From Admiration To Disgust, From Disgust To Pity.

[Jedah]

Some may find it odd that I have been a member of these forums for so long and only now have I decided to post my “ex testimony”. Truth be told I've wanted to for a while but only now that I am stuck on a Sunday stormy night do I find a time to do it. The other reason being, that I never truly believed. This is not a story of how someone came to the realization that their own beliefs held no water and crumbled before them, but of how someone grew up as a secret agnostic in a family of fundamentalist Pentecostals, and through the deeds of the hundreds of Christians I have met throughout my life I slowly watched my positive outlook on Christianity fall further and further into the depths of disgust.

 

Rewind back to when I was 5. My parents were divorced and my father was Re-Married to what I can only describe as the complete stereotype of the typical American bimbo. Living with them was hell, my father is a decent man at heart, but cannot control his temper for the life of him. My step mother was an imbecile who was blatantly using my father for money due to her own lack of ability to do anything other then provide him with some measly pleasure during the night at the expense of my ability to get any sleep over the sound of her incessant moaning.

 

I will try to keep short all the nasty details of my pathetic childhood and stick more to how it affected my evolving view on religion. Fast forward to My first day of school – my enrollment into a private Christian elementary kindergarten class...or as I now like to call it, “The Brainwashery”. The first day they wasted no time on cramming the glorah of gawd into our malleable minds, and this is where it all began. Its funny, had the teacher explained it in a way that God was just the generic creator of all and left the parts about how Christianity is the one true path and everything else was a delusion of satan, I might have actually bought it all up...and yet, our unwitting instructor did not. I was young, so I “sort of” believed her, but something spun in my mind and I asked a question I thought to be innocent, “How do we know were not the ones who are being tricked ?”, I asked. I didn't mean to ask a question as to be challenging the Christian faith, I thought it an honest question and was expecting to receive a simple answer. I thought I just wasn't getting it. I was wrong. I don't remember exactly what was said, but she snapped at me in a very cold voice something along the lines of “We know we aren't the ones being deceived because WE have god on our side !!” or something equally circular, and then accused me of being a foolish little child who didn't know anything. How dare I question gawd ! I found her attitude shocking, and while I was too young to notice the blatant logical fallicy, I had a distinct feeling that my question was not answered. To make matters much much worse, the rest of the class was not with me but instead laughed at me. They called me stupid. Obviously, I had just questioned an all knowing omniscient adult, so I must be some kind of psychopath. No matter how many times I tried to make amends, my reputation was screwed. For my entire life during K-6 gradeschool and 7-9 middle school, I could not make a single friend. Needless to say my life during these years was hell. Many kids picked fights with me, and when I defended myself they conspired against me to the teachers who were in charge of the court to say I was the instigator, not them. I was namecalled to the point were I could no longer hear their voices, I had to tune them out. I was falsely accused of too many things to count, including stealing, sexual harassment, basically everything that could be lied about.

 

My inability to make friends wasn't all the fault of my first impression blunder, I made many other mistakes with reconciliation down the line. I don't know exactly what is wrong with me, but its likely either ADHD, HFA ( High Functioning Autism ) or maybe even both. I have never been diagnosed, I just know from my outlook and social skills there is something not right with me. Enough about that, being friendless wasn't all bad. I found a nice large tree where the breeze was nice and steady for myself to eat my lunches alone and watch the other kids play. I had a lot of time to think, and became very introverted. Pretty much all the other kids had bought into Christianity, and I admired them. I figured my inability to believe in God no matter how hard I tried was simply a fault of my own. I saw how happy they all were playing together, and dreamed every day what it would like to be like them. I figured I just “didn't get” Christianity, and that my agnosticism was my own fault and that the reason church felt boring as watching dirt blow around in the wind to me because I was a bad kid. I was “broken” somehow. I didn't quite know exactly where I was broken, but that's what I felt.

 

At some point in time around the age of 12 my father divorced the bimbo and went back to getting married with my real mother who, unlike my now Ex-stepmother who I wish I had never met, is an amazingly caring, kind, and forgiving women. If there is anyone I have met who actually follows the few good moral teachings of Christ, it is her. Unfortunately for them, this coincided with a turning point in my “faith” in a direction they would not have enjoyed if they knew about it. I had kept my lack of Christianity a secret up till then simply because I didn't want to let my parents ( Both strict Pentecostals ) think I was going to burn hell for all eternity as a punishment for not being able to delude myself into believing what human beings have no way of knowing to be true, courtesy of their all forgiving gawd, Yahweh. ( I still haven't told them ! )

 

I started to study the bible and really think about it. I wanted to believe in it. I wanted there to be some truth in it so I could finally fit in with the rest... but at the same time I wanted to honestly believe it. I didn't want to delude myself into thinking something that wasn't true. “Better to know the unforgiving truth, then to follow a sweet delusion” is a motto I made for myself ages ago that I still live by today. I found the "truth" alright. The Bible had many things in it that blatantly contradicted everything that Christians claim to stand for. Condoning of slavery. Blatant misogyny. Random nonsensical passages that didn't fit anywhere. Contradictions galore. Things that completely contradicted science. Yahweh didn't even seem to follow his own supposedly absolute rules. There were also bigger contradictions, ones that contradicted reality as we know it. For instance, the gift of the holy spirit: if this was at all true, then there would only be one denomination of Christianity, and Christians should all have a seemingly supernatural understanding of each other. They don't. If God really did give everyone an equal chance to become a Christbot, then every nation should have an equal number of Christians. They don't. If the trinity is true, then conversations between God and Jesus shouldn't exist anywhere in the bible. They do. Needless to say, I no longer admired Christianity. I was repulsed by it. I still kept it to myself because now more then ever did I understand the sociopathic nonexistent gawd these people served scared the sheep shitless. I do not ever want my parents to think I would be given the treatment this religion promises for non believers, it would break their hearts. Somewhere around this time in my life, I finally took the leap from “agnostic christian” to atheist.

 

Fast forward to high school and my days of being a total anime/computer/math/science/internet geek. There's a little thing about having no friends for the first 13 years of your life: you never really get over it. There will always be those crucial years of social development which everyone else had that I simply cannot ever relate to. You could say I am some kind of alien, if it makes more sense to you that way. A bad childhood may screw you up a bit, but a bad childhood with no friends or anyone to help you pull through it fucks you over for life. Yet, I still managed to find friends in the gamer and computer geek clique. While overall I hated high school, it was a public school and I was finally able to be myself and be the open heathen I really was. This is when I started arguing with Christians both in person and over the internet. I started out fairly immature and patronizing, but after seeing their arguments I have slowly became more accustomed to dealing with them. What I found was that apologetics is basically a load of circular logic, blind assertions, lies, and utter nonsense.

 

I'm sure all of us here are familiar by now with the wonderful world of fundy non-logic.

 

The first thing I realized after debating Christians on CF forums for a while was that Creation Science isn't science at all, it is a conspiracy theory dressed up as science. They have no actual proof of anything at all. They delusionally think that they do, but in fact all they ever seem to do is attempt to discredit science and fill in the gap left behind with their God. If humans didn't evolve from monkeys and lesser organisms, then clearly it must have been done by the Judeo Christian God ! If all the scientific evidence for the earth being billions of years old is a mass conspiracy theory by satanists posing as scientists then guess what it must really be ? You guessed it ! 6000 years old and created by none other than the Judeo Christian God ! If the universe was not started from a single point by the big bang and all the evidence for it is fabricated by the evil atheist conspiracy, then how did the universe get here ? Well tickle me silly ! Obviously, it has to be the Judeo Christian God ! Not Buddha, not Krishna, not the deists god, not the spirit of the hallows, not the great Water Dragon, not any other equally supported interpretation of the divine – The Judeo Christian God ! How do they know ? Because they know that they know because they KNOW !

 

...Gag me with a spoon...no, scratch that, gag me with a shovel.

 

 

The worst part of creationism is that it is essentially just glorified circular logic. They start off with assuming the bible is true, make some kind of assertion or excuse in scientific terms for how things could fit in with a biblical worldview, and then simply assert that their hypothetical idea of how things “really happened” must be true because it fits with the bible and the bible is true so their ideas MUST be true ! Bullocks. Pure utter trash. One fantastic example of this kind of insanity lies in how Creationists explain how we can see objects in space that are billions of light years away despite the supposed fact that a literal interpretation of the buy-bull claims a 6000 year old universe. Obviously, Gawd must have placed the light for these planets at a distance only a few light years away, just so we could see them. Wasn't that nice of dear ol' Yahweh to place light reflections around so we could see the whole universe for when we invented telescopes ? Hahahaaaaaa FAIL. What evidence do they have that the light was actually set up this way ? None. Its an unverifiable claim, and is therefore not science. But what do creationists care ? They assert it to be true simply because it meshes well with the conclusion they already have in mind. Round and round their logic goes, where it stops ? Only Cthulhu knows.

 

After Creation science nonsense, I started arguing with those who call themselves theologists. Enter the world of presuppositional apologetics ! Also known as the most intellectually dishonest form of reasoning ever conceived by man ! HOORAY ! Rather then going into great detail as to why presuppositional apologetics are all nonsense, I will let you see for yourself: Go to any presuppositional apologetics website, replace all the words in their so called “arguments” that pertain to Jesus with words pertaining to Mohamed ( or pretty much any other religious prophetic/messiah figure of any other religion ) and all words pertaining to the bible with those of the Koran ( Or any other religious text ) and finally any words pertaining to God with “Allah” ( Or any other divine being ). The end result of this wordplay is an argument template that makes just about as much sense for any delusion under the sun and beyond that you can think of. Needless to say, pressupositional apologetics are pure trash and the “Theology Professors” who propagate them are completely delusional.

 

Finally, you come to what I like to call “Hurr Durr apologetics” which are basically all appeals to consequence, authority, popular belief, and any other nonsensical argument that Christians pull out of their asses that do not fall into either of the above categories. Examples include “Morals can only exist with God” ( blind assertion, appeal to consequence ) “Without God, there is no grand purpose in life”

( appeal to consequence ) “The bible is true because it says it is yada yada yada” ( circular logic ) “I know Jesus exists because *insert personal experience that cannot be verified in any possible way here*” ( Special pleading. By demanding that people go by your personal experience, you deny the personal experience of anyone who has had one that leads to a conclusion that contradicts your own. ) “Convert NOW OR BURN FOREVER SINNER !!! ( Argumentum ad baculum ) “SPPPAAAAACCEEEE MUFFFIIIINNNSSSS !!!! Therefore, gawd exists !” ( ignoratio elenchi, non sequitor ) Ect. Ect. Ect.

 

Fast forward to where I am today, Graduated from college with a bachelor of arts, and a beginner professional 3D artist. I no longer despise Christians. I despise the Bible and find it to be a horrendous book of lies and deceit, but as for Christians themselves I just pity them. It pains me to see so many people wasting their lives away worshiping a sadistic nonexistent god. I think Christians are missing out on a fantastic and beautiful outlook on life by shutting their brains off and going by whatever they are told. It's sad to see how they fall in line by the thousands with so many foolish political scandals because they are deemed ungodly by the church, like obedient lemmings waltzing over the side of a cliff.

 

For now, I just hope I can eventually get over my horrible past and move on with my life.

 

Cheers, Jedah.

[oddbird1963]

My inability to make friends wasn't all the fault of my first impression blunder, I made many other mistakes with reconciliation down the line. I don't know exactly what is wrong with me, but its likely either ADHD, HFA ( High Functioning Autism ) or maybe even both. I have never been diagnosed, I just know from my outlook and social skills there is something not right with me.

 

Thanks for putting your story out there for the world to see, Jedah. I have been reading a book called A Mind of Its Own: How Your Brain Distorts and Deceives which lays out the facts on how the mind will do whatever it takes to maintain a belief despite absurdity or evidence to the contrary.

 

There is a great payoff for school kids to believe in a way that is harmonious with parents and teachers and "the establishment." It prevents one of the worst fears that people have from coming true: separation from the group, or the "tribe."

 

I think it is people like you and me - - the outsiders - - with "connectivity" issues, to one degree or another, who can more easily see the truth. When there is no payoff in remaining blind to the truth, it is easier come to the conclusion that the God behind Christianity just is not there. Of course I'm not as sharp as you. I put up with Christianity for 30+ years, believing that the typical evangelical responses to charges of absurdity, contradiction and suffering imposed by [G|g]od were "good enough". But, I was not raised in Christianity. I didn't convert until 14. Only when my economic situation dwindled hopelessly and I had to scratch and dig every step of the way, did I begin to realize that the promises of my faith that I was clinging to were as empty as froth. Also, when I looked around and realized there was no one (outside my wonderful wife and kid) that had my back, not even God, was I able to put away the remnants of a tattered faith and realize that my life had been tragically side-tracked by a false hope.

 

Like you, I don't hate Christians either. In fact, there are many Christians I love. But I don't hate the Bible. I just see it for what it is - - a reflection of humanity at different points in time and a reflection of humanity's ever-changing views of [G|g]od at different points in history. It is by relenquishing the notion of "one" benevolent [G|g]od behind a unified bible that you can actually enjoy the bible for what it is (skipping the repugnant parts, of course).

 

 

Jedah, keep up the journey toward wholeness and happiness! I look forward to seeing your posts throught this forum.

[Insanity personified]

Fast forward to high school and my days of being a total anime/computer/math/science/internet geek. There's a little thing about having no friends for the first 13 years of your life: you never really get over it. There will always be those crucial years of social development which everyone else had that I simply cannot ever relate to. You could say I am some kind of alien, if it makes more sense to you that way. A bad childhood may screw you up a bit, but a bad childhood with no friends or anyone to help you pull through it fucks you over for life.

 

I can totally understand this.

 

I've been extremely introverted for as long as I can remember. My father has de-facto control over my household and essentially NEVER lets me hang out with people. That's not an exaggeration either, he won't let me go to YOUTH GROUP for fucks sake. The only people he approves of me making friends with are people I would rather murder with a tire iron. I can count the number of normal teenage moments i've had on one hand. It's a wonder i've managed to have sex.

 

And here I am, 17 years old.... slowly coming to the realization that my teenage years have been a giant colossal fucking waste. It literally pains me to see other people my age happy and independent.

[deb]

Jehah, I thoroughly enjoyed your story. It is a shame what you had to endure during your school years. I never experienced anything on that level of cruelty. However, I was witness to the horrible way kids can treat each other. Was victim in just a few instances, and wasn't always the epitome of kindness myself. Although the few times I did something mean, I suffered myself at the thought of having done it! But what you experienced was what I saw magnified many times. You seem to be making your way in the world pretty well though, and that's great. You story was interesting and well written. Thanks for sharing.

 

Deb

[NaturalSelection]

Thanks for sharing your story with us. I feel sad reading about your childhood; I thought being a kid was hard too. Life is so sad sometimes but it does sound like you came through it with a strong mind..... I definitely think being a grown up is better than being a kid.

 

My husband and I are both loners and we've come to the conculsion that, dammit, there isn't a thing wrong with that!

[pitchu]

I'm glad to finally know your whole story, Jedah, and to know that I'm not the only one who, as a kid, struggled to believe what my Pentecostal relatives did, but couldn't. Ever. Just couldn't. I, too, share with you the self-imposed childhood silence on religious matters, and I didn't have a real friend until I was eleven.

 

But, boy, do I like where I wound up! I wish the same for you (but that it should happen even earlier ).

[Skeptic]

Your past sounds a lot like mine, except for the divorced parents part. I always questioned xiantiy but did buy into some parts of it, I didn't really have any friends until high school, and I have Asperger's (mild form of autism). I always found myself gravitating towards the geekier and less mainstream kids.

 

I no longer despise Christians. I despise the Bible and find it to be a horrendous book of lies and deceit, but as for Christians themselves I just pity them. It pains me to see so many people wasting their lives away worshiping a sadistic nonexistent god. I think Christians are missing out on a fantastic and beautiful outlook on life by shutting their brains off and going by whatever they are told. It's sad to see how they fall in line by the thousands with so many foolish political scandals because they are deemed ungodly by the church, like obedient lemmings waltzing over the side of a cliff.

 

This is kind of where I am now. Xianity still pisses me off and the attitude and stuff that xians sometimes say really gets to me, but I find myself pitying them more than anything. They're missing out on life. I missed out on a lot of life and I didn't get a chance to grow up the way most kids do, so I'm still pretty immature for my age. Deconverting really helped me in that area, though, and I'm starting to act my age (I'm 20 BTW).

[Jedah]

I kind of figured I wasn't the only one here who didn't fit in when growing up. What oddbird said about outsiders is something I figured out for myself a long time ago. The entire point of following trends is to stay in good standing with the herd mentality... but if you are already banished from the herd, then what point is there in following it ? It definitely makes it a lot easier to reject bullshit when everyone else seems to gobble it up.

 

In some ways I am proud to be a loner. Without anyone else to tell you what to think, you can be sure that the personality you develop is certainly your own. In a sense, I pity unquestioning crowd followers in the same way I pity Christians. Of course, I am not one of those pretentious douchbags that thinks he is better then everyone else for being different. I don't mind people who follow the crowd if they legitimately know the reasons behind what is going on. It's the ones that do it in order to make up for their own lack of individuality that seem pitiful.

[Guest dragonfly310]

Fast forward to high school and my days of being a total anime/computer/math/science/internet geek. There's a little thing about having no friends for the first 13 years of your life: you never really get over it. There will always be those crucial years of social development which everyone else had that I simply cannot ever relate to. You could say I am some kind of alien, if it makes more sense to you that way. A bad childhood may screw you up a bit, but a bad childhood with no friends or anyone to help you pull through it fucks you over for life.

 

Jedah, this was me to a tee back when I was in school. What you said here is absolute truth, based on my own experience. I could probably write a book based on the last sentence of what I quoted from you giving details on just how it "fucks you over for life."

 

While it does seem like you are well on your way to recovery, I do want to offer you some encouragement, again based on my own experience. Do not succumb to the notion that you are "fucked over for life." During my lifetime, and my childhood was similar to yours, I have moved away from the town in which I had no friends. Even in the new city, I still had trouble fitting in somewhere and gaining friends and other companionship. Even though they had never seen me before, it really did seem like they just knew I was a "bad kid," even though I had crossed over that threshold into adulthood. Even when I moved to a different state, it was the same thing all over again.

 

Yes, it is easy to get discouraged by this to the point of despair. Yep, I know this from experience too. The loneliness can indeed be that painful. But, always remember that there are others just like you out there that you can reach out and touch, and those of us online too. They are not too hard to find either, not even in the "crotch of the Bible Belt." I know you're in California, so that doesn't apply to you, but it just adds to the strength of what I'm saying. (I'm living proof the Bible Belt comment and so are my friends.)

 

I like your motto, "Better to know the unforgiving truth, then to follow a sweet delusion.” Never, ever give that up. When you loose your mind, what you know is truth, you've truly lost everything. Never, ever give it up, even when the majority are idiots. Don't succumb to the pressure. (Although, I doubt you have that much trouble with this.)

[Kuroikaze]

I had a lot of the same experiences growing up as well. I moved around quite a bit, and I was always picked on in any school I went to.

 

I was always the odd ball, the one who didn't fit in very well.

 

Teachers diagnosed me as ADHD and wanted to put me on medication for it. My parents, thankfully, refused.

[Jedah]

My parents didn't even bother to have me diagnosed with anything.

 

In some ways thats a good thing, since a background check on me will reveal that I am perfectly normal...

 

 

 

....

 

 

 

...........

 

PPPPPPPPPPPFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFT

 

:lmao: :lmao:

[Vigile]

I'm always amazed when I read the rare cases like you Jedah who were cognizant enough to question things on the level you did at such an early age. Looking back I can think of a few instances where my thought processes were different from the norm but for the most part I was all baseball, apple pie and 4th of July.

 

I wonder if an alternative explanation to your supposed disorder(s) might not just be that your brain developed quicker than average and that you have an unusually high IQ. Being abnormal doesn't necessarily mean something is wrong with you.

[Jedah]

I am not exactly socially shy, I am socially apathetic. I used to be shy maybe at around age 11 ~13, but now I am more in a position where I just don't care about other peoples opinions enough. Currently, I have no real friends outside of work. It's not that I am afraid to go out and meet new people, its just that I don't care or feel any need to do so. Years of being alone has taught me how to cope with being alone, and thus it eventually stopped being a big deal. I will probably remain a loner for all my life, and I am perfectly fine with that. Who knows, it might change one day, but for now my focus is moving forward.

 

I think one of my mistakes was moving back to California after going to college in Arizona. Part of it is because my career choice, while being something I love to do, happens to have a ton of jobs in the San jose/ San Fransisco area. Just over the hill of San jose is a small fundyville town, where my folks live. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind visiting my folks, but at the same time everytime I do go there I am reminded of fundy nonsense. Its kind of like knowingly eating something that gives you heartburn because it tastes good.

 

Once my current job ends, I am seriously considering moving to Seattle WA or Portland OR. There are a ton of jobs from my field in that area as well, and it may become much easier. Right now, I am just too close to where I used to live for comfort.

[Guest Abby84]

Hey Jedah.

Thanks for your story. I can't say that I really questioned anything when I was that young, I do remember being in my teens and always having a problem with stories in the bible that consisted of genocide ,the flood,sodom and gomorrah, etc. or other cruelties, which I'm sure you guys already know abound in "the good book".

I never had any friends growing up as well, even into my teens.........I had maybe around one or two friends and they were more like acquaintances. Yeah, it got lonely, my mother would always say that that's why she had my brothers (I have four), so I wouldn't get lonely(go figure). Like you, all the friends that I have now are from work with the exception of one. I just recently found myself kind of yearning for friends, before I was like you and didn't really care anymore, you do get used to being alone.Yeah, it does feel sometimes like I'm fucked over for life........but I guess life goes on whither it's fucked up or not, I guess I just have to make the best of it.

[LBW]

Hey Jedah.

Thanks for your story. I can't say that I really questioned anything when I was that young, I do remember being in my teens and always having a problem with stories in the bible that consisted of genocide ,the flood,sodom and gomorrah, etc. or other cruelties, which I'm sure you guys already know abound in "the good book".

I never had any friends growing up as well, even into my teens.........I had maybe around one or two friends and they were more like acquaintances. Yeah, it got lonely, my mother would always say that that's why she had my brothers (I have four), so I wouldn't get lonely(go figure). Like you, all the friends that I have now are from work with the exception of one. I just recently found myself kind of yearning for friends, before I was like you and didn't really care anymore, you do get used to being alone.Yeah, it does feel sometimes like I'm fucked over for life........but I guess life goes on whither it's fucked up or not, I guess I just have to make the best of it.

 

I really admire those of you who were thoughtful enough at a young age to seriously consider the awful moral implications of god's supposed acts, especially in the old testament. It shames me to think that I just chocked all that human suffering up to, "god's will" for all those years. And nowadays when I think of all the cutesy children's products that are themed around the, "Noah's Ark" story, it just blows my mind - how can we so easily separate the cruelty and inhumanity from our perception of that story, especially as Christians when we actually believed that it happened?

 

And being a loner isn't so bad. I'm not all that great socially, either.

[♦ Fuego ♦]

Once my current job ends, I am seriously considering moving to Seattle WA or Portland OR. There are a ton of jobs from my field in that area as well, and it may become much easier. Right now, I am just too close to where I used to live for comfort.

 

Portland is known as a place that tolerates, if not encourages, being different. They have a bumper sticker here that says "Keep Portland Weird". There are also a fair number of fundys here too, and a couple of "We do the thinking so you don't have to" mega-churches. But overall, and especially in the "Hollywood" district, things are definitely not mainstream conservative. I don't know much about Seattle's culture.

[R. S. Martin]

I was young, so I “sort of” believed her, but something spun in my mind and I asked a question I thought to be innocent, “How do we know were not the ones who are being tricked ?”, I asked. I didn't mean to ask a question as to be challenging the Christian faith, I thought it an honest question and was expecting to receive a simple answer. I thought I just wasn't getting it. I was wrong. I don't remember exactly what was said, but she snapped at me in a very cold voice something along the lines of “We know we aren't the ones being deceived because WE have god on our side !!” or something equally circular, and then accused me of being a foolish little child who didn't know anything. How dare I question gawd ! I found her attitude shocking, and while I was too young to notice the blatant logical fallicy, I had a distinct feeling that my question was not answered. To make matters much much worse, the rest of the class was not with me but instead laughed at me. They called me stupid. Obviously, I had just questioned an all knowing omniscient adult, so I must be some kind of psychopath. No matter how many times I tried to make amends, my reputation was screwed.

 

That pretty much describes my experience, too. Seeing it explained and described by another person helps me better understand what happened to me and that it really wasn't my fault at all and that maybe I wasn't stupid after all for having all these questions. Thanks so much for sharing this.

 

I also like the idea that it may be easier for loners to see and accept that the group teachings are faulty. Somehow, though, that seems to me like the chicken-and-egg dilemma. Which came first--the loner with time to think and the strength to stand alone. Or the level of insight that created the social isolation and the necessity to stand alone?

[Vomit Comet]

Jedah: wow! That's one hell of a story you've got there.

 

Hey, I have Asperger's Syndrome myself. I'd recommend going in and getting screened. If you indeed have "something", then knowledge is power; there's no use flying blind. Is it pride that keeps you from going in?

 

And if you don't have "anything", then oh well.

 

And here I am, 17 years old.... slowly coming to the realization that my teenage years have been a giant colossal fucking waste. It literally pains me to see other people my age happy and independent.

 

Two things:

 

1. The teenage years suck for most people. Hit the ground running when you escape to college. Be glad that you got over the delusion by your late teens as opposed to... your late 20s, like I did. May you have all the fun that I didn't get to have until a few years ago, and I'm thirty now.

 

2. By my use of the term "escape", I am implying that the only solution -- whether you aspire to higher ed or not -- is to get as fast the fuck out, and as far the fuck away, from your parental household as you can the first fucking chance you get. Please tell me that's what you're going to do.

[Vomit Comet]

Portland is known as a place that tolerates, if not encourages, being different. They have a bumper sticker here that says "Keep Portland Weird". There are also a fair number of fundys here too, and a couple of "We do the thinking so you don't have to" mega-churches. But overall, and especially in the "Hollywood" district, things are definitely not mainstream conservative. I don't know much about Seattle's culture.

 

Portland, Seattle, and Las Vegas are among the three most godless cities in all of America. The "fair number" of fundies you mention would be comparatively minuscule in almost every other American city, going by the stats.

[Dagan]

And nowadays when I think of all the cutesy children's products that are themed around the, "Noah's Ark" story, it just blows my mind - how can we so easily separate the cruelty and inhumanity from our perception of that story, especially as Christians when we actually believed that it happened?

 

Yes, my kids are of the age where all the cute Noah's Ark toys and story books abound. We just use them as toys without the story though... My wife is still a Christian, but neither of us ever believed in this story as-written. It probably doesn't help that I keep making smartass comments out of the kids' earshot like, "and here's a bird, and this guy lying on his side, he's the bloated corpse of a dead unbeliever, bumping up against the side of the ark!"

[Jedah]

Hey, I have Asperger's Syndrome myself. I'd recommend going in and getting screened. If you indeed have "something", then knowledge is power; there's no use flying blind. Is it pride that keeps you from going in?

 

More along the lines of just not giving a damn. I've gotten used to being me so I wouldn't take any meds if prescribed.

 

As for "knowledge is power"...well, not so much in the field of psychology as you would think. There is no need to know an exact mental diagnosis, because psychologists don't really know either. "ADHD", "Aspergers", "Schizoidal" ect. are just terms diagnosed based on what you tell them. They are blanket labels for describing a common set of mental differences. Unlike more "biological" diseases ( IE ulcers ) there is no real exact virus or bacteria at the root cause. In cases where you already know what symptoms you have and already get by in life just fine with them, seeing a psychologist is pointless since they will only tell you what you already know. Maybe it would have been good for me when I was still a teenager growing up but now it would just be a waste of time.

[Vomit Comet]

As for "knowledge is power"...well, not so much in the field of psychology as you would think.

 

You do realize that there is a great many of us out there who would've been up shit creek without their help, right? Not all of us have had the luxury of getting to be an ubermensch....