♦ nivek ♦ Posted July 19, 2005 Share Posted July 19, 2005 Faith, science meet in space Boston Globe by Peter Bebergal "In one of those rare but spectacular moments, human beings got a glimpse of eternity. On July 4, NASA sent a probe headlong into a comet, and the explosion stirred up cosmic dust as old as the beginning of our galaxy. According to scientists, that was likely 4.5 billion years ago. The wonder of the thing strikes a chord of such deep resonance, it's hard to not feel a sense of reverence. Of faith. The science of space does it to me every time. The questions that are now creating controversy -- the teaching of evolution, the right to life, stem cell research -- have put science on the defensive as well as revealed an almost dangerous literalism that has infected certain religious communities. ... But the science of space is a science that begins, like authentic religious feeling, in wonder and trembling. Astrophysics is the last best hope for science to bridge the cultural gap between science and faith. As both a theist and a skeptic, a believer and a rationalist, I can appreciate the cultural tension currently at play. I have at times wanted my science to be speckled with religious sentiment, and my faith to be reasonable. Nevertheless, this conflict is resolved for me when I read about galaxies forming." (07/18/05) http://tinyurl.com/cpvqu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AllSeeingI Posted July 19, 2005 Share Posted July 19, 2005 Interesting read. I often wonder if time existed before "big bang". As an atheist, I've found the most difficult argument of the existence of a God with a fundie is the beginning of time/the earth/life. Most can't seem to grasp the concept of not knowing. They feel the need to have an explanation for everything, especially if it's as simple as creating a god from which EVERYTHING was created. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antlerman Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 Faith, science meet in spaceBoston Globe by Peter Bebergal "In one of those rare but spectacular moments, human beings got a glimpse of eternity. On July 4, NASA sent a probe headlong into a comet, and the explosion stirred up cosmic dust as old as the beginning of our galaxy. According to scientists, that was likely 4.5 billion years ago. The wonder of the thing strikes a chord of such deep resonance, it's hard to not feel a sense of reverence. Of faith. The science of space does it to me every time. The questions that are now creating controversy -- the teaching of evolution, the right to life, stem cell research -- have put science on the defensive as well as revealed an almost dangerous literalism that has infected certain religious communities. ... But the science of space is a science that begins, like authentic religious feeling, in wonder and trembling. Astrophysics is the last best hope for science to bridge the cultural gap between science and faith. As both a theist and a skeptic, a believer and a rationalist, I can appreciate the cultural tension currently at play. I have at times wanted my science to be speckled with religious sentiment, and my faith to be reasonable. Nevertheless, this conflict is resolved for me when I read about galaxies forming." (07/18/05) http://tinyurl.com/cpvqu Wow. That really expresses my feelings about the wonder of the universe. I have choosen to have no theism, but I know well what you mean and often wish I could have some mystical object to express those feeling toward. It's something I used to do when I believed in a god. Thanks for the comments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Posted July 21, 2005 Share Posted July 21, 2005 I think the universe is a very amazing thing, but it doesn't prove that anything supernatural exists. Still, when looking at the pictures taken by Hubble and other such instruments, I can't help but feel a sense of awe. Some of the photos of galaxies and supernova remnants are, to me, more beautiful than a painting because they are completely natural and exist in reality. One of my favorite websites is Astronomy Picture of the Day. I discovered it a few years ago, and can't help but keep coming back for more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
♦ ficino ♦ Posted July 21, 2005 Share Posted July 21, 2005 Interesting read. I often wonder if time existed before "big bang". As an atheist, I've found the most difficult argument of the existence of a God with a fundie is the beginning of time/the earth/life. Most can't seem to grasp the concept of not knowing. They feel the need to have an explanation for everything, especially if it's as simple as creating a god from which EVERYTHING was created. So far the best i've been able to do is two lines of response: 1. time is a function of space. There was no "before" in our universe before the big bang. 2. or if we want to imagine something "before" our universe, a protouniverse, anohter universe on the other side of some string or membrane, i.e. reality is eternal. That's more plausible than having recourse to God, because one cannot show how God can interact with the space-time world if he is outside space and time. And if God is "in" space and time enough to interact with it, then he's part of the universe, so we're back to square one anyway, and "God" doesn't add anything to the explanation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Helmet Posted July 22, 2005 Share Posted July 22, 2005 I think the universe is a very amazing thing, but it doesn't prove that anything supernatural exists. Still, when looking at the pictures taken by Hubble and other such instruments, I can't help but feel a sense of awe. Some of the photos of galaxies and supernova remnants are, to me, more beautiful than a painting because they are completely natural and exist in reality. Yeah it's really amazing when you look at the night sky and realize all that is out there. Heck, the're probably some other kind of lifeform in the galaxy waiting for us to be discovered. With a few hundreds of billions stars out there the chances that life might have developed are good and considering the billions of galaxies in the observable universe there surely is at least one somewhere out there. Is there a god controlling all this? Personally I don't think so. Chemical reactions don't need to be created, they merely need the right conditions to be allowed to occur. When I was chrisitian I was amazed at the universe and how gawd was great to have created such beauty out there. Today I am only more amazed to see that such beauty exist by itself with no god to paint out the universe. One of my favorite websites is Astronomy Picture of the Day. I discovered it a few years ago, and can't help but keep coming back for more. Heh, I got most of my wallpapers from APOD and I must have browsed half of the pages! Do you know about GRIN? Another great site is Nasa's Planetary Photojournal. Check out the Saturn section (lots of Cassini updates!). Also check out the Mars Exploration Rover Home. Lots of great panoramics of Mars! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spamandham Posted July 28, 2005 Share Posted July 28, 2005 As an atheist, I've found the most difficult argument of the existence of a God with a fundie is the beginning of time/the earth/life. This really isn't all that difficult. Even without assuming things like m-branes or strings, we can conclude that it is impossible for nature not to have existed for all time. Relativity is the only knowledge necessary to make such a conclusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Flash River Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 As an atheist, I've found the most difficult argument of the existence of a God with a fundie is the beginning of time/the earth/life. This really isn't all that difficult. Even without assuming things like m-branes or strings, we can conclude that it is impossible for nature not to have existed for all time. Relativity is the only knowledge necessary to make such a conclusion. Interesting, so... relativly speaking, one can conclude that if nothing is created, then there is no creator... just as a Tsunami, created by a Earthquake... if it exists, then something created it... if there is time, the time itself must have been created... it exists... so, in conclusion... there is a creator, and if there is a creator, something created it? i just can't imagine where my imagination will go next... imagine that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spamandham Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 .. if there is time, the time itself must have been created... What does the word "created" mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Flash River Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 .. if there is time, the time itself must have been created... What does the word "created" mean? come on' it's not that perplexing... don't go getting all complex... lets see... Created, Produced, Shaped, Fashioned, Formed, Wrought, Made, Give rise to, Invented, Perform for the first time… time, hmmm... there it is again... somewhere in a historical moment... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spamandham Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 come on' it's not that perplexing... don't go getting all complex... lets see... Created, Produced, Shaped, Fashioned, Formed, Wrought, Made, Give rise to, Invented, Perform for the first time… time, hmmm... there it is again... somewhere in a historical moment... None of these address the meaning of "created", they are simply synonyms for the same concept. Does the word "created" imply that which was "created" is not eternal (existing for all time, or infinite time - your choice)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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