioned about how she is really confused regarding religion. Each time, we've discussed it a little, and it seems to me that her main reason for still believing is the fear that christianity puts into you from day one. She isn't terribly religious, but she stills believes it, and she always ends up saying, "What if there is a god, and if you don't believe, then you're screwed?" She, too, has noticed things in religion that don't make sense and inconsistencies in the bible and such, and she seems very questioning and confused about it.

 

My question to you good people who frequent this website is I want to know if you think I ought to try to get her thinking more about it, and if you think so, I'm not sure what exactly to say to get her thinking when she poses the "What if?" question. She is pretty open about it and not particularly defensive about the religion thing. I just want to know what you all think. She has a good head on her shoulders, otherwise she wouldn't be questioning religion, but I'm just not sure if I should keep her thinking, or just let her own thoughts run their course. It doesn't help much either that her mom is Lutheran I think, and her dad is Catholic. Anyway, advice regarding this would be appreciated. I'd hate to see a good mind like hers go to waste.

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Hey JohnFensworth,

 

It's good to see another young ex-c. I'm only 16, so I'm younger than you, but I'll try to help anyway.

 

Regarding trying to deconvert others, it's a very debatable topic. I personally have nothing against it, but at the same time I think it's good to try to let others sort things out for themselves. That's not to say you shouldn't try to help her... but don't be like a Christian and force all of your opinions on her and expect her to believe (or disbelieve) as you do.

 

When she says "What if there is a god, and if you don't believe, then you're screwed?" remember that this goes for all religions, not just Christianity. What if Hinduism is right? We're screwed (and so are Christians). What if Islam is right? We're screwed again (and, again, so are Christians). You see what I'm trying to say? Christians are taking a chance of being wrong, just like we are. We just happen to be going one step further by saying Christianity is wrong too.

 

“I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours.”

-Stephen Roberts

 

I hope everything goes well for you.

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Wow, well first of all welcome to exc! I hope you stick around so we can get to know you. About your gf, well do you want her to be free? Is that what you're after because if you are then great, get her thinking, show her this website, talk about things in depth. It sounds like she's curious and isn't squelching her intellectuality. Just don't force it or anything, because if you're pushy then she's going to go the other way, and to me it sounds like you really respect her and aren't pushy about anything, so good for you. I hope that things work out for the both of you.

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Guest JohnFensworth

don't be like a Christian and force all of your opinions on her and expect her to believe (or disbelieve) as you do.

 

 

Yeah, that's one reason why I wasn't really sure what to do. Because I know how christians are into forcing their beliefs like that, so I don't want to be a hypocrite at all.

 

When she says "What if there is a god, and if you don't believe, then you're screwed?" remember that this goes for all religions, not just Christianity. What if Hinduism is right? We're screwed (and so are Christians). What if Islam is right? We're screwed again (and, again, so are Christians). You see what I'm trying to say? Christians are taking a chance of being wrong, just like we are. We just happen to be going one step further by saying Christianity is wrong too.

 

 

Thanks for this help. That is, indeed, a very good point, and it could get her thinking without me being forceful. I will definitely try to remember that.

 

 

 

 

Just don't force it or anything, because if you're pushy then she's going to go the other way

 

 

yeah, that's why I decided to ask the fine people here about it, because I don't want to be like a christian and force what I believe on her. I just think she really has the potential to figure out the truth about christianity.

 

 

to me it sounds like you really respect her and aren't pushy about anything, so good for you. I hope that things work out for the both of you.

 

 

Yes, that is, indeed, true. Thanks a bunch for posting, and thanks for the help.

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When she says "What if there is a god, and if you don't believe, then you're screwed?" remember that this goes for all religions, not just Christianity. What if Hinduism is right? We're screwed (and so are Christians). What if Islam is right? We're screwed again (and, again, so are Christians). You see what I'm trying to say? Christians are taking a chance of being wrong, just like we are. We just happen to be going one step further by saying Christianity is wrong too.

 

Thanks for this help. That is, indeed, a very good point, and it could get her thinking without me being forceful. I will definitely try to remember that.

 

With a bit of (not exaggerated I hope) self-interest I would like to add the none-too-well-known fact that there are even religions out there who don't say "We are blessed, all of them are damned!!!11!!!!1!!!"...

 

Take my own Asatru faith for example, or the Celtic druidism of my wife. Gee, so there are others who don't believe like we do? Oh well, to each his own - don't bother us and we won't bother you, it's simple as that. ;)

 

That may nor may not be helpful for you to get her out of her confusion, but it may be advantageous to show her that religion != exclusive truth... :HaHa:

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She isn't terribly religious, but she stills believes it, and she always ends up saying, "What if there is a god, and if you don't believe, then you're screwed?"

 

I'd reply with: "Would a truly supreme being really be that petty?"

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Guest JohnFensworth

If you love your GF for who she is and that includes any warts seen or unseen, you will be fine....as long as she loves you warts and all. If it is a mutual thing...it can work...

 

...To make it through a tough one like that, you have to really love and care for that person no matter what they believe. I even say this, that if my wife's Christianity helps her cope with her pain, I am all for her believing even if I don't. Get to know your GF and learn to love her....this is a great time in your life...enjoy it...

 

Hey Burnedout

 

I want to thank you for posting. I'm not one to blow off the advice of someone who is, shall we say, more mature and experienced than I am.

It is true that the love is definitely a mutual thing, and it is really working well, and I really think that she maybe subconsciously wants to be out of christianity, especially since she always seems to want to talk about it, and she always says how much she's confused about it. Like I said, I don't want to be pushy about it, but I just really think she has the potential to be able to understand the world for what it really is. I have told her my opinions on various things, and she seems to agree on a lot of it, but I have also told her that I think that she shouldn't believe something just to please someone, and she should only believe what she really feels is true. She is a thinker, she questions things about religion, and she had already realized problems with christianity without prompting from me. That's why I'd just like to possibly help spur her thinking. Like I said, I'd hate to see a good questioning mind like hers go to waste. Anyway, thanks again for posting. I appreciate the help.

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Hi, John!

 

Since you've been a member here for a while, I suggest you share some of the material on this website with your girlfriend -- not to hit her over the head with it and try to deconvert her, but merely present it to her as something interesting that you've read and ask her what she thinks of it. For example, you might want to check out "References for New ExChristians" which is pinned at the top of this forum on Ex-Christian Life, and the "Introductory Stuff" (see the left column on the main page).

 

Also, since the fear that you're screwed if you don't choose the right religious belief is Pascal's Wager, I refer you to a good article refuting that at http://www.geocities.com/paulntobin/pascal.html

 

Best of luck to you and your girl!

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Guest droskey

Hey there, JohnFensworth. Thanks for sharing your story. I'm not a big fan of activly trying to deconvert people. It sounds like your gf is questioning. That's good. When you guys talk about religion, be honest. Tell her why you left. Tell her about your thoughts on the subject. Inform her about resources that you find/found helpful. Those are all good things to do when you are having a mutual discussion. However, I wouldn't go so far as to start strategizing how you can "get her to think". It sounds like she's doing fine on her own. It also sounds like she is still dealing with fear of hell/God issues. I dealt with those as well. She won't leave Christianity until she comes to a point where she doesn't have the fear anymore. The only way that she will come to that point, in my opinion, is by realizing that it is a pointless fear to have. She'll only get there on her own. It is an emotional as well as an intellectual journey. You can help her with the intellectual part by telling her your thoughts. However, she has to come to grips with the emotional part on her own.

 

Either way, as long as you both love and respect each other, you'll be fine together.

 

Cheers and good luck.

Dan

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Guest JohnFensworth

When you guys talk about religion, be honest. Tell her why you left. Tell her about your thoughts on the subject. Inform her about resources that you find/found helpful. Those are all good things to do when you are having a mutual discussion.

 

Yes, I have been done my best at being as honest as I can regarding how I feel about it. I was kind of apprehensive at first about doing so, but fortunately, she is not offended by it or anything, and she's pretty open.

 

However, I wouldn't go so far as to start strategizing how you can "get her to think". It sounds like she's doing fine on her own.

 

Yeah, "getting her to think" wasn't really the best way to word it, I don't think. I didn't really want to make it sound like I was trying to coerce her or deceive her or anything. I was just thinking of like things that maybe she hadn't yet considered that would spur her own thought processes.

 

It also sounds like she is still dealing with fear of hell/God issues. I dealt with those as well. She won't leave Christianity until she comes to a point where she doesn't have the fear anymore. The only way that she will come to that point, in my opinion, is by realizing that it is a pointless fear to have. She'll only get there on her own. It is an emotional as well as an intellectual journey. You can help her with the intellectual part by telling her your thoughts. However, she has to come to grips with the emotional part on her own.

 

Either way, as long as you both love and respect each other, you'll be fine together.

 

It does seem like the main thing is the emotional attachment of something so comforting that's been with her all her life. You're probably right about it. The emotional attachment isn't going to just disappear like that in a poof.

 

Anyway, thanks for your help, I appreciate it.

 

 

Hi, John!

 

Since you've been a member here for a while, I suggest you share some of the material on this website with your girlfriend -- not to hit her over the head with it and try to deconvert her, but merely present it to her as something interesting that you've read and ask her what she thinks of it. For example, you might want to check out "References for New ExChristians" which is pinned at the top of this forum on Ex-Christian Life, and the "Introductory Stuff" (see the left column on the main page).

 

Also, since the fear that you're screwed if you don't choose the right religious belief is Pascal's Wager, I refer you to a good article refuting that at http://www.geocities.com/paulntobin/pascal.html

 

Best of luck to you and your girl!

 

Thanks a bunch for your help, Thackerie. That wager about Pascal's Wager is pretty interesting. And I'll be sure to check out some of the other things you metnioned.

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