Kaiser01 Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Is JayL a creationist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Valk0010 Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Is JayL a creationist? From what I understand yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaiser01 Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Is JayL a creationist? From what I understand yes. BWHAHABWBHAHH! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bornagainathiest Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Is JayL a creationist? Probably not Kaiser. More likely he's just a troll who's pretending to be one. Creationists also tend to be Bible Inerrantists, seeing scripture as God's perfect and unflawed word. If Jay is an Inerrantist, then he's just shot himself in the foot, with his reply to Centauri. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- centauri, on 08 August 2012 - 08:53 PM, said: JayL, on 08 August 2012 - 03:01 AM, said: If one reads the Gospels, one finds that Jesus Christ making an outrageous claim - that he is God the Son visiting the earth. We do have fairly good idea what he is saying. It is just that what he is saying is very, very difficult to accept - just like the people of his time, who put him to death on the cross.Perhaps the reason it's difficult to accept is because it contradicts God's earlier word about himself. God is not a man. Num 23:19 God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good? 1 Sam 15:29 And also the Strength of Israel will not lie nor repent: for he is not a man, that he should repent. Interestingly, NKJV has several verses where it says God repented. Genesis 6:5-7 21st Century King James Version (KJ21) 5 And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagining of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. 6 And the Lord repented that He had made man on the earth, and it grieved Him in His heart. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Jay's quoted Genesis 6:6, where it says that God repented. This, taken in the context of Numbers 23:19 and 1 Samuel 15:29, implies that since God has repented, then He must be a man - because only men or the sons of men repent of anything. Men repent because they are fallible and make mistakes. Nice work, Jay! You've demoted God to the status of men AND shown that He makes mistakes! . . . See what I mean Kaiser? He's not doing a very good job of being a Creationist... so he probably isn't one. Creationist? No. Troll? Yes. Thanks, BAA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaiser01 Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Your probably right BAA, most creationist cant use the internet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayL Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Is JayL a creationist? I am a creationist but not 6 days variety. I believe the universe is designed by 'vast intelligence'. I think Einstein had similar outlook. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayL Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 All that is needed to create the first "effect" is something that is self existent, sure that self existent something could be God but the problem is with a crisis of causality, where on explanation becomes no more valuable than the other. I think the quantum feild as the start of the universe viable based on the value of proof because we can observe its effect in plate experinents and when you have a quantum fluctuation no energy is gained or lost. Theism has other problems to it dealing with perosnalism and choice. My mother always told me I was special.... And I still believe her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayL Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Your probably right BAA, most creationist cant use the internet. Even hundred monkeys with keyboards and mouse can log on to internet. But they cannot come up with even one sonnet by Shakespeare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayL Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day; teach a man to fish and he will eat for a lifetime; give a man religion and he will die praying for a fish. Perhaps this why Jesus said, Matthew 7: 7-8 “Ask and it will be given to you. Search and you will find. Knock and the door will be opened for you. The one who asks will always receive; the one who is searching will always find, and the door is opened to the man who knocks.” It may not be enough to pray and ask. You also have to seek out and knock against obstacles. But the main point Jesus makes in this passage is that God the Father is in charge. We should go about each day with positive expectation ( even confidence ) that things will work out - because our loving Heavenly Father is watching out for us. Well, that could be today's sermon for people on this board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaiser01 Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 All that is needed to create the first "effect" is something that is self existent, sure that self existent something could be God but the problem is with a crisis of causality, where on explanation becomes no more valuable than the other. I think the quantum feild as the start of the universe viable based on the value of proof because we can observe its effect in plate experinents and when you have a quantum fluctuation no energy is gained or lost. Theism has other problems to it dealing with perosnalism and choice. My mother always told me I was special.... And I still believe her. REEEAAALLLL special. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaiser01 Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Is JayL a creationist? I am a creationist but not 6 days variety. I believe the universe is designed by 'vast intelligence'. I think Einstein had similar outlook. The universe is an extinction racket, we occupy a thin film of scum on the surface of a ball made mostly of material that would kill us. Not very intelligent if you ask me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serendipity Rose Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 It may not be enough to pray and ask. You also have to seek out and knock against obstacles. But the main point Jesus makes in this passage is that God the Father is in charge. We should go about each day with positive expectation ( even confidence ) that things will work out - because our loving Heavenly Father is watching out for us. I always find it interesting how convenient it is for god to sit back and wait for his followers to pray for something to happen, and then he waits for them to actually carry it out themselves. If Christians are such noble creatures, instead of praying that their favorite driver win the NASCAR race or the football player that prays for god to lead him to victory, why don't you just pray to end world hunger and war and then GO OUT AND DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT instead of trolling forums and trying to convert perfectly able bodied people to your version of morality. See, you're assuming that the act of prayer is a higher form of humanitarianism than actually DOING something to make the world right. Atheists assume the opposite. Atheists assume that it is OUR responsibility to DO the actions that make can work to make the world right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 I agree TOE is the main enemy. It forsters atheism and the view of a meaningless universe. TOE's main imperative is 'Survive!'. But for what - when the whole thing is a pretty meaningless accident. "To survive" is a meaning, so you're contradicting yourself. Imperative is "Survive!" = A meaning to life. But it's only one of many meanings. Check Maslow's hierarchy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Valk0010 Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Is JayL a creationist? I am a creationist but not 6 days variety. I believe the universe is designed by 'vast intelligence'. I think Einstein had similar outlook. And you overcome the nonsequiter to jesus how? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 I am a creationist but not 6 days variety. I believe the universe is designed by 'vast intelligence'. I think Einstein had similar outlook. I think he didn't. Besides, if you believe because of a scientific authority, then you have a bad reason to believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcdaddy Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day; teach a man to fish and he will eat for a lifetime; give a man religion and he will die praying for a fish. Perhaps this why Jesus said, Matthew 7: 7-8 “Ask and it will be given to you. Search and you will find. Knock and the door will be opened for you. The one who asks will always receive; the one who is searching will always find, and the door is opened to the man who knocks.” It may not be enough to pray and ask. You also have to seek out and knock against obstacles. But the main point Jesus makes in this passage is that God the Father is in charge. We should go about each day with positive expectation ( even confidence ) that things will work out - because our loving Heavenly Father is watching out for us. Well, that could be today's sermon for people on this board. Prayers works 100% of the time. When it's aligned with gods will. And you've asked for forgiveness. And you've asked Jesus into your heart. And you've offered a burnt offering. Of your firstborn son. On a stack of wood. Doused with lighter fluid. Hooray prayer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayL Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 It may not be enough to pray and ask. You also have to seek out and knock against obstacles. But the main point Jesus makes in this passage is that God the Father is in charge. We should go about each day with positive expectation ( even confidence ) that things will work out - because our loving Heavenly Father is watching out for us. I always find it interesting how convenient it is for god to sit back and wait for his followers to pray for something to happen, and then he waits for them to actually carry it out themselves. The Biblical view is that the Earth is under man's control. ( See Book of Genesis ). So much of things that happen to mankind - wars, injustice, etc. are all responsibilities of man. When we pray, we are inviting God to intervene into our world. "Thy will be done on the earth as it is in Heaven." The point is that God cannot intervene into our affair until He is invited to do so. We are autonomous beings and the earth is under our control. And when God is invited to intervene into our affair, how does He do so? Well, this is not as simple as one imagine. You see, God is Spirit and has no direct material presence in this world. ( John 4:24 ) God has to intervene primarily thru 'Spirit' or information. For example, God may influence how some people think. God may even directly tell some people to do something. So once again, much of legwork takes people. I hope this clarifies - to some degree - what the Bible teaches about prayer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaiser01 Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 It may not be enough to pray and ask. You also have to seek out and knock against obstacles. But the main point Jesus makes in this passage is that God the Father is in charge. We should go about each day with positive expectation ( even confidence ) that things will work out - because our loving Heavenly Father is watching out for us. I always find it interesting how convenient it is for god to sit back and wait for his followers to pray for something to happen, and then he waits for them to actually carry it out themselves. The Biblical view is that the Earth is under man's control. ( See Book of Genesis ). So much of things that happen to mankind - wars, injustice, etc. are all responsibilities of man. When we pray, we are inviting God to intervene into our world. "Thy will be done on the earth as it is in Heaven." The point is that God cannot intervene into our affair until He is invited to do so. We are autonomous beings and the earth is under our control. And when God is invited to intervene into our affair, how does He do so? Well, this is not as simple as one imagine. You see, God is Spirit and has no direct material presence in this world. ( John 4:24 ) God has to intervene primarily thru 'Spirit' or information. For example, God may influence how some people think. God may even directly tell some people to do something. So once again, much of legwork takes people. I hope this clarifies - to some degree - what the Bible teaches about prayer. How is a all knowing God going to change is mind based on prayer if he knows his future action? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Valk0010 Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 God is god till he isn't. Very convenient!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serendipity Rose Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 It may not be enough to pray and ask. You also have to seek out and knock against obstacles. But the main point Jesus makes in this passage is that God the Father is in charge. We should go about each day with positive expectation ( even confidence ) that things will work out - because our loving Heavenly Father is watching out for us. I always find it interesting how convenient it is for god to sit back and wait for his followers to pray for something to happen, and then he waits for them to actually carry it out themselves. The Biblical view is that the Earth is under man's control. ( See Book of Genesis ). So much of things that happen to mankind - wars, injustice, etc. are all responsibilities of man. When we pray, we are inviting God to intervene into our world. "Thy will be done on the earth as it is in Heaven." The point is that God cannot intervene into our affair until He is invited to do so. We are autonomous beings and the earth is under our control. And when God is invited to intervene into our affair, how does He do so? Well, this is not as simple as one imagine. You see, God is Spirit and has no direct material presence in this world. ( John 4:24 ) God has to intervene primarily thru 'Spirit' or information. For example, God may influence how some people think. God may even directly tell some people to do something. So once again, much of legwork takes people. I hope this clarifies - to some degree - what the Bible teaches about prayer. So again I ask, if there are so many Christians in this world, why do you pray for your own selfish needs to have food and shelter and not pray enough, obviously, to end poverty and war? If your god is so damned powerful and Christian faith is so strong... why have YOU not ended poverty and war? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serendipity Rose Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 It may not be enough to pray and ask. You also have to seek out and knock against obstacles. But the main point Jesus makes in this passage is that God the Father is in charge. We should go about each day with positive expectation ( even confidence ) that things will work out - because our loving Heavenly Father is watching out for us. I always find it interesting how convenient it is for god to sit back and wait for his followers to pray for something to happen, and then he waits for them to actually carry it out themselves. The Biblical view is that the Earth is under man's control. ( See Book of Genesis ). So much of things that happen to mankind - wars, injustice, etc. are all responsibilities of man. When we pray, we are inviting God to intervene into our world. "Thy will be done on the earth as it is in Heaven." The point is that God cannot intervene into our affair until He is invited to do so. We are autonomous beings and the earth is under our control. And when God is invited to intervene into our affair, how does He do so? Well, this is not as simple as one imagine. You see, God is Spirit and has no direct material presence in this world. ( John 4:24 ) God has to intervene primarily thru 'Spirit' or information. For example, God may influence how some people think. God may even directly tell some people to do something. So once again, much of legwork takes people. I hope this clarifies - to some degree - what the Bible teaches about prayer. How is a all knowing God going to change is mind based on prayer if he knows his future action? Good question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayL Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 If your god is so damned powerful and Christian faith is so strong... why have YOU not ended poverty and war? If you read the first book of the Bible, you will see that God giving the control of the earth over to mankind, autonomous beings created in God's image. Once the control is given over to others, obviously one is not all that powerful. So God is NOT 'damened powerful'. Not on the earth. In Heaven, yes. But not on the earth. This is the Biblical view. Once again, remember the phrase from 'Lord's Prayer' - 'Your will be done on the earth as it is in heaven.' So ending poverty and war would be done by human efforts. But strictly speaking, those are not the first priority for Christians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Valk0010 Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 If your god is so damned powerful and Christian faith is so strong... why have YOU not ended poverty and war? If you read the first book of the Bible, you will see that God giving the control of the earth over to mankind, autonomous beings created in God's image. Once the control is given over to others, one is not all that powerful. Ending poverty and war would be done by human efforts. But strictly speaking, those are not the first priority for Christians. How do you look yourself in the mirror in the morning? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayL Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 If your god is so damned powerful and Christian faith is so strong... why have YOU not ended poverty and war? If you read the first book of the Bible, you will see that God giving the control of the earth over to mankind, autonomous beings created in God's image. Once the control is given over to others, one is not all that powerful. Ending poverty and war would be done by human efforts. But strictly speaking, those are not the first priority for Christians. How do you look yourself in the mirror in the morning? This is why I keep coming here and wasting time. Occasionally I get a good laugh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Valk0010 Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 If your god is so damned powerful and Christian faith is so strong... why have YOU not ended poverty and war? If you read the first book of the Bible, you will see that God giving the control of the earth over to mankind, autonomous beings created in God's image. Once the control is given over to others, one is not all that powerful. Ending poverty and war would be done by human efforts. But strictly speaking, those are not the first priority for Christians. How do you look yourself in the mirror in the morning? This is why I keep coming here and wasting time. Occasionally I get a good laugh. I guess maybe I just don't get the mind of the believer anymore. I can't get my head around the insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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