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Is God Powerless Or Unwilling?


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This is my first post on this board and a bit long winded.

 

Throughout my life I have always questioned not only the existence of God but also as to his intent and mindset. Talking to many hardcore Christians i typically get shot down with them telling me "you should adhere to his teachings but don't question his purpose or mindset". I feel that this is a valuable question that is often supressed by Christians. When a disaster strikes and hundreds of thousands die (Tsunami) ultimately people can and often will question their creator. How can a purported loving God allow such things to happen? With the mere presence of evil in the world, God's foundations are rather precarious. Is God powerless to stop evil? If so he isn't an omnipotent God. Does God allow evil to exist? If so he cannot be perfectly good negating his godliness. The third option is that there is no true good/evil and/or God just doesn't concern himself with such events. When a massive earthquake or Katrina situation happens? Did God cause it for a previous indiscretion? Why do we as humans attempt to attribute actions as being involved or caused by a god? Earthquakes, fires, thunder & lightning, famine, drought, and disease time and time again have all been looked at as a sign of an angry god when there is no direct correlation between the act and the supposed creator? Without science and understanding would we not still cower in fear of an angry god when a thunderstorm goes overhead?

 

Why do evangelical Christians often say that a Katrina or Twin Tower or Sri Lankan tsunami was because of an angry god? Does this not show just how polluted and intolerant the Christian faith has become? For a religion supposedly based on Love and compassion in my travels I have seen Faith and God used to sell products, to instill fear to ensure obediance, and to use it as a justification to aggressively proselytize, and also as moral justification to supress, dominate, and to make war with others that the church would see as inferior or infidels. During the crusades was the Christian God pleased or offended by the droves of Europeans reclaiming the Holy lands? Was he angered that his own disciples broke his most sacred law about taking life for some square miles of land? Where was God then? There were TEN crusades which shows God had his chance to intervene and stop the killing in his name. If a loving God allows his creations to kill others using his name wouldn't you be living in a hipocracy?

 

Overtime there have been many ideas as to what God's will is or what he represents. We have the Roman and Greek pantheon of Gods who represented various Human attributes such as war, drunkeness, jealousy, and love. Those have been done away with in our modern world with the idea of an all encompassing God which is creator/guardian/judge/and knower of all things. Much of the Roman Empire's expansion was caused because they admitted their warlike tendencies and worshipped deities which catered to their mindset. Again fast forward today and the message of expansion of the Empire (Roman or Christian or otherwise) is now shrouded in a convienient message of love. Gone are the days of being truthful and direct with people about your intentions. Now Christians hide their message of fear, forceful conversion, and hatred towards non believers in a conveniently supposedly "holy" sales pitch. Throughout my years in dealing with Christians I have always had an issue with the whole duality system of heaven/hell, punishment/reward, and sin/virtue. All i learned from Christians was that if you weren't a believer you were punished regardless of your worth as a person. I learned that good deeds mean absolutely nothing unless you believe in Jesus and these most simple issues is what makes me vehemently opposed to Christianity. Regardless of how a person lives, his "worth" spiritually is what determines his post mortem reward or punishment. Should I invent the cure for cancer but not believe in Jesus but Sikhism instead I am punished regardless of how many I save with my cure. These little questions have always bugged me and it has pushed me to outright despise Christianity. Christians have attempted to proselytize me many times over the years. Why push people with an empty rhetoric of punishment just to increase the Church coffers? Why the cover story PR image of love and acceptance when the underlying cloth that makes up the faith is a Them/Us mentality? If Christians truly their fellow man should they not leave people be to their own choices? Is religion not the most effective when one comes to the conclusions themselves instead of being force fed by an army or people who supposedly care about saving your soul?

 

In my studies Buddhism frowns upon any proselytizing. It must be sought out for oneself to discover what one believes to be personal truth. I've never been approached by a Buddhist to convert nor even a Muslim, Zoroastrian, or Taoist. Why do Christians feel so obligated so push their spiritual beliefs on others and feel that they are doing the "right thing" when in essence they are trying to destroy and rebuild you spiritual beliefs to their liking? Didn't Jesus himself preach tolerance? Why do Christians continue to view me as someone who needs to be saved when I don't require "saving"? If God did supposedly create this planet, isn't the bio diversity and millions of species (past & future) proof that God didn't want everyone to be the same both physically and spiritually. Can't we infer that God intended there to be multiple paths and religions that can reveal spritual truths? Why do Christian zealots campaign to make the world Christian when diversity is so apparent in our lives?

 

Christianity has evolved overtime to be the ultimate control tool. It is a way to replace the limitless imagination of the human mind with conformity and an us/them mentality which can prove to be harmful to the collective whole of all humanity. We've seen in recent times the use of Christianity in regards to politics and especially the Presidency. We've seen God used as a pawn to further the dominion of man. In history we have such dark times including the inquisition, the crusades, and the conqeuring and Christianization of the new world with the landing of the conquistadors. We've seen Christianity used to justify the repression of women and also used to degrade their value to mere baby factories in the Fundamentalist Morman sects. God has been used as a prime instrument in the brainwashing and reprogramming of people. Jonestown, Waco, Sun Myung Moon, and recently captured Warren Jeffs of the FLDS and so many other prime examples of religion gone wrong.

 

What ultimately can Christianity provide us with? Does it serve as something that can unify people or divide them further? The current Christian mindset of non believers is that they are incomplete or do not have the full truth and that they are missing something that only Christianity can provide. Other religions (for the most part) which claim and practice tolerance never say to others that theirs is the only way to discover spritual truths. Followers of Christianity are quite the opposite. They seek to win converts by any means and present an image that theirs is the only "true" spiritual belief. This mentality is used by many to elevate and promote oneself above those deemed inferior to supress, convert, and then enlighten with ones own dogma and beliefs. Here you have a religion where it is commonplace for it's members to look at non believers as incomplete people who need help even when it's not asked for. You have a ethic of expansion at any cost even if it means intruding and forceful conversion (which Jesus whold abhor). This elitist attitute gives many christians a superiority complex. I've had Christians tell me to my face on a street that I would burn in hell for not believing in jesus and that I required direction and needed to find Christian faith to be complete.

 

Ultimately our society and planet are ultimately doomed when a group of humans can and will continue to believe that they are better and have all the answers and attempt to make others think, feel, and pray in the same way. Christians many times attempt to belittle people telling you that your incomplete or damaged without their guidance and the Bible. Men crave power and it comes in so many flavors. Some control others by force. Some occupy countries. Others cover it up with deceit and make it fluffy on the outside but deeply divisive and intolerant on the inside. The quote iron fish in a velvet glove comes to mind.

 

Christianity is just a byproduct in man's neverending quest for power over all facets of live both real and imagined. Power over people, the environment and over your soul. The alpha male mentality of making others submit to your will is ever more apparent even in our supposed advanced society. What better power is there for a priest than to tell a non believer that he is broken and that he alone knows how to fix it in exchange for obedience? It's like an auto glass worker who breaks windows at night so he'll make more money fixing them the next day. To me though it looks like classic bait & switch. Make of it what you will.

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This is my first post on this board and a bit long winded.

 

Throughout my life I have always questioned not only the existence of God but also as to his intent and mindset......

It just seems to me that you have to solve the problem of it's existence BEFORE you question it's mindset.
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God may be almighty but not necessarily omnipotent. The Bible says there is something that God cannot do:

 

"And the Lord was with Judah; and he drave out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron." (Judges 1:19) KJV

 

If God can't even handle chariots of iron, then how is he supposed to handle all the evil in the world? :grin:

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Welcome to Ex-Christian.net

 

I will try to answer this for you the way I interpret it

 

God is Unwilling

 

Here is how I see God

 

My analogy:

 

Lets say I am a firefighter and I can save you and everything. I find out that somone is going to start a fire and it will kill you. I know the time/how you will die since I found some sources.

 

Well the fire starts and you die BUT I KNEW IT WOULD HAPPEN. That is unwilling to help and cause pain.

 

Which this connects with God is not moral then;

 

Lets pretend God is real for a second and he is all knowing like he says he is:

 

The Holocaust (the worst event in history happend) God just watched those people get mass murdered and did nothing. If I had the power to stop it I would but I am not all powerful like God says he is and he did nothing.

 

September 11th- I read the 9/11 report (good read I recommend it). The planes got hijacked and 1,000's of people died. If I was God I would give someone the message and use my powers but did God do anything no?

 

Prayer- I am not going there, well I will. I prayed for God to show himself right before I was an athesist. I prayed and said " Please answer one prayer and I will believe you." (It was at a hard time) God did not answer the prayer of course and thus look where I am today. The fight against religion for me. If God knew I would turn and become an atheist why would he not do anything...

 

AIDS/Disease/Famin/drought/pain/cancer/suffering/genocide/killings/molesting kids (pastors)/fires/horrible deaths/crusades/sept 11/hurricane katrina

 

This is just a list of horrible things in this world and guess what God did not do anything to stop this. It proves that this character really is a bitch in the end. Look in the Bible and the disturbing things that GOD ORDERS HIMSELF. Killing of pregant woman and dashing with a sword. God is not loving and he is unwilling and powerless since he does not exsist.

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God may be almighty but not necessarily omnipotent. The Bible says there is something that God cannot do:

 

"And the Lord was with Judah; and he drave out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron." (Judges 1:19) KJV

 

If God can't even handle chariots of iron, then how is he supposed to handle all the evil in the world? :grin:

 

 

I think its judah that couldn't do it in this passage, although if all powerful god couldn't help him then your point stands. Maybe god is made of timber.

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Welcome to the boards :)

 

In my opinion, a god who is all-loving and all-powerful cannot exist. This goes most especially for the Xian god of Yahooweh/Jebus/Holy Spurt. Any god with the power to create what he can conceive can create a literal paradise, where there is no evil and a billion times the variety and potential this one has, if he so chooses. A god who is all-good/loving would never permit evil or any kind of ill to exist if he has the power to stop it. A god with both characteristics cannot possibly will into creation anything less than a literal paradise, and one with unlimited potential for his creations with the added bonus of being evil-free.

 

Such a world does not exist, therefore such a god does not exist. There's no smoke, so there ain't no fire.

 

Hence, the all-loving, all-powerful, all-perfect Xian god cannot possibly exist. The question is not whether "God" is powerless or unwilling, but rather why don't people just see that such a god cannot possibly exist, given the chaotic and ill-fraught world we live in.

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