Jewish And Xian Sacred Texts

[ShackledNoMore]

Mah Tovu said (regarding homosexuality) in another thread:

 

There's a later rabbinic prohibition, but the Torah doesn't have anything to say about it.

 

You're going to have to excuse me here for being about as ignorant of Judiasm as an ex-c can be, but I'm curious: what is the relationship to Judaic sacred texts with those of xianity?

 

As a clueless xian, I was taught that the Old Testament was basically the same as the Judaic text (the Torah, I guess, just called something else). Is there more to it than that, or is that partially true, or what? The xian OT certainly does not regard homosexuality kindly.

[mwc]

If you read her statement it is specifically about lesbianism not man with another man.

 

(All this is from memory so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.)

 

Although, you might, just might get killed if you are a lesbian (or just a woman) and you are caught dressing as a man (or vice-verse...although King David got away with it as I recall but he and his family got away with lots and lots of things).

 

So it appears lipstick lesbians are okay but the butch cross dressing types aren't. Some things just never change.

 

mwc

[ShackledNoMore]

If you read her statement it is specifically about lesbianism not man with another man.

 

(All this is from memory so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.)

 

Although, you might, just might get killed if you are a lesbian (or just a woman) and you are caught dressing as a man (or vice-verse...although King David got away with it as I recall but he and his family got away with lots and lots of things).

 

So it appears lipstick lesbians are okay but the butch cross dressing types aren't. Some things just never change.

 

mwc

You are absolutely correct: I must have been half asleep this morning.

 

After I got to work, it occurred to me that the topic had been about lesbians and not gay men, and sure enough, that's specifically what was addressed.

 

Also while I was half asleep I forgot to apply a double standard.

 

Another thing I remembered that had to do with the Torah was something about the books of Moses. Once I got home, sure enough, I see that the Torah is indeed comprised of the Pentateuch: Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy.

 

I also learned that the Hebrew Bible, or Tanakh, is composed of three sections, the Torah, the Nevi'im, and the Ketivum, which together seem to pretty well cover what xians have adopted as the Old Testament. The last tidbit was totally new to me.

 

I normally would have googled this--don't know why I didn't, but there's the answer!

[מה טבו]

I also learned that the Hebrew Bible, or Tanakh, is composed of three sections, the Torah, the Nevi'im, and the Ketivum, which together seem to pretty well cover what xians have adopted as the Old Testament. The last tidbit was totally new to me.

 

Yep, that would be the Jewish Tanakh and the Christian OT. The Torah prohibits cross-dressing and (to some unagreed-upon degree) male homosexuality, but says nothing about lesbianism. Similarly, it's generally interpreted that male masturbation is prohibited by the Torah (Onan), but nothing is said of female masturbation.

 

Well, this is where the rest of the Jewish texts come in. Jews have the Talmud and the rabbinic rulings that go beyond the Tanakh. Christians don't adopt this part. This is why there are no Christians who refuse to tear toilet paper on Shabbat. The rabbis stepped in and decided that female masturbation and lesbianism were bad, but not as bad as if a guy (or two guys) was involved instead.

 

Then came liberal Judaism, which said we should take both the Tanakh and the Talmud with a grain of salt, and thus rejected the prohibitions on masturbation and homosexuality entirely for both sexes. Gender equality was also introduced, and lo, people did tear toilet paper on Shabbos. And it was good.