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Evidence For The Bible As The Word Of God?


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Here is a guy who studied and researched the Bible for a very long time and concluded that it is the Word of God. Part of the reason I said this is because some of the people here said all we need to do to know the Bible isn't true is to read it. Check it out at www.amazingbible.com

It's pretty cool.

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Here is a guy who studied and researched the Bible for a very long time and concluded that it is the Word of God. Part of the reason I said this is because some of the people here said all we need to do to know the Bible isn't true is to read it. Check it out at www.amazingbible.com

 

It's pretty cool.

  1. You didn't provide any quote or active link
  2. Aren't you the guy who started the Christians And Non-christians, What's the point of debating? thread and then never acknowledged anyone's posts in that thread?

http://www.ex-christian.net/index.php?s=&a...st&p=214180

 

I'm been thinking about all the debates going on around these forums. Debating between Christians and non-christians is kinda like multiplying apples and oranges, so to speak. Christians will never see it their way, and non-christians will never see it our way. Christians walk by faith and not by sight {2 Cor. 5:7}, yet atheists and agnostics walk by site. If we say "You must have faith", they will call us ignorant. If they say "Look around you, God doesn't exist" we will say "We see Him everyday" or something like that. We will never see eye to eye. The Bible says it's the job of the Holy Spirit to convict people anyway. I'm not saying we shouldn't have discussions, but why debate? It's like going around in circles. Christians have heard every argument in the book that nonchristians have to offer, and I'm sure it goes the other way around too. So, what's the point?

 

And then you prance in here and begin a topic titled: Replying to evidence for the Bible as the Word of God? :banghead:

 

Are you really so niave as to think people are going to come in here and applaud you for finding a site full of such "wisdom" and "truth"?

 

Do you really believe, Scott, that folks here haven't "been there - done that" with literal interpretations of the Bible?

 

What in the world are you thinking? :banghead:

 

If you don't want a debate, why prance in here starting a thread linking people to site full of bullshit?

 

(Yes, NotBlinded I said, "bullshit" .... and I wasn't joking ..... look at the site .... it's chuck full of bullshit... And Scotty here, doesn't want a debate.)

 

______________________

 

Oh ... and Scott .... at least have the curtiousy to respond to people when they post in a thread that you've started. :nono:

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Here is a guy who studied and researched the Bible for a very long time and concluded that it is the Word of God. Part of the reason I said this is because some of the people here said all we need to do to know the Bible isn't true is to read it. Check it out at www.amazingbible.com

It's pretty cool.

\

Scott, I am a guy who studied and researched the bible for a very long time and concluded that it is not the word of any god. What makes your guy any different from me, other than the fact that you choose to believe him instead of me?

 

P.S. I note that you have placed this topic in The Lion's Den, right off the bat.

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What is it with fundies and their addiction to the caps lock? I couldn't get past the first page of that website because it's too damn hard on the eyes.

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Check it out at www.amazingbible.com

It's pretty cool.

Here is a quote

I was searching to find if the Bible was true. My wife spent a lot of time at the library making copies of various reference materials, which I would check out against the Scriptures. Stubborn, that's me. Even after four weeks of intensive study, proving prophecy after prophecy was true, I was still skeptical and refused to believe. I began taking more time off from my business and investing it in study. One month turned into two, and two months turned into four. The more I researched, the more determined I became. It wasn't possible. The Bible could not be perfect. Thousands of prophecies, and every one perfect? No, impossible! Sixty-six books written by many people over hundreds of years and not one error? If I would admit that, I would have to admit there was a God, and I was not prepared to do it, even after months of research.

My studies also included various translations of the Bible, checking prophecies against reference books, archaeological discoveries, just to mention some. It became an obsession with me. My foremost desire was to know the truth. Four months turned into many months. I’ve never known anyone, before or since, that was willing to take this amount of time just to find out if the Bible was true. Finally, I had to admit—I was wrong.

 

As you can see he based most of his ideas on typical bible prophecies and found that the bible must be true because all the prophecies came true. Sigh....the whole site is so misinformed. I like how english people try to pull apart bits of Jewish text and say they are prophecy. I also love how many prophecies aren't even there. You should go to a Jewish site and see if the bible fulfills all the prophecies

 

Try this site http://www.messiahtruth.com/response.html

Amongst the most basic missions that the Messiah will accomplish during his lifetime (Isaiah 42:4) are to:

 

 

Oversee the rebuilding of Jerusalem, including the Third Temple, in the event that it has not yet been rebuilt (Michah 4:1 and Ezekiel 40-45)

 

Gather the Jewish people from all over the world and bring them home to the Land of Israel (Isaiah 11:12; 27:12-13)

 

Influence every individual of every nation to abandon and be ashamed of their former beliefs (or non-beliefs) and acknowledge and serve only the One True God of Israel (Isaiah 11:9-10; 40:5 and Zephaniah 3:9)

 

Bring about global peace throughout the world (Isaiah 2:4; 11:5-9 and Michah 4:3-4).

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If Emperor Julian had been more successful and hadn't been murdered by one of his own recently-converted Jesus-freak soldiers, we would be reading a very different Word Of God.

 

This is almost the entire history of Xianity: murder. It is an evil, freaky religion. Although I don't find most modern Xians to be murderers (just some of them), I do think they are a little freaky. When they talk to me, it's like in my head I can hear the theme from The Twilight Zone.

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One thing to note...if you look in all the pages of the Bible, it never refers to it's self as "The Word of God." You simply won't find it in print anywhere inside there......

 

That...and every single outside source that tries to prove the bible is the word of god ultimately falls right back onto the bible for source material to support the hypothesis.

 

Otherwise known as using the bible to prove the bible and trying to hide the logic fallacy by surrounding it with kitchy heart-tugging anecdotal testimony and Aesop Fable modelled morality tales.

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Here is a guy who studied and researched the Bible for a very long time and concluded that it is the Word of God. Part of the reason I said this is because some of the people here said all we need to do to know the Bible isn't true is to read it. Check it out at www.amazingbible.com

It's pretty cool.

 

Alright, I give up...what's so damn cool about it? Looks like a jumbo fundie-festival to me.

 

Now, Scott, since fair is fair, try these:

Ask Why (Click on "Christianity Revealed")

Jesus Never Existed

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The Bible doesn't just say "This is the Word of God". This is a phrase like the Trinity or the Rapture. While their names are not mentioned, they are described. The same goes here.

 

All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work." 2 Timothy 3:16-17

 

But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation, for no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God." 2 Peter 1:20-21

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You continue to quote the bible in order to prove the bible.

 

Here is a guy who studied and researched the Bible for a very long time and concluded that it is the Word of God. Part of the reason I said this is because some of the people here said all we need to do to know the Bible isn't true is to read it. Check it out at www.amazingbible.com

It's pretty cool.

 

Alright, I give up...what's so damn cool about it? Looks like a jumbo fundie-festival to me.

 

Now, Scott, since fair is fair, try these:

Ask Why (Click on "Christianity Revealed")

Jesus Never Existed

I doubt that scott will click on your links, but I did. Thanks - good reading.

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The Bible doesn't just say "This is the Word of God". This is a phrase like the Trinity or the Rapture. While their names are not mentioned, they are described. The same goes here.

 

All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work." 2 Timothy 3:16-17

 

But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation, for no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God." 2 Peter 1:20-21

 

If this is the way you determine the WORD OF GOD then you have a problem because the same criteria can be used to determine that scripture from other world religions is also the WORD OF GOD.

 

As YOU say, Scott.... "The same goes here".

 

http://www.unification.net/ws/theme111.htm

 

Islam. Qur'an 41.41-42

Lo! it is an unassailable Scripture. Falsehood cannot come at it from before it or behind it.
It is a revelation from the Wise, the Owner of Praise
.

 

Sikhism. Adi Granth, Ramkali Siddha Goshti, M.1, p. 943

This age stands in need of the holy Preceptor's teaching. The holy Word is the Preceptor
; by devoted meditation on it am I its disciple. By absorbing the discourse of the Inexpressible I remain free from the taint of illusion.

 

Baha'i Faith. Epistle to the Son of the Wolf, 128

O leaders of religion!
Weigh not the Book of God with such standards and sciences as are current among you, for the Book itself is the unerring Balance established among men
. In this most perfect Balance whatever the peoples and kindreds possess must be weighed, while the measure of its weight should be tested according to its own standard, did you but know it.

 

Confucianism. I Ching, Great Commentary 1.10.1-2

The Book of Changes contains the fourfold Tao of the holy sages. In speaking, we should be guided by its judgments; in action, we should be guided by its changes; in making objects, we should be guided by its images; in seeking an oracle, we should be guided by its pronouncements.

 

Therefore the superior man, whenever he has to make or do something, consults the Changes, and he does so in words. It takes up his communications like an echo; neither far nor near, neither dark nor deep exist for it, and thus he learns of the things of the future.
If this book were not the most spiritual thing on earth, how could it do this
?

 

So.... Scott... are you now willing to embrace these other world scriptures as the "WORD OF GOD"?

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No Scott, the Bible isn't the word of God, but the Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy is. The Guide is the only book that contains the Truth.

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No Scott, the Bible isn't the word of God, but the Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy is. The Guide is the only book that contains the Truth.

Were those your helicopters? And what about the black SUVs?

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I clicked on the links, Piprus.

 

No, Open_Minded, the Bible is the only Word of God.

 

I have a question for all of you. I have been studying Scripture & Prophecy for a long time. How is it that many prophesies {such as Israel becoming a nation in 1948} have been fulfilled? Of course, many prophesies will come in the future, but how do you explain the fulfilled prophesies? How do you esplain the events of today's world happening as prophecy said it would in exact detail?

 

Another question, and this is not meant to be a joke of any kind. Why is it, that people in today's world say that they have had visions of Jesus Christ {Not to be confused with dreams}? I know of three people who had these visions and I'm one of them. So tell me, how do you explain this?

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No, Open_Minded, the Bible is the only Word of God.

And... exactly how do you know this Scott. I'm serious, do you expect me, and everyone else on this board to think, "Well, Scott says the Bible is the only Word of God, so that makes it so."?

 

I have a question for all of you. I have been studying Scripture & Prophecy for a long time. How is it that many prophesies {such as Israel becoming a nation in 1948} have been fulfilled? Of course, many prophesies will come in the future, but how do you explain the fulfilled prophesies? How do you esplain the events of today's world happening as prophecy said it would in exact detail?

 

Every nation has it's prophets, Scott. If you're seriously interested in prophesies and how they are filled you many want to study Native American prophesies about the earth's environment.

 

http://www.paragonhouse.com/catalog/produc...products_id=142

DID THE ANCIENT MAYAN AND AZTEC CALENDARS PREDICT THE END OF THE WORLD IN OUR TIME? WILL SEATTLE'S MT. RAINIER SOON ERUPT AND "WIPE THE LAND CLEAR TO THE SEA"? HAS THE GREAT CYCLE OF EARTH CHANGES ALREADY BEGUN?

 

The startling, sometimes frightening, predictions of Native American prophets have proven remarkably accurate and relevant in the past. It was the Hopi, for example, who foresaw the Rising Sun of Japan and the swastika of Nazi Germany. For generations, these seers have warned us to respect the land from which we all spring or face dire consequences. Today, their warnings have renewed significance in light of the social and environmental changes now sweeping the planet.

 

In this thought-provoking book, Scott Peterson explores Native American wisdom, its origins~and history, and its relevance today. First discussed are the predictions, practices, and calendars of the Mayans and Aztecs. Next examined are two Native American prophets whose wisdom often

proposed ways of regaining dignity and personal power in an unstable and hostile environment: Deganawidah the Peacemaker whose visionary system of political organization influenced Benjamin Franklin; and Wovoka, the Paiute Messiah who foresaw the end of the white race and

reestablishment of an Indian paradise. As his chilling Ghost Dance swept across the nations of the Plains, the increasing deceptions and self-delusions sustaining his cult ultimately ignited the massacre at Wounded Knee. Finally Scott Peterson introduces us to contemporary Native American prophets and their astonishing prophecies for our future, including the charismatic and controversial Sun Bear, whose visions of coming earth changes--from volcanic eruption to nuclear war--hold lessons for us all.

 

An exciting blend of North American Indian culture, history, and biographies of our most, powerful Native American visionaries, Native American Prophecies raises a compelling plea to step off the path of social and environmental earth contamination that we currently tread and embrace a natural respect for our Earth Mother.

 

TABLE OF CONTENTS

 

Preface to the Second Edition

Introduction

CHAPTER ONE The Mayan Roots of Prophecy

CHAPTER TWO The Aztecs: Cult of the Fifth Sun

CHAPTER THREE Deganawidah: Peacemaker of the Iroquois

CHAPTER FOUR Chief Seattle: Seer of the Suquamish

CHAPTER FIVE Wovoka: Paiute Ghost Dancer

CHAPTER SIX Sun Bear: Save the Planet

CHAPTER SEVEN White Shell Woman: Beloved of the Navajo

CHAPTER EIGHT The Hopi: Waiting for Pahana

 

Or if you're still not convinced that other faith traditions have their prophesies as well, check out the following:

 

Hinduism. Mahabharata, Udyoga Parva 95

After all the kings had been seated and perfect silence had ensued, Krishna, possessing fine teeth and having a voice as deep as that of a drum, began to speak, "In order that, O Bharata, peace may be established between the Kurus and the Pandavas without a slaughter of the heroes, I have come hither. Besides this, O king, I have no other beneficial words to utter.... Know, O thou of Kuru's race, that those wicked sons of thine, headed by Duryodhana, abandoning both virtue and profit, disregard- ing morality, and deprived of their senses by avarice, are now acting most unrighteously towards their foremost kinsmen. The terrible danger [of universal slaughter thus] has its origin in the conduct of the Kurus. If you become indifferent to it, it will then produce a universal slaughter. If, O Bharata, you are willing, you may be able to allay that danger even yet, for peace, I think, is not difficult of acquisition. The establishment of peace, O king, depends on you and myself. Set right your sons, and I will set the Pandavas right."

 

African Traditional Religion. Dinka Prayer (Sudan)

O Lord, your power is greater than all powers. Under your leadership we cannot fear anything. It is you who has given us prophetic power, And has enabled us to foresee and interpret everything.

 

Confucianism. Doctrine of the Mean 24

It is an attribute of the possession of the absolute true self to be able to foreknow. When a nation or family is about to flourish, there are sure to be lucky omens. When a nation or family is about to perish, there are sure to be signs and prodigies. These things manifest themselves in the instruments of divination and in the agitation of the human body. When happiness or calamity is about to come, it can be known beforehand. When it is good, it can be known beforehand. When it is evil, it can be known beforehand. Therefore he who has realized his true self is like a celestial spirit.

 

Another question, and this is not meant to be a joke of any kind. Why is it, that people in today's world say that they have had visions of Jesus Christ {Not to be confused with dreams}? I know of three people who had these visions and I'm one of them. So tell me, how do you explain this?

 

Do you really believe people of other faiths don't have visions as well, Scott. You really need to study the Native American tradition, you really do. Visions abound in all faith traditions - that alone should tell you something.

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Another question, and this is not meant to be a joke of any kind. Why is it, that people in today's world say that they have had visions of Jesus Christ {Not to be confused with dreams}? I know of three people who had these visions and I'm one of them. So tell me, how do you explain this?

Religious hysteria.

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I have a question for all of you. I have been studying Scripture & Prophecy for a long time. How is it that many prophesies {such as Israel becoming a nation in 1948} have been fulfilled? Of course, many prophesies will come in the future, but how do you explain the fulfilled prophesies? How do you esplain the events of today's world happening as prophecy said it would in exact detail?

Many things can be explained by self fulfilling prophecies. Also, the "prophecies" are interpreted depending on the light of current events. You see what you want to see. Cryptic and vague messages in form of so called prophecies can always be interpreted to fit the events you want them to fit to.

 

Can you please give the verse that most accurately prophecy Israel to become a nation again and we can take a look at them? Over the years I've forgotten them.

 

Another question, and this is not meant to be a joke of any kind. Why is it, that people in today's world say that they have had visions of Jesus Christ {Not to be confused with dreams}? I know of three people who had these visions and I'm one of them. So tell me, how do you explain this?

It's a psychological phenomenon. Muhammad had visions of Gabriel, Moses, Jesus and God, but yet you don't believe in Islam. How come?

 

Most likely, unbeknownst to you, you had a natural occurrence of lucid dreaming.

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I clicked on the links, Piprus.

 

No, Open_Minded, the Bible is the only Word of God.

 

I have a question for all of you. I have been studying Scripture & Prophecy for a long time. How is it that many prophesies {such as Israel becoming a nation in 1948} have been fulfilled? Of course, many prophesies will come in the future, but how do you explain the fulfilled prophesies? How do you esplain the events of today's world happening as prophecy said it would in exact detail?

 

Another question, and this is not meant to be a joke of any kind. Why is it, that people in today's world say that they have had visions of Jesus Christ {Not to be confused with dreams}? I know of three people who had these visions and I'm one of them. So tell me, how do you explain this?

 

Here ya go, Scott...

Prophecies: Imaginary and Unfulfilled

 

As far as those "visions" go...I second Renfield. Religious hysteria. A fairly common phenomenon, actually...happens to schizophrenics a lot.

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No, Open_Minded, the Bible is the only Word of God.

 

 

 

 

Whoa!!!

 

Back that train back up to the station Scott!!!

 

O_M just listed scripture from other sources that claim the supreme being had a hand in their coming to be!

 

What makes the bible's claim of being 'god inspired' more valid than the exact same claim coming from the Qur'an, or the other sources listed?

 

It's the EXACT same thing!!

 

So how can you even have the gall to claim the bible is really THE ONE? Based on WHAT? Because it's what you just so 'happen' to have devoted your life to believing? Gee how convienient for you! Must totally suck to be a muslim who has devoted their whole life to the exact same claim from another book....because obviously they are wrong! [major sarcasm here]

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I clicked on the links, Piprus.

 

No, Open_Minded, the Bible is the only Word of God.

No it's not. There, I just proved it isnt, right?

 

I have a question for all of you. I have been studying Scripture & Prophecy for a long time.

So have we. Probably considerably longer than you if your in your early 20's which I suspect.

 

How is it that many prophesies {such as Israel becoming a nation in 1948} have been fulfilled?

Which prophecy are you referring to? That vague verses that says, "When you see the budding of the fig tree, this generation shall not pass...."?

 

Of course, many prophesies will come in the future, but how do you explain the fulfilled prophesies? How do you esplain the events of today's world happening as prophecy said it would in exact detail?

Yes it is quite fascinating indeed how scholars and theologians prior to those living in todays political climates had entirely different explainations as to what those prophecies were about. Most of them saw the book of Revelation referring directly to the Roman Empire of that day, not some revised Roman Empire that the dispensationalists in the 19th Century started talking about.

 

Your interpretation of prophecy is infused with a modern way of looking at it, made popluar in the 70's with Hal Lindsey and his book "The Late Great Planet Earth". Try reading some commentaries from the 15th century for their predictions and interpretations. It'll make you think twice about things being so clear Scott. Your a victim of the classic con job where you are told what something says, then shown it in writting to confirm it. Explain everyone elses interpretations of prophecies that don't agree with you first before we go down the path of arguing interpretation.

 

Another question, and this is not meant to be a joke of any kind. Why is it, that people in today's world say that they have had visions of Jesus Christ {Not to be confused with dreams}? I know of three people who had these visions and I'm one of them. So tell me, how do you explain this?

Easy answer. Your experience was real. It really happened. You supplied the symbols of your cultural mythology as a language for you to interpret something that went beyond the ordinary in your life which you already have a vocabulary for in order for you mind to relate to it. This is why if you had been raised in India, you would have seen a Blue Krishna, or in Saudi Arabia you would have seen Mohamad on a flying horse, etc. BTW Scott, I had a vision too. Don't think that proves Jesus is real.

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Prophecies only happen if you make them happen.

 

Plus God did in fact lie about a prophecy which never happend. The return of Christ.

 

( Runs before Scott starts throwing verses and saying I am wrong)

 

Here is where Jesus was wrong and lied

 

 

Amen, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation. (Matthew 23:36 NAB)

 

"Immediately after the tribulation of those days, the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. And then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming upon the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And he will send out his angels with a trumpet blast, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other. "Learn a lesson from the fig tree. When its branch becomes tender and sprouts leaves, you know that summer is near. In the same way, when you see all these things, know that he is near, at the gates. Amen, I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things have taken place. Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will not pass away. (Matthew 24:29-35 NAB)

 

 

 

These are just prime examples. Why would God say he would come in that generation?When that generation is long dead and gone. God didn't say he would come in our generation at all. Christians assume end times all the time and want it to happen.

 

It shows the validity of the Bible is weak. There are 363 contradictions in the whole Bible. Scott I gave you 125 + 25 Verses of God being a murdering lunatic. Yet you have dodged everything we are trying to tell you. You sound like a preacher that is a bitch , that won't see the obvious.

 

The Bible was INSPIRED by God. Not written by God. It was written by non educated men. The Quaran was INSPIRED by Allah but at least Mohammad, (their leader) wrote it actually. Jesus didn't write a single thing.

 

 

Complete List of all 363 Contradictions in The " Holy Bible" ( Not so Holy any more)

 

http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/contra/by_name.html

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The Bible doesn't just say "This is the Word of God". This is a phrase like the Trinity or the Rapture. While their names are not mentioned, they are described. The same goes here.

 

All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work." 2 Timothy 3:16-17

 

But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation, for no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God." 2 Peter 1:20-21

 

Scott,

 

i really love these passages, because when they were written... the Bible didn't fully exist in its present form.... so they can't possibly be referring to the Bible

 

The 2 Peter quote is the greatest because 1. 2 Peter never quotes the bible... but does quote the apochryphal text "the assumption of Moses." Why is 2 peter quoting a book that wasn't considered "biblical?" 2. 2 Peter isn't talking about scripture in this passage, but rather the interpretation of Scripture. 3. The method of interpreting scripture suggested by this passage is fascist. ie, "it's our scripture and you can't interpret it without us."

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CB,

 

I'm glad your here at Ex-C. Your posts are great! It's nice having a scholar on the boards to learn from your knowledge.

 

Taph

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So have we. Probably considerably longer than you if your in your early 20's which I suspect.

 

I believe Scott is 18 according to his bio page. Which means his claims of having studied the bible for a "long" time is utterly ridiculous. When I started college as a religion major he was about 9 years old...which means I've been studying this religion for half of his life.

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I believe Scott is 18 according to his bio page. Which means his claims of having studied the bible for a "long" time is utterly ridiculous. When I started college as a religion major he was about 9 years old...which means I've been studying this religion for half of his life.

Oh yes, that makes sense. I was actually thinking he sounded younger that early 20's. We're just a bunch of old farts here who can't see how clear cut and black and white the answers are, because our old minds are getting soft and mushy :Old: , not tight and firm like the brain muscles of an 18 year old! Hell, I remember back at that age how clear all the answers were, how people were so blind not to see the truth like I could see it!

 

This isn't about religious beliefs at all. This is about a kid who thinks he has it all figured out! He's right on one thing, it's pointless to debate theology with him. This is about him feeling independent from mom and dad, not a pursuit of knowledge. :grin:

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