4 Step Perfect Proof For God Of The Bible

[Dave]

The thing is, give him murder, I've read the same stats, about LA at least, that the murder rate had gone down in the last 20 years. How does it then follow that the "sin" rate, in whole, is down? It doesn't, not if you follow the bibles rules about sex, worship, lying, etc. I'd say what the bible calls sexual sin is up, not down. I could probably find some unwed pregnacy stats to back this, but our guest has been escorted out. Also, does he consider aboration murder? That would toss the "murder is down" thing right out the window. The only way sin is down is if you disreguard what the bible calls sin, especially since Jesus added thought crime, and accept a secular understanding of right and wrong.

There is also the fact that the over all crime rate has had a general downward trend for quite awhile, but then so has the rate of religiosity. His claim proves him wrong.

[Ouroboros]

And when and how did these trends come into place? Through secular philosophy the last few hundred years. It is because of philosophers and thinkers that broke *away* from religion that we now can reap the benefit of. To go back to hard core religion is like going back to the immorality in the old days. It's because we don't follow religion in the extreme ways anymore that morality finally can grow.

[nick5]

Hey Parture, I just have one question. I was wondering if you could help me with it, because I'm really lost. So far nobody has been able to answer it but I'm sure its just because they werent real christians.

My question is, since jesus was himself a sinner, how can he pay for my sins? It never made sense to me. I hope you can help me.

Thanks!

[Lycorth]

Can you do that?

 

No. The god of the Babble is impossible.

 

He is said to be all-knowing, all-powerful, and all-good. It is not possible for a being to be all three and for the world to exist as it does or for Xian mythology to be true. If Yahooweh were all-good, he'd want the best for the world. If he were all-knowing, he'd know how to make the world the best possible place it could be. If he were all-powerful, he would be able to do it with a mere thought.

 

However, according to Xian mythology, the devil (the primary author of evil) still exists, and sin does as well. This is not logical, for if Yahooweh existed and possessed the attributes Xians claim he does, he would not permit the devil to tempt people into sin and therefore into eternal torment. Yahooweh would simply eradicate the devil, thereby eradicating sin and doing away with all possibility that humans could be led astray by this being.

 

He would also erase all evil in the world, and would have created a universe in which all living beings could exist without having to devour or destroy or displace each other to survive. We all must do all of this to exist; it is not possible to avoid harming other beings. Even walking through some grass squashes innumerable blades of it, and many insects in the process. Humans and animals eat each other, animals and insects do the same, so do animals and insects and plants - and humans again. From the smallest bacteria which must live off its host to the largest whale which devours billions of innocent plankton each day, we all must destroy each other or oppress each other in some form, just to live. According to Xian mythology, Yahooweh wanted the world to exist like this, therefore he can't be all good or all-loving and still want all his creatures to devour and/or destroy each other.

 

Also, Xian mythology itself disproves the god it posits. Again, if Yahooweh were all-knowing, he would have known better than to entrust his message of salvation to the extremely fallible and changeable vehicle of human language. He would know that people need to be reminded, often, even of important things. He would know enough to at least show up, in a form that all would understand, and tell us in plain language what we need to do to avoid Hell. If he were all-loving, he would certainly stop at nothing less, if our souls really mattered that much to him, and if he were all-powerful, nothing could stop him - not sin, not the devil, and certainly not any contrived "logic" that Xian fanatics dream up to explain why he doesn't.

 

He wouldn't permit his message to be translated (and mis-translated) into innumerable versions, and wouldn't beat around the bush with parables and proverbs and conflicting accounts of the life and death of Jebus, his only begotten Scum. He would deliver the message in clear, simple language, without the need to study and re-study and waste precious time trying to decipher it. Humans who want to warn humans of dangers do so in clear, simple language, and don't fuck around. The Wholly Babble is just that - a lot of fucking around.

 

Also, an all-good god who had moral compunctions wouldn't permit a book to exist with horrible stories of evil, done by the so-called "good guys" like himself. The Babble is rife with tales of murder, theft, rape, and all sorts of evil, done by Yahooweh, Jebus, and their cronies. If this god existed, he would be the true devil, not the ambiguous Satan. If Yahooweh didn't want to be seen as a monster, then he had all the power to see to it that people presented the correct image of him. He did not, therefore he is not.

 

Here is proof, straight from the Babble itself and taken completely in context, of the genuine nature of your god - that of pure wickedness:

 

Examples of Murder being Condoned in the Babble

Examples of Rape being Condoned in the Babble

Examples of Human Sacrifice being Condoned in the Babble

Examples of Slavery being Condoned in the Babble

Jebus Lying about Prayer

Jebus the Jerk

Jebus behaving as a Cult Leader - no different than Jim Jones or David Koresh

Assorted Examples of Babblical Cruelty

Assorted Examples of Babblical Injustice

Assorted Examples of Intolerance in the Babble

 

I could go on, but my point is clear. The god posited by the Abrahamic cults is illogical, absurd, and insane - as well as wicked. However, he is portrayed as all-good, all-loving, and all-powerful, which is easily disproven by a simple and honest observation of Xian mythology and the universe around us. Yahooweh, Jebus, Allaaaaaaaaaaaah - they are all wholly unreal and products of the human imagination. And better for us that these devils do not exist.

 

Now, either accept these irrefutable proofs or continue to spew praise to your monster. I'm sure you'll do the latter, but that's why people like you help us to display to the world why Xianity is garbage and leaving it is the best thing any Xian can do. Thanks for your help

 

 

Keep your devil to yourself.

[nick5]

That pic is fucking sweet. Did you make that sculpture?

[Ahh!]

"Step 1 - There is an exponential progression in our conscience these past 6000 years, so that it won't take much longer to reach sinlessness in the saved. That being the case obviously there would not have been an eternity of the past of cause and effects. Therefore, the only possibility is the uncreated created."

 

How does progress contribute to sinlessness? Define "progress."

 

I still see cause and effect continuing as much as ever. 1,000 years ago, drinking too much liquor would make you drunk. Today, it is the same.

 

How can the uncreated create following your logic? Wouldn't someone need to create it. If not, how would the universe need to be created to exist?

 

"Step 2 - Since nothing in nature happens all by itself and always has a cause, then nature could not have caused itself. Thus, the uncreated created."

 

Did God cause himself?

 

"Step 3 - Don't argue against some god for we are talking about God of the Bible. Just stay on topic."

 

I refuse. The God of the Bible would make no sense as a Creator God. For God to create entire universes He would have to be infinitely wise. Yet His plan for humanity is this: some guy ate an apple so I'm going to give a law to a small wandering desert tribe. This desert tribe will not be able to keep that law so I'm going to come as a person who is also my son and die on a cross to save people who belief God was a Hebrew peasant who died for them. Yet at the same time God can't save people who do not believe this bizarre story. No if there's a God, he couldn't logically be that one.

 

"Step 4 - There can not be gods creating gods or supernatural events causing supernatural events in the eternity of the past, because they do not cause themselves. Therefore, the uncreated created."

 

Can you explain what you are saying a little more clearly? I don't get what you are saying here.

 

"... Realize the proven fact that you were created by the uncreated. Can you do that?"

 

Sure but first you have to...

 

1. Prove Jesus was the Jewish messiah using the original prophecies in Hebrew.

2. Explain why in Revelations 22:20 it is recorded that Jesus will come quickly and its been over 1500 years since that prediction was made. There is also a chapter in the gospels where Jesus says that the end will come in his generation but I can't remember it right now off the top of my head. This is vital information because according to Deuteronomy 18:18-22 the penalty for false prophecy is death.

3. Explain why God would take a human form and become the messiah.

4. Prove that God is only going to save people who believe Jesus's claims and nobody else and logically explain WHY.

[Ouroboros]

... Explain ...

He can't, because I threw him out. Troy (is another name for this troll) never listen to arguments or answer questions, he just keep on repeating his 4 Steps argument ad nauseam. He was made to de-Parture.

[Taphophilia]

It's pretty apparent that Parture doesn't think. All he's done is parrot what's he's been told. Maybe he could at least rewind a tape or two in order to give us even a somewhat semi-related response to the questions asked him.

 

Taph

[Thurisaz]

It always circles back around to the bible with christians. They haven't got anything else aside from other people who share the same delusion. It's all very "us and them" to a christian. The existence of a dissenting belief is very threatening to them because their faith is so very fragile. The rational part of their mind tries to break through and say "this is impossible, that is not right, that's not a description of a righteous man" and most of them react by stretching things to fit or twisting them around so they don't look so bad.

 

Not to forget that they love to attack others' "lack of faith" or "doubts" by proxy because they can't get rid of their own.

Aside from that, every single fucking word above is true.

[Thurisaz]

...he must've evolved to a rodent.

 

...and evolved into its current form from a shitpile.

 

Aaaaah, again and again I find that if there's any evidence against evolutionary biology indeed then it's morontheists who either refuse to evolve in any way, or who evolve to something resembling a human from raw sewerage, cockroaches, tapeworms or similar stuff. And they're damn successful too, in both.

[narcissist]

The only thing perfectly proven in this thread is the stupidity of the creator of this nonesense and the stupidity of whoever believes and promotes it.

[Robbobrob]

Come on now, try to deal with it. Don't shut your mind down!

 

Here we have the 4 Step Proof for God of the Bible. If you can't isolate anything wrong with it, it proves God of the Bible.

 

 

Step 3 - Don't argue against some god for we are talking about God of the Bible. Just stay on topic.

 

Step 4 - There can not be gods creating gods or supernatural events causing supernatural events in the eternity of the past, because they do not cause themselves. Therefore, the uncreated created.

 

If you can't find anything wrong with the Proof then accept that it is true. Realize the proven fact that you were created by the uncreated. Can you do that?

 

A) God of the Bible is supernatural, being something outside of normally percieved nature. ("we are talking about God of the Bible. Just stay on topic.")

Angels and Satan are supernatural, and found in the Bible. ("stay on topic.")

C) "There can not be gods creating gods or supernatural events causing supernatural events" (copied from Step 4)

D) Therefore, your steps are invalid within themselves...no need for external proofs. Your proof self-implodes due to faulty logic.

 

You lose....again.

[Robbobrob]

OK, how does one edit a post after it has been posted.

 

My B turned into a smiley face (though I think it is well placed)

 

And I forgot to add: Supernatural God created Supernatual Angels and Satan.

[Ouroboros]

You get the edit function after a certain number of posts (don't remember how many, 10, 50 or something).

[Lycorth]

That pic is fucking sweet. Did you make that sculpture?

 

No - wish I had thought of it, though. But, it's inspiring nonetheless. Comparing Jebus to Cthulhu just seems so right, no?

[Ouroboros]

I realized another flaw in Troy's argument.

 

He claimed knowledge and morality has grown better over time, i.e. evolved. So he admits that knowledge and morality and etc is evolving. But doesn't that mean that the Bible is incomplete, and we today, through science, have a better understanding of everything? So why then claim the Bible to be correct if we are MORE correct now? The Bible can't be the "absolute truth" or "absolute morality" if we look at knowledge and morality in this relative form that Troy suggests. He basically contradicts his own beliefs of the absolute when he argues that it's all relative!

[crazy-tiger]

Well Hans... we'll put that with all the other flaws.

 

 

If we can find room in the warehouse...

[quicksand]

I realized another flaw in Troy's argument.

Sweet!

He claimed knowledge and morality has grown better over time, i.e. evolved. So he admits that knowledge and morality and etc is evolving. But doesn't that mean that the Bible is incomplete...

Good point, but you know he woud either move the goal post or alter the criteria to say that the Bible stands outside this progression. (But then I would say, does it stand outside knowlegde? If so, then what good is it? ) Which is funny, cause the Bible is divided in two parts (basically) OLD and NEW. The very sections denote that it is not an ineffable, immutable document.

...and we today, through science, have a better understanding of everything? So why then claim the Bible to be correct if we are MORE correct now?

Ramblings of madman help you? HAHAHA

The Bible can't be the "absolute truth" or "absolute morality" if we look at knowledge and morality in this relative form that Troy suggests. He basically contradicts his own beliefs of the absolute when he argues that it's all relative!

But heck, if he says he's consistent, he must be. Kinda like Bush saying he knows where Iran or Syria is hiding the "weapons."

[white_raven23]

Ugh!! I didn't even bother to read the thread.... for the newer members if it hasn't been made clear before, Troy (Parture) is *special*.

 

Once a year he comes in to wave his "Four Proofs" that have been repeatedly and REPEATEDLY PROVEN again and again to be flawed at the very core of Troy's delusions and dreams of logic. What does he think, that we forget that somehow?

 

And his only defense is his persistent denial. Denial is all that keeps him the little king of his little hill. Sad really. Even inadequate people and personalities reach a point where they cannot hide from their deficiencies any longer, and most are in the end, personally strong enough in the end to do the LAST and ONLY effective thing in their life...which is to kill themselves.

 

Alas....Troy is the other part of such a insubstantial breed....his denial of his own low insignificance shields him from the truth that, for personalities like his, would demand his life as the truth is too unbearable for them. Instead he remains vital in his personal denial so as to be unbearable to those he encounters.

 

In short, this is the kind of person you throw off the lifeboat and into the shark infested waters within the first 4 hours of a survival situation to improve the overall chances of the rest of the group.

[Thurisaz]

What does he think, that we forget that somehow?

 

"Think" + "troy"!

 

And his only defense is his persistent denial. Denial is all that keeps him the little king of his little hill.

 

Remember fuckface's forums? The ones with all the one-post-by-owner-any-one-reply-replier-gets-banned stuff?

 

In short, this is the kind of person you throw off the lifeboat and into the shark infested waters within the first 4 hours of a survival situation to improve the overall chances of the rest of the group.

 

You'd last for four hours with this morontheist? Even just possibly?

I wouldn't give it more than four minutes

[white_raven23]

You'd last for four hours with this morontheist? Even just possibly?

I wouldn't give it more than four minutes

 

Oh no doubt! The four hour buffer is only a practical social consideration. You want to be sure you are fully in a "situation" before you start doing the extreme hardcore self-saving stuff. You know, the stuff that in a non-survival situation would obviously earn jail time, but in a "situation" could be understood and sympathized with.

 

For example, you don't jump from your burning wreckage onto the lifeboat, promptly grab a screaming child from it's mother, break it's neck, and start eating it right then and there when the Coast Guard choppers are already circling overhead.

[NotBlinded]

Oh no doubt! The four hour buffer is only a practical social consideration. You want to be sure you are fully in a "situation" before you start doing the extreme hardcore self-saving stuff. You know, the stuff that in a non-survival situation would obviously earn jail time, but in a "situation" could be understood and sympathized with.

 

For example, you don't jump from your burning wreckage onto the lifeboat, promptly grab a screaming child from it's mother, break it's neck, and start eating it right then and there when the Coast Guard choppers are already circling overhead.

[Valgeir]

Well... maybe YOU don't...

[Robbobrob]

Ugh!! I didn't even bother to read the thread.... for the newer members if it hasn't been made clear before, Troy (Parture) is *special*.

 

Once a year he comes in to wave his "Four Proofs" that have been repeatedly and REPEATEDLY PROVEN again and again to be flawed at the very core of Troy's delusions and dreams of logic. What does he think, that we forget that somehow?

 

So he is kind of like hazing...each year the newer members get to face a complete idiot who does not listen, and does not care what the rest of us think. It was my first Ex-C bonding moment....Awwww.

[Thurisaz]

So he is kind of like hazing...each year the newer members get to face a complete idiot who does not listen, and does not care what the rest of us think. It was my first Ex-C bonding moment....Awwww.

 

Congrats, you have now passed your Rite of Passage successfully. You have earned yourself the right to enter the special areas of the house, like the goat slaying room for example.