Antlerman Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 Sonja asked in another thread "What if you're wrong"? And I thought it's a good topic to stand on its own for those interested to respond to. Here's what I said to that question if I stood before God at the seat of judgement, discovering I had been wrong: "Apparently I got that wrong. But I ask you to judge me as I judged myself. Examine my heart and the actions of my life, and if you see that I acted insincerely then judge me as a liar. If you see that I did less than open myself to the pursuit of understanding, willing to accept truth no matter what form it took, then judge me as opposed to the light of knowledge. If you judge that I was unwilling to conform my beliefs to the weight of evidence, than judge me as a coward worshipping his own ideas over truth and as one living his only life insincerely. If you find that I opposed those with other points of view and condemned and rejected them as ignorant and lost, despite their most sincere efforts, then judge me as one who arrogantly supposed himself superior to others and not one who through humilty sincerely strove towards a better understanding and compassion with my heart towards my fellow humans. But if you find that despite all these traits of honoring and attempting to live by these principles that honor the world, myself, and others, you find fault that I was unable to accept that the stories of the Bible were in fact historical realities despite them appearing identical to all other myths of all other religions which are well known to be stories of human beings trying to understand the world in the times they lived and not facts of history, then judge me as condemned for sincerely rejecting the ideas that required ignoring and actively resisting evidence that overwhelming pointed to something far greater, if it pleases you. I then perish with integrity for responding sincerely to what the evidence supported. As I am at your mercy, do now to me as you will in accord with your character." It's an interesting thought what someone might say faced with that. I'm curious to hear what others might say.
Ouroboros Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 We had this topic a while back and I can't remeber what I answered then, but I think I'd say a lot less now, probably it would be more like "God, Whatever." I would go to Hell, holding my head high, taking the punishment with pride because I utilized my own mind and didn't follow other peoples ideas and delusions. And if that is a crime, I rather be in Hell than Heaven, as far as I can away from the Evil God.
BlueGiant Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 If I'm wrong...I think something like "Hi, Marduk." If you refer to the Christian God, then I'm not wrong. Knowing that that thing doesn't exist is kind of like asking: "what if you're wrong about Cuthulu?" Ia, R'Yleh
Robbobrob Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 If I am wrong, then at least I did it with all my heart. If I am wrong, I still tried to make the world I live in a better, nicer place for ALL to live. If I am wrong, then shame on God for making me in such a way that I loved to learn, and explore, and question His Creation....and give false information to me in order to cloud my God Given judgement. If Christians are wrong, what do they end up losing? Nothing but their full enjoyment of this world. If I am wrong, What do I end up losing? Everything but the full enjoyment of this world. If I am wrong, then why would I have allowed my soul to be born in the first place....that does not sound like me at all. Before being born, would I not know the rules, and know I was giving up an eternity of peaceful existence as an unborn, for a short life full of pain and pleasure, but if I accept too much pleasure, and not enough pain, I will have to give up my current peaceful existence for eternal agony..... Um, who in their right spiritual mind would agree to such a lose-lose proposition. If I am wrong, therefore, I intended to go to Hell since before birth, and no holier-than-thou Christian is going to stop me!!! LOL....Oops, I think I just has an epithany. I do feel much better now....great topic Antlerman!!
white_raven23 Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 What if I'm wrong? Then I'm wrong. Then we get to see the merit and measure of the supreme being. I'm not sure I'd want to spend the entire afterlife in the company of a being that would be satisfied with "just in case" belief. It would be an afterlife of deep disappointment if the end result would be so petty and small compared to the grandeur of the living universe I'd had to leave behind.
Robbobrob Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 Of all the badguys ever written, the Joker is my favorite, because of his pure love of being bad for no reason than because he wants to. Most other villians have selfish motives of monetary gain....but Joker does it for the love of life. now there is a man living life to the fullest, wholeheartedly.
Ouroboros Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 I realized there is one question I'm curious to ask God about... I would look at the famous three, and ask them, which one is it that is the true God? And the Father, Jesus and the HS would start arguing and try to explain in an infinite regression of definitions and eventually God would explode and exist no more. The doors of Hell would open, and we all could have a party in the main hall in Heaven.
L.B. Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 Friend, my first response is that your first paragraph of monologue to 'god' is actually backwards, because if you write it as directed TO you instead of to him/it, you will find that it is sublime in its purity. That is EXACTLY what we exist for, to live as you described. My second response: A rabbi was asked on his deathbed what he thought the kingdom of God would be like. "I don't know," he replied. "But one thing I do know. When I get there I'm not going to be asked, 'Why weren't you like Moses? Why weren't you like David?' I'm only going to be asked one question: 'Why weren't you you?'" In my view, the ultimate question is whether we embrace the interconnectedness of all things and live accordingly, or whether we exalt the lie of an autonomous, independent 'self' and push one agenda over another. Those who do that will find themselves lacking, as who they were and how they lived reverberates throughout the future generations... the fruit of their karma will be poisonous for sure.
SWIM Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 What if the whole planet is wrong, and some other planet's religion turned out right? Who knows maybe they have all the original manuscripts and video-taped miracles... What?!? sputter-pop What?!? How were we supposed to believe it when they can't get the word to us... Hey then, welcome to The African Congo... or (insert isolated illiterate tribes people here), what about them? Guess ya gotta pay the piper... I would say "just kidding... DOH!" and all would be ok since we all KNOW god has a sense of humor right? No? lol look at a sloth then tell me he doesn't...
Mongo Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 I guess I'm having trouble with these kinds of questions because it always begs the ultimate question... "wrong about what"? If one searches diligently for a consistant philosophy against which to ask what if I'm wrong about "that" then finding "that" is near impossible. I cannot for the life of me accept that the Cannon is a legitemate representation of a consistant philosophy. (oops either of the Cannons... frick!) Hence, how do you slice up the Cannon and then present me with the remaining books and then ask that question again? Any other question accords far too much legitemacy to the silly writings of Revelations or the miracles of Moses and fairy tales of Ezekiel. About the only legitemate question I can be asked is, "What if when you die you are wrong about the existance of god?" So if I'm wrong about god's existance... I am pretty certain that I will only find out exactly what I'm wrong about after I die. I'm hoping that if I'm wrong, that god turns out to be the flying spaghetti monster. I love pasta and after reading Robbob's topic on responding to a fundy, I am considering becoming a Pastafarian. Mongo
Grandpa Harley Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 Of all the badguys ever written, the Joker is my favorite, because of his pure love of being bad for no reason than because he wants to. Most other villians have selfish motives of monetary gain....but Joker does it for the love of life. now there is a man living life to the fullest, wholeheartedly. It's more a proof that, in a Mad World, insanity is the only sane response. As I've said before, if the God of the Christians is real, then there is nothing to stop me from going howling into the eternal night of madness... since the universe is mad, and ruled by a capricious, demented, capricious, mumbling, murderous demented child-king.... One can do no better than mirror the madness that underpins all that is... HA-HA-HA-HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAA!!!!!
Grandpa Harley Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 I am considering becoming a Pastafarian. Mongo You just want to talk like a pirate and go to beer fountain heaven....
Mongo Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 I am considering becoming a Pastafarian. Mongo You just want to talk like a pirate and go to beer fountain heaven.... As long as I can swim in that fountain!
Grandpa Harley Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 Grotesque. People want to drink that without body hairs...
mwc Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 Just be sure to ask "god" what he's going to feel like when his God finally comes to judge him. What? "god's" an atheist? I wonder what kind of hell awaits him for not believing in his God and for all he's doing to us? mwc
Fweethawt Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 Grotesque. People want to drink that without body hairs... But they'd be spiritual body hairs... You'd never know they were there.
Grandpa Harley Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 If you say so... I prefer my beer pirate free... I'm a bit of a ponce like that...
Fweethawt Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 If you say so... I prefer my beer pirate free... I'm a bit of a ponce like that... Main Entry: ponce Pronunciation: 'pän(t)s Function: noun Etymology: origin unknown British : PIMP; also usually disparaging : a male homosexual Umm... Okay. If you say so.
crazy-tiger Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 What would I say? I'd say... "Where the fuck you been??" Xaru, on the other hand, would apparently say "Get a shave!"
Fweethawt Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 I think I'd say something like, "Dude! NOW is it okay for everybody to go to the all-U-can-eat shrimp buffet?"
Grandpa Harley Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 If you say so... I prefer my beer pirate free... I'm a bit of a ponce like that... Main Entry: ponce Pronunciation: 'pän(t)s Function: noun Etymology: origin unknown British : PIMP; also usually disparaging : a male homosexual Umm... Okay. If you say so. also means a hand flapping cissy... It's sort of ironic bearing in mind that ponce was often a hooker's bodyguard rather than her pimp... since he was quite capable of settling the hash of a reluctant payer and wasn't likley to be taking freebies from the hooker...
♦ nivek ♦ Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 I'll line the Canon up and take a shot at that sand dwelling asshole until he's hit... kFL
Legion Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 If am I wrong then I will ask God, "Given the evidence at hand, what would you have done?"
Evolution_beyond Posted October 4, 2007 Posted October 4, 2007 If I was wrong about what? The existence of God? Or the existence of the Christian God in particular? If I was wrong about the existence of God but right about what God would have to be like if he existed then I'd say "Hey, Dude! Shit, I didn't see that one coming. Oh well, I know you won't hold it against me so thanks for the freedom you allowed me to search and question" If I was totally wrong and the God that existed was also the Christian God - then I'd say "Call that an ethical way to run a Universe? - even I could do better than that. I think you're fired, mate!"
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