Grandpa Harley Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Actually the political/football team analogy goes only so far. Their book tells them who not to respect... look at Kratos... can on actually repsect a man who holds such poisonous views of his fellow man? Moving away from him to less Universalist views... can one respect someone who thinks that you're that vile and filthy that you deserve eternal torment? Respect someone who tries to drag you into their pit of self loathing to make them feel better and assured they're the favourite of some imaginary friend? It's more like respecting the views of a KKK member... niggers, jews, queers all deserve death... so tell me, for a person who is nominally sane to hold views by which women are second class, gays are the biggest scourge on the planet and YOU (whoever YOU are) deserve eternal torment for not having their imaginary friend, are deserving of more respect than they hand out to others, or should they be reviled right back as the sociopathic monsters they choose to be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gobbler Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 One of my online agnostic friends linked me today to an article dealing with this subject about whether or not we should respect believers even if we disagree with them and I think it brings up some really good points: http://crookedtimber.org/2008/03/11/respec...ious-believers/ One point they brought up that I really like is that it's not that much different from politics. I'm democratic but even if there are members here who are Republican, that doesn't mean I have to hate them even if I don't disagree with their position. And like this article says, even if I don't agree with their political position, that doesn't mean I can't respect them for other values they may have that I do agree with. After all, isn't there an old saying that goes "to agree to disagree?" Personally, I think it's our differences that make people interesting and life would be boring if we all thought the same. Another example is that it's like how you might have one favorite football team you really love but your friends might hate that team and support another one you don't like. If your whole life is centered around football, certainly this can create problems but if you can find other common bonds to have, I don't see why this can stop you from respecting people even if you don't agree with everything. You might not be able to respect them for their favorite football team, but couldn't you still respect them for these other aspects of your life that you do have in common? Likewise, I can see how "hate the religion, love the religious" might become problematic if their religion is their only aspect of their life they share with you, but if there are other aspects of their lives that you can still find value in to respect in spite of their religion, if we can still maintain friendships with each other in spite of our differences in our hobbies or political differences, I don't see how religion is much different than those. And honestly, as long as Christians aren't trying to control my life, I don't care how they waste their Sunday mornings. Yes I believe you can often times find common ground with others who spout religion as if it's the only way to live. Especially with your relatives and close friends. Yet I'm not so sure if you can treat it as if it's only a political difference or matter of opinion between the two of you. Fundies have blinders on. They think (know) they are right and you are not if you don't believe the same way. Even christians can't get it right among themselves when espousing various doctrines from their particular sect to another sect. Also the fact that they think you are heading towards god's judgement (hell) without their precious savior. And they often-times get very emotional and angry about this because of the so-called consequences of your heading down the wrong path. They believe this with their whole heart and that us non-believers are being stupid, arrogant, god-hating, deceived by the devil, what have you. If it was just a matter of hating one football team or the other then yes, you can still agree to disagree. Yet with religious beliefs it is far more insidious. They think you will be tortured for eternity for turning your back on their sky daddy. It can cause them great emotional and psychological trauma in some instances. It constantly wears on their mind whenever they think of you in their prayers and they are hoping for the return of the prodigal. They just don't see it any other way! It has to be their way or everything they have been taught to believe is for naught. We can joke about different football teams and for the most part it's usually all good natured. You can't do that with religion. Most christians will say they respect your choice of unbelief yet in their heart and minds they are pitying you and questioning themselves, "How can they not believe?" Therefore I hate christianity and all religion because of its ignorance, myths, atrocities, hatred, bigotry, arrogance, self-righteouness, and its utter insane theologies! I am so ashamed I was once a christian and I am happy to be that prodigal who will never return! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gobbler Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Actually the political/football team analogy goes only so far. Their book tells them who not to respect... look at Kratos... can on actually repsect a man who holds such poisonous views of his fellow man? Moving away from him to less Universalist views... can one respect someone who thinks that you're that vile and filthy that you deserve eternal torment? Respect someone who tries to drag you into their pit of self loathing to make them feel better and assured they're the favourite of some imaginary friend? It's more like respecting the views of a KKK member... niggers, jews, queers all deserve death... so tell me, for a person who is nominally sane to hold views by which women are second class, gays are the biggest scourge on the planet and YOU (whoever YOU are) deserve eternal torment for not having their imaginary friend, are deserving of more respect than they hand out to others, or should they be reviled right back as the sociopathic monsters they choose to be? Hey Grandpa! You beat me to the point. It takes me a long time to write my thoughts down! Maybe imaginary friends are like fantasy football?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandpa Harley Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 The last guy who called me a sinner and that we all deserved hell took umbrage when I called him a rapist and traducer of children... only thing I could think of that made him deserve eternal torment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
♦ nivek ♦ Posted March 12, 2008 Share Posted March 12, 2008 Don't give a damn until threat of a boot to the neck and bayonet to the heart happens. Fools of all stripes will believe as they damn well please. As long as they stay pleasant in their lives and stay away from me and mine, after a warning is warranted and given, got no problem with the meme'd Xorg hoards. Being *nice* ainta my cup of used motor sludge. But for sake of family and community around me, I try.. Those who choose to bring their religion and gods to me know they need be more than half armed with the wit bucket. I'm considered damaged goods by the religious, and oft after speaking with me, they tend to shy the fuck away with "Dealing with daFatman". Got a hard face and a handful of knuckles for those who won't go away when asked. For anyone else my door is open as Sanctuary. The god followers have their support groups and meeting halls. House of Fatman is not theirs.... k F L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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