Let's Be Real

[Dom]

Well I'm new here and I basically found this site ebcause I was doubting some things myself. Now after reading some of the testemonies of people here and why they left the christian faith I realized some of the main reasons they left. Let's go through them. Don't reply to this post if you don't read it all.

 

- People have left because they feel Christians are imposing their beliefs on people or they feel that Christians condemn them

 

Now if you encounter a "christian" who acts like this, then they are not a christian. I can see why you would not like to be around them. THIS IS NOT TRUE CHRISTIANTY. I see that most people see somebody who calls themselves a believer of Christ, but they are acting nothing like what it says to do in the bible. You have a legitimate gripe here, but you can't apply this to all of us!! Let's say I go down south to a predominately white town and someone calls me a nigger, should I just assume that all white people are prejudiced against black people?? That they are constantly holding me down?? Nope. Don't apply that to Christians either.

 

- People have left because they felt like they could never measure up

 

For all you ex-christians out there, if you still have your bible, in Ephesians 2, it says that you are saved by grace and faith, not by your works. So for everyone of you who ahs run into a christian, and they make themselves seem so high and mighty because they have gone out to be missionaries, or they give this amount to the church, etc, THEY ARE WRONG. Once again making everyone look bad by bad representation. At the same time, if you left because you felt like you could never not sin, then you left for the wrong reason. Like it says nobody is perfect. Christians are not saved because they are mighty good people who do good things all the time, we are saved by faith. We do good works not because we are righteous, but because it helps us strive for the righteousness as best we can.

 

- No patience

 

I've read people talking about "the just have faith" line. Well it's true. I've read many posts and people just simply didn't have longsuffering or patience with God. Whatever they prayed for, they wanted it right then and there, and because it didn't happen, they didn't believe God for it. TRUST ME if you have the patience and trust in God, he will deliver. Maybe not on your schedule but on his schedule, and you know what the great thing is? His schedule is always at the perfect time.

 

- Left because of self

 

I also see that many people left simply because they couldnt keep doing what they were doing in the world, such as fornication or homosexuality. I bet if God said that it was ok, everyone would be a christian!!

 

Now, a question for atheists out there, you say there is no God, but how can you be sure just as you ask us. We've seen the miracles time and again but you just KNOW that there is no God. Now for the question, in D.C. the Library of Congress has over 70 million texts. Now how much of that knowledge would you say is in your own realm of knowledge? What percentage? So you wouldn't say that if you knew say just 5% of that, there isn't the slightest possiblity of a God existing? Now if ou try to flip this question on me, I've actually seen God work in my life and others as well. Things that were impossible and people prayed for happening. I've seen people completely turn their lives from crime, drugs, pornography, etc, what is bad about that?

 

I hope I myself didnt sound condeming. If I did, that was not my intention and I apologize. If you have any more questions you know for a civilized debate without the random insults, I'll be happy to answer them as best I can. Peace.

[Dave]

.....Now, a question for atheists out there, you say there is no God, but how can you be sure just as you ask us.....

First, you need to learn the definition of Atheism; lack of belief in gods. An Atheist is one that lacks a belief in gods. An Atheist does not have to make the claim that there are no gods, they just have to lack a belief in gods. An individual Atheist may make the personal claim that gods do not exist, and I do, but that individual does not, cannot, speak for all of Atheism.

 

To put it in another way; the ONLY thing that all Atheists have in common is a lack of belief in gods.

 

Now, how can I be sure? Easy. Look at the source for all information about gods - mythology.

[Vixentrox]

Funny how this person fails to mention those who list reading the bible as a major cause.

[Legion]

Dom I can tell that your being here is going to go over like a Junebug in a bowl full of grits.

 

I left because I detected two main things with regards to Christianity. They were engaged in denial and control. Those two things make a bad combination and I wanted no part of it.

 

Please remember it: DENIAL and CONTROL.

[Dom]

Dom I can tell that your being here is going to go over like a Junebug in a bowl full of grits.

 

I left because I detected two main things with regards to Christianity. They were engaged in denial and control. Those two things make a bad combination and I wanted no part of it.

 

Please remember it: DENIAL and CONTROL.

 

ok legion, this refers to the first part of my post, which confirms why you left. You had bad experiences with people who call themsleves christians bt dont represent it well. If you come across ANY church including those catholci churches who believe your sins can be forgiven by talking to the priest etc, it's simply not how one is supposed to represent the christian faith.

 

And dave, i know atheist is defined as lack of belief in gods, but this is ex-christian forum so we are talking about the one and only God in the bible, which is the main topic of discussion here on these forums. I've yet to find anything calling hindus or buddhists crazy for their beliefs in multiple gods.

[Legion]

You had bad experiences with people who call themsleves christians bt dont represent it well. If you come across ANY church including those catholci churches who believe your sins can be forgiven by talking to the priest etc, it's simply not how one is supposed to represent the christian faith.

I suppose then that you are a True Christian? You represent the true body of Christ?

 

I don't suppose that you engage in any level of DENIAL and CONTROL.

 

Do you think that 1) evolution has occured and do you feel that 2) it is your duty to encourage people not to sin?

[Scarlett]

Don't reply to this post if you don't read it all.

 

Well I read it all.

 

- People have left because they feel Christians are imposing their beliefs on people or they feel that Christians condemn them

Well I am sure some Christians did condemn me, but that isn't the reason I left.

 

 

 

People have left because they felt like they could never measure up

 

Actually, I thought I was a pretty good Christian, when I was one. So again, no that wasn't the reason.

 

No patience

Oh I had plenty of patience, too much in fact.

 

 

- Left because of self

 

I also see that many people left simply because they couldnt keep doing what they were doing in the world, such as fornication or homosexuality. I bet if God said that it was ok, everyone would be a christian!!

 

No, I wouldn't be. I find your god to be disgusting, I find his actions and commandments to be reprehensible. So just on that alone I wouldn't be a Christian...not to mention the fact that the bible is just mythology and your god doesn't exist.

 

 

Now, a question for atheists out there, you say there is no God, but how can you be sure just as you ask us.

 

Well how can you be sure Darkwing Duck isn't real hmm?

 

 

My reason for leaving Christianity was that I read the bible.

[Thurisaz]

Now if you encounter a "christian" who acts like this, then they are not a christian.

 

Standard morontheist cop-out. Whoever professes belief in jebus as da savur is a christian, as the name itself shows. You lose.

 

in Ephesians 2, it says that you are saved by grace and faith, not by your works.

 

And in several other verses the book of lies contradicts itself by making it clear that it is by works that you get saved. You lose.

 

Whatever they prayed for, they wanted it right then and there, and because it didn't happen, they didn't believe God for it.

 

Translation: They didn't wait long enough for something, anything, to happen so that they can claim that their sadistic monster gawd did something for them. Behold, I predict that rain will fall. Soon you will see that I make true prophecies, so bow to me. You lose.

 

Now, a question for atheists out there, you say there is no God, but how can you be sure just as you ask us.

 

"A" god: Not possible to prove either true or wrong.

"The" god, i. e. the judeochristian monster: Proven impossible in a heartbeat.

You lose.

 

We've seen the miracles time and again but you just KNOW that there is no God.

 

Hic Rhodos. Hic salta.

You know it and I know it: You lose.

 

I've actually seen God work in my life and others as well. Things that were impossible and people prayed for happening. I've seen people completely turn their lives from crime, drugs, pornography, etc, what is bad about that?

 

No one said that it's bad. "Too bad" (for you) is just that such things happen to those who don't kiss the arse of jehoover the sadist too.

Guess what? You lose.

 

I hope I myself didnt sound condeming.

 

Hope for something else. Your entire posting shows standard braindead morontheist bullcrap, including hurling insults left and right (by acting as if surely we neeeeeeeever heard all your pseudo-arguments before - we're not as intellectually lazy as you morontheists hare), then saying "sorry" without meaning it and thinking that everything's fine now. Oh well, what else to expect from an idiot who believes that saying some magic words (AKA "prayer") will instantly give you a "get out of Hell™ free" ticket for life...

[Dom]

You had bad experiences with people who call themsleves christians bt dont represent it well. If you come across ANY church including those catholci churches who believe your sins can be forgiven by talking to the priest etc, it's simply not how one is supposed to represent the christian faith.

I suppose then that you are a True Christian? You represent the true body of Christ?

 

I don't suppose that you engage in any level of DENIAL and CONTROL.

 

Do you think that 1) evolution has occured and do you feel that 2) it is your duty to encourage people not to sin?

 

yes i do believe that, but please remember nobody is perfect. No you may think when i say that, that that's an excuse to go out and mess up and just say 'well nobody is perfect' but thats not the case. I'm saying that im not one of those christians that youve come across and myself as well, who go out party, fornicate, sleep with all the women in the church, but then condemn someone for doing the same thing or they are in church the next day saying forgive me Lord. Yes he forgives your sin, but there is a verse in the bible that says if we sin willfully after knowledge after whats right and wrong, then its kind of tainted. Think of it as you going to your best friend for money that you really need because you put yourself in a jam by gambling it all away and he gives it to you, but if you keep going time after time to that friend because you know he'll give it to you, sooner or later he'll start to catch on and realize that whatever money you get, you'll go blow it on the casinos because you know he'l; give ti to you. Same thing with me. I'm not perfect by any means but if i know fornication is wrong but i do it anyway because i say oh God will forgive me thats not right.

 

Now sorry for that long reply but what do you mean by denial and control? how do you inquire that ive engaged in that?

 

answering the others: i feel that evolution has not occurred, but contrary to what many christians and otehr people think, THE EARTH IS NOT 6,000 YEARS OLD. this is very clear in the very first verses of the bible..

2.) i think its my duty t share the gospelof Christ. NOT FORCE IT UPON THEM. If i come up to someone and say "oh you're smoking, you shouldnt do that, or oh youre an adulterer, youre going straight to hell!!. Thats incorrect. Many people know this si wrong in the first place. Don't you think it's worng that two people have committed themselves toe ach other, and one of them breaks that covenant?

 

One thing to add on piggy backing off what i said about your experiences with "christians", i read a post in here, ill have to find it and in it someone was talking about their experience of being a christian but he was going to churches sleeping with pasotrs wives and whatnot. Now wasnt he doing the very thing that many people acuse christians of doing? He wasn't living the Christian life to begin with!!

[sparkyone]

Hi,

Something you said about not being perfect being a reason that some leave Christianity makes me ask you: have you ever read the verses in the N.T. that say that one who is born of God doesn't or cannot commit sin? Where does that leave all the "saved" people who still sin? Or Jesus is quoted as saying that the disciples are to be perfect just as the father in heaven is perfect. Does that leave any wiggle room to say that "God just isn't finished with me yet" or "I'm only human"? What about "all things are become new, and old things are passed away"? I'm seriously wondering how you can explain this. I didn't find your post rude, but just so very predictable and nothing new to me,k so please explain this for me. I'm reluctant to ask my own pastor about this because he'll just try to explain it away.

 

Sparkyone

[Dom]

Don't reply to this post if you don't read it all.

 

Well I read it all.

 

- People have left because they feel Christians are imposing their beliefs on people or they feel that Christians condemn them

Well I am sure some Christians did condemn me, but that isn't the reason I left.

 

 

 

People have left because they felt like they could never measure up

 

Actually, I thought I was a pretty good Christian, when I was one. So again, no that wasn't the reason.

 

No patience

Oh I had plenty of patience, too much in fact.

 

 

- Left because of self

 

I also see that many people left simply because they couldnt keep doing what they were doing in the world, such as fornication or homosexuality. I bet if God said that it was ok, everyone would be a christian!!

 

No, I wouldn't be. I find your god to be disgusting, I find his actions and commandments to be reprehensible. So just on that alone I wouldn't be a Christian...not to mention the fact that the bible is just mythology and your god doesn't exist.

 

 

Now, a question for atheists out there, you say there is no God, but how can you be sure just as you ask us.

Well how can you be sure Darkwing Duck isn't real hmm?

 

 

My reason for leaving Christianity was that I read the bible.

 

well you didnt answer my question about the library of congress. Now you find God to be digusting and his commandments reprehensible. So thous shalt not murder is a crazy commandment to obey? Name specific actions that you find disgusting about God. And how can I be sure Darkwing Duck isnt real? lol. Maybe he is. But because I saw people actually drawing him I would say he isnt because hes a cartoon. What was it in the bible that made you leave?

[Taphophilia]

You came here to show us the error of our ways, and tell us we are wrong.

 

The reasons you mention may have caused some to doubt their faith, but it wasn't their reason for leaving it. We left because we realised Christianity isn't true no matter how much we wanted it to be. We didn't just wake up one day and not believe or just decide not to believe, it was a process that took years. You don't just give up the entire way you have lived your life, your thought processes, and disappoint your family and friends for the reasons you stated. Think about it!

[Vixentrox]

Good grief....this person must never have read the bible. It's filled with atrocities your monster tribal god commits or orders his faithful to commit. Never was there a baby killer like your god. He revels in the blood of children.

[Legion]

Yes he forgives your sin, but there is a verse in the bible that says if we sin willfully after knowledge after whats right and wrong, then its kind of tainted. Think of it as you going to your best friend for money that you really need because you put yourself in a jam by gambling it all away and he gives it to you, but if you keep going time after time to that friend because you know he'll give it to you, sooner or later he'll start to catch on and realize that whatever money you get, you'll go blow it on the casinos because you know he'l; give ti to you. Same thing with me. I'm not perfect by any means but if i know fornication is wrong but i do it anyway because i say oh God will forgive me thats not right.

I think that was a rather interesting analogy. Thank you for that Dom.

 

Now sorry for that long reply but what do you mean by denial and control? how do you inquire that ive engaged in that?

 

i feel that evolution has not occurred

Personally I feel that if you have been adequately exposed to the evidence then this is a form of DENIAL. Basically I feel that it amounts to a denial that we humans are in fact mammals.

 

i think its my duty t share the gospelof Christ. NOT FORCE IT UPON THEM. If i come up to someone and say "oh you're smoking, you shouldnt do that, or oh youre an adulterer, youre going straight to hell!!. Thats incorrect. Many people know this si wrong in the first place. Don't you think it's worng that two people have committed themselves toe ach other, and one of them breaks that covenant?

Well then perhaps you're not the kind to try and control other people. If so, that is definitely a strike in your favor. And yes, I think that loyalty and a devotion to one's word are virtuous.

 

i read a post in here, ill have to find it and in it someone was talking about their experience of being a christian but he was going to churches sleeping with pasotrs wives and whatnot. Now wasnt he doing the very thing that many people acuse christians of doing? He wasn't living the Christian life to begin with!!

Many people here, myself included, frowned heavily upon this person's behavior and boasting.

[Vixentrox]

Not to mention he was in fact, doing it with Xtians.

[Lycorth]

Don't reply to this post if you don't read it all.

 

Why? You can't have possibly read anything here and spouted the bullshit you did. How presumputous of you to turn around and tell other people what to do.

 

- People have left because they feel Christians are imposing their beliefs on people or they feel that Christians condemn them

 

I have never heard of anyone leaving Xianity because they feel like that. Many ex-xians cite that as criticism of Xian behavior and part of the reason they stay away, but I've never seen it listed as the primary reason for deconverting.

 

- People have left because they felt like they could never measure up

 

What? For people to say that, they'd have to first believe that Xianity is the primary moral standard. People who leave Xianity believe it is not the primary moral standard. Believe it or not, despite what the Babble says, ex-xians don't still think Xianity is true and are just trying to be evil by opposing it.

 

For all you ex-christians out there, if you still have your bible, in Ephesians 2, it says that you are saved by grace and faith, not by your works.

 

If salvation is by faith, and not by works, then you may find these passages problematic:

Psalm 62:12

For you render to each one according to his works.

 

Proverbs 10:16

The labour of the righteous tendeth to life: the fruit of the wicked to sin.

 

Jeremiah 17:10

I the Lord ... give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.

 

Ezekiel 18:27

When the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness ... and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul.

 

Matthew 5:20

Except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

 

Matthew 12:37

For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.

 

Matthew 16:27

For the Son of Man will come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and then He will reward each according to his works.

 

Matthew 19:17

If you want to enter into life, keep the commandments.

 

Matthew 25:41-46

Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee? Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

 

Luke 10:26-28

He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself. And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.

 

John 5:29

And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

 

Romans 2:6, 13

Who will render to each one according to his deeds. ... For not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified.

 

2 Corinthians 5:10

For we must all appear before the jugment seat of Christ, that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad.

 

2 Corinthians 11:15

Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works.

 

Philippians 2:12

"Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling."

 

James 2:14

What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him?

 

James 2:17

Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.

 

James 2:21-25

Was not Abraham our father justified by works? You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only. Likewise, was not Rabab the harlot also justified by works? For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

 

1 Peter 1:17

The Father, who without partiality judges according to each one's work.

 

Revelation 2:23

I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

 

Revelation 20:12-13

And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

 

Revelation 22:14

Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life.

 

So much for that one.

 

...if you left because you felt like you could never not sin, then you left for the wrong reason.

 

People who leave Xianity don't believe in sin, so ex-xians cannot possibly have such a stupid point of view.

 

- No patience

 

I've read people talking about "the just have faith" line. Well it's true. I've read many posts and people just simply didn't have longsuffering or patience with God. Whatever they prayed for, they wanted it right then and there, and because it didn't happen, they didn't believe God for it. TRUST ME if you have the patience and trust in God, he will deliver. Maybe not on your schedule but on his schedule, and you know what the great thing is? His schedule is always at the perfect time.

 

Bullshit. I have had many unanswered prayers during my Xian days, and I trusted fully and honestly in Jebus. Many people here can also testify to this. And to say Jebus answers in his own time, not ours, is just obfuscation. Stop making excuses for why Jebus doesn't answer prayers in the swiftest way possible (which would bring him the greatest glory).

 

- Left because of self

 

I also see that many people left simply because they couldnt keep doing what they were doing in the world, such as fornication or homosexuality. I bet if God said that it was ok, everyone would be a christian!!

 

I can agree to this one, because fornication and homosexuality are not morally wrong. There is nothing wrong with having sex with someone you are not married to or for two people of the same gender to have sex with each other. People's sex lives are none of your business and Xianity fosters a perverted obsession with the sex lives of others as well as an oppressive environment that is second only to that seen in the world of Is-lame.

 

Many people leave this sick-ass religion because it makes insane demands from its followers, such as to hate oneself or one's family for Jebus' sake. No sane person wants anything to do with filth like that.

 

Now, a question for atheists out there, you say there is no God, but how can you be sure just as you ask us. We've seen the miracles time and again but you just KNOW that there is no God.

 

Prove there are such thing as miracles. And if they do exist, why does God not show them to us all in order to gain more believers and glorify himself?

 

He doesn't do it because he doesn't exist.

 

Now for the question, in D.C. the Library of Congress has over 70 million texts. Now how much of that knowledge would you say is in your own realm of knowledge? What percentage? So you wouldn't say that if you knew say just 5% of that, there isn't the slightest possiblity of a God existing? Now if ou try to flip this question on me, I've actually seen God work in my life and others as well. Things that were impossible and people prayed for happening. I've seen people completely turn their lives from crime, drugs, pornography, etc, what is bad about that?

 

That's a lot of obfuscation. And few Atheists claim that there is no way any gods can exist, but we do claim that the Abrahamic god does not exist. It's just not possible.

 

What's wrong with drugs and porn? Some people can do drugs and be fine with it. Most can't, and if they used modern Xian philosophy as their impetus for leaving drugs, that's fine. But many Buddhists, Satanists, Agnostics, Atheists, and Pagans have also left drugs and found inspiration in their religions to do so. This does not make every religion objectively correct, does it?

 

And what's wrong with porn? There's nothing immoral with two consenting adults filming sexual acts and allowing others to view them. Again, people's sex lives aren't your business or your god's.

 

I hope I myself didnt sound condeming. If I did, that was not my intention and I apologize. If you have any more questions you know for a civilized debate without the random insults, I'll be happy to answer them as best I can. Peace.

 

You sure did sound all puffed-up, but most Xians do. I did once. But I for one have no questions for you because I've heard it all before. I can see that you'd offer nothing new or special to me that any other Xian would not.

 

Especially as you clearly do not understand the reasons people leave Xianity, I have no further wish to talk to you, but will hand your ass to you if you ever again dare to presume that I should believe in that demonic sicko you call Jebus.

[Taphophilia]

Here's just a few:

 

Jephthah Burns His Daughter

Judges 11:29-40

 

God Commands Burning Humans

Joshua 7:15

 

Humans are Fuel for Fire

Ezekiel 21:33-37

 

Murder, rape, and pillage at Jabesh-gilead

Judges 21:10-24

 

Murder, rape and pillage of the Midianites

Numbers 31:7-18

 

More Murder Rape and Pillage

Deuteronomy 20:10-14

 

Laws of Rape

Deuteronomy 22:28-29

 

Death to the Rape Victim

Deuteronomy 22:23-24

 

Rape of Female Captives

Deuteronomy 21:10-14

 

Rape and the Spoils of War

Judges 5:30

 

Sex Slaves

Exodus 21:7-11

 

God Assists Rape and Plunder

Zechariah 14:1-2

[Dom]

Now if you encounter a "christian" who acts like this, then they are not a christian.

 

Standard morontheist cop-out. Whoever professes belief in jebus as da savur is a christian, as the name itself shows. You lose.

 

Isn't that stereotyping? Like I said, if i met someone who called themselves a buddhists but could show no resraint in ager whatsoever, does that mean they are all like that?

 

in Ephesians 2, it says that you are saved by grace and faith, not by your works.

 

And in several other verses the book of lies contradicts itself by making it clear that it is by works that you get saved. You lose.

 

can you provide these passages?? From the new testament only?? Since many claim to know chrisitanty so well you should understand why i ask this. I can site at least four passages in the new testament which state the same exact thing.

 

Whatever they prayed for, they wanted it right then and there, and because it didn't happen, they didn't believe God for it.

 

Translation: They didn't wait long enough for something, anything, to happen so that they can claim that their sadistic monster gawd did something for them. Behold, I predict that rain will fall. Soon you will see that I make true prophecies, so bow to me. You lose.

 

Actually not everything has to be waited on. I've prayed for things, and they have happened within the next week even sooner. Praying for something like paying for a bill, and receiving a check the very next day for the exact amount from a family member who just "felt like sending you the check". And like i said, patience produces perserverance and your trust in Him. Think about it, if God just trusted everyone without making sure they were legit, then woul it be right? Do you just trust anyone the first time you meet them?

 

Now, a question for atheists out there, you say there is no God, but how can you be sure just as you ask us.

 

"A" god: Not possible to prove either true or wrong.

"The" god, i. e. the judeochristian monster: Proven impossible in a heartbeat.

You lose.

 

You keep making statements saying i lose but you provide no proof which is the very basis of how any of you believe in anything. If you would allow God to work in your life without doubt, you would truly see!! Do you think I just blindly follow God if I didn't trust him to deliver on EVERY, SINGLE, THING he's said he would give me?

 

We've seen the miracles time and again but you just KNOW that there is no God.

 

Hic Rhodos. Hic salta.

You know it and I know it: You lose.

 

LOL

 

I've actually seen God work in my life and others as well. Things that were impossible and people prayed for happening. I've seen people completely turn their lives from crime, drugs, pornography, etc, what is bad about that?

 

No one said that it's bad. "Too bad" (for you) is just that such things happen to those who don't kiss the arse of jehoover the sadist too.

Guess what? You lose.

 

Actually these things happen to anyone. God may be actually trying to bring them closer to him by doing these things. Believe it or not, even though you curse him constantly, he still has faith in you that you may one day come to him. He looks out for everybody, but the truth of the matter is at the end of the day have you accepted Christ.

 

I hope I myself didnt sound condeming.

 

Hope for something else. Your entire posting shows standard braindead morontheis bullcrap, including hurling insults left and right (by acting as if surely we neeeeeeeever heard all your pseudo-arguments before - we're not as intellectually lazy as you morontheists hare), then saying "sorry" without meaning it and thinking that everything's fine now. Oh well, what else to expect from an idiot who believes that saying some magic words (AKA "prayer") will instantly give you a "get out of Hell free" ticket for life...

 

 

Can youpoint out my insults?? I'm sorry for them. But can anyone on this board reply without insulting me??

[Legion]

Don't reply to this post if you don't read it all.

I think that I must re-examine my assestment of you Dom. This is leaning towards the CONTROL side of things.

 

So as far as I can presently tell you too are engaged in a refusal to look at the natural world as it really is (DENIAL) while simultaeously insisting that others do your bidding (CONTROL).

[Kelli]

I second Vixentrox. The biggest reason I left christianity was due to actually reading the bible and not glossing over all the insanity that nobody wants to talk about. My biggest problem with christianity isn't the behavior of christians, lack of patience, feeling like I couldn't measure up, or my own selfishness.

 

My biggest problem was (is) the bible. The behavior of christians, feeling worthless and unworthy, and constant feelings of guilt (the ignoring of which could be construed as selfishness) are all symptoms. The root of the problem is the foundation of christianity, that is, the bible itself. It is not inerrant and at best delivers a litany of mixed messages that can be interpreted any way one wishes to interpret them. The bible is *the* problem, and without the bible christianity ceases to exist.

[Lycorth]

Can youpoint out my insults?? I'm sorry for them. But can anyone on this board reply without insulting me??

 

Why should anyone not insult you, when you imply that homosexuals or people who watch pornography are wicked and evil?

 

You've earned your insults for your own insulting behavior, so quit crying and pony up with a defense of your god.

[Scarlett]

well you didnt answer my question about the library of congress.

 

Because the way you worded it makes no sense.

 

 

Now you find God to be digusting and his commandments reprehensible. So thous shalt not murder is a crazy commandment to obey?

Actually it was thou shalt no kill... But I digress. Dom, there are many many more commandments then just the 10. I am referring to all of them. Murder was rampant throwout the bible, in fact god kills many people for stupid reasons such as making fun of a bald man and some poor fellow that tried to keep the ark of the convent from falling during transport and commands that people be killed for absurd reasons such as working on the Sabbath, being gay, cursing at your parents, not being a virgin on your wedding night. And you don't even want to get me started on all the examples of the god of the bible committing mass murder himself!

 

 

And how can I be sure Darkwing Duck isnt real? lol. Maybe he is. But because I saw people actually drawing him I would say he isnt because hes a cartoon.

 

Well how do you know your god isn't a work of fiction as well?

 

What was it in the bible that made you leave?

 

See above. As for your question asking for examples of what actions of your god is disgusting, I think a few of the other posters have already given you some good examples of bible verses, I feel that it might be redundant to quote them.

 

If you are sincerely interested in why people have left Christianity, read some of the testimonies.

[Dom]

Don't reply to this post if you don't read it all.

 

Why? You can't have possibly read anything here and spouted the bullshit you did. How presumputous of you to turn around and tell other people what to do.

 

Lol wow. Why the rudeness?? But wouldn't it make sense to read a post before you reply. I've been in many forums where people reply to a post after they havn't read it because of their own biases.

- People have left because they feel Christians are imposing their beliefs on people or they feel that Christians condemn them

 

I have never heard of anyone leaving Xianity because they feel like that. Many ex-xians cite that as criticism of Xian behavior and part of the reason they stay away, but I've never seen it listed as the primary reason for deconverting.

 

Yes my mistake on that one.

 

- People have left because they felt like they could never measure up

 

What? For people to say that, they'd have to first believe that Xianity is the primary moral standard. People who leave Xianity believe it is not the primary moral standard. Believe it or not, despite what the Babble says, ex-xians don't still think Xianity is true and are just trying to be evil by opposing it.

 

Correct. People who were once Chrisitians believe that the bible is the moral standard and ill try to link some posts which refer to people leaving because they were afraid of going to hell or they could never measure up which is not true

 

For all you ex-christians out there, if you still have your bible, in Ephesians 2, it says that you are saved by grace and faith, not by your works.

 

If salvation is by faith, and not by works, then you may find these passages problematic:

Psalm 62:12

For you render to each one according to his works.

 

Proverbs 10:16

The labour of the righteous tendeth to life: the fruit of the wicked to sin.

 

Jeremiah 17:10

I the Lord ... give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.

 

Ezekiel 18:27

When the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness ... and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul.

 

Matthew 5:20

Except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

 

Matthew 12:37

For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.

 

Matthew 16:27

For the Son of Man will come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and then He will reward each according to his works.

 

Matthew 19:17

If you want to enter into life, keep the commandments.

 

Matthew 25:41-46

Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee? Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

 

Luke 10:26-28

He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself. And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.

 

John 5:29

And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

 

Romans 2:6, 13

Who will render to each one according to his deeds. ... For not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified.

 

2 Corinthians 5:10

For we must all appear before the jugment seat of Christ, that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad.

 

2 Corinthians 11:15

Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works.

 

Philippians 2:12

"Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling."

 

James 2:14

What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him?

Whoo!! A lot of verses there but they are taken out of context. To go more in depth, I said that we are saved by faith and not works, but doing the works is part of it because what good is it to be saved and you are doing totally the opposite of what you believe. We do the works not because we are righteous but because we want to be. This is th defintion of a righteuous person. Now as for this scripture, i just explained it. If you look deeper into it its saying that if we are saved by works, then Christ's death was in vain!! So we are not saved by works. You are save by faith but how can you feed your faith, if you don't do the works??

James 2:17

Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.

 

James 2:21-25

Was not Abraham our father justified by works? You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only. Likewise, was not Rabab the harlot also justified by works? For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

 

1 Peter 1:17

The Father, who without partiality judges according to each one's work.

 

Revelation 2:23

I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

 

Revelation 20:12-13

And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

 

Revelation 22:14

Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life.

 

So much for that one.

 

...if you left because you felt like you could never not sin, then you left for the wrong reason.

 

People who leave Xianity don't believe in sin, so ex-xians cannot possibly have such a stupid point of view.

 

I said they left because WHILE THEY WERE A CHRISTIAN, they felt like they could never sin.

 

- No patience

 

I've read people talking about "the just have faith" line. Well it's true. I've read many posts and people just simply didn't have longsuffering or patience with God. Whatever they prayed for, they wanted it right then and there, and because it didn't happen, they didn't believe God for it. TRUST ME if you have the patience and trust in God, he will deliver. Maybe not on your schedule but on his schedule, and you know what the great thing is? His schedule is always at the perfect time.

 

Bullshit. I have had many unanswered prayers during my Xian days, and I trusted fully and honestly in Jebus. Many people here can also testify to this. And to say Jebus answers in his own time, not ours, is just obfuscation. Stop making excuses for why Jebus doesn't answer prayers in the swiftest way possible (which would bring him the greatest glory).

 

If you read scriptures, God will give you anything you desire. But look at this, when you were a child you knew what and what not to ask your parents for. You knew that if your parents were strict, you wouldn't ask for an extension on your curfew etc. Same thing with God. His promises are all throughout the bible and they are yours. But some people pray for selfish things like a million dollars to buy four cars and gamble. If God answered every single prayer in the world, the world would be in even worse shape than it is now. If you are truly in the spirit, you will pray for the right things and they will be what you want. And even if you say something like, well I want to have a nice house!! Theres nothing wrong with that, but seek the kingdom of God first, truly seek it first in your heart and the desires of oyur heart will be added unto you.

 

- Left because of self

 

I also see that many people left simply because they couldnt keep doing what they were doing in the world, such as fornication or homosexuality. I bet if God said that it was ok, everyone would be a christian!!

 

I can agree to this one, because fornication and homosexuality are not morally wrong. There is nothing wrong with having sex with someone you are not married to or for two people of the same gender to have sex with each other. People's sex lives are none of your business and Xianity fosters a perverted obsession with the sex lives of others as well as an oppressive environment that is second only to that seen in the world of Is-lame.

 

Hmm, nothing wrong with it?? Well let's see, AIDS, Herpes, and other diseases are spreading because of multiple sex partners. Condoms are not 100% reliable. Not to mention sex before marriage causes babies out of wedlock, which causes babies without fathers, which causes, rifts in the family which destroys the family. Its a chain reaction.Same thing with homosexuality. You think God just said these things were wrong because it wanted to cut off people's fun?? What if everybody from the beginning of time had just one sex partner which was their mate. I dont think we would be having all these sexual diseases everywhere

 

Many people leave this sick-ass religion because it makes insane demands from its followers, such as to hate oneself or one's family for Jebus' sake. No sane person wants anything to do with filth like that.

 

Now, a question for atheists out there, you say there is no God, but how can you be sure just as you ask us. We've seen the miracles time and again but you just KNOW that there is no God.

 

Prove there are such thing as miracles. And if they do exist, why does God not show them to us all in order to gain more believers and glorify himself?

 

He doesn't do it because he doesn't exist.

 

He shows them to us everyday in creation on earth. I know you've seen things about miracles on the news on the discovery channel and whatnot.Ill provide some links later to such stories.

 

Now for the question, in D.C. the Library of Congress has over 70 million texts. Now how much of that knowledge would you say is in your own realm of knowledge? What percentage? So you wouldn't say that if you knew say just 5% of that, there isn't the slightest possiblity of a God existing? Now if ou try to flip this question on me, I've actually seen God work in my life and others as well. Things that were impossible and people prayed for happening. I've seen people completely turn their lives from crime, drugs, pornography, etc, what is bad about that?

 

That's a lot of obfuscation. And few Atheists claim that there is no way any gods can exist, but we do claim that the Abrahamic god does not exist. It's just not possible.

 

What's wrong with drugs and porn? Some people can do drugs and be fine with it. Most can't, and if they used modern Xian philosophy as their impetus for leaving drugs, that's fine. But many Buddhists, Satanists, Agnostics, Atheists, and Pagans have also left drugs and found inspiration in their religions to do so. This does not make every religion objectively correct, does it?

 

 

And what's wrong with porn? There's nothing immoral with two consenting adults filming sexual acts and allowing others to view them. Again, people's sex lives aren't your business or your god's.

 

 

Hmmm whats wrong with porn?? Look on google and see how many marriages and lives its destroyed by bankruptcy, depression, and other things.

 

I hope I myself didnt sound condeming. If I did, that was not my intention and I apologize. If you have any more questions you know for a civilized debate without the random insults, I'll be happy to answer them as best I can. Peace.

 

You sure did sound all puffed-up, but most Xians do. I did once. But I for one have no questions for you because I've heard it all before. I can see that you'd offer nothing new or special to me that any other Xian would not.

 

Thats cool.

 

Especially as you clearly do not understand the reasons people leave Xianity, I have no further wish to talk to you, but will hand your ass to you if you ever again dare to presume that I should believe in that demonic sicko you call Jebus.

 

Again thats cool. No need to be rude however

[Dom]

Whoooo!! yall got me workin tonight. I work on one post and theres another!! lol...i love it

[Scarlett]

Whoooo!! yall got me workin tonight. I work on one post and theres another!! lol...i love it

 

What did you expect?