Jesus Or Hell!

[All Gods Fail]

Who is this Christian Yo Yo anyway. I thought I'd seen it all before with fundies but this guy takes the cake in hypocrisy. This guy is swearing like a trooper and trying to defend his fundamentalist stance!!!

 

Personally, I call troll/spoofer. Not even fundies are that ignorant.

[Checkmate]

Who is this Christian Yo Yo anyway. I thought I'd seen it all before with fundies but this guy takes the cake in hypocrisy. This guy is swearing like a trooper and trying to defend his fundamentalist stance!!!

 

Personally, I call troll/spoofer. Not even fundies are that ignorant.

Believe it or not, but YoYo is legit. He's been with us for awhile and has ever been a Fundy nutjob. He recently suffered a divorce (which he caused with his Fundyism), and this event has made him bitter and angry at his fellow Christians, and apparently at everyone else in the world. This explains his assertion that even when Xians let HIM down (pot/kettle/black) he still remained in the faith.

 

You should learn to take his every post with a grain of salt. (Or do as I do, and ignore him completely.) The boy is truly disturbed and desperately seeking attention/friends/arguments.

[All Gods Fail]

Who is this Christian Yo Yo anyway. I thought I'd seen it all before with fundies but this guy takes the cake in hypocrisy. This guy is swearing like a trooper and trying to defend his fundamentalist stance!!!

 

Personally, I call troll/spoofer. Not even fundies are that ignorant.

Believe it or not, but YoYo is legit. He's been with us for awhile and has ever been a Fundy nutjob. He recently suffered a divorce (which he caused with his Fundyism), and this event has made him bitter and angry at his fellow Christians, and apparently at everyone else in the world. This explains his assertion that even when Xians let HIM down (pot/kettle/black) he still remained in the faith.

 

You should learn to take his every post with a grain of salt. (Or do as I do, and ignore him completely.) The boy is truly disturbed and desperately seeking attention/friends/arguments.

 

 

Yeesh. More than I wanted to know!

 

Still, he acts like a troll. I suspect deep down he's losing faith rapidly, and is just fooling himself with his schtick. Hell, even us un-savable, degenerate apostates know - no true believer would say the shit he's said.

[Abiyoyo]

Yo yo,

 

Three things.

Firstly my name is not Bob. Secondly, your arguments do not address the issue I was bringing up.

By the way. I used to be an assistant pastor, I think I know a thing or two about Chrisitianity.

 

Firstly. I used to be a Christian that went to church every Sunday and witness the Pastors in there self righteous personna trying to manipulate many people into there cult lifestyle instead of Christianity. So, your assistant pastor reference holds little with me. Pastors, preach the denomination, not Christ. You should know that, Sir.

 

I can assure you that if you think your bible which you base your beliefs on would encourage you to swear the way you do, you probably haven't read it. "Let no unwholesome thing come out of your mouth". It has nothing to do with defamation of character, although you have already done that by calling all the rest of the people on this site "bitches"

 

The point was that its the intent of the language and the attack of character, that does make a person wrong. Well, Sir. Since you have this "Christian" authority, in which has now been taken from you, of course according to the Bible; Should we wash the inside or the outside of the cup first? Should we be angry and sin not? Should I love in truth, in which truth according to Christianity, is the Word?

 

The main issue I was getting at is that the bible paints a picture of a God who is angry with his creation and requires a blood sacrifice for the remission of sins which was handled with Jesus' substituionary atonement. That idea is what I think most people here find repugnant.

 

Angry? Have you read the Bible? Or did you just think that because it said in His feirce anger/wrath etc. He was Angry? Did you read why He was angry? Did you consider that God doesnt get angry? or that the author of the majority of the "angry" God was a human?

 

Oh! Thats right Pastor. I forgot. Church folks teach people that the Word is the inffalable Word of God, handed down by God, for His people. Well Sir. if it was infallable, Why the nned for a redeemer? People wrote the Bible telling a story, painting their own picture of God, in which God let be written?

 

Why? Ask God.

 

The second idea that I think I can speak for everyone here on is the idea that a supposedly loving father would have an eternal hell created for sinners who do not believe in his blood sacrifice atonement theory and his god man son.

 

Whats the deal man? If you believe even in spiritual things of any nature, then you would have to appoint good and bad. The confusion comes when we try to tell others with our finite, ungodly, self motive ambitions; of How they go to Heaven.

 

Biblically, Pastor. The kingdom is inside of us. So, if the kingdom of God is inside of us, then He is apart of us and we are apart of Him. That menas that God dwells in the hearts of man, yet His spirit is with us in measure. So. That means that even though the kingdom is inside of us, as believers, and His spirit resides in us; it is in measure.

 

So. Hell. If There is good, there is evil. Maybe, just maybe.., the murderer went with Jesus, and the adulteress, and the hypocrite that repented. So, why would God send someone to Hell, for being skeptical about Jesus. Church of Philadelphia, Jesus said that " you have not denied my name"; as if some have yet there reward will be less. i mean, Jesus said the Father would forgive those that reject the Son, but not the Spirit.

 

The spirit is God. Thats why. The Son showed us, and paved the way to direct access to this spirit, in measure, for anyone that called upon the Lord. or direct access to God.Correct, Biblically.

 

So. If there wasnt another type of spirit, in a strong form( refer to Job); that is in opposition to God; then there wouldnt even be any sinful nature. This spirit, being, satan, whatever; He is againist the will of God.

 

So. Sometimes the people that are suppose to be the leaders of Christ fail the people because they let opposition get in the way. Status, Stature, circumstances. Job lost his whole family because of satan, yet gained it all back because of his humbleness of knowledge, and seeing the interaction of God, in conversation. he humbled himself and reliased that God is God, Thats it.

 

Yes. There is a hell. No, I dont think my grandma is there because she never went to church. Why? Just my opinion. Do I have the right to even wonder if someone is or isnt going to Hell? No. Why? Because I dont know the hearts of man, and neither do you. So. Preacherman. Thats why most preacherman end up here. Because they preached the Gospel of denomination, inside of the Gospel of Christ.

 

Perhaps last and not least is the fact that the bible was not fully compiled until 450 years after Christ at the council of Chalcedon and was done so to mirror a decision made in 325 AD at the council of Nicea. A council that was assembled at the behest of a Roman emperor so that he could have one religion and one creed to unify his empire. There were more than 10 different Christian factions at the time. SOme of them fighting bitterly in thestreets of Aexandria.

 

Yeap. I know all that already. so, why do I believe still? I not asking you to tell me as if Im dounbting anything; Im saying that as to say that sometimes you have to relate to God and His way, rather than people and their facts.

 

Do you think if God was, that He did it wrong? Please explain. If God was, when these things came about, Do you think that He would have sent a glowing Book down and say this is the true Book, and that 500 witnessed this including a king, of whom wrote historical decree that says this event really happened?

 

Think hard, pastor. if that would have happened, then everyone would have knowledge that this event was real? Right. Or would they? Maybe, they would become skeptical and doubtful, degrading and trashing the event the king and all the other witnesses. Then, they would revolt againist the King and burn everthing that was written about this event. Then maybe some witnesses, of whom werent exactly important people, would take this and tell as many people as possible what happened. Many Choose to believe it, many choose to kill them, or rididcule them.

 

Now. Why did the people revolt againist the King? If God is God? Your Bible, answers your own questions, pastor. Because we are human being made in the likeness of God, yet we live in the flesh warring in spirit.

 

So. The Book that people died trying to distribute in small hidden printing presses, about Christ; You, Sir, can go to Wal Mart and buy for 5.99.

 

 

The end result is that one religion dominated and became what we know as Catholicism which later gave birth to Protestantism and all of its various factions. But I'm sure you know all of this right?

 

Really. I always assumed that the Protestant movement was in line more with the direct result of people in the Catholic religion that found some of their church doctrine, not Biblical. Martin Luther.

 

 

In case you hadn't noticed this is an exchristian site. I suspect after you have been here awhile and argued with everyone for a bit about your intolerant and self righteous ideas you will probably either end up swearing at some one or leave. Then again maybe the webmaster will tire of your ranting and raving and cut you off..

 

yes. I know. I have been posting here for almost 1yr and half now. Welcome aboard. Dont be so sure of yourself. Remeber. Thats why you were crushed in the first place.

 

 

 

In case you hadn't noticed this is an exchristian site. I suspect after you have been here awhile and argued with everyone for a bit about your intolerant and self righteous ideas you will probably either end up swearing at some one or leave. Then again maybe the webmaster will tire of your ranting and raving and cut you off..

 

Yes. I know. I have been posting here for almost 1yr and half now. Welcome aboard. Dont be so sure of yourself. Remeber. Thats why you were crushed in the first place.

[Abiyoyo]

 

 

yoyo,

the main reason I left was because I started studying the Bible academically and found that 99% of what modern American preachers say about the book in their churches (and how people can relate to God through the book) just simply is not true.

 

So, the variety of sects formed into Christianity was your bias toward disbelief in part. That makes sense though. I mean, God should have not let ther be a " stumbling block" for the ones that truly wanted to believe. Right.

 

To stand up in a pulpit and to say that God wrote the Bible or that Jesus was God and saves from sin is disingenuous, since good evidence points us away from those claims... That was enough to make me swear off the pulpit and search into "liberal Christianity"... but another year and a half or so of study (and reading in the library) pretty much equipped me with the mental tools to pull myself out of Christianity. I was finally honest with myself about the whole thing and found the courage to say "No."

 

Bishop. People say no to drugs, because they kill. People dont say No to god, unless they want to. Thats a fact. Just as much as you can give good reason to say No, I can, in my world, give good reson to say yes. I mean, for every informational avenue about the falseness of the Bible, there can be pointed avenues to the trueness of the Word. The deciding vote is the mindset, and its deep roots of emotional toil and process in getting to where someone is mentally at. Make sense?

 

Stubborness is as idolitary. Samuel.

 

I know where HanSolo is coming from too, there was a time when I was looking to have a certain experience or gifts with "God" that others in my church kept claiming they had done. So I waited and prayed and waited and read the Bible and waited and nothing ever happened. I guess I just didn't have enough faith...? (or none of it was "real.") They all told me that I "just think too much."

 

I truly understand. Sometimes life sucks, and we cant do anything about it. But, I do know that before I even believed in God, I always knew that everthing in my life was for a reason; Good and Bad. The frustrating part is the whole Hell, get Jesus quick scheme, that the church uses to get more money in the pots. Have you ever noticed the structure of most modern Protestant church services? I just observed and realised that everything, mostly is structured a certain way for a certain goal. Whether that goal is obtaining vistors info, to tithe collecting, to how many people got saved.

 

I was a business man. Very structured and balanced at that. Very successful, without God. Structure is a trait of a business. Antics is what I call it in sales. Structure that I used to truly respect in a business standpoint, are truly well thought and executed classy antics.

 

Since I was in a classy atmosphere, where feelings and emotions were invloved; I noticed this trait right off the bat in the church. They are classy sales people that dont trust God enough to support there cause. If they fail, then they werent going in the direction God wanted.

 

Nevertheless. Thats all outside judgement really. The fact is that we dont know what truly people intentions are, and God does. Ex. A preacher might be highly respected amung all the congregation and outside. Perfect gentleman. Perfect persona. Perfect speech patterns and direct impact to many. If this same man lusts after women in very ungodly ways, thinks about how he could start laundring money from the church, thinks about that needy widow, or divorcee, or even just down right starts going personal things nobody would know about or ever did.

 

So. What do you think God would let happen to this persons church that is under this authority. Dunno. But God does already. Remember, nobody knows anything other than good from this man.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Curiosity, courage and an adventurous nature is what it took to sail the seas. That, and greed and conquest, too.

Well. They sailed in a ship (with their enormious weight from others disproval); all for curiousity. Courage is out too. Courage is looking something that seems unobtainable and doing it anyway. i will say they had courage to actually set sail, of course, by faith that the earth was round, or hope. I probualy turned into a great adventure after they sailed by faith, and found that the earth was round.

 

 

 

Faith doesn't "discover the unknown", either. Faith makes shit up then parades around saying, "Look at me! Look what I got! I'm so special!"

 

And the serpent talked...

 

 

Are you pregnant?

 

 

 

 

 

How about all the harm it does! Fucking belief in majical figures, guilt, worry, moral upstandingness (when the very same churchoing, communion receiving christians will stab you right in the back.)

 

I know the difference between right and wrong. I've prayed all my life for nothing. Most christians I know are afraid of fuckin hell. If you study the issue, fucking hell was made up at a later time and the babble is just a book of rewritten fuckin fairytales. Reason enough?

 

 

Try praying for something bad to happen to you! Guess what! The same fuckin thing happens after such prayer, NOTHING.

In this we fuckin jesus pray,,,,amen!

 

You alright man. Bad shit has happened to me too. People are people. People will stab you in the back. Oh yeah. Its only worse in the other sects, Garrison.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I don't need any excuse. What's your excuse for still believing? (should I say just kidding too?)

 

I was told that if you really really prayed you would know the cut for denomiantional purposes. I really really prayed. I didn't get anything back. Lather, rince, repeat over many years. Eventually I gave up.

 

It seemed silly to cut for denominational purposes,

 

Since so many people were raised with other beliefs that seemed just as credible.

 

Yeap. Your right. I meet a muslim that Im friends with now and we peacfully talk about our beliefs

[Abiyoyo]

 

 

We had a serious accident '96, and one of my kids got hurt seriously. We still suffer the consequences. I did ask God for healing for my son, and it never came, but it didn't change my view on God much. I stayed a Christian for 5 years after the accident. The situation was eating me though. I tried to understand and figure out what to believe. Things didn't make sense anymore. I understood that the theology I had learned for a long time was wrong somehow. And I tried to figure out the "right" theology, and realized that nothing made sense. So in the end, I was becoming more and more convinced that the Bible gave a false image of God, but I still wanted to believe in some sort of God. I wanted to understand who/what God was and if he could hear me. I wanted to build my faith up from ground up, and not from what preachers, teachers or books told me to believe. I realized that only my own experience of God was important. So I tried. I wanted to stick with God, whatever or whoever he was. I then prayed, and asked this unknown God to educate me of his existence. And as I told you, I'm still waiting. The only education God has given me is that God does not exist. Or alternatively if God exists, then he wanted me to become what I am, an unbeliever. I stretched out my feeble and weak hand to God and asked for help before the last glow died, and he chose not to answer.

 

Hans. First and foremost. i want to apologize if I have offended you in any manner. Truly. You have been around here about as long as I have. I have read your testimony, and we have had a similar fallout in discussion in the past. Your situation is on my mind, more than you would ever know. I ask God, Why? Why would you let these things happen to this man and his family, when he is genuinely trying to obtain your help?

 

I truly had had you and your family in my thoughts for the better part of a year. I try to understand, but cant. I try to look for explantions, but come to blanks. The blanks, I perceive, are usually where most start losing there faith in the existance of God.

 

To top that off, I started living my very own hell in a lesser degree. No physical elements, or circumstances; just emotional. You know most of my story I assume. Its only gotten worse. I have actuall cursed God, literally, and yelled at Him. I ask Him if this is all some big freking joke or something. Sometimes I can just picture Him up there( Wherever) laughing at my emotional breakdowns.

 

So. Then, i dont pray. Its kinda odd. I kinda say whatever, like a girlfriend. I start doing my own thing, trying to avoid God in many ways. I try to use more reasoning, reality, and structure, than emotions. Then, I fall worse. Every time. I start this process of mine, of separation, until my life gets to the point of utter confusion and unfair circumstances.

 

People are cruel, and life sucks the majority of time for me. BBut, Hans. Its the times that God uses the littlest things to let me remember that everything is for a reason.

 

Good ex., My wife and I, prior to separation, where yelling and arguing very abruptly and loud. My daughter got upset( she was 4 at the time), and started crying, going into the bedroom. The wife and I kept going at it. My wife was this fanatic for Jesus stuff, like The Passion calander, whatnot. Well, we were fighting about what most do, money; so the calander was on the floor in the bedroom. Personnally, at this point in my life, I felt that same thing. I needed something to keep going, because I was close to disbelief. I was being wondered about by my family, pastors, friends, etc. because of my actions and how it looked. It really went from wondering to disowned. They were almost embarrassed of me in some way. A jesus freak, Bible beater. My pastor even told me not to think to deep into everything.

 

Anyhow, back to the calander. We were fighting, and my daughter started crying. She picked up this calander, walked over to me, and with this aggresive tone said, " Daddy! Remember, The soliders killed Him." She was pointing to Jesus on the calander. I instantly stopped fighting, and began crying so much I couldnt stop. Realizing that Christ already beared this burden, He already was beaten, spit on, ridiculed, and killed. If Christ can go through that and not deny His Father, of whom he also prayed to relieve Himself from death; then I can make peace with my wife.

 

 

I kept peace in the house for almost a year after that, until later things started to revolve. I sometimes regret leaving, even though my wife grew a hatred toward me and even told me to leave; I know that I shouldve stayed, because people like you Hans, stayed. People like Christ, stayed. Sometimes when we think we are the weakest, God shows us that we are the strongest He has.

 

You and your family are in my prayers, and have given me strength, to persevere to the end. Thats real Hans.

 

JK

 

 

 

 

Sorry anyone that i havent responded to yet.

 

 

I am ending this tread. I kinda just dont want to argue amymore.

[Guest JP]

Topic closed at YoYo's request.