Ahh! Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 How do you interpret the part of the Gospels where it says, "the Kingdom of Heaven is within?" What could this have meant in context? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
מה טבו Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 For some reason, that statement reminds me of this article from the Onion: Osama Bin Laden Found in Each of Us. Actually, to me, it sounds like another cop-out to deal with Josh failing to live up to any of the messianic prophesies of the Tanakh. When people point out that the definition of the Jewish messiah is someone who would reign as king in Israel, Christians try everything from "he'll reign as king in his second coming" to "his kingdom is within." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LithaB Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 In context, Jesus was replying to the Pharisees question "When will the Kingdom of God come?" They were asking when the messiah would show up, and his answer basically meant "I'm standing right in front of you, you're just too stupid and arrogant to recognize me." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deva Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 I think there is some question as to the translation of the word "within." I read that the word used could mean either "within" or "among." To me, if Jesus meant "among" I would go with what Litha says. If he was really saying "within", well, it almost sounds like Hinduism to me (if you want to get esoteric) or it was written simply as an explanation why there was no visible "kingdom." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Harley Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 Few points. Jesus couldn't have said anything to the Pharisees since they weren't really a recognised group until about AD50. Also the 'Kingdom of Heaven is within' makes perfect sense in terms of what could be communicated in Aramaic. I'm sure Mah-Tovu can bear out that the Jewish image of God is more intrinsic, imminent and immanent than that of the Christians (the Trinity being a localised, but omniscient, deity... although it couldn't sort the part of the Schrödinger Equation within a black hole...) I'd refer the interested to Neil Douglas-Klotz works on mystic, first century "Christianity", for a more complete view on what one can say with certainty of what the sayings of Jesus could mean in terms of the Aramaic tongue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwc Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 How do you interpret the part of the Gospels where it says, "the Kingdom of Heaven is within?" What could this have meant in context? I'm going to assume you're referring to this passage: Luke 17 20 And when the Pharisees put questions to him about when the kingdom of God would come, he gave them an answer and said, The kingdom of God will not come through observation: 21 And men will not say, See, it is here! or, There! for the kingdom of God is among you. 22 And he said to his disciples, The time will come when you will have a great desire to see one of the days of the Son of man, but you will not see it. 23 And if they say to you, See, it is there! or, It is here! do not go away, or go after them. 24 For as in a thunderstorm the bright light is seen from one end of the sky to the other, so will the Son of man be when his time comes. Compare to this passage from Paul: Romans 10 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who has faith. 5 For Moses says that the man who does the righteousness which is of the law will get life by it. 6 But the righteousness which is of faith says these words, Say not in your heart, Who will go up to heaven? (that is, to make Christ come down:) 7 Or, Who will go down into the deep? (that is, to make Christ come again from the dead:) 8 But what does it say? The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart: that is, the word of faith of which we are the preachers: 9 Because, if you say with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and have faith in your heart that God has made him come back from the dead, you will have salvation: 10 For with the heart man has faith to get righteousness, and with the mouth he says that Jesus is Lord to get salvation. 11 Because it is said in the holy Writings, Whoever has faith in him will not be shamed. Finally let's look at what Moses/YHWH had to say: Deuteronomy 30 8 And you will again give ear to the voice of the Lord, and do all his orders which I have given you today. 9 And the Lord your God will make you fertile in all good things, blessing the work of your hands, and the fruit of your body, and the fruit of your cattle, and the fruit of your land: for the Lord will have joy in you, as he had in your fathers: 10 If you give ear to the voice of the Lord your God, keeping his orders and his laws which are recorded in this book of the law, and turning to the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul. 11 For these orders which I have given you today are not strange and secret, and are not far away. 12 They are not in heaven, for you to say, Who will go up to heaven for us and give us knowledge of them so that we may do them? 13 And they are not across the sea, for you to say, Who will go over the sea for us and give us news of them so that we may do them? 14 But the word is very near you, in your mouth and in your heart, so that you may do it. 15 See, I have put before you today, life and good, and death and evil; 16 In giving you orders today to have love for the Lord your God, to go in his ways and keep his laws and his orders and his decisions, so that you may have life and be increased, and that the blessing of the Lord your God may be with you in the land where you are going, the land of your heritage. So according to Moses, speaking directly for YHWH, the Law (what is being referred to by jesus as the "Kingdom of God"), is not a secret or mysterious and is in "your mouth and in your heart, so that you may do it." According to this the "Law" or the "Kingdom of God" is already in our hearts. Strange considering that the "prophecy" of the future messiah requires that the Law be written upon our hearts (I guess it didn't "stick"). Anyhow, the "word," if it is equal to "jesus," was already put into humans long ago and a physical manifestation is redundant (and didn't work either). Paul, on the other hand, lies by twisting the words of Moses/YHWH and says the whole thing is a curse and that only his version is valid. Typical Paul. At least the version in Luke is closer to the original in the OT. mwc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Harley Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 Paul was a self admitted snake oil salesman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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