Garden Of Eden And The Fall Of Man

[sparkyone]

Hi,

I'm pretty new here, so I'm trying to figure out how to start getting into some discussions. I'm pretty open to other points of view, but I usually find things to criticize in sermons at my fundamental Baptist church. Like just recently we had a sermon based on Genesis 3, about the tree of "doubt" that is fertilized by the "manure of pride" and so on. I'm starting to think that parts of Genesis are more mythical than historical. After all, the book wasn't put into writing until maybe a few thousand years after the purported events. To get back to the sermon, it was the same basic application I've heard before, of how the man (Adam) should have made sure his wife was doing right, since it was his responsibility. Also, that the reason wives should obey their husbands is because part of the curse on Eve was having Adam ruling over her, and so on. To start with, weren't those curses given specifically to Adam and Eve, not to the entire human race after them? Also, I noticed that what God said would happen didn't (they would die in the day they ate of the tree) and what the serpent said (nowhere does it say it was the devil tempting them, does it?) did happen, at least in part (they would be as gods, knowing good and evil). Why doesn't the pastor ever point that little tidbit out? He says that even if something looks good, doesn't mean it can't hurt you, and if God says not to do something, than just don't do it. How does one know that God is telling you anything? Oh, I'm supposed to go by the Bible? That's way too ambigious to really know what it right in every situation.

sparkyone

[Poonis]

Read Formal Debate Poonis vs. Amanda, Snake in Genesis in 'The Arena' section, especially my argument at http://www.ex-christian.net/index.php?s=&a...ost&p=39257

 

In that debate I simply referenced the bible unto itself as an excercize in showing what happens when done so, but as an atheist I hold the entire bible to be a malevolent lie used ultimately to control others on the basis of fears and desires.

[Dave]

Hi,

I'm pretty new here, so I'm trying to figure out how to start getting into some discussions. I'm pretty open to other points of view, but I usually find things to criticize in sermons at my fundamental Baptist church. Like just recently we had a sermon based on Genesis 3, about the tree of "doubt" that is fertilized by the "manure of pride" and so on. I'm starting to think that parts of Genesis are more mythical than historical. After all, the book wasn't put into writing until maybe a few thousand years after the purported events......

That's right. None of the bible is historical. The "flood"; didn't happen. The whole Moses thing; didn't happen. And you know that incident where 42 children were torn apart by a "she-bear" as punishment for calling an old man "baldy" didn't happen. Do you honestly believe they stood there, quietly, waiting their turn to be torn apart? All the New Testament stuff; didn't happen. jesus, not one shred of evidence that he even existed.

 

When anyone starts an argument for the belief in a god, and starts with the bible, just stop them right there and easily eliminate the bible. They usually have nothing left.

[Antlerman]

To get back to the sermon, it was the same basic application I've heard before, of how the man (Adam) should have made sure his wife was doing right, since it was his responsibility. Also, that the reason wives should obey their husbands is because part of the curse on Eve was having Adam ruling over her, and so on. To start with, weren't those curses given specifically to Adam and Eve, not to the entire human race after them?

Well, your pastor doesn't appear to be approaching this very critically. The myth of Adam and Eve isn't about women being in submission to men. He really should stop to question how this tale speaks to a pre-fall condition of humanity. In the pre-fall story it begins with there being no real division of the sexes, they didn't know they were naked nor a difference (depending which of the 2 different creation stories in Genesis your looking at). The point is prior to the fall of man there was unity with man, nature and god. No man over woman bullshit.

 

What you will see again and again in churches, and with a lot of home-brew preachers particularly, is that they will take modern culture and values and read them back into the Bible stories. Though mythology has the ability to fit any sort of story you want it to, including justifying genocide if you are so disposed to reading it that way, to really appreciate what it is you have to understand the origins of the myths, the peoples, their cultures, contemporary myths etc.

 

If you want to get a quick primer course on the Creation myth and the Flood myth, you should look at the Sumerian myths that predate the Genesis adaptation of these stories for a little better understanding of what these things are addressing: http://faculty.gvsu.edu/websterm/SumerianMyth.htm

 

For myself, I see the adaptation of the Sumerian myth as speaking about human being's view of themselves as being separate from each other and nature. It's the whole dualistic nature of man story, that we define everything including ourselves by virtue of opposites. "This is hot because that is cold; this is good because that is bad; I am me because I am not you"; and so on. The pre-fall myth, the Garden of Eden story is about imagining ourselves in a projected perfection where there is no separation or opposites.

 

Now that's a far cry down the road from a pastor talking about how man failed to be a good husband to "the little wifey"!

[sparkyone]

Read Formal Debate Poonis vs. Amanda, Snake in Genesis in 'The Arena' section, especially my argument at http://www.ex-christian.net/index.php?s=&a...ost&p=39257

 

In that debate I simply referenced the bible unto itself as an excercize in showing what happens when done so, but as an atheist I hold the entire bible to be a malevolent lie used ultimately to control others on the basis of fears and desires.

 

Hi,

Thanks for the link. I read through that debate, but it just seemed like Amanda just kept throwing in verses from the N.T. and trying to explain away what should be pretty straightforward. Why do people think that the Bible is supposed to be hard to understand without the "Spirit" leading? Because it says so in the N.T. It also opens it wide open for all sorts of personal interpretation with the justification that the "Spirit" told me (leading into all truth). Another thing that grates on my nerves is when a pastor not only avoids or overlooks important facts in a passage so it will fit his interpretation, but also when he says "so and so never did or said this or that", just because the passage doesn't mention something, then it's like it for sure never happened. How wierd is that? That would be like reading a biography of someone like Mark Twain, and saying at the end. Well, he never flew a kite because it didn't say so in that book." The sad part of it for me is that my husband is so trusting and accepting of things at church and is good friends with the pastor, so any questions or criticisms about a sermon come across like a personal attack. I feel like a pariah at church because I don't believe the same way I did for most of my life, and some people just seem to think I'm like dirt. Some unconditional love, huh. I've worked through most of the hardest parts of the process, but I still haven't reached the point of deconverting. It's more like I'm still trying to find some better answers than I've heard in the past. The good thing is that my husband is sometimes willing to engage in calm discussion about things like evolution and creationism and certain other topics. He doesn't like me to share my point of view with my children (elementary age), but I can't help but talk about some things. I grew up being controlled and manipulated and confined in a little box figuratively because of fundamentalist Baptist religion, and I'm not about to climb back into that dark little space now that I'm out.

I'm sorry if this is not the correct forum to to share this sort of thing. Just point me in the right direction if another one is more appropriate.

I appreciate the other replies I've received to my original post.

Thanks,

sparkyone

[mwc]

That's right. None of the bible is historical.

Well, I wouldn't go quite that far.

 

mwc

[Poonis]

The sad part of it for me is that my husband is so trusting and accepting of things at church and is good friends with the pastor, so any questions or criticisms about a sermon come across like a personal attack.

 

Taking offense is not a strength but a weakness. Those who take offense do so because they have no other recourse, such as providing evidence that logically makes sense to counter your argument or answering your question. It is this weakness that shows you that they have nothing to go on.

[NotBlinded]

For myself, I see the adaptation of the Sumerian myth as speaking about human being's view of themselves as being separate from each other and nature. It's the whole dualistic nature of man story, that we define everything including ourselves by virtue of opposites. "This is hot because that is cold; this is good because that is bad; I am me because I am not you"; and so on. The pre-fall myth, the Garden of Eden story is about imagining ourselves in a projected perfection where there is no separation or opposites.

That's exactly what I think too. And, when you say, I am me because I am not you" that ties in nicely to the concept of believing that we are separate from each other and causes judgement. I find it so ironic that Christians that take this literally are fit to be the poster children for the moral of the story! It's there in Sparky's opening post.

 

They always seem to get it backwards. They think that the curse on Eve was something that God did to them instead of realizing that the curse comes in the form of human judgement on others. It a story about what happens to people when they judge others based on a perceived separation.

 

Sparky's preacher speaks to the truth of that story:

 

To get back to the sermon, it was the same basic application I've heard before, of how the man (Adam) should have made sure his wife was doing right, since it was his responsibility. Also, that the reason wives should obey their husbands is because part of the curse on Eve was having Adam ruling over her, and so on.

 

He sees Adam and Eve as polar opposites, and since Adam can't possibly be equal to Eve, the judging commences. This is not a curse, but a way of life that happens when we view others as "not I".

 

*Where's my poster paints.... *

[Taaliba22]

Revelation Chapter Twenty - Two Revealed At Patmos 96 A.D. Verse 1-2

 

Verse 1 . And he showed me water of a river of the water of life glittering as crystal coming out from the seat of Yahweh and the Lamb . ( Also Read .. Psa 38;8-9 , 46;4 , Eze 47;1-7 , Joel 3;18 , Zec 31;1 , 14;8 , Jer 2;13 , Joh 4;14 , Rev 4;6 , 7;17 ) .

 

Psalms 36;8-9 And I Quote ; They feast on the abundance of thy house, and thou givest them drink from the river of thy delights. 9 For with thee is the fountain of life; in thy light do we see light.

 

Psalms 46;4 And I Quote ; There is a river whose streams make glad the city of God, the holy habitation of the Most High.

 

Ezekiel 47;1-7 And I Quote ; Then he brought me back to the door of the temple; and behold, water was issuing from below the threshold of the temple toward the east (for the temple faced east); and the water was flowing down from below the south end of the threshold of the temple, south of the altar. 2 Then he brought me out by way of the north gate, and led me round on the outside to the outer gate, that faces toward the east; and the water was coming out on the south side. 3 Going on eastward with a line in his hand, the man measured a thousand cubits, and then led me through the water; and it was ankle-deep. 4 Again he measured a thousand, and led me through the water; and it was knee-deep. Again he measured a thousand, and led me through the water; and it was up to the loins. 5 Again he measured a thousand, and it was a river that I could not pass through, for the water had risen; it was deep enough to swim in, a river that could not be passed through. 6 And he said to me, "Son of man, have you seen this?" Then he led me back along the bank of the river. 7 As I went back, I saw upon the bank of the river very many trees on the one side and on the other.

 

Zechariah 13; 1 And I Quote ; "On that day there shall be a fountain opened for the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem to cleanse them from sin and uncleanness

 

Zechariah 14;8 And I Quote ; On that day living waters shall flow out from Jerusalem, half of them to the eastern sea and half of them to the western sea; it shall continue in summer as in winter.

 

John 4;14 And I Quote ; but whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him will never thirst; the water that I shall give him will become in him a spring of water welling up to eternal life."

 

Revelation 4;6 And I Quote ; and before the throne there is as it were a sea of glass, like crystal. And round the throne, on each side of the throne, are four living creatures, full of eyes in front and behind:

 

Revelation 7;17 And I Quote ; For the Lamb in the midst of the throne will be their shepherd, and he will guide them to springs of living water; and God will wipe away every tear from their eyes."

 

And he --The Angelic Being Michael .

Showed me --The Prophet John son of Zebedee .

The water of life -- This is what the Messiah Jesus promised to his faithful followers John 4;10 ..

 

John 4;10 And I Quote ; Jesus answered her, "If you knew the gift of God, and who it is that is saying to you, 'Give me a drink,' you would have asked him, and he would have given you living water.";....The springs rivers and fountains of the water of life loacated in Paradise

[Taaliba22]

ParTwo Of The Above

 

 

The seat of Yahweh -- Yahweh throne . Throughout the Book of Revelation the Angelic Being Melchisedek is spoken of as being on the throne . This throne is representative of the kingdom of Yahweh ( Psalms 11;4 , Isaiah 66;1 ) ;...

 

Psalms 11;4 And I Quote ; The LORD is in his holy temple, the LORD's throne is in heaven; his eyes behold, his eyelids test, the children of men

 

Isaiah 66;1 And I Quote ; Thus says the LORD: "Heaven is my throne and the earth is my footstool; what is the house which you would build for me, and what is the place of my rest ?

 

And the Lamb -- The Angelic Being Michael is called the Lamb of Yahweh , for he ( like the Messiah Jesus ) suffers and is persecured for righteous namesake . The Lamb's job is to teach the children of Yahweh The Laws Of Moses . In doing so he must combat the Devil as he did in the Heavens , When Iblis the rebelious Angelic Being was cast down with his 200 helpes ( Cherubin ) Revelation 12;7-9 ) ...

 

Revelation 12;7-9 And I Quote ; Now war arose in heaven, Michael and his angels fighting against the dragon; and the dragon and his angels fought, 8 but they were defeated and there was no longer any place for them in heaven. 9 And the great dragon was thrown down, that ancient serpent, who is called the Devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world--he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.

 

Verse 2 . In the middle of what looked like a market street of it and on both sides of the river was a tree of life which gives twelve fruits every month and the leaves and the tree were to hell all nation ( Gen 3;22-24 , Eze 47;12 , Gen 2;9 , Rev 2;7 , 21;21 )

 

Genesis 3;22-24 And I Quote ; Then the LORD God said, "Behold, the man has become like one of us, knowing good and evil; and now, lest he put forth his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever" -- 23 therefore the LORD God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from which he was taken. 24 He drove out the man; and at the east of the garden of Eden he placed the cherubim, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to guard the way to the tree of life.

 

Ezekiel 47;12. And I Quote ; And on the banks, on both sides of the river, there will grow all kinds of trees for food. Their leaves will not wither nor their fruit fail, but they will bear fresh fruit every month, because the water for them flows from the sanctuary. Their fruit will be for food, and their leaves for healing."

 

Genesis 2;9 And I Quote And out of the ground the LORD God made to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight and good for food, the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

 

Revelation 12;7 And I Quote ; Now war arose in heaven, Michael and his angels fighting against the dragon; and the dragon and his angels fought,

 

Revelation 21;21 And I Quote ; And the twelve gates were twelve pearls, each of the gates made of a single pearl, and the street of the city was pure gold, transparent as glass.

 

Like a market street --- With so many people on it , the market street is described as of pure gold . as if it was transparent glass . Meaning you could see right throught it . The main street was the gold path through the city . The crystal city has 365 paths within the main path called '' Siraat '' On this path you can see through the floor of the ships . You must stay on this path or you can be electrocuted .

 

A tree of life -- In Revelation 2;7 And I Quote ; He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who conquers I will grant to eat of the tree of life, which is in the paradise of God.';... It says that those who overcome the Devil will have the right to eat from the Tree of Life and here in Revelation 22;2 And I Quote ; through the middle of the street of the city; also, on either side of the river, the tree of life with its twelve kinds of fruit, yielding its fruit each month; and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.

 

This promise is fulfilled . The Tree of Life . as a symbol , is first introduced in the early chapter of the Book of Genesis . Yahweh formed a garden Eastward in Eden and in the midst of this garden were Two Tree , the Tree of Life and the Tree of The Knowledge of Good and Evil Genesis 2;9 And I Quote ; And out of the ground the LORD God made to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight and good for food, the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

 

This Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil was placed in the garden as A Test For Man . The Prophet Adam and Eve were provided with everything in the garden and they were only given one Commandment ; Not to eat of the tree that was in the midst of the garden '' Thus this was their First Test . Because the Prophet Adam and Eve would never know '' Sickness or be ill , they would not need to partake of the Tree . This tree was to be The Opium Tree, It LQQks Like A Shrub Of A Small Trees . And It Can Be Found In Asia . Because The Poppy Plant Resembles The Pomegranate ( Chinese Apple ) . It Is Called The Apple '' That Tempted The Prpphet Adam And Hawwaa In The Garden .

 

The Opium Poppy Is One Of The Genus Of Plants Called Papaver . Not All Poppies Contain The Narcotic Qualities Of The Opium Poppy As Can Be Seen From Their Open Cultivation In Many Garden Throughout The United States . Opium is the oldest drug known to man . it was known to the ancient Sumerians and the Assyrians as a '' Joy Plant '' It has been cultivated for its medicinal purpose . and also to satisfy the vast market for heroin in the United States . The major suppliers for the heroin market are Turkey , Laos , Combodia and Thailand .

[Taaliba22]

ParThree Of The Above

 

 

 

The plant also cultivated in other countries such as Mexico . Lebanon , China and Egypt . The drug is obtained from the unripened buds that have beed dried . When the plant is green , it exudes a milky liquid but when it is dried a brown gummy substance emerges . It is this substance that is refined to various degress into morphine and other narcotics . Raw opium is marketed today as Lumps , Cakes , or Bricks that may be powdered or further treated .

 

The legitimate uses of opium are medical and include extraction of purified opium alkaloids ( e.g. morphine , codeine ) and manufacture of alkaloid derivatives ( e.g. dihydro morphinone , dihydro codeinone ) . Opium , either raw or purified as alkaloid and their derivatives such as heroin is also used illicitly . The active principles of opium reside in its alkaloids the most important of which is is morphine . Opium alkaloid are of two types depending on chemical structure and action . Morphine , Codeine , and thebaine which represents one type act upon the nervous system . They are analgesic narcotic and potenially addicting compounds . In Genesis 3;6 the tree of knowledge of Good and Evil was described as one that was '' good for food pleasant to the eyes and a tree to be desired - to make one wise '' .

 

Torah ( 5 Books Of The Prophet / Apostle Moses In Arabic ) Genesis 3;6 ( Revealed 1512 B.C.E. And I Quote ; And When The Woman Witnessed That The Tree Tasted Good

( Poppy Seed Used For Food ) And Appetizing ( Poppy Seed Plant Has A Pretty Flower ) For The Eyes . And Enticing ( Having Addictive Powers ) To The Sight And A Tree Desirous Of The Human Being ( All Men ) To Make Him Wise ( Drugs Makes Him Think He Is Free Of The World And Its Problems And That He Knows Everything ) She ( Eve ) Picked Of Its Fruit And She Ate . Then ( Time Span ) She Gave Some To Her Mate ( Adam ) , Also So He Ate Of It With Her ( Together They Betook Of It Her Second Time . His First .

 

 

Good For Food --- Yahweh is Ar Razzaaq meaning '' The Provider '' for man & woman making it unnecessary for the Prophet Adam to choose this particular plant . The poppy seed is used in the preparation of many food of the Eastern countries as a form of seasoning in soups . desserts and breads .

 

Pleasant To The Eyes ---- When the pooppy seed blossoms . it becomes either a white flower or a red flower --- both resembling a rose . The flowers are so pretty and color , and are known for their beauty . So a poppy field is also very pleasant to the sight as mentioned in

Torah ( 5 Books Of The Prophet / Apostle Moses In Arabic ) Genesis 3;6 ( Revealed 1512 B.C.E. And I Quote ; And When The Woman Witnessed That The Tree Tasted Good

( Poppy Seed Used For Food ) And Appetizing ( Poppy Seed Plant Has A Pretty Flower ) For The Eyes . And Enticing ( Having Addictive Powers ) To The Sight And A Tree Desirous Of The Human Being ( All Men ) To Make Him Wise ( Drugs Makes Him Think He Is Free Of The World And Its Problems And That He Knows Everything ) She ( Eve ) Picked Of Its Fruit And She Ate . Then ( Time Span ) She Gave Some To Her Mate ( Adam ) , Also So He Ate Of It With Her ( Together They Betook Of It Her Second Time . His First .

 

A Thing To Be Desired - To Make One Wise --- Before the detrimental ( hazardous ) effects of drugs became obvious the idea that it is '' Hip '' is something that serves to attract those desiring to be '' Wise '' The detrimental effects of opium makes one feel '' Wiser '' than the average person . This is one aspect that attracts mant people . Once this seed is processed and taken in it . stimulates the body and starts convincing people that they can leap and bow in situaions that they could not ordinarily indulge in while sober . Meaning when you become intoxicated you tend to get the '' Courage To Do Things That You Normally Wouldn't Do If You Weren't Intoxicated .

 

Opium in the Orient --- Opium was introduced into China by Arabian traders . by the early eighteenth century . Opium smoking then became very popular in the Orient . There were many Opium shops all over China and their main business was that of selling the Opium drug . '' There Were Opium '' Dens '' Were Addicts Remained For Days And Even Weeks Becoming Satiated With The Drug . During Such Long Periods Of Intoxication The Opium Addicts Experienced Illusins ( Opium Dreams ) . The next stop on the opium trip was Europe . Opium smoking gained swift popularity among the '' Rich And Fashipnable . From there the '' Fad '' spread to America . In The Early Nineteen Hundreds This Drug Could Be Obtained By Prescription In The United States . In This Country Smoking Of Opium Has Declined But A Drug Derived From It Heroin Is By Far One Of The Most Evil Weapons UnLeashed Upon Man and Woman . ( Eventually Eve ( Hawwaa ) Was Seduced By The Serpent To Partake Of The Tree And She In Turn Convinced The Prophet Adam To Eat Of It Also .

[Taaliba22]

ParFour Of The Above

 

 

As Suhuf ( 100 Pure Pages ) A . The Book Of Life ( 10 Pages 3126 - B.C.E. ) Revealed In Syriac ( Ancient Arabic ) Prophet Adam 4026-3096 B.CE . ( Fourth Page , Verse 57-65 )

Verse 57 . At the touch of the forbidden fruit against my lips the intake of the intoxicants from the poppy seed , my crown rose towards heaven and my rings fell from my fingers and the countence of my robes dropped from '' Kingship To Man From Ruler To Slave From Guardian To Guarded From Leader To Follower From Wise To Fool From Giver To Taker And From Protector To Striker From Supreme Being To Human Being .

 

Verse 58 . Nakedness appeared to out eyes and obvious were our naked states .

Verse 59 . Thr throne which had been erected for us in the tent thus chased us away and cried '' rebels depar ''

 

Verse 60 . The unicorn Maymuwn , upon which I attmpted to fly would not suffer me to mount it and asked . Has thou kept the covenant of Allah Most Glorified and Exalted ?

Verse 61. All creatures of Paradise then turned from us and besought Yahweh Most Glorified and Exalted to remove the human pair from the special spot in the garden .

 

Verse 62 . Yahweh Most Glorified and Exalted addressed me in the most of thunder ; Was thou not commanded to abstain from the fruit and forwarned of the cunningness of the Devil = Zahrah son of the dawn - Curse Be Upon Him , Thy For?

 

Verse 63 . I Adam son of The Most Glorified and Exalted attempted to flee but I was held by the branches of the tree called '' Talh '' Hawwaa ( Eve ) my mate , would have followed but she too was entangled by own hair as well as the branches while the voice of the tree exclaimed .

 

Verse 64 . From the wrath of Allah Most Glorified and Exalted there is no escape .

Verse 65 . Submit to his divine decree leave this Paradise ' < This Is How It Was Recorded And This Is How It Was >

 

The fall or slip of the Prophet Adam in the physical plane caused a reduction of his abilities . His spiritual eye ( Also Called The Third Eye ) became close . Man would now have to experience physical death for he had broken the seat of eternal life . As a result of his disobedience he gained five negative attributes ; evil shame decit fear and stupidity . When he first entered the Garden of Delight his power of will was not complete . After transgressing he became able to interfer with the course of his deatinty .

 

After the First Sin , the garden that was East ( The Garden Of Delight ) was immediately transformed into a wilderness of sand and heat , a desert , In Arabic , the word is Sahraa , from the root word '' Sahara meaning '' Spead Out Wide , or Spacious became like a desert '' which in reference to plants . it translate '' Dried up '' or became yellow or a dingy '' Red ''

( Implying That It Was Scorched By The Sun ) , The meaning of the word , as we can see is quite descriptive of the condition of the garden after Allah cursed the ground because the Prophet Adam's Sin .

 

The desert enveloped the large of the Arabian Peninsula , leaving small areas that could be cultivated . Today the would's attention is directed as Saudi Arabia because under the hot burning sands is the valublle substance . petroleum . It was formed from the plants that once existed in the Garden of Delight . Up until the fall of the Prophet Adam in the Garden of Delight . The Prophets Adam and Hawwaa ( Eve ) did not have to reproduce ; their only duty was to The Most High . Because of their disobedience to The Most High by partaking of the fruit of the tree in the midst of the garden , they were cast from it . They were reprimanded and condemned to a temporary existence of Earth .

 

In the process of living on Earth for a time , they had to reproduve in order to keep their progeny alive unitl such a time that they would eventually return to their Creator . Death became a part of man's ;ife when the Prophet Adam and Hawwaa' disobeyed the first commandment of The Most High by eating from from the forbidden tree in the midst of the Garden of Delight He no longer would be able to live in Everlasting Bliss In The Garden . After their departure from the garden . The Most High placed '' Two Cherubims To Gaurd It From Anyone Parting Of It .

 

Now that one Prophet Adam and Eve ( Hawwaa ) were like unto the Angelic Beings , Knowing good ( as the Seraphim , the good Angelic Beings and evil ( as the Cherubim , Bad Angelic Beings ) a precaution was taken so that man would not eat of the '' Tree Of Eternal Life, for if they would eat of it they would have eternal life in the physical . The Tree Of Life is known to be just that . A Tree That Gives Eternal Life . It is known to be a medicinal Tree , Herb and Plant . As well as a vegetable Tree . By partaking of this tree , man would have perfect health and death would be kept at a distance .

 

The Tree of Life that was place in in Garden of Delight , was an emblem of that life which man should always live . provided he continued in obedience to The Most High and the use of the Tree would have been as a means of preserving the body of man in a state of continual vital energy and an antidote against death .However because the Prohet Adam and Eve fell from grace by eating of the '' Tree Of Knowledge Of Good and Evil . They were no longer able to partake of this woderous tree . Because the Prophet Adam and Hawwa' had forfeited the blessing of being able to partake of The Tree Life ( Eternal Life ) in the beginning that privilege will now be awarden to those who've endured to the end and worked for perfection . The right of partaking of The Tree Of Life will be for those who will reside in the Crystal City in the end .

 

Thus The Book of Revelation brings the relationship betweet The Most High and man's full circle . It actually reverse man's fall from grace . All those who kept The Most Hight commandments will no longer be blocked from the Tree of Life .

 

Twelve fruits every moth --- Almost identical to the description given by the Prophet Ezekiel in Ezekiel 47;12 in both the description of the tree and the river found here in this chapter . In this verse the Tree is described as being on both side of the River of the Water of Life . yet it is still one tree and the tree bears twelve kinds of fruits every month .

 

The Book Of The Prophet Ezekiel 47;12 ( Revealed 591 B.C.E. )

And By The River Upon The Bank Thereof , On This Side And On That Side Shall Grow All Tress For Meat , Whose Leaf Shall Not Fade , Neither Shall The Fruit Thereof Be Consumed ; It Shall Bring Forth New Fruit According To His Months . Because Their Waters They Issued Out Of The Sanctuary ; And The Fruit Thereof Shall Be For Meat . And The Leaf Thereof For Medicine .

 

 

To heal all nations -- The leaves of the Tree would be used to heal all the nations of People who would enter the city . That's why Revelation 21;4 , And I Quote ; He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away." ;... Say The Most High will wipe away all tears from their eyes '' The Most Confort them . Just as it says in Revelation 7;17 And I Quote ; For the Lamb at the center of the throne will be their shepherd; he will lead them to springs of living water.

And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes."

 

He will lead them into gardens of plentiful fruits and still waters Psalms 23 ; 1-3 And I Quote ;

1 The LORD is my shepherd, I shall not be in want. 2 He makes me lie down in green pastures, he leads me beside quiet waters, 3 he restores my soul. He guides me in paths of righteousness for his name's sake. ;....There won't be any more sickness or disease or death .

[Robbobrob]

And now in your own words?

[Grandpa Harley]

this has to be eligible for the 'Indiana Jones' award for July 07!

[Taaliba22]

And now in your own words?

 

 

 

 

Here It Is You're Mind Your Business .

[Grandpa Harley]

We got ourselves a moron... just what I need to complete my day...

[Taaliba22]

We got ourselves a moron... just what I need to complete my day...

 

 

 

Name calling sure sign of a old man weakness

[Grandpa Harley]

but it shocked you into typing in English... so my day improved.

 

Care to decode what you said to Rob, since it's not any dialect of English I know, nor is it good typing...

[Taaliba22]

but it shocked you into typing in English... so my day improved.

 

Care to decode what you said to Rob, since it's not any dialect of English I know, nor is it good typing...

 

 

 

English is the devil language ?

[Grandpa Harley]

And thus, ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I rest my case... we have a nutjob...

[Taaliba22]

And thus, ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I rest my case... we have a nutjob...

 

 

 

Bet your wife wear the pants and you wear the panties Right ?

[Grandpa Harley]

And thus, ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I rest my case... we have a nutjob...

 

 

 

Bet your wife wear the pants and you wear the panties Right ?

 

Only for weekends, leisure time and my pay per view webcam site... BTW your subscription is nearly expired.

[mwc]

Adam

Hmmm...yes..."Adam."

 

Are you sure you have the proper creation myth?

 

Here's another one:

 

After on the mountain of heaven and earth,

An (the heaven-god) had caused the Anunnaki (his followers) to be born

Because the name Ashnan (the grain-goddess) had not been born, had not been fashioned,

Because Uttu (the goddess of plants) had not been fashioned,

Because to Uttu no temenos had been set up,

There was no ewe, no lamb was dropped,

There was no goat, no kid was dropped,

The ewe did not give birth to its two lambs,

The goat did not give birth to its three kids.

 

Because the name of Ashnan, the wise, and Lahar (the cattle-god),

The Anunnaki, the great gods, did not know,

The . . . grain of thirty days did not exist,

The . . . grain of forty days did not exist,

The small grains, the grain of the mountain, the grain of the pure living creatures did not exist.

 

Because Uttu had not been born, because the crown (of vegetation?) had not been raised,

Because the lord . . . had not been born,

Because Sumugan, the god of the plain, had not come forth,

Like mankind when first created,

They (the Anunnaki knew not the eating of bread,

Knew not the dressing of garments,

Ate plants with their mouth like sheep,

Drank water from the ditch.

 

In those days, in the creation chamber of the gods,

In their house Dulkug, Lahar and Ashnan were fashioned;

The produce of Lahar and Ashnan,

The Anunnaki of the Dulkug eat, but remain unsated;

In their pure sheepfolds milk, . . ., and good things,

The Anunnaki of the Dulkug drink, but remain unsated;

For the sake of the good things in their pure sheepfolds,

Man was given breath.

Look. It has gods and the creation of man right there at the end of everything else too. It's also a whole lot older than the ones you're basing your spiel on.

 

Actually, truly best of all, it's straight up Sumerian and not some hodge-podge of writings thrown together to make up some poor excuse of an argument (one that you apparently cannot, or will not, support when asked to do so). I'm not quite sure what the actual point of your posts were, beyond "troll," but if it's that you accept that stolen poetry/hymns from Canaanite/Egyptian religions, Christian interpolations into Jewish texts and some sort of Islamic/Arabic side-note (from the scan I gave to it) makes the bible/quran/whatever somehow true...then you're smoking something extremely powerful and you could probably make quite a lot of money selling that shit instead of giving away the shit I read here a few minutes for free.

 

mwc

[Robbobrob]

Taaliba22 said:

Here It Is You're Mind Your Business .

 

Sorry I asked for your own words. Please go back to long quotes from other people.

 

 

As far as creation stories go, you need not go any further than:

 

The Flying Speghetti Monster created mountain.

The Flying Speghetti Monster created trees.

The Flying Speghetti Monster created midget.

 

As credible as any I've ever read.

[Grandpa Harley]

Leave him alone... he's the only one who sends me pictures of his (admittedly tiny) erection while watching my grotesque, transvestite, mincings on web cam...