Grandpa Harley Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 If you know some good ones....be glad, I have not been so lucky. I figure it is safer not to trust them. My dh has been pulled over numerous time for speeding and has never once, had run-ins like you and your friends. He probably doesn't piss them off... No, he doesn't and he is all *man*. :-) Once when pulled in Louisiana it was a "Get out of the car, boy" (no, not racist because we're white and so was the cop) my children and I freaked out because we thought he was going to jail. Thankfully, we just got a ticket and were on our merry way. He deserved it going 20mph over the speed limit. Anyone under 70 is 'boy' and the measure of a man is not the level of noise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vixentrox Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 My uncle was a cop, a paramedic and a volunteer fireman during his younger days. A great guy really into helping the public till medical problems robbed him of his ability to do so. Lot of shitty cops out there no doubt. But some are true to the whole "Serve and Protect" theme. Still, a healthy distrust of the police isnt a bad thing but again, there are good ones out there that dont deserve the abuse heaped on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodsmoke Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 Of course. That's exactly why I try to treat cops the same way I try to treat everyone else; "tit for tat." Initially give them the benefit of the doubt and alter my behavior thereafter according to how they react. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Harley Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 Of course. That's exactly why I try to treat cops the same way I try to treat everyone else; "tit for tat." Initially give them the benefit of the doubt and alter my behavior thereafter according to how they react. just needed repeating... I have nothing to add... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigile Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 I don't think cops are inherently evil, but I do think the power goes to their heads. Nor do I think that's limited to a few "bad seeds." I've known (former) cops I normally think the world of and trust completely who've admitted to abusing their power in certain situations, despite knowing it was wrong, simply because they could. Right, the problem is two-fold. First, cops are given too much power over the people they are supposed to protect and serve. Second, the institution attracts schoolyard bullies and meat-headed jocks. Essentially, we have taken our high school tormentors and given them official power over our adult lives. To say they ought to be killed is over the top, but they absolutely need to have their power limited. It's a problem in every country I've ever lived in. The one difference in the US is that when you are caught in the cogs of the legal system, you are seriously screwed. Most countries I've lived in enjoy enough corruption that you can avoid getting caught up in the legal system. In other words, the difference between a small bribe and having your entire life screwed. US cops are corrupt in their own way; in a way that can be much more painful to the victim. In Prince Georges County MD, for example, the entire sherrif's department was under investigation after it was proven that they had been for years torturing confessions from the accused. Sleep deprivation, threats, etc... were used to coerce confessions in order to shut the books on cases. I would argue that such practice is rampant in the US. Boise, ID, a city with one of the lowest crime rates in the US, also has one of the highest police shootings per capita. During the 80s and 90s cops were killing 3-4 people a year. One kid was shot by a plain clothed, off duty cop who had attempted to arrest him for drunk driving. The kid got scared when the cop tried to pull him out of his car (who wouldn't?) so he tried to drive off. The cop pulled out his gun and killed the kid. The department self investigated and ruled that the cop was justified. Hence, the city hired an ombudsman due to community outcry against police brutality. Again, this is a city that has virtually no racial minorities, and whose citizens are largely upper middle class, yet the cops patrol it like they are in downtown Detroit. Boise City cops require a 4 year college degree, so ignorance is not their excuse. I'd argue too much power given them is the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigile Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 The film Serpico did an excellent job depicting what it is like to be a decent cop IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Harley Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 The film Serpico did an excellent job depicting what it is like to be a decent cop IMO. Frank seems to hold the opinion that things are a helluva lot better now... although he thinks the country is going to hell in a hand basket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueGiant Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 I've seen my share of harrassing cops in Chicago. I've known some damn decent ones, here as well. I've seen cops get very, very polite when a camera comes out and flashes start going. Yeah, too much power is a problem. Still, if a cop is pulling me over or I am otherwise being questioned by them, the relationship is advarsarial. After all, it is their job to bust your ass. In other contexts, well, depending on the person in the uniform, I'm cool with them. And GH, you talk more shit than a outhouse. All talk, no action, eh? They make pills for that now, you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Harley Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 I've seen my share of harrassing cops in Chicago. I've known some damn decent ones, here as well. I've seen cops get very, very polite when a camera comes out and flashes start going. Yeah, too much power is a problem. Still, if a cop is pulling me over or I am otherwise being questioned by them, the relationship is advarsarial. After all, it is their job to bust your ass. In other contexts, well, depending on the person in the uniform, I'm cool with them. And GH, you talk more shit than a outhouse. All talk, no action, eh? They make pills for that now, you know. Ah, I made a new friend... an insult and we've barely crossed swords (if we have, you've left an indelible blank on my memory... must have been singularly low brow, not to say dull) well, I'll take your advice on the pills... you doubtless pop enough to keep your tiny pecker throbbing... or do you do something that makes you impotent and paranoid? Any other problems with me? I'd cordially suggest you go die, in great pain, in a cold place, of something cosmetically disfiguring, that smells bad, alone... or wind up maggot ridden in a ditch... then dead is a bonus, but the maggots are a necessity... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
♦ nivek ♦ Posted May 11, 2007 Author Share Posted May 11, 2007 Keep on topic please, personal insults and problems taken private. OP was one set of corrupt poooolices beating and torturing some poor dumbshit caught up in their web. I don't want to get to point we're bashing ALL the PIGS, err, cops.. Been in the Emergency Medical Services and assorted Security for Hire work, Investigations, and even some shit marginally on the bad side of gray that has had my passport privvies revoked in several countries. Known a LOT of assorted Professionals in all aspects of the businesses, and most of the Cops aren't bad sorts. Will say tho that todays Police are more amped up, more heavily loaded, and more ready to pull triggers than not too many years back. Lots of things to blame for this, but IIMO that the "Culture of Blue", referring to the paying public as "civillians" as tho the Cops are some kind of Millitary unit, rather than paid employees is one big influence. The same Cops treating "Civillians" like some kind of "revenue pig" to be sliced off of whenever there is need for new toys and overtime pisses me off. Our local Cops will do a "Crosswalk Enforcement Trap", waiting for folks not to stop for people cross streets. Paid by a grant, and given overtime for this, the Cops wait and bust folks, hang paper and generally piss we denizens off.. I call for a Cop when there is gunfire and a known criminal gang fighting at my neighbor three doors down. The Cops refuse to come UNTIL there is like half a dozen of them *for backup*.. Refuse to even come close and keep the Peace.. Dislike that Cops are now Law Enforcement Officers rather than Peace Officers. They indeed are Revenue Enhancement Agents for their jurisdiction for most part. Ask a Cop what he does most of the shift, he or she will reply "write tickets"... Thing is folks, with the various Drug Laws and the Federalizations of the Cops and their activities unchecked by local control with the *dopers*, things like OP are happening, will continue to happen, and until We the People have had enough, things like the OP will not stop happening.. What do we do? Carry a small voice recorder. Carry a small video camera. Retain your Rights, learn how not to be busted hard when you are stopped on a traffic stop. Carry and KNOW the Bill of Rights and how it pertains to you. You don't have to be a fuggin' lawyer to know the Law and use it to your advantage. LEAF, RJ Tavel's little spot on Web Prepare to fight for your Rights with every damn thing you have, including every cent you own, things get ugly in Kort and in the System. Try your best not to get arrested.. When it does happen don't blame the Cop at time. It may be his fault, but then is not time to remind him of what a dickface you think he is.. The Law like Sasuage is nothing pretty to be watched made... Skippin law 101 daily Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Harley Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 By and large, things in the UK aren't *that* bad. We still don't have armed police as a first line, outside of airports, and we still don't need them. But then, that's the Free World, not the Federal Republic, which seems to be stuck in the 19th Century, judging by the comments on here... although the general level of people who believe in a literal Christianity gives lie to the fact you chaps NEED guns. Cue jingoist is macho posturing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jubilant Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 The issue with me is that I am so cynical that I treat all cops the same. If they give me a ticket, and try to search my car or give me an attitude, I make life very difficult. Mainly I file complaint after complaint and every reason that would force them to have to have one formal inquiry after another until they just get exhausted from dealing with me. I'm sorry but am dying to know...what on earth are you doing to draw so much attention while out on the road that you appear to get pulled and bothered by police on a regular basis? You're not much older than my husband and I, and we're not bullied by the police despite driving each and everyday...you are coming off as though the police are a constant pain in your ass, pulling you over at every opportunity just to give you shit. Not one time, despite being pulled for speeding, have the police ever asked to search his car, whether or not he's alone or with us. To keep on topic, what some police are doing to civilians as far as abusing their power is something that should cause people to rise up and make a stand. When we see videos of people being pulled and use of excessive force is being used, makes me sick and those police need to be punished by having their badges pulled...no questions asked and then taken to court. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Harley Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 Like any bureaucracy, there's going to be some bad ones... Seems that a vocal minority want to go back to the good old days... Ah, glory days, when justice was meted out democratically... No uppity rozzers there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueGiant Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 Nivek, true about your rights, you have to know them and use them, and protect them. Last I checked, there isn't anyone that will do that for you in any country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Harley Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 "Last I checked, there isn't anyone that will do that for you in any country." When was that? How many countries? How long in each country? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueGiant Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 "Last I checked, there isn't anyone that will do that for you in any country." When was that? How many countries? How long in each country? Would you trust a government to protect your rights? There is truth to the saying that the price of freedom is eternal vigilance. My point is that, when push comes to shove, an individual must either stand up and protect their own rights, or give them up and get screwed over. When it comes to using and protecting your rights, you are the one who has to make that stand, ultimately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtheistMommy Posted May 11, 2007 Share Posted May 11, 2007 TN cops torture suspect Siler This mp3, copy of the tape Siler's wife had left running when she was chased out of their home by this gang of Law Enforcement Officers is very hard to listen to as they torture Siler... This is what the PATRIOT ACT is more than capable of letting our tax paid for Peace Officers to become.. This bullshit is NOT the AmeriKa my Dad and his forebearers lived and died for.. kFL ***************** You know I don't trust the cops. Especially around here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vixentrox Posted May 12, 2007 Share Posted May 12, 2007 8 times in 10 years? Huh? I have been pulled over like once in the last 15 years and didnt even get a ticket then. Are you that bad of a driver or something? It seems an awefully high nimber of pull overs. Maybe you have made such an annoyance of yourself that they look for any reason at all to pull you over? I really dont know anyone that has been pulled over even close to that number of times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Harley Posted May 12, 2007 Share Posted May 12, 2007 I've been done for speeding twice in the years I've been driving and neither time was I pulled, I just got a fine in the post and three points on my licence There seems to be a pattern that the people who complain of the Police in the US are the ones who live in the former slaver states... I'm not claiming causality here, I'm just noting a minor pattern.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Harley Posted May 12, 2007 Share Posted May 12, 2007 "Last I checked, there isn't anyone that will do that for you in any country." When was that? How many countries? How long in each country? Would you trust a government to protect your rights? There is truth to the saying that the price of freedom is eternal vigilance. My point is that, when push comes to shove, an individual must either stand up and protect their own rights, or give them up and get screwed over. When it comes to using and protecting your rights, you are the one who has to make that stand, ultimately. So, you're guessing/ making it up... that's fine... and no, I don't trust anyone who wants power, simply because they're emotionally and intellectually unsuited for having it by virtue of the fact they want it... However, how does one then prevent the sort of sights I posted above? Complete libertarianism is all but indistinguishable from Anarchy. Where is the line drawn and by whom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casey Posted May 12, 2007 Share Posted May 12, 2007 [N]o, I don't trust anyone who wants power, simply because they're emotionally and intellectually unsuited for having it by virtue of the fact they want it.. That's about my position. However we do have a certain curious species of animal known as professional politicians. They want power, that's for sure, and they have mastered the art of not appearing to want it. The only thing that keeps them somewhat in check is that people have rights. However the people must know their rights and demand they be enforced, or this check will be useless. Also, whenever politicians try to legislate any of the people's right's away, this must be resisted. And they will try to legislate the people's rights away, of that there is no doubt. Casey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Harley Posted May 12, 2007 Share Posted May 12, 2007 Unless one is prepared to go to armed insurrection on every violation, the fact that we only get to vote once every four years for the people who's lies we like best, then there's not much one can do... a lot can happen in 4 years... One of the good things about being one of the last Constitutional monarchies in the world is that the UK armed forces are allied to the Queen and lent to the government. Should things get out of hand, she can veto something and make it stick. "The most significant family of constitutional monarchies in the world today are the sixteen Realms, all independent parliamentary democracies in a personal union relationship under Elizabeth II. Unlike some of their continental European counterparts, the Monarch and her Governors-General in the Commonwealth Realms hold significant "reserve" or "prerogative" powers, to be wielded in times of extreme emergency or constitutional crises usually to uphold parliamentary government. In both the United Kingdom and elsewhere, a common debate centers around when and when not it is appropriate for a monarch to use his or her political powers. When a monarch does act, political controversy can often ensue, partially because the neutrality of the crown is seen to be compromised in favor of a partisan goal. While political scientists may champion the idea of an "interventionist monarch" as a check against possible illegal action by politicians, the monarchs themselves are often driven by a more pragmatic sense of self-preservation, in which avoiding political controversy can be seen as an important way to retain public legitimacy and popularity." By 'in support of parliamentary government', it means against the instigation of a dictatorship... for instance in 1999 the Queen vetoed a bill that would allow the sitting government to deploy troops without royal assent. The bill never entered law and thus wars can only be entered into with her majesty's approval, even in 'Times of Emergency'.... but the overall UK system is pretty baroque... I'm no monarchist, but the role has its uses... which is seldom understood by people who want ot dismantle the monarchy (or they understand it and they want the safe guard removed)... One thing about this Queen... she wasn't born to be Queen, nor did she she want the job. However, I know she puts the fear of God into most Prime Ministers, since she's dealt with every PM since Churchill... It ain't perfect, but it's less bellicose (and blood thirsty) than a lot of systems Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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