Sylvia Brown

[AtheistMommy]

AM, I just can't get over how disgusting your avatar is. Everything you say is rendered irrelevant because of that filth.

 

Asimov, stop flirting with me, you know I'm married and nothing more can become of it.

[Asimov]

AM, I just can't get over how disgusting your avatar is. Everything you say is rendered irrelevant because of that filth.

 

Asimov, stop flirting with me, you know I'm married and nothing more can become of it.

 

*sits in a corner and cries*

[euphgeek]

Yes, Euphgeek..I keep an open mind to all of it. I find charging such prices a bit suspect though.

Me, too.

To definitively state something as true or not true..seems like what we did as xtians..accepting on the word of others that reality was what was proclaimed.

 

So much is being learned on a daily/yearly basis that what we now call "paranormal" may actually BE normal. Consider the gene that was just discovered-that makes us different from other primates. Perhaps another form of evolution will take place or is taking place?

I think that's a definite possibility.

I believe anything is possible, but not all things are probable.

 

As to premonitions..and I'm going out on limb here..I'm sure we've all had those dreams that seemingly "come true". I had one last December..(I always dream and remember them-last night I dreamed that the tattoo I just got started fading away until it was gone..I actually checked when I woke up ) Anyway, back to the December dream:

I dreamed I was arranging milk cartons at work (school lunch milk). Only, they were yellow. We didn't have yellow cartons. Blew that off as a distorted work dream...until I got to work and saw a memo about vanilla milk, coming in January. Yep..the cartons were yellow.

 

However..it really served no purpose. I mean seriously, what good did it do for me to know the cartons were yellow? It did make for interesting conversation though..

Hehe...yeah, that is kind of interesting. I think everyone has probably had one of those types of dreams at some point in their lives.

[AtheistMommy]

*sits in a corner and cries*

 

Don't cry. I still like you. I'm just not inlike with you.

[Asimov]

Yes, Euphgeek..I keep an open mind to all of it. I find charging such prices a bit suspect though.

Me, too.

 

No need to be wishy-washy, euphgeek. Just admit you're a spiritualistic hippy who never washes.

[euphgeek]

Yes, Euphgeek..I keep an open mind to all of it. I find charging such prices a bit suspect though.

Me, too.

 

No need to be wishy-washy, euphgeek. Just admit you're a spiritualistic hippy who never washes.

I know you're just joking (at least I hope you are ), but sometimes I think that's how close-minded some people are. It's like the misconception some Christians have about atheists being god-haters who just want an excuse to sin.

[The Sage Nabooru]

I read a pretty interesting idea on psychics.

 

Let's say we consider the universe to be (not in shape, but in practice) like a giant CD-ROM. Everything that could ever possibly happen in the course of time in written on the CD-ROM. Just like an actual computer game, the CD-ROM shifts to different points on the disc, depending on the actions of the player. So time and fortune play themselves out, depending on the actions of the individual.

 

Now consider that a psychic is a person who can see into one of those possible futures. No clairvoyant can say for certain that what they predict will be true, because they are only seeing one of a number of possible outcomes. The actual outcome is dependent on the individual.

[Guest Shiva H. Vishnu]

What good is someone who can give you a list of possible outcomes. All outcomes are possible outcomes. What? They narrow it down to the more probable sounding possible outcomes? Like, they rarely predict that a hail of skittles will maim your dog and destroy your car. Good for them. That's just smart business. You get more hits that way.

[The Sage Nabooru]

What good is someone who can give you a list of possible outcomes. All outcomes are possible outcomes. What? They narrow it down to the more probable sounding possible outcomes? Like, they rarely predict that a hail of skittles will maim your dog and destroy your car. Good for them. That's just smart business. You get more hits that way.

 

Yeah, pretty much.

 

But when you think about it......think about ALL possible outcomes. Suppose a psychic told you that, according to where you were now on the CD-ROM, if you continued to let the game run its course, the program would have you run off the edge of a cliff and die. It's your initiative to operate the program in such a way as to prevent that from happening.

 

The best any psychic can offer is a warning or suggestion when it concerns matters of the future. That's why good psychics won't ever promise they can assure your lover will come back to you, or that they can guarantee you'll win a million dollars. A real clairvoyant would only be able to tell you what will hit you if you don't step out of the way.

[Guest Shiva H. Vishnu]

Suppose a psychic told you that, according to where you were now on the CD-ROM, if you continued to let the game run its course, the program would have you run off the edge of a cliff and die. It's your initiative to operate the program in such a way as to prevent that from happening.

 

The way I figure it, if you stay away from cliffs because of anything a psychic told you, you're pretty much a tool.

[Lizard]

I recently dreampt I was having sex with a really hot blonde I work with who happens to be six months pregnant. What the hell is that supposed to mean?

 

It means one of two things, either you desire a baby and a "hot blonde" or you're one sick bastard.

 

 

 

I believe anything is possible, but not all things are probable.

 

As to premonitions..and I'm going out on limb here..I'm sure we've all had those dreams that seemingly "come true". I had one last December..(I always dream and remember them-last night I dreamed that the tattoo I just got started fading away until it was gone..I actually checked when I woke up ) Anyway, back to the December dream:

I dreamed I was arranging milk cartons at work (school lunch milk). Only, they were yellow. We didn't have yellow cartons. Blew that off as a distorted work dream...until I got to work and saw a memo about vanilla milk, coming in January. Yep..the cartons were yellow.

 

However..it really served no purpose. I mean seriously, what good did it do for me to know the cartons were yellow? It did make for interesting conversation though..

 

Its possible, just highly improbable. Evidence goes against someone being able to predict such things.

 

I had two different dreams about two different people dead. About two weeks later they died. I could be a psychic! No seriously, I did have these dreams. But do you think they were totally without data?

I don't know what you knew about those two people..whether they were sick or living a life that could lead to death?

The really frustrating thing is, if it were to have been a precognitive dream, what good was it? Other than to know two weeks in advance that someone would die-or vanilla milk would be offered?(Yes, that last was SUCH useful information to have!)

 

There's also the difficulty in proving such a claim..if a psychic tells you specifically that you will die if take a certain route to work at a specific time..and you do take the route, but at a later or earlier time, then it changes the outcome, rendering the prediction null..

 

Its like getting a warning that the boss is coming, so you then look busy, avoiding being fired..without the warning, you would (perhaps) have continued in what you were doing.

 

So..where does that leave us? With the inability to rationally prove anything-at this point anyway.

[LosingMyReligion]

I think it is so cool that this thread has lasted so long...lol

 

Carry on...

[AtheistMommy]

I don't know what you knew about those two people..whether they were sick or living a life that could lead to death?

The really frustrating thing is, if it were to have been a precognitive dream, what good was it? Other than to know two weeks in advance that someone would die-or vanilla milk would be offered?(Yes, that last was SUCH useful information to have!)

 

There's also the difficulty in proving such a claim..if a psychic tells you specifically that you will die if take a certain route to work at a specific time..and you do take the route, but at a later or earlier time, then it changes the outcome, rendering the prediction null..

 

Its like getting a warning that the boss is coming, so you then look busy, avoiding being fired..without the warning, you would (perhaps) have continued in what you were doing.

 

So..where does that leave us? With the inability to rationally prove anything-at this point anyway.

 

Well, one had been in the hospital for about a week (my grandmother) and the other (my uncle) had told me he was sick. He thought he had a cold it turned out to be much more serious. I had the dream and I told him about it, I asked him to see a doctor. However, it was too late.

 

But wouldn't it be true that for one to predict the future (I'm speaking of the way a TV and phone psychic predicts the future not your every day observation prediction), the future itself would have to have been already determined? And if so, why would it be worth living out something you have no choice over?

 

 

 

I think it is so cool that this thread has lasted so long...lol

 

Carry on...

 

It's a good topic. Plus most of the people in here are debating rationally. It's pretty awesome!

[euphgeek]

But wouldn't it be true that for one to predict the future (I'm speaking of the way a TV and phone psychic predicts the future not your every day observation prediction), the future itself would have to have been already determined? And if so, why would it be worth living out something you have no choice over?

I don't think so. For one thing, TV and phone psychics are pretty much all fakes and frauds. One person I spoke with who used to work for one such place said that most of the people there tell the people calling in whatever they want because they'll probably never talk to them again. As I said before, no legitimate psychic or medium claims to know 100% what the future will bring. There's too much free will involved.

 

For another thing, as in the CD-ROM analogy, there are multiple possibilities. For the future to be predetermined there would only have to be one possibility. Of course, one would have to know something about a person's past to make any intelligent predictions on what will happen to them in the future.

[Knightley]

Even though I don't believe in Bible God and all that stuff I'm still into the afterlife, angels, spirits, and psychics.

 

Anyway, I am a huge fan of Sylvia Brown; I was even when I was a X-tian. Now, I am starting to realize something peculiar about her.

 

Even though she says that god is impartial and that no one is going to rot in hell and etc...I notice that she always invokes the name of The Holy Spirit, Christ Consciousness, AND in one of her books she talks about Jesus being Lord...But later, in the same book, she contradicts herself and states that all great religious figures(Buddha, Jesus, Ghandi, and Dali Lama)are all avatars of god...

 

Sometimes I think she's forreal, but I keep wondering is she pushing a Christian agenda...Most psychics don't point to certain religions...

 

 

 

I don't like her, there's something off about her. I can't quite explain. A while back she recently published a book where she said that fairies and sprites exist.

 

 

 

I'm not going to believe her if she makes claims like that. Give me a break, I'm tired of blind faith, if it can't be proven with science, then there is no point in believing in it. My "blind faith" days are over baby. They are over. I know people hate it when people like me say things like that, but well, if I'm going to believe in something then there had better be proof, dead hard proof.

[AtheistMommy]

I don't think so. For one thing, TV and phone psychics are pretty much all fakes and frauds. One person I spoke with who used to work for one such place said that most of the people there tell the people calling in whatever they want because they'll probably never talk to them again. As I said before, no legitimate psychic or medium claims to know 100% what the future will bring. There's too much free will involved.

 

For another thing, as in the CD-ROM analogy, there are multiple possibilities. For the future to be predetermined there would only have to be one possibility. Of course, one would have to know something about a person's past to make any intelligent predictions on what will happen to them in the future.

 

Yes but, isn't that exactly what were're talking about? Sylvia Brown is a "fraud." The first time I heard of her was on the Montel show. She comes on like once a week (not sure which day, but I've noticed she's on every once a week).

 

However, if you give the average person some information about yourself and ask them what happens next, they have the same chance of being right as anyone else, psychic or not. But when I think of a psychic, I think of these people who claim to know all about you, charge an arm and a leg, work on TV or the phone, and are totally full of shit.

[euphgeek]

I don't think so. For one thing, TV and phone psychics are pretty much all fakes and frauds. One person I spoke with who used to work for one such place said that most of the people there tell the people calling in whatever they want because they'll probably never talk to them again. As I said before, no legitimate psychic or medium claims to know 100% what the future will bring. There's too much free will involved.

 

For another thing, as in the CD-ROM analogy, there are multiple possibilities. For the future to be predetermined there would only have to be one possibility. Of course, one would have to know something about a person's past to make any intelligent predictions on what will happen to them in the future.

 

Yes but, isn't that exactly what were're talking about? Sylvia Brown is a "fraud." The first time I heard of her was on the Montel show. She comes on like once a week (not sure which day, but I've noticed she's on every once a week).

 

However, if you give the average person some information about yourself and ask them what happens next, they have the same chance of being right as anyone else, psychic or not. But when I think of a psychic, I think of these people who claim to know all about you, charge an arm and a leg, work on TV or the phone, and are totally full of shit.

I know what you mean about Sylvia Brown. I mean, sometimes she'll say philosophical things that I agree with, but her predictions are way out there and they make the legitimate psychics and mediums look bad.

 

And anyone can tell you what will happen next if you give them the necessary background information. But some are able to do so without you telling them anything, even taking cold reading techniques into account.

[AtheistMommy]

And anyone can tell you what will happen next if you give them the necessary background information. But some are able to do so without you telling them anything, even taking cold reading techniques into account.

 

Like who? It was said before, non-verbal cues give off a lot of information about someone. Lets keep that in mind when we talk about "cold readings."

[Guest JP]

Euphgeek, would you mind explaining some of the things that your psychic told you that she wouldn't have any way of knowing? If they are too personal I understand.

 

As for Sylvia Browne...I once had a co-worker who went to go see a taping of Oprah by herself in Chicago. Well, Oprah sold out, but Montel had open seats, so she went there instead. Sylvia was the guest that day. Sylvia said that someone was speaking to her about someone in the audience. Somehow my co-worker was targeted as the person in the audience. I guess that Sylvia said that this person was her brother, that he had cerebral paulsy, and that he was on the Other Side painting. All those things were true (including that he loved to paint.)

 

I'm not sure of what exactly happened, because I haven't seen the tape of the show where all this occurred. But for the most part, I don't buy a lot of what Sylvia says or believes. I think that she sometimes gets hits but also gets a majority of misses.

[euphgeek]

And anyone can tell you what will happen next if you give them the necessary background information. But some are able to do so without you telling them anything, even taking cold reading techniques into account.

 

Like who? It was said before, non-verbal cues give off a lot of information about someone. Lets keep that in mind when we talk about "cold readings."

I know all about cold reading techniques. I was skeptical the first time I went to a medium, so I was careful to not give her any clues. But she started telling me really specific things about me.

 

Euphgeek, would you mind explaining some of the things that your psychic told you that she wouldn't have any way of knowing? If they are too personal I understand.

I can tell you some of the things she said. She started out by telling me I thought that mediums were evil (I did, although at the time I was starting to wonder). She also told me that I was nice, but genuinely so, not to be a kiss-ass (her words) and that I liked violent video games (I was into Mortal Kombat and Street Fighter at the time). She never asked if she was right, either, but she was.

As for Sylvia Browne...I once had a co-worker who went to go see a taping of Oprah by herself in Chicago. Well, Oprah sold out, but Montel had open seats, so she went there instead. Sylvia was the guest that day. Sylvia said that someone was speaking to her about someone in the audience. Somehow my co-worker was targeted as the person in the audience. I guess that Sylvia said that this person was her brother, that he had cerebral paulsy, and that he was on the Other Side painting. All those things were true (including that he loved to paint.)

 

I'm not sure of what exactly happened, because I haven't seen the tape of the show where all this occurred. But for the most part, I don't buy a lot of what Sylvia says or believes. I think that she sometimes gets hits but also gets a majority of misses.

Like I said, she does say some things that I agree with, so she may not be a total fraud, but this is the first time I've heard of her being so dead-on in a reading. Usually, I hear about her saying to someone that aliens stole the water out of their pool or that Gore was going to win the 2000 election (when Bush won, she claimed she was thinking of the popular vote. Suuuurrrreeeee...).

[AtheistMommy]

 

 

I know all about cold reading techniques. I was skeptical the first time I went to a medium, so I was careful to not give her any clues. But she started telling me really specific things about me.

 

 

You do realize that non-verbal cues are subconscious. You cannot totally control what you aren't aware of. I'm sure you gave off that you were skeptical. Keep in mind that she was doing this for a living.

 

You know, its not that I believe these people are fake, its that I don't agree that the human brain is able to do such things. I agree that the human brain is able to predict things given enough data, or with observation. But not having known nothing about the subject.

[euphgeek]

 

 

I know all about cold reading techniques. I was skeptical the first time I went to a medium, so I was careful to not give her any clues. But she started telling me really specific things about me.

 

 

You do realize that non-verbal cues are subconscious. You cannot totally control what you aren't aware of. I'm sure you gave off that you were skeptical. Keep in mind that she was doing this for a living.

 

You know, its not that I believe these people are fake, its that I don't agree that the human brain is able to do such things. I agree that the human brain is able to predict things given enough data, or with observation. But not having known nothing about the subject.

Yes, I realize that non-verbal clues are subconscious, and I may have given off that I was skeptical. But she said that I thought it was evil, not fake, which was accurate. Basically she had a 50/50 chance of getting it right just by guessing, since nothing I wore gave any clues to my religious beliefs, and she didn't guess, she stated it as a fact. Cold reading might be able to explain some of the things she told me (like that I was named after someone in my family), but certainly not everything.

 

If you don't believe these people are fake and you don't think the human brain is able to do these things, where do you think it's coming from? The medium I went to said she gets information from guardian angels and passed on loved ones, and I don't quite think that she's not right.

[AtheistMommy]

 

Yes, I realize that non-verbal clues are subconscious, and I may have given off that I was skeptical. But she said that I thought it was evil, not fake, which was accurate. Basically she had a 50/50 chance of getting it right just by guessing, since nothing I wore gave any clues to my religious beliefs, and she didn't guess, she stated it as a fact. Cold reading might be able to explain some of the things she told me (like that I was named after someone in my family), but certainly not everything.

 

If you don't believe these people are fake and you don't think the human brain is able to do these things, where do you think it's coming from? The medium I went to said she gets information from guardian angels and passed on loved ones, and I don't quite think that she's not right.

 

If the psychic in question really believes himself/herself to be actually (magically) psychic, they will give off the appearance of being so. However, I think its a bit more like common sense, not a lot of people have much of it if at all and those who do are the minority. What I'm trying to say here is, I think some people have better perception than others and can pick up on the smallest of cues, subconsciously themselves.

 

It's kind of like "mothers intuition," What does that really mean? It means mothers know their children and have "feelings" that something is wrong, or something is going to happen. Sometimes giving them (the mothers) the appearance of having "eyes in the back of their heads" because they know how that child works, thinks, is.

 

You don't hear much about "fathers intuition" but I think that's because the majority of fathers don't spend nearly as much time with their children as mothers. However, I don't think it has much to do with sex. I do understand that our brains are a bit different because of our sex but they are able to work in the same way.

 

The brain is complex, and for the most part we know about as much about it as we do about space. I think the point would be that we know allot as it is. I think I'm getting a bit off subject now, sorry, I'm typing this and yelling at the kids. LOL, it's not easy, but someone's got to do it. Anyway, I've got to get them outside for some exercise. Talk to ya later...

[euphgeek]

If the psychic in question really believes himself/herself to be actually (magically) psychic, they will give off the appearance of being so. However, I think its a bit more like common sense, not a lot of people have much of it if at all and those who do are the minority. What I'm trying to say here is, I think some people have better perception than others and can pick up on the smallest of cues, subconsciously themselves.

I don't believe there's anything magical about being psychic any more than there's anything magical about being a musician. You said yourself that our brains give off and are made up of energy. What if there's some way for another brain to tap into that and we've been writing it off all this time just because we think it's "magic" or "supernatural" and therefore can't possibly exist?

[Guest JP]

If the psychic in question really believes himself/herself to be actually (magically) psychic, they will give off the appearance of being so. However, I think its a bit more like common sense, not a lot of people have much of it if at all and those who do are the minority. What I'm trying to say here is, I think some people have better perception than others and can pick up on the smallest of cues, subconsciously themselves.

I don't believe there's anything magical about being psychic any more than there's anything magical about being a musician. You said yourself that our brains give off and are made up of energy. What if there's some way for another brain to tap into that and we've been writing it off all this time just because we think it's "magic" or "supernatural" and therefore can't possibly exist?

 

I've actually thought of that myself. What if it does exist, yet it's just a simple brain function? The clairvoyant I saw said that she got all of my information from my keys...sounds kind of unbelievable to me.